* Posts by gunslingor

8 posts • joined 28 Jun 2013

Windows 8.1: Here at last, but is it good enough?


Re: Back to 1990 anyone? @gunslingor

"I (and others,) have been using the term app in conversation to refer to full-blown applications as far back as I can remember. Not a program? What?"

-me too, but the terminology has taken on a distinct meaning since the invention of smart phones. Android has an AutoCAD app, but it does not have an AutoCAD Application for example. There has to be a way to distinguish these versions in general discuss and "app" has become the keyword to indicate the tiny tiny version. The term app now refers to very small bits of code, often less than 1MB, that aren't usually written in a formal programming language. Usual scripting languages or just HTML.

"With regard to defaults, what are you saying Windows runs as default? I wouldn't expect Windows to automatically change a file association - isn't that generally done when a new app is installed, e.g. archivers and media players which ask what you want them to open? I would expect it to set the default association for some stuff with the appropriate program that comes with it. So that'd be Notepad++ and Word out, then."

-I concur for the most part, so let me clarify. Windows desktop comes with the usual default wordpad and note pad, which are infinitely more powerfull than the windows cell phone app, yet by default, notepad and wordpad are not the choice, the app is the choice. This is very very wrong in my opinion. And it isn't just this, there are lots of files that default to these apps even though windows comes with better default desktop programs. Every file I open, from adobe to txt to img files to audio files defaults to these dam apps, even though windows comes by default with better real programs... this really pisses me off.


Microsoft Spying Program

You don't believe me that windows 8 has a privacy policy equivalent to the internet, well fine, but at least this makes the intent of Microsoft quite clear.... Read this:



Re: Win8 is fundamentally flawed design and marketing

I concur. I'm not against touch screens... I've designed HMI touch interfaces (once a multitouch) for power plants and I can tell 100%, MS is not innovative with their live tiles... its a very minimal approach to something that required innovation to compete with the market leader. MS failed with the phones, at least compared to android and apple, and they decided to turn there desktop OS into their smart phone. Death sentence. God knows what they are planning for the server software, but my company has already made the switch to AIX out of fear and uncertainty about the MS product line.


Re: Upsell

I can't express how 110% right you are sir. MS always has tried to do this, but never as blatantly as this, and never so many subjects of market manipulation at once... the new OS has bing inherent integration, windows stores, apps, skydrive, user tracking, a joke of a privacy policy, advertising, OS production cost reductions, so much it is really scary what this company has become since they tried to get into cell phones.

Its like they said "hey, lets stop being Microsoft and start being Apple, but lets implement our products poorly and lets take Apple's monopolizing philosophy a few steps further.... TO THE MOON!"


Re: Well...

Ha! no we wont =). Plenty of other options out there now.


Re: I see that some at least of the....

Boy that would be nice, but there isn't a way to fully remove the bloatware, "apps", windows store, the charm-luck-friendship-love-happyhappy control, or any of that other crap. I've messed with it and it would be very difficult, likely taking away other functionality from the desktop... it really is that ingrained in the system.

Besides, ethical companies and truly flexible OSs always give the user the choice. MS intentionally didn't give the user the choice to disable all this crap in an attempt to guide the market to cheaper developed and more profitable products for the company. They are dead to me.


Re: Back to 1990 anyone?

Lets get one thing straight, because your confusing terminology. An "app" is not an "application" nor a "program", it's a tiny little version of an application which is why they call them "apps", because app is short for application...we like to play these word games.

I agree with your comments. The worst part is how they default to the crappy apps. I mean, I have MS notepad, MS wordpad, MS word, Notepad++ and others installed, every single one is preferable to the "app" of MS, yet MS intentionally defaults to the less powerful app in an effort to brainwash users into thinking apps are better and, as a result, the windows store supposedly has the best programs for your tasks.

This is not an OS designed by engineers, its designed by CEOs who know little about computers and care only about reducing costs to increase profits in an extremely shortsited way.


Way too little, way to late... their base of loyal customers has already jumped ship.

I'm a computer engineer and have been a loyal MS supporter since DOS. MS windows 8 is a blatant attempt to turn the desktop market into the cell phone market, to track user data in a more profound way and to integrate marketing into an OS on a level I never could have dreamed.

Smart phone interfaces are impressive in comparison to everything else before, but they are quite clumsy designed for operation in the palm of your hand. I mean, if Microsoft shipped off this product with a free 42"

LCD Touch screen.... even then, I don't need an OS designed for a 4" screen... Don't they realize Windows is used for an infinitely number of applications, from NASA modeling simulators and satellite flight controls, to power grid operations, to freaking magazine development. This OS is designed with few things in mind:

1. To sell you more stuff from Microsoft..the model of every smart phone manufacturer.

2. To track more personal data and likely sell it.

3. To reduce the cost of OS development, regardless of the cost to the consumer.

4. To open a market for PC touch screens, which cost pennies more to make than an LCD, yet cost literal 5 times the cost (Like $500... ha! rip off). I bet they invested heavily in the market thinking they had insider information.

I truly feel betrayed by this company, 20 years of service, betrayed. The idea of making a one size fits all OS is extremely bad, especially considering the range of devices out there now... each deserves special attention and the only reason not to give each device class a tailored OS is to save development costs. I'll never buy another windows device....

Screw you guys, I'm a goin Ubuntu! I've tried to return the windows 8 disk, but neither MS nor the store I bought it at will accept it.

A lot doesn't play nice with windows 8... trust me on that... I run high end application in parallel... I've reinitialized my top end system 3 times today... I've probably restarted or forced restarted 50 times today. The start menu is silly, its all set up the way MS wants you too use it (the one item MS always had over apple was flexibility). The sad part is its all designed around selling products at their store...

Again, the biggest problem is that they took a highly flexible OS used in every notch our society has, and turned it into a god dam smart phone. I don't feel this change was honest, everything technical will be tougher in windows 8. An OS like windows needs to be intuitive and flexible, this is neither... its a departure from a "satisfy the customer" design philosophy, to a "make products cheaper to make and more profitable, regardless of what we do to or how we are perceived by the customer".

When it does work, I can see its got a good backbone to it... but primarily because it's a small efficient OS (no HDD requiremnt increase from win7, which is historically unique I think...usually the OS gets bigger). I think they accomplished this by taking some lessons learnt on smart phone OSs, which isn't bad... but then someone got the bright idea, lets make the experience as trackable and market controlled as a smart phone! Bad idea taking away the one thing allowing MS to be so versatile and putting them more inline with apple (even worse in my opinion... I'd rather have the apple OS than win8.1)... and they won't let me return it, after 20 years of loyalty to MS. Screw em, they are official crap producers... yes, worse "conceived" OS in history, worse than windows ME, definitely worse "conceived" than Vista.... Vista and Me had serious implementation flaws, but the idea behind what they were trying to produce was far better than the idea of win 8... I honestly feel this departure is going to be a death sentence for windows on the desktop (perhaps servers as well, lord knows what they are planning to do there)... which likely will make active directly far harder to deal with and that'll be the end of windows server. I really think, windows is done for technical computing environments. Which is bad for them considering their smart phones really kind of suck compared to android... and apple for that matter.

I mean, why am I going to buy "apps" from the MS store when I have an Iphone... Except in rare circumstances, why the hell would I want an "app" on my desktop computer anyway? They are designed for smart phones... tiny little htmls, scripts and... Its fine if MS wants to make a phone app desktop interface like apple did with itunes, but to make the center of the OS and to design the OS interface around an app selection interface is tarded, very tarded. Now, perhaps if they make this app selection interface as versitile as the desktop and touch screens come down in price at least 80%... and they fix the installation process which was the worst I ever went thru, 8 hours...and if they fix the bugs, and wait 5 years for everyone to buy a touch screen, maybe then this new OS will work out ok for them... but because they like intel appear to be getting out of technical computing business (opting for cheaper "all-in-one" chips); Sadly, I don't think MS will survive this one... the phones suck in comparison to android and apple, and they based the desktop OS around the phone. Saves development costs now and in the future... but what a risk to take so prematurely and to implement so poorly, and in such a dangerous time for the market, so stupid. Ha... Mozilla just frooze up for like 45 seconds, I'm back!

Most everything defaults to these crappy apps in the metro interface when I try to open files. Everyone of these apps is a toy designed for smart phones, with only the least knowledgeable user in mind (my 70 year old dad, who knows only ebay) and the simplest touch capabilities (i.e., designed for tiny touch screens you can barely put your figures in). Can you imagine... once I could open 10 word documents and be constantly dynamically switching between them all in an effort to write a term paper. Now I'm forced into full screen view no matter what file type I open... this is ideal behavior for a smart phone, not for a desktop. Switching between them is a joke unless there is something I am missing (am I?). There are strange new ways to do things like scroll down, or double click (I think they are intending to bury the double click and opt for single click behavior, all part of some naive CEO's idea to turn the PC market into the smart phone market. Which is interesting, because now after viewing this OS, I'm wondering if all this hype about PCs going out of style is merely a marketing ploy by MS... I mean, most people want a powerful machine compared to the day's standard. Smart phones will always be lowest in memory, processing power, etc... smart, redesign and compromise a 20 year successful platform to make it fit within the market where your succeeding the least... smart phones.... the devices aren't even comparable! The only advantage is reducing development costs of the PC product. You remember Captain Kirks communicator? You think its a good idea to conform the Enterprise's Communications array to that standard? That's what we are talking about here... traditional windows was build for real machines, windows 8 was build for cheaper, more profitable and FAR less capable devices.... size will always be a limiting factor in computer design, therefore a smart phone will NEVER equal a desktop sized PC. In most cases, the interfaces and software will be total different due to these size based design compromises and the completely different uses by the consumer....

Organization is around marketing, not the user. For example, I go to the metro sexual interface and click on the icon called games, expecting to see what games are installed on my machine or at least the old accessories-->games-->solitary type games... no, it takes you straight to the windows app store.... Is this where I buy Call of duty? No, its where I buy freaking Angry Birds! Do they really think we are that stupid? Angry birds was specifically developed for smart phones, why the hell would someone want to play an 'app' on a real computer? Integration of sales software into an OS on such a level I never could have imagined. Sure OSs have always come with bloatware, but this is blatant and highly integrated with the system, you couldn't remove it all if you tried. It would be interesting for a lawyer to wade thru the privacy policies between the old and new windows... I bet they effectively turned the PC into the internet, in terms of privacy. They should really call this OS "Windows Angry Birds", but "Windows Metro Sexual" suffices I guess.

I'm Constantly being asked to register windows and there is no way to turn it off.... I don't want to register, I don't trust them with my information and neither should you. This is messing up my time sensitive programs, forcing me out of games for example.

Most general programs don't operates well all the time in windows, I mean.. everything from Firefox, to VLC player, to cpu-z hangs up and stops responding... I'm going to test, but it really feels like clockwork... every 4 hours, "not responding" for like 2 minutes, most programs (I'm not using the "apps" of windows.... I could have saved $1200 and bought a smartphone if I wanted an app). It wouldn't surprise me in the least if MS intentionally hard coded errors into the desktop "old" OS trying to force people to buy there $3 script files instead of the free and far more powerful equivalents. Seriously, everything that isn't a windows cheep app runs quite well for like 2-4 hours and then hangs.

I am done with em. Don't buy this OS... go with a free Linux platform or at least an Apple... When/If the Linux guys ever do start to decide to focus more on touch interfaces, I'll trust them to come up with something innovative for the PC and not conformed to the marketing, user tracking and software/device capability wishes of the Vendor.



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