They should thank the guy ;)
Surely, a perfect opportunity for this Chamber to do a reverse Munich, and jump ship to Linux + LibreOffice!!
51 posts • joined 4 Feb 2010
Surely, a perfect opportunity for this Chamber to do a reverse Munich, and jump ship to Linux + LibreOffice!!
Hang-on big_D, you can't say positive things like that about Windows!
The only closed source* product you are allowed to be positive about is OSx, that's the law!! ;))
* some (naive) people mistakenly believe it's open source but then fail to wonder why it doesn't run on non Apple hardware - go figure!!
ps haven't seen one of your posts in years. Didn't you used to post on PCPro before they ruined it?
I suspect alcohol intake of said "senior associate ICT delivery facilitator" is going to exceed NHS guidelines this evening;
Good day at the office darling? Give me that damn bottle now!!!
"is Safari becoming the new IE6"
Err Yes, and wouldn't it be sweet if the EU Competition Department (come back Neelie Kroes!) fined Apple big time and made them display a Browser Choice window (remember that monstrosity!) on all new iFruit devices. Ah but it'll never happen because it's Apple, right?!
Are self destructing."
Well you might well be right but then again the haters have been predicting (hoping!) this would happen for twenty years or more.
You say Open Office formats are blossoming. In business I come across Office Open XML formats everywhere, not so much Open Office formats. Personally, I would miss modern versions of MS Office. The alternative seems to be use Open/Libre Office and use a UI from the 90's or use a cut down web based product like Google Docs. I don't find either prospect particularly appealing :(
"1) Such devices ran XP badly, they originally had Linux"
Bit of an over simplification that. The early ones with 7" screens and minute SSDs were horrible and weren't even up to running XP and should have been restricted to Linux . The later ones like the Samsung NC10 I had with a single core Atom, 2GB RAM and 160Gb HDD ran XP just fine. I even ran a full version of Visual Studio on it for occasional late night coding in hotel rooms. I never tried the last of the line dual core models but I can't see any reason why they wouldn't have run Windows 7 quite well.
"2) Win 10 costs money to replace XP and offers just spyware"
Can you actually back that claim up re Spyware. I've read several in depth analyses of Windows 10 that compressively debunk that myth - sorry if the facts don't fit your anti-MS stance.
"3 Linux Mint with Mate works fine"
If it does be happy but remember some of us need access to stuff not easily accessible via a Linux Distro - different strokes and all that.
Yeah the MS haters are out in force this holiday season ;))
"but that it uses a default proprietary file format"
B*llocks it uses an Open standard XML format. That's why there are loads of open source libs out there that can read and write offices docs. I'm using one at present called Epplus to create Excel spreadsheets.
"Yeah, so backward the gays can get married."
Oh Alan, you old homophobe you..
Howard you are obviously a being with mighty knowledge. You have convinced me that I need to move off Windows. Oh great one, can you recommend an OS that has no security vulnerabilities? I guess that will be the one you use. So please speaketh its name so that we can all come into the light and hail this mighty OS ;-)
B*llocks!! For starters, we all know that translating binary to decimal and back has inherent limitations. That's just a fact of life. That doesn't mean spreadsheets aren't useful, they've been used successfully for years. But every tool has its limitations, you wouldn't use an F1 car for rallying would you? Yes some mis-guided users have tried to over reach the limits of Excel, but that doesn't mean it's not a useful tool for data analysis. And adding automation via VBA can enhance a solution if used sensibly. I mean plenty of stupid apps have been created for iOS, it doesn't mean per se that creating apps is bad per se (evil yes, as it's supporting Apple ;-). Baby and bath water come to mind here!!
VBA Macros haven't run automatically since Office 2007.
What drivel !!
I think MS missed a trick, they should of added, say Python, as the scripting language, then all the cool Open Source types (who usually have closed source MacBooks, oh the irony) would have thought it was all wonderful, even if Python is the VB!
But because it's Microsoft and VB you automatically think it's uncool even though you probably know f*ckall about it!
"Which is exactly why I abandoned MS platform development when they decided to change VB to .NET. By that point I was properly fed up with their constant changes in direction."
Jeez, get over it. VB6 was creeking back in 2001, do you seriously think it would have been fit for purpose now?! (Although to be fair, it still limps on as VBA).
> Just as you get tooled up to develop on .net core MS will shift the goalposts.
And can you name an area of IT where the goalposts aren't being ripped up constantly?
Web Developer to his (developer mate):
Hey I just learned XYZ language and the new hoki-koki framework, oh and that new JS library.
Too bad man, they are like two years old now and so passé. Nobody uses that stuff anymore !!!
So John, clearly you are a rabid Microsoft hater. That's fare enough. But I wonder do you loath all large US Corporations? I mean is MS really any better or worse than Apple, Google, Oracle, Facebook et al?
Do tell, do you boycott all big US corps?
The average consumer wouldn't know what an operating system is, let alone whether it's open or closed. And as the recent OpenSSL debacle has demonstrated, there's plenty of juicy 'accidental' back doors waiting to be exploited in open stuff as well!
Yeah right. Cos the last labour government was such a success ;-)
A tenner says you're just a wind bag and you won't move even if Salmond gets his way!
Are we on?
Personally, if it helps the RSPCA to catch the scum who like to indulge in badger baiting or other forms of animal cruelty then I'm in favour of them having access. I suspect the Police don't have the time or the inclination to pursue most of these cases.
I'm far more annoyed at the DVLC selling my personal details to non statutory parking companies so they can try and frighten me into paying a £100 fine because I happen to have parked 15 minutes longer than 2 hours on a motorway service station car-park.
Wrong and wrong again: Microsoft don't have any market share in the mobile space to eat into. And with the patent royalties they receive on Android sales, they probably make more money from Android than Google does! So why would they pay someone to develop an anti Android trojan?
But anyhow. how come Android has exploitable security bugs? How many times have I read that open source software is inherently more secure because of the 'many eye balls on the code' factor - looks like some of those eye balls belong to the bad guys!
Err Not necessarily.
I had the misfortune to be given one of the early Acer tiny screen netbooks recently. What a laughable piece of junk compared to my 11" Samsung NC10. My NC10 might be running XP and have a 'slow' (but capacious) disk drive but its such a capable machine even to this day. On a trip, I once loaded Visual Studio and it handled that pretty well. And build quality is great, and after 3 years I still get 4hrs + battery life.
I think that the problem with Netbooks is that the vociferous naysayers were exposed to the early tiny screen Linux models and found them wanting and have slagged off Netbooks ever since. If they'd tried the much better later models they'd have a different opinion. But then again, the anti-MS brigade never got over the fact that most people wanted to ditch Linux and have something that could run Windows. (And I'm not anti Linux, I use it every day, I'm just OS agnostic - I use whatever is best for the job in hand.)
Given the choice between one of the later Win 7 based Samsung, Acer, Dell etc dual core netbooks and one of the earlier 7" or 9" early Linux models, I'd have the dual core machine every time.
Sometimes more is more
Err, neither are you. You can turn it off, so its no barrier at all.
AC? Eadon we know its you!
Me too, I have an NC10, had it for 3 years + I still get over 5 hours running XP. It might be just plastic but fantastic build quality for such a cheap bit of kit. Its not my main machine either but I still use it regularly when I have to visit a site and need USB ports and a decent crop of mature applications to work with.
I'm beginning to wonder myself if in a few years when everyone is so over the iPad etc whether cheap tablets might go the way of the Netbook. Perhaps decent (ie. by that I mean they have a useable selection of ports and 100's of gigs of internal storage, proper multi-tasking etc) netbook-tablet hybrids will be the next big thing.
Don't waste your time, Robert Long 1 is just a rabid anti MS troll. There's no reasoning with these people.
Oh dear, just another clueless troll.
@Eadon - talk about don't let the facts get in the way of your prejudice. The higher return rates of Linux based netbooks are well documented. See this article for example;
"In reality windows notebooks were returned in larger numbers due to their being slow."
Care to back that up with any facts?
If you mean in terms of absolute numbers rather than return rates, well that wouldn't be all that suprising given that the vast majority of netbooks sold came with Windows.
I recently had the misfortune to try and sort out one of the early Acer 7 inch screen netbooks that came with Linux and a tiny SSD. What a dog slow machine!! Fortunately, my netbook is one of the later Samsung 10" NC10 with good ole Windows XP on it. I've used it for all sorts of tasks over the last three years - Its even got a full version of Visual Studio on it which runs tolerably well. Its still going strong and is really handy to sling in a bag for when a real Keyboard and a good selection of ports are needed.
@Eadon - you've got that the wrong way round. Initially they were Linux only and the market rejected them. It was only when they came preloaded with Windows did they sell in huge numbers.
your loss then as VB.Net is 99% like C# but with nicer syntax - unless you like squiggly brackets and semi-colons that is :-)
"NET as a platform is also encumbered with submarine patents."
Yeah right. Let me put things right for you; As an MS hater what you really wanted to say was "I hate that .Net runs on Linux under Mono!" - there you go, fixed it for you :-)
"In contrast, if you learned C/C++ / python / java (Java excels as a serverside language / platform, so no need to hit with me "Java is slow" and other out of date, noob myths) : if you learned those languages and platforms, then your skills will have accumulated and be even more relevant in the future than they are today."
I partly agree with you but learning any modern programming language (MS or not) will stand you in good stead - it will make it easier to pick up whatever new language/framework comes along - even in the none MS world things can change rapidly. And today's hot ticket language can rapidly fall out of fashion. So there are no guarantees.
Life in the Ivory Tower would be great except for those damn users!! I mean, who do they think they are writing VBA macros. Sacre bleu, they haven't even read our IT department coding standards manual! I say, make em all use Ipads, that way they won't be able to any DIY coding.
If you'd thought about your comment for just two seconds before posting you would have realised how daft it is. Have you never heard of the World Trade Organisation. Do you think India (or any country) can just make up its own trade rules and ignore patents and continue to trade internationally? I think not. How long do you think India's huge IT sector would survive if it followed your prescription?
Lets face it, it wouldn't matter if IE9 was the best browser on Earth, or in the Universe even. That would not be good enough for most contributers above who seem to harbour a latent hatred of all things MS.
For what its worth, I tried IE9 for the first time today (I mostly use IE8, shock horror! but have Chrome and Opera as well on this PC). Inspite of the claims of whizzy performance, it doesn't make that much difference to my browsing experience. Just as I wasn't blown away by Chrome, I'm not with IE9.
The one thing I don't like (and this applies to Chrome) is the lack of user customisation options. Want to edit the Navigation toolbar so the Favorites button is on the left (where it should be!), forget it, can't do it! They also messed up the menus. Where's 'Find on this Page' now? Buried in the File sub-menu which is accessed via the Tools menu. As someone on another forum said, the interface is one step forward, two steps back.
Will the current version of Safari run on the version of OSX released in 2001? I think not!!!
Just get real, it was inevitable that MS would stop realeasing new stuff that would run on XP at some point. I actually think its quite creditable that they've supported it this long.
no need to 'drone' on about it ;-))
Wow those Oracle guys make the Israeli Defence Force look warm and cuddly :-))
$120 million in legal fees!! Those lawyers know a gravy train when they see one!!
On my PC, I can of Windows of course and I can also easily dual boot or virtualise Linux. Can I run OSx as well? No not legally, I have to have an Apple Mac for that and pay over the odds for the 'privelege'.. But I can run Windows and Linux on a Mac. Conclusion: OSx is the most 'closed' OS of the three.
The early court decisions to which you are referring were superceded by a settlement with the Department of Justice which was ratified the US appeals court!
So presumably you also think that Apple should not be able to bundle Safari, and that Ubuntu should be barred from including Firefox!
The link you give just reports on Microsoft's record quarter results. What's that got to do with image?
Oh and please, this whole MS tax business is just lame bleating. Try buying an Apple Mac Book without OSX! If there was big demand for Linux, Toshiba would surely offer Netbooks with it on. But as we saw when netbooks were lauched primarily running Linux, Joe Public didn't want it, so manufacturers stopped offering it. And down the line, when you come to sell your Netbook, it will be worth more with a Windows licence, so you'll get your money back.
You've no control over your apps, they can be changed on a whim and you've no say on where your data might end up!!!
"People WANT Apple devices, they desire them and will pay silly money for them - me included"
Read your post and thought the job was at Apple. Then I noticed the location is in Seattle ;-))
Much less well balanced were some of the comments. The author did NOT conclude that OSS was unfit for purpose, he just went through some of the pros and cons of using it in a business environment. Admittedly the article was quite generalised. But reading some of the replies, one would have thought he'd said that OSS was the work of the devil himself! The religous zeal of some open source advocats is a bit freaky/scary in my opinion.
"It's not so long ago that a colleague of mine demonstrated a Win exploit that allowed him to effectively wipe the hard-drive on the test machine..."
Or it could be you just made that up to add false gravitas to your point. Or put another way, I think its boll*cks!!
The bottom line here is that consumers don't want to pay for software anymore (or music or videos). If they can't kick it, and can easily copy it, they see no value!
Hence why this kind of story raises hackles. They only want to pay for software indirectly as part of a hardware purchase and/or through the hidden cost of advertising built into the price of every product.
Its a challenging world for commercial (sorry to use that dirty word) developers!
Final thought; Is Linux an OS, a religion, a political movement or all three?
"In .Net's case what else does it run on." ?
Well er let me see...oh that's it, how about Linux!! Check out the Mono project John!
Oh and if that doesn't float your boat, you could always write ASP.Net web apps. They'll run in all the major browsers across all the main platforms.
But having said that, I think MS should push .Net's cross platform capabilities much much further, particularly on mobiles. Forget the iPhone it's a closed book but wouldn't it be great if MS agressively developed .Net to run on all the other major mobile platforms.
I seriously doubt the 32% Linux market share that ABI Research were predicting for 2009.
Here in the UK, just try and find Linux Netbook! Have a look at the PC World website for example. How many Linux netbooks are they selling? That would be a big fat ZERO!
And its a similar story in the US I believe - take a look on the Walmart site, how many Linux based Netbooks are they selling? You guessed it, that would be zero again.
Oh Please, if you can't generally get a modern Windows installation to run with stability and reliability, I think it says more about your lack of technical competance!!