I'm fairly certain the OP wasn't asking where the tech is, but where the open source is, and/or the community.
70 posts • joined 15 Jun 2009
Everything old is new again
“Future features and functionality in Solaris will continue to be delivered through dot releases instead of more disruptive major releases.”
"Solaris 11 follows a Continuous Delivery model…”
“It's likely to be the customers like that who asked for [no Solaris 12]. S11 takeup is steady, but slow, and neither customers nor ISVs will want the disruption of yet another major release yet”
I’ve seen this movie before.
After Solaris 10, word came from the executive suite that Solaris 11 would not be coming out for… a while. Possibly ever. Can’t spend all that money on ISV adoption, customers are ascairt, and so on. Let’s just keep on adding things to Solaris 10.
Customers would hear the “Solaris 10 forevarr” message (aka “continuous non-disruptive delivery”) and say, “that sounds great! So when do we get feature X in Solaris 10?”
“Oh, well…” —kicking of ground with toes ensues— “…that requires feature Y, which would require too much change for a dot-dot release…” (remember, as someone already pointed out, “Solaris 10” is really SunOS 5.10, so “continuous delivery” would come through dot-dot releases.)
Customers in general do not want anything to change, ever… except for, of course, the new things. Can we have all the new things, please? But don’t change anything!
When Oracle took over, they saw what was in Solaris 11 and never coming in Solaris 10, and listened to customers who wanted those things, and said, “ship that sucker.” Which took another almost two years, for a total of almost seven years between 10 and 11 by then.
(Oracle had a novel way of solving the adoption costs, though, by not spending anything on customer or ISV adoption. Which might explain the “takeup is steady, but slow” —after FIVE YEARS— part.)
The good news is that a big reason why “continuous delivery” was a non-starter for Solaris 10 was that all the features needed to make it work at all, most notably IPS, were in Solaris 11. So it will definitely be easier to do this than it was 10 years ago. The questions are how much Oracle is willing to spend on backporting how many features from Solaris 12, and at what point do you start fudging the line between what is and isn’t a dot release?
The rain gage to me, and what I’d be asking as a customer, is, “When do you expect to continuously deliverate zero-downtime patching?” since that is A) on the top of the list of Solaris 12 features they’ve been talking about, and B) something that if it makes it into Solaris 11 would be strong proof that “Continuous Delivery” is doable, even for something requiring what would seem to be major changes to the kernel.
"...I'm not sure if this is a major deal"
I'm not entirely sure how one would define where an OS ends and applications start
This is actually a pretty important concept. If you don’t have a crystal-clear boundary between the OS and applications, you don’t really have an OS, and application compatibility across releases is a vague fantasy rather than reality. This was the rap against Linux since practically forever: that the OS interface guide was called "the kernel source code."
“and whether a lack of development in the OS is a major deal.”
Spoiler: it is. OSes keep evolving, either with outright new developments (think DTrace in the Solaris world), or co-opting and integrating features that had previously been bolted on outside the OS (virtualized compute, virtualized networking, virtualized storage come to mind). Security continues to be ripe for development.
An example of how lack of development can bite you: When Oracle bought Ksplice in 2011, it was a unique technology, allowing Linux sysadmins to apply kernel fixes without rebooting. Oracle has been talking about how they've been working to get similar functionality into Solaris ever since then, with Solaris 12 as the target release, which would be cool, but at this point it would now be catchup rather than a leadership feature.
So yeah, if this move means functionality like this is seriously delayed or even dropped from Solaris, it will be a major deal. Ditto for their work on integrating Docker. Solaris Containers/Zones is already great, but but adding Docker integration would have been extraordinarily useful.
"Solaris doesn't have systemd. Oracle would have to do quite a lot of porting then to accommodate such a package."
The Solaris equivalent to systemd is SMF, which came in with Solaris 10 in 2005. It was considered to be heretical by Unix traditionalists, but it was a major leap forward in service management and reliability. It’s another great example of “development in the OS being a major deal”.
There’s a lot more to OS development than just keeping existing userland programs running, or even accommodating new hardware. It’s the underlying plumbing, carefully hidden away from the applications (or presented as new services with stable interfaces), where innovation can really pay off. Killing off Solaris 12, which has been in development for over five years, and trying to shoehorn that work back into Solaris 11, is going to make it even harder for Solaris to stay current with OS trends than it had been.
What I’ll be looking for is signs of any of the advanced work that was going into Solaris 12 (and there’s more than what we’ve been talking about here) suddenly making its way exclusively into Oracle Linux.
"What the roadmap does tell us is that the new OS will debut in 2017"
The rather large box fades in and splays itself comfortably over 2017 and most of 2018. Generally in "arm-wavy roadmap" -speak, that means "Sure, 2017... or so."
Given that they're making a seemingly abrupt shift from Solaris 12 being the target development base for new features to Solaris 11, it doesn't seem likely that it's going to be ready any time soon.
I asked my smart meter if there was any credence to any of this. It said, "chill."
Mr. Language Person appreciates you holding the line
Thank you for saying "on-premises" despite EMC's slide saying "on-premise".
One Step Beyond?
"...touting Alpha as a step beyond anything else on the market at the time. It was mostly right: x86-64 didn't arrive until the year 2000."
Er, what? Even if you define "the market" as being "the market for processors desperately hoping to split the 'Wintel' atom", that still isn't true.
Florida thanks you.
I'm thinking El Reg needs to call a close to their experimental "Proof Automated Reading Is Sexy!" module, and hire the requisite callow intern.
Doesn't strike me as a good idea at all
I really don't like it when my web browser tries to outguess reality. If a page is missing, that's data of a sort right there. And instead showing me what is by definition outdated information? No. Don't.
I'm especially not crazy about the potential for a chilling effect. Sites will quickly learn that they can't actually delete a page -- unless they request that it be deleted from the Wayback Machine, too!
I've already seen archived sites get wiped from the IA at the request of a new domain owner. This is going to cause even more disappearances.
It takes a real man to apologize.
Re: Christ, just put it out of its misery now
I forgot about the intermediate step, there -- thanks.
Re: Christ, just put it out of its misery now
The VMS-derived OS that runs on Itanium is called "OpenVMS".
HP-UX was at one time promised to get an infusion of VMS file system and cluster technology, but that never happened.
HPE DONS SURPLICE, OFFERS PRAYER FOR ITANIC PASSENGERS
Now how hard was that?
I am following their lead
...and returning any and all awards to have been issued for my perpetual motion app, which *WOULD HAVE* provided limitless energy for the world, until you meddling kids went and spoiled it.
Well, as Tay pointed out, you have to know things about stuff to instantly recognize how ludicrous the very premise of this app is. And to be able to prove it, you *really* need skills beyond that of basic journalism -- or at least be smart enough to ask someone who does have the skills.
We're in a world where people are *shocked* to discover that yes, a jet airliner can disappear without there being satellite videos that will show exactly where it was for every second of its journey. And people want to feel good about being able to help from their armchairs (slacktivism). If wearing pink cures breast cancer, can't we solve the refugee disaster by swiping right? Don't we *deserve* the opportunity to know that downloading an app will fix everything??
Well, someone else downloading an app, really. I'd download it myself, but it looks kind of boring.
"ALL BUT useless?"
I suppose because it actually shows the weather for Misrata, Libya?
Re: I wonder when Microsoft is finally going to pull the plug.
"FYI ... X86 has been "RISC" since the "Ppro" in 1999"
Why? Because, you quote at us...
"the highest performing CPUs in the RISC line were almost indistinguishable from the highest performing CPUs in the CISC line"
That has nothing to do with x86 being "RISC". That has to do with *high-end* chips being possible in either RISC or CISC implementations.
In the *low* end -- which is what the OP was talking about -- the difference between RISC and CISC is that if you're not lugging around a large instruction set, you can implement a reasonably powerful core (or lots of cores) with a *lot* fewer transistors, meaning significantly smaller size, and much lower power.
What would be a proof point for this? I would look for a "CISC"-bound company getting out of the low-end chip business. Oh, look at that.
"Who nautical miles" are bigger on the inside.
Re: what is
Presumably they mean these boxes are built from Oracle's X5 systems, which in turn use Intel E5-2600 processors.
"This appears to be Sun's fault, and now Oracle's fault, because they used a derivative of a well-recognized public license, the MPL, a clear violation of the 'must be literally blessed by a man who appears in public wearing a disk platter on his head under the alter ego of "St. IGNUtius"' doctrine."
Antler heaven? Carry a big stick, Roger. The refrigerator is full
See? I can do this, too!
Re: Have to admit....
I imagine paragraph two will eventually be hit by a reorg, with the word "blog" targeted as redundant.
"premise" is not the same thing as "premises".
"On-premise" -- to the point, germane, appropriate.
"On-premises" -- at your place of business.
Flaunt: to show off, to provoke envy
Flout: to blatantly ignore or disregard
Re: I'm having a vague flashback here...
It would mean that in 2020, the amount of permanent data one person would generate in a year would fit in 3 millionths of the temporary working area of a single 64-bit application.
boop. beep. boop. beep.
Does it stay at the same number when you look away and look back a few seconds later if someone tasked with dealing with it is busy wrestling with someone?
For shame: Asimov's expository style was definitely more Shatner to Clarke's Stewart. The good doctor would have written something like:
"My God!" Quarv Seldnar exclaimed. "The stars! They're all... going *out*!"
Re: He should be ashamed
Just sayin', not thinkin'
Re: missle silos
Specifically -- for science, geography, history, and all that -- they're at Battery Guthrie on Fort Barry, near Rodeo Lagoon.
That's some serious industrial-strength messed-up, there.
Where's the warning label?
Re: Or, to summarise
But, FRUIT LOOP! Because it's FUNNY! *throws confetti*
Blue Screen of Death, or...
...Orange Screen of Smoke?
Re: Accident or Malicious?
"Otherwise I'd just manage the problem by flying evenly, at altitude, in the knowledge that they're unlikely to notice anything is wrong that way."
And I guess turning off the mappy screens -- "We're very sorry, we've had a technical problem, please enjoy this single episode of 'Spongebob Squarepants' looped over and over and over again". That seems reasonable.
But hoping that not one of the passengers -- or flight attendants! -- would notice that the terrain is kind of different, and/or the moon isn't where it's supposed to be? (No, I haven't checked whether the moon would have been up during the flight)
Ya know what? I wasn't saying Steve Jobs was anything other than an egocentric, selfish bar steward. However, what I was saying was that Gates' response to what took place were shortsighted and clueless, albeit not in those words.
I cannot think of one single quote from Bill Gates since -- I don't know, when did The Road Ahead come out? -- that has indicated he has any kind of pool of visionary thinking he's going to be tapping into here.
The Steve Jobs biography is littered with Gates comments that could pretty much be gathered together and published as "Advice Well Worth Ignoring."
Re: Ignore the obvious choice
Er, yes, but the PC/AT wasn't around in the PC days. The PC-101 keyboard came out several years after the original PC.
"Oops. Did hitting that mess something up for you?"
And I would like to add that asking for a single dedicated "BORK YOUR COMPUTER" key on a computer keyboard may be the single stupidest thing I have ever heard a multizillionaire brag about.
"Microsoft. We're so confident that you'll need to reboot, we want a DEDICATED KEY for it."
We Unix people laughed and laughed when one of the most vaunted features of Windows 2000 was that it would go *so long* without rebooting -- like *30 days* -- that they built in a special "reboot at a regular interval" feature.
Which, of course, we would have called "cron". If we thought that it was a good idea in the first place.
Re: The purpose of Surface
Actually, the article seems to be pretty reasonable; the headline, which I'm sure Vance didn't write, is over the top and doesn't exactly match the content.
Article sez: Microsoft just threw a big faux-Apple show to introduce a product of the kind its OEMs weren't willing to make. And oh, by the way, the OEMs weren't willing to do so primarily because there's very little R&D money to be found for hardware once they've forked over the bulk of their margins to Redmond.
The most embarrassing part of the article is the gush over the stand (ZOMG, it sounds like a LUXURY CAR DOOR!). At least he called out the one guy who said he had a disturbingly deep love for his keyboard.
Re: "Damn you hamfingered digits and lack of proofreading"
I hear Jimmy Wales is eager to pitch in.
Re: The purpose of Surface
"Linux on the surface would be awesome." Yes, because what Linux is known for is its AWESOME DESKTOP and SEAMLESS ESOTERIC HARDWARE integration.
You know what would look really good on it? OS X.
But this all misses the point. Microsoft is not really interested in selling razors. They're selling razor blades. Lovely, lovely razor blades with big colorful animated rectangles that you'll LIKE, dammit! Just give them a chance!
I'm a frequent editor, but I don't think of myself as being part of the WP inner, middle or even recognized outer circle.
...and I find the new editor to be pretty awful. First of all, my editing is necessarily of the "get in, get out and move on" style; it's usually because I see something in an article I came to read, and it hurts my eyes. The new editor is slow than sin to fire up.
Second, anyone who edits WP regularly knows what's behind the skin, and I think it would scare us all to death to trust the fragile thing that is the markup to a visual editor of recent origin.
I suspect new/infrequent editors might like it better than having to learn the markup, though.
Here's one thing that made me laugh: if you go to your preferences to turn it off, you'll see that the option isn't something like "use the old editor" -- it's "temporarily disable VE during beta." You LIKE scented air! It's fresh and invigorating! Please stand by while we make it even MORE wonderful! In time, you will learn to love me!
Re: Yeah, about that Windows button...
Oh yeah, I'm delighted with some of the two-key presses. Windows-L, for example. That's why the "fix it with a table knife" solution is not optimal.
Re: Yeah, about that Windows button...
A late reply...
it's really both. The fact that I accidentally hit the Windows key as often as I do is certainly due to the difference between the two OSes. (And: Microsoft's introduction of the Control key as a function modifier ranks right up there in the "teethgrindingly annoying decisions" Hall of Fame, right along with their using the backslash as the file path separator instead of slash, by the way. And yes, I *know* why they did both. Doesn't make it any better.)
But -- having a key that acts in two ways like this is still a bad decision, as well. Those who have pointed out that some Linux desktops do the same thing with "Alt" doesn't make that a good decision, either. Nor does the fact that the Windows key has behaved that way since before Windows 8.
I did finally discover on my own that pressing it again toggles back from Chiclet land to the desktop.
Oh and yes, I also very much hate the "multiple presses of Shift activates Sticky Keys" feature, and turn it off whenever I remember it. (I remember it, of course, when I press the Shift key a few times to wake up a blank screen.) But that doesn't help when I'm working on someone else's computer.
Yeah, about that Windows button...
I have to ask: whose brilliant idea was it to have a key that's both a modifier key AND a function key?
As a recent conscript to Windows 8, I can't tell you how many times I've held down the Windows button instead of the control key (part of this is Mac reflexes). If I accidentally hold down, say, the Shift or Alt key, no problem. However, releasing the Windows key without pressing another key of course means the computer no longer thinks I was going to do something useful, and instead interprets the keypress as "Take me to the land of shiny colored boxes." Argh.
"but the NT kernel is the direct descendant of VMS. :)"
Well, more like the bastard brother of VMS, with Cutler jumping ship from DEC to MSFT to do his thing. And then, apparently, losing control of the project and having it mangled beyond recognition by his new colleagues.
I always did like the VMS -> WNT alphabetic progression, though.