No dice, comrade! Senate floats Russia-busting election law The US Senate is mulling a bill that would call for sanctions on any country caught trying to hack or influence American elections. The Defending Elections from Threats by Establishing Redlines (DETER) Act covers any foreign nation, but focuses particularly on Russia, where Kremlin agents carried out their campaign to tip the …
I dont really get your angst here Guus. It seems (although i havent read the full Bill's text) a reasonable response to a proven problem. If someone's proven to be trying to meddle in the democratic process then why shouldnt they get a slap on the wrist in the form of sanctions (since money is usually the only thing those at the top care about). There's no option for military action or the like, its purely trade and sanctions options on the table.
What is kinda sad is that such a bill is necessary - If your intelligence chiefs turn around and say blah and blah were trying to meddle in the election, then responding with some sanctions should have been the first course of action for the newly elected president/prime minister. It doesnt matter if they were trying to help you or hinder you (or just mess with the system!). Because that didnt happen, this law which would make action a requirement. Doesnt seem unreasonable to protect one of the prime tenets in a democracy.
By the way I'm not an American, and i think the American political system is a broken mess, but it doesnt mean others should be allowed to f%&k with it, without response...
So a Russian trollfarm spending $4500 on ads swung the votes into Trump's favour?
If you think that had any impact, you either believe the US population is really gullible ort hat the Clinton campign who literally spent billions of dollars was inept.
What swung the elections is the 8 years of recent abuse of the US electorate by the democrat govt with four years more of the same in the near future.
Aside from that. Who is the US govt to complain about meddling in elections. Are they afraid of the competition, because meddling in foreign elections is their forte.
The Angst, dear lglethal, is that this bill / act is a foot in the door for future governments to broaden the retaliation aspects... It's not unheard of that once a government has the ability to do something small, they want to be able to do more... The saying goes: "Give them a hand, they take the whole arm"... It's just human nature...
Yes. Retrospectively back to the mid 60's at least, others may mention Korea. One of my earliest memories from the TV news is the Mi Lai (sp?) massacre. Lt Calley was it?
On a side note, slightly related i suppose, i'd played Arlo Guthries "Alice's Restaurant Massacree" a couple of times before i't clicked as to why there were no deaths.
One of the retards is promoting this Bill. Marco Rubio must be on steroids and amphetamine and never sleeps, because he is out there threatening other country's elected governments, trying to pass bills and commenting on everything including the kitchen sink. Expect to see him as a rabid presidential hopeful inan election near you sooner rather than later.
I know that the US has quite a track record in fiddling other countries' elections, this is really pot-kettle-black.
But in the case of Venezuela, I think the current situation is largely of their own making. Decades of underinvestment (so you could spend dosh on you favourite ground and projects instead) and filling positions based on loyalty rather than competence goes a long way to explain the current mess.
The problem seems to be fundamental to mineral wealth, please list five countries with vast natural resources compared to population which are not in some sort of mess. I give you Norway.
If you have any involvement in a campaign and you are contacted by any non-citizen regarding providing help, money, etc. for your campaign and don't immediately report it to the FBI. Or if you provide any election information to foreigners. What Don Jr. did in 2016 in setting up that meeting in Trump Tower with Russians or what Manafort did in providing polling data to Kilimnick may not have been illegal, but it sure as hell should be!
If you have any involvement in a campaign and you are contacted by any non-citizen regarding providing help, money, etc. for your campaign and don't immediately report it to the FBI. Or if you provide any election information to foreigners.
Saudis and Israelis giving huge gobs of money to presidential candidates and their foundations are not non-citizens then?
And newspapers goes to court for, say, publishing polls and the location of polling stations on the internet, or indeed anywhere where a tourist might read it?
Campaigns ALREADY can't legally accept campaign contributions from Saudis or Israelis. AIPAC for example is a US based lobbying company that lobbies on behalf of Israel but it is supported by Americans. Or at least is supposed to be, if some of the money comes from Israel they at least hide it well enough to avoid getting caught.
Campaigns NEVER share their internal polling data with newspapers, they consider that one of their most closely held secrets. That's why it was so strange to hear that Manafort shared Trump's data with Kilimnick. The media does their own polling, along with independent organizations like Gallup, and the most you hear about internal polling is that campaigns will always claim their internal polling shows a rosier picture when their candidate is behind. But they don't share the data itself.
that will never happen, the Cuntons and other dems (and likely reps too) accepted so much money from China (not a secret), its a staple of corrupt politics in the US - and they won't make rules that take money out of their own pockets - only yours and mine.
The worst thing is, there's enough of a mess of Americans interfering with the whole US democratic process, from the way district boundaries are drawn, electoral rolls are kept, campaign financing (CPACs anyone?)... and then after the elections, the lobbying, pork tacked onto every bill etc etc.
Foreign interference should be quite low down on their priority list if they really want a functioning democracy
The worst thing is, there's enough of a mess of Americans interfering with the whole US democratic process, from the way district boundaries are drawn, electoral rolls are kept, campaign financing (CPACs anyone?).
And then there's 'opposition research' that was behind a lot of the Russiaphobia. A dodgy dossier full of unverifiable allegations that should make for a simple libel case, and bankrolled by the Democrats. But that's US politics. Their last election seemed to show just how low things can go, and given the infighting & dirty tricks, there's probably little need for outside interference.
(and then of course, there's Joe Biden. Assuming he dodges his groping allegations, a future contender. As long as nobody looks too closely at his influence in Ukraine, or his son's role in Burisma..)
"Among the Russia-specific provisions are calls for the White House to produce and maintain a regular report on the net worth of Russian President Vladimir Putin, and any other individuals who would potentially have an interest in meddling with US affairs."
Does this mean we get to see Trump's tax returns? (Along with all other candidates, of course. Can't pick and choose.)
Loch K. Johnson: “We’ve been doing this kind of thing since the C.I.A. was created in 1947,” said Mr. Johnson, now at the University of Georgia. “We’ve used posters, pamphlets, mailers, banners — you name it. We’ve planted false information in foreign newspapers. We’ve used what the British call ‘King George’s cavalry’: suitcases of cash.”
Apart from US meddling happening since Italy in the 1948 election, and no doubt for many elections in Latin America before that: if I were a smallish to medium country I would pray every day not to allow any trade or contacts with America, and let them impose what sanctions they may to keep themselves out. Only private citizens would be welcomed. No USAR military bases and no businessmen to destroy indigenous industries through competition and blanketing.
No more exploitation, and no furthering of democracy, no Free Trade, no Free Market ideology and no whiny diplomats telling one what to do, no more congressthings under the illusion they rule the world... sounds like heaven.
perhaps the US government and such people as Marco Antonio Rubio - that tribune of the people, as his given names suggest - which continually interfere in the internal affairs of other, nominally sovereign countries, could sanction themselves out of existence ?...
Henri
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