Chinese hackers switch tactics for spying on Russian jet makers

Re: similar looking aircraft

Thanks to the laws of aerodynamics and materials science, there are only so many ways you can lay out an aircraft performing any given role.

Up to a point, but there's a question of HOW similar the Chinese version is. Rafale, Gripen, Typhoon are all somewhat similar designs, but I don't think I'd conclude that they were the product of espionage, whereas some aircraft designs are so similar that you have to conclude that they are copies.

Mind you, when it comes to keeping up with the military Joneses, the Chinese have a long way to go before they overshadow my favourite modern aircraft, the Iranian Q313 "stealth fighter"......

Re: similar looking aircraft

Aerodynamically speaking, I'd say that there are currently four basic forms: fuselage-based, lifting body augmented, flying wing (FW) and blended wing-body (arguably, BWB is a subclass of flying wing).

As far as fighters are concerned, fuselage-based is the oldest form and is used in all of the current U.S. fighters (F-15, F-16, F/A-18, F-22 & F-35). Lifting body augmented was first used, in a fighter application, in the U.S. F-14, and was also employed in the YF-23, but now is only used in the Russian MiG-29, SU-27 family & Sukhoi T-50.

In the context of fighters, both flying wing and Blended wing-body suffer from poor yaw control, but are being tried in some 'agile' drones.

The important thing though, is that any spying will be directed at the electronics fit, not the aerodynamics, and so will not be reflected in the appearance or form of the aircraft.

The appeal of stealing details of the F-35 is that it will make it possible to screw not only its flight & fighting systems but also its logistics & maintenance systems.

Re: similar looking aircraft

Everyone spies on everyone and it's overly simplistic to write china off as copycats.

It's not just weapons. They copy damned near anything and everything and then sell it to the world. Their law says only native Chinese can coyright and they will only enforce native Chinese copyright. Everyone else is ignored. Even now, there is fighting going on internally as the Chinese copyright/patent laws are not being enforced and companies are stealing from each other.

Re: An impressive list

" Including nukes, but not aircraft carriers (unless I'm mistaken)."

On it's way.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/comes-chinas-first-home-built-180207705.html

Re: An impressive list

China, like Russia, will continue to be treated with the utmost caution so as to not push them too far.

I think both the US and the Russkies have hardly treated each other with caution, and if anything the US have been particularly aggressive, eg meddling in Ukrainian politics to the point of provoking the Russian invasion, moving tanks 5,000 miles round the globe to park on the Poland/Russia border, flying military aircraft right along the boundary of Russian airspace, etc. I'm under no illusions about the Russian provocations and interventions, and China's outlandish territorial claims to the South China Sea are a provocation of enormous magnitude.

Seems to me that there's no caution at all, just an expectation by the major powers that they can do roughly what they want so long as they don't directly attack another major power with military force. OTOH it is absolutely fine for the major powers to invade any non-nuclear armed country they choose - which seems to be an approach that (in the modern age) the US are cheerleaders for (aided and abetted by Britain?).

Of course, all of this is bad news for nuclear non-proliferation, because the obvious lesson is that you don't get invaded if you've got the big stick. Why end up like Saddam or Gadaffi, when you can build your own talisman to protect against invasion? Despite the claims about WMD, it is obvious to a two year old that nobody would have attacked Iraq if they actually believed that the country had a working WMD arsenal, since it would undoubtedly have been used.

Back to espionage: Does it matter? No. The big guys still aren't going to fight each other, and the US and Russians will be just as keen to steal any Chinese technology when the opportunity exists.

Re: An impressive list

Certain functionaries in the US administration have already commented that they expect a war with China. The islands China has taken over will probably be the excuse.

Re: That is worrying...

Not only the MiG-35, but the utterly bonkers MiG-41 is under development., due for release around 2020 and the even more crazy Ayaks.

Re: That is worrying...

"This is worrying on a couple of levels."

1: You assume China and Russia are friendly. They've been to war twice in the last century.

2: You're also assuming the chinese want to copy the aircraft rather than simply work out what's needed to take or keep them out of the air

3: Russia and the USA have "domestic" and "export" tech. Russia might have sold china a few Mig-35s but they won't be equipped with the same technology that the domestic versions get. In the same way USA export version F35s are inferior to domestic ones (and this extends downrange to things like F15/16s, the export versions are significantly less capable than the domestic units)

Correct - but still a very bad excuse to use, for various reasons.

Re: Look on the bright side

We could save a huge pile of cash by buying F35s from China.

Won't help the UK: You don't think they'd be daft enough to copy and build the B variant do you?

If they stole the B designs, it would only be by mistake, or to laugh at them.

Re: Serve them right!

> I wonder what other horribly expensive failures we can trick them into spending billions on?

Well we have managed to convince them that the idea of giving out cheap central bank backed mortgages to inflate the price of property is a wise investment idea and the path to economic prosperity.

In the last few years, and even as we speak, their property prices in the big cities are skyrocketing off cheap loans, while they are frantically building new "affordable" housing in ghost cities where virtually nobody wants to buy due to the hassle of commuting, and because they won't get the same ROI as a trendy spot in the big city.

They have blown such a massive asset bubble that now people are trying to get their wealth out of the country before it collapses (into places like Vancouver, hence the explosive house price bubble over there).

The next "good idea" is us attempting to convince them to transition to a "consumer" economy, which means cheap credit to the masses to they can spend it on disposable trinkets and dig themselves into a hole they can never get out of. We are hard at work trying to convince them this is a good idea, because it will allow an increase in "money supply", resulting in more goods purchased, more income earned, and people might actually be able to buy their way out of the debt hole they created (yeah right).