US government sued by activists looking for backdoor smoking gun The Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) is suing the US government to reveal just how it compels tech companies to help agents spy on people. The activist group has hit the Department of Justice (DoJ) with a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) lawsuit in the US Northern California District Court requesting details on whether …
questions the extent to which the FBI and NSA wish to extend their powers to gather and retain communications collected during investigation mass surveillance.
Hogan did, however, end up granting the two agencies' motion to continue their intelligence-gathering mass surveillance operations.
FTFY
@ a_yank_lurker
That was my question too. I don't see how any of this passes muster, the whole National Security Letter nonsense smells awful too. An order from a secret court that the recipient can't even talk about?
The problem is that the Supreme Court has ruled in the past that money is speech, and corporations are people, so who knows what they're even for any more.
A FOIA request is great and all but what, exactly does anyone believe this will accomplish?
I am not suggesting it is inherently pointless as we must always keep questioning our elected leaders. But a FOIA, while theoretically able to bypass the FISC, is still subject to that most versatile of 'get out of jail free' cards: 'National Security'.
Nothing about a FOIA request requires that the response - if provided - must be 100% complete and un-redacted so anyone who thinks that such a request will force the government to reveal information it is not already willing to provide is perhaps in for some disappointment.
It tells ordinary people that these agencies are up to no good, and the expected rebuffs and evasions makes the point even more clearly. It also serves to bounce the 'nothing to hide - nothing to fear' back on them. People are slowly beginning to take this in, and starting to take measures to protect themselves.
It's a long game though.
EFF is just wasting government time and money. They gripe about crap the gov't does, yet adds to the problem. It's costs a lot of time and money each time a FOIA requests is launched. You didn't think the all this information is just lying in one spot and "plunk" it's available to give out?
This isn't to say, there aren't times when FOIA requests shouldn't be done; however, in this case it's just wasteful nonsense.
There is a court system in place which overseas this.. and as of yet, nobody has been hurt by being investigated...well, unless you're a criminal.
Yet... think of the lives which have been saved and the amount of violent criminals which have been put in jail. Violent criminals which could commit acts where you hang out or shop. Not to mention other crimes like credit card fraud and identity stealing.
So go on and continue making it more difficult for the government to protect us and less difficult for thieves to steal your identity.
Once in a blue moon I come across a post I wish I could upvote a thousand times.
You have introduced me to the reverse of this concept.
All this stuff going on behind closed doors - no oversight - secret courts, secret orders, public treated as the enemy - no accountability - numerous abuses of power etc. ad nauseam and your response to the freedom of every person you know being jeopardized amounts to:
"Yeah, but it makes us safer dunnit"
You Sir, are an ignorant twat and a prime example of why we are in this fucking mess.
"Fact is, you still need a court order to "spy" on the public in America. In an "emergency" (yeah, this can be debated), you get a week to petition for the warrant. Which is really what the friction point is.
Still... it is better than most countries which have no laws against the government spying on their citizens. Not only do most countries allow it, but there isn't any judical oversight. So don't be so quick to bash the American system. You are probably being spied on this moment if you aren't in the US... and cannot do anything about it."
HAHAHA! Impressive lurk, too...11th Sep 2008 -7 days ago. Something seems to have happened in the meantime to change the guy into a living embodiment of Godwin's Law. Promotion? Different poster?
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