back to article PC market shambling towards an unquiet grave

The ongoing decline in PC shipments has continued in Q1 2016, according to Gartner and IDC. Depending on which set of numbers you prefer, the cold number is that between 60.6 million (IDC) and 64.8 million (Gartner) machines shipped in the quarter. The misery is clear in the table below. Vendor Gartner Q1 shipments ( …

  1. Innocent-Bystander*

    Old Story

    The industry has matured, the technology is more than good enough for 99% of the population and we are in a phase where if a computer is not broken it won't be replaced. Since well built desktops usually don't break for about 5-7 years, I don't imagine these numbers will be getting any better.

    That doesn't mean that the PC market is heading to its grave. It just means it's settling into a stable replacement cycle. We just haven't found what that looks like yet..

    1. a_yank_lurker

      Re: Old Story

      History is repeating itself, this time with PC's while earlier it was with other products. During this period there will be more consolidation/shake-out. Another reason for the market stability is many users do not need the latest version of Office for example. Their needs are met perfectly a version 2 or 3 releases back. So there is no compelling software release that will obsolete their current kit.

    2. joed

      Re: Old Story

      on the bright side - due to users insisting on getting portable, the equipment they get has lifespan of just few years. Easy to damage, messy as f... (anyone wanted a 2nd hand system with keyboard consisting of fast-food menu and worn keys?) and batteries that may not be replaceable.

    3. Mikel

      Re: Old Story

      Peak PC occurred in 2010, with a surge of buying before the end of availability of Windows XP. 85m PCs were sold in Q1 of 2010. A third more than this year. We can lay the blame squarely on Wintel, their indisputable determination to drive the market where it doesn't want to go.

      Or, if you prefer, 2 billion PCs were sold last year - the vast majority of them being these innovative new battery powered always-connected Personal Computers. PC sales never slowed down at all: we just forgot what a PC was. As usual, whether the news is good or bad depends on where you are. Your point of view.

      https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2011/apr/14/pc-market-has-passed-its-peak

    4. ecofeco Silver badge

      Re: Old Story

      We have found the cycle. It's about 7 years. This was known back in the 1990s. Just because it's being ignored doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

      Win 8 and 10 are really not helping either.

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    and businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades in quantity until the end of the year.

    ... if then.

    This is why MS are trying to force Win10 (OS by software subscription) down people's throats, rather than let them sit on Win 7/8/8.1 and not have to pay.

    Unfortunately for MS, many businesses aren't stupid. (hopefully most, but we'll see...)

  3. Ole Juul

    crying wolf

    - PC market shambling towards an unquiet grave

    - The two are agreed that the market remains in sharp decline.

    It's a way of talking that fits short sighted bean counters. The reality is that not so many are being sold lately and likely things are just levelling off. Like the "decline" of the CD this could be news for the next 10 years or more.

    1. DropBear
      Joke

      Re: crying wolf

      Well they clearly showed about 10% decline - which means in ten years, there will be exactly zero PCs sold! ...isn't that how statistics works?

    2. Mikel

      Re: crying wolf

      We are already six years in. The story that it was a temporary glitch got the channel to overstock on dead inventory three times already. They are unlikely to buy that story again. We are like four generations of Intel processor and two major versions of Windows into a decline of the Wintel PC - which had never had any decline previous in its history.

    3. Vector

      Re: crying wolf

      "The reality is that not so many are being sold lately and likely things are just levelling off."

      No, the reality is they are being replaced. As productivity apps mature in the mobile space along with accessories such as bluetooth input devices and various display interfaces to make productivity possible, more and more people will find that their phone will do everything they need and abandon the traditional PC market altogether. This will take a bit longer in the business space, but they too will follow eventually and the PC will go the way of the VCR into antiquity.

      I know many people refuse to believe it, but this is coming sooner rather than later.

  4. Mikel

    Shocked! Shocked, I say!

    Um wait. No. The other thing.

    Cancel Christmas again for HPQ and Dell. Six(?) times running. The execs may as well admit that Santa died. He's not coming back.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This is the year I'll finally be boosting those stats. New Zen desktops all around, and some low wattage servers based on Skylake, or is it Goldmont, Apollo lake? I can never keep up with Intel's ridiculous naming scheme, but whatever comes out next for low power SoC.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: whatever comes out next for low power SoC.

      whatever comes out next for low power SoC ... isn't normally associated with Intel, unless you're still tied to Windows.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    So they are admitting their forecasts a few months ago of 0.5% decline are wrong?

    Or do they still hold to those forecasts I said were ridiculous, assuming that something magic will happen to increase sales in Q2-Q4?

    This is bloody obvious, as people who have PCs have no reason to replace them, because a 2016 PC doesn't do anything a five or heck even ten year old PC can't do. Plus a growing number of people are getting along just fine with their phone or tablet, and doesn't see the need to own a PC any longer. The type of people who read the Reg can't imagine living without a PC, but the type of people who read USA Today or The Guardian certainly can.

    1. Flocke Kroes Silver badge

      Re: Gartner forecasts

      Gartner have predicted of sorts of rubbish over the years. I have more confidence in Raspberry Pi's outselling desktops within a decade than in a random Gartner forecast.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Android held back by Chrome

    I think the numbers would be a lot worse, but Android is really held back by Chrome.

    So the bigger tablets with faster processors are being used to run Chrome or Windows not Android.

    e.g. Contrast the Pixel Chrome with the Pixel C. Googles 2 home brand tablets. The Pixel C has a smaller screen (10 inch) and less storage. It doesn't even have a flash card slot, they want you to backup to their NSA friendly cloud not to a flash card presumably?

    And instead of Google pushing ahead with Android for bigger platforms (they were late into the split screen Android implementation and so are behind now), it puts Chrome on those instead.

    The last slightly larger tablet was the Galaxy Note Pro 12.2 from 2 years ago, and that suffered from being powered by USB (it would quietly drain its battery even when on the charger if you had the screen running and so it wasn't propular).

    Now Samsung makes a big tablet, but not in Android (it runs Windows 10) and with a new higher power charger!

    http://www.samsung.com/us/explore/tab-pro-s-features-and-specs/?cid=ppc-

    So there is no high spec Android tablets to compete with Apples iPad Pro. And certainly no desktop PCs. The closest thing are 'media' TVs with only 1080p resolution and lowered processing power to match. Windows lives on in the home in that niche.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Android held back by Chrome

      So there is no high spec Android tablets to compete with Apples iPad Pro.

      I have one of those Galaxy Note Pro 12.2's. Can't stand the thing, mostly because Android is such a disgusting mess of crap and not-well-thought-out design

      But the nail in this things coffin is that Samsung doesn't release updates for it any more. Haven't in ages. The recent exploits for Android will all likely root this thing.

      If I'd bought an iPad (the Pro wasn't out at the time), it would still be receiving updates still, and likely would for years to come.

      From my perspective the biggest problem to Android has nothing to do with Chrome. It's Android being pretty crap in usage (Samsung's version at least), plus their absolutely ridiculous decision to not support the their hardware (via software updates) just a few months after purchase. I'd almost suspect that's illegal. :(

      1. stephajn

        Re: Android held back by Chrome

        "But the nail in this things coffin is that Samsung doesn't release updates for it any more. Haven't in ages."

        I have the same device you do. To think that this was supposed to be a premium device for them and a top tier product line. And yet the thing is still sitting on Android 5.0.2. This is precisely why I refuse to shell out any more money for any Samsung device no matter how flashy or great its reviews are. The fact is that Samsung releases it, gives it a few months of support for software updates and then tosses you out on your ass for their next "premium" device.

  8. Pascal Monett Silver badge
    Facepalm

    "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades in quantity"

    Can someone please take that turkey behind the shed and finally shoot it ?

    We are told by literally everyone that Win 1 0 runs better than Win7/Vista/8.x - if that is the case, PC sales will absolutely not be impacted by Win 1 0 "upgrades" because businesses, and everyone else, are going to install it on an existing computer, not a new one.

    Except the businesses that have a global maintenance contract that includes machine replacement, obviously - but the OS version has no impact on that. Businesses can perfectly state they want the new machine with Win7 if they want, it would make no difference on the number of PCs sold.

    Gartner : copy/pasting last decade's reasons into next year's report without ever checking that reality has changed in between. There's an economic crisis going on Gartner, you might want to factor that in some time.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades in quantity"

      Windows 10 might well perform better than earlier versions, but still has the user interface step change of Windows 8 to put everybody off.

      And the downside of the higher performance is that it also slurps your private data faster than any predecessor Windows os.

  9. EvadingGrid

    I want a "Raspberry PC" ~ something that does not need a 500W power supply, or sound like a jet engine on take off . . . and I dont want a huge crate on my desktop when I can have a little box. I'm carefully watching things like the Odriod-C2 and the declining PC sales market. I'm also drooling over the hardware acceleration possible with tech like NEON.

    1. Nigel 11

      Raspberry PC

      Buy yourself a mini-ITX motherboard with an Intel J1800 or J1900 passive-cooled CPU (NB not all such motherboards are fanless - check first!) Add 8Gb of RAM and an SSD and assemble it in a tiny mini-ITX case with a "brick" external PSU. Voila - no moving parts, total silence. A slightly larger case will also have space for a 3.5 inch multi-Tb HDD should you want that, and the faint whirring and clicking noises it brings.

      It's "slow". It's plenty fast enough to run a Linux Desktop, Firefox, Chrome if you want it, LibreOffice without pain. Windows I cannot vouch for. It actually boots (linux) faster than any PC with an HDD however fast its CPU. This is one of my home PCs. It uses so little electricity when idling, I leave it turned on all the time.

      Why you have to build it yourself for lack of anybody selling it pre-assembled, I don't know. Isn't "Tiny, totally silent, no moving parts" the sort of thing that sells a new PC when the old one is refusing to become obsolete within 36 months?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Raspberry PC

        Why would you build using the J1900 (which blows goats), when for roughly the same money you could use N3150?

        1. Nigel 11

          Re: Raspberry PC

          blows goats

          The N3150 did not exist when I built mine, and it is still £30-£40 dearer. And the benchmarks here suggest that it's not much if any faster than a J1900. http://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-intel_celeron_n3150-511-vs-intel_celeron_j1900-327

          Anyway if you choose a system like this you probably don't care about faster CPU. I have another PC (i5) which I use if the silent lightweight box isn't fast enough. I don't seem to use it much these days.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Like many people, what I really want is for somebody to make a Raspberry PC that could run a real desktop.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Luckily for the industry...

    ...there are folk like me who go out and buy the newest shiny as soon as it come out. Unfortunately my urban tribe tend to favour a particular brand - it wouldn't be fruitful to give them any more publicity, but they make really grape products.

    Yes sir, your double maxi-light-lattichino espresso single house hi-premium blend will be with you in a moment!

  12. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    So "exponential" growth turned out to be sigmoidal. Why should Gartner or anyone else be surprised?

  13. adam payne

    "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades in quantity until the end of the year"

    "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10" statement fixed.

    1. bombastic bob Silver badge

      Re: "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades<snip>"

      The question, then, is what will businesses do when MICROSOFT! STOPS! SELLING! W7PRO! IN! OCTOBER!!!

      "Ape" (8.x) won't be much of an option, either. It may be time for the business world to consider a Linux-based alternative.

      (had to edit the title, it was too long)

      1. MT Field

        Re: "businesses aren't going to be running Windows 10 upgrades<snip>"

        We are very much married to Outlook/Exchange so have to dance to MS's tune. Hmm ... that rhymes with Zune ...

  14. bombastic bob Silver badge

    marketeers still don't have a clue, do they?

    It seems to me that the marketeers *STILL* don't understand why PC sales are down. I've explained this before, and I'll do it again. Captain Obvious (me) says "no need to thank me"

    1. Moore's law stopped making the user-perceived speed of next year's computer 50% faster than this year's computer.

    2. MS hasn't put out a good OS since 7, and they're generally perceived as being *INFERIOR* than what people already have (in one way or another, from appearance to performance to features to whatever). Win-10-nic fanbois will disagree and downvote me because I said this.

    3. because of 1 and 2, people aren't replacing old computers. maybe they get a new hard drive, but they don't need to upgrade something that works.

    4. the economy stinks because of bad gummint policies, and it's giving people less disposable income, so VANITY 'new computer' sales aren't happening, either.

    So yeah, as predicted, slabs did NOT replace desktops or notebooks. marketeers were looking at 'new computer sales' as if people threw their existing computers out every year, and "not buying a new one" means you don't have an EXISTING one (or that getting a slab meant that the PC desktop went in the trash). OBVIOUSLY not the case. But they didn't think of that at all. No, they just look at DERIVATIVE numbers, thinking it's an INTEGRAL.

  15. Howard Hanek
    Headmaster

    The solution

    ....is an invasion by alien illiterates. Oh wait! Now I see WHY immigration policies have been so lax.

  16. NatalieEGH

    Development has slowed

    I do not know that much about the general desktop computer sales but I imagine the main reasons for slowing of sales are:

    1. The technology for new systems is not growing as fast as in recent years. I am retired and consider myself an enthusiast. I used to spend a thousands of dollars every year or two to keep my system current or near current. My current system is 2.5 years old. The only recent update as been to switch from using two NVidia 760 GPUs to two NVidia 980Ti. My 3 year old processor is still runs at about 90% of the processing power as a current Intel i7 5930 processor and only slightly slower than the current i7 170 generation processors.

    2. As previously indicated, new processors are not providing significant increases in processing power. While workstations can be replaced with systems that have the lastest instruction set and more processors, the software has not been modified to take advantage and automatically scale to the number of virtual processors available to the system. Most programs still only reside in one processor at a time. Until programs useful to the specific businesses are written to take advantage of the latest instructions or designed to scale with number of processors, most businesses will see at best a 3% increase in processor speed. This increase is generally not sufficient to even be noticed by the individual users as most are using very little of the processors they currently have. The increased speed is therefore useless to the business world and there are only so many enthusiasts out there.

    3. There have been no significant increases in storage technology. Yes, Seagate has come out with their 8TB and 10TB drives but those are really only useful for long term archival. They are not suitable for constant reading, modifying, and writing. Further the speed of the drives has not significantly increased even in the SSD category with the only real exception being drives such as the Intel DC P3500 series which plug into a PCI-e slot and the m.2 SATA III drives.

    4. Memory speed increases provided by DDR4 compared to DDR3 are again not noticeable by most users outside the enthusiast community. Unless the user is processing a lot of data or doing CPU/memory intensive processes, like video editing, the speeds gained by the new memory, I would guess might save the 30-60 seconds in a day. Again not enough for the user to notice.

    5. No new technologies have appeared in the last year that call that call to businesses or to enthusiasts. The only real changes have been in software such as Windows 10, which will almost surely be an anathema to extremists that like full control over their system, and cloud processing and storage that actually reducing the processing requirements of workstations and home systems.

    To sum this all up, at present there is little to no reason for businesses to upgrade the workstations in the individual work areas in the current machine is less than 3 years old and probably less than 5 years old. Private users fall into the same category. Desktop systems are not on the way out. Businesses must just scale to reduced change over as systems now have a much longer life/duty cycle before replacement will be required. It is much like automobiles, once everyone has a good car they only replace when it starts having problems or they feel it is just time to replace their old but still functioning system.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I wonder where Microsoft comes in with Surface on this chart. It seems like people are buying a ton of Surfaces.... I wonder if that is considered a tablet. If so, may not be all bad for Microsoft.

  18. Mark Spooner

    Statistics

    When one sees difference int 1-2% range one wonders what the "plus or minus" is that applies to this report.

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