back to article GOP senators push FCC to kill support for local broadband

A group of US Senators is asking the FCC to dial back its support for local governments that wish to set up municipal ISPs. The eight Senators, all Republicans, sent a letter [PDF] to FCC chairman Tom Wheeler asking that he provide more information on the FCC's recent actions on behalf of local governments who wished to set up …

  1. phil dude
    WTF?

    verbatim, from ATT...

    Verbatim, how corrupt the industry is.

    Phil, we have an offer that could save you money!

    For $15 a month†† for 12 months (1‑yr term with combined billing; other charges apply), you will get AT&T U‑verse® High Speed Internet at our best price....

    ....††$15 U-verse Internet Offer: Price for Express (1.5Mbps) Internet after bill credit for new residential Internet customers. Requires another AT&T service (TV/Voice/Wireless) and combined billing on a single AT&T bill. After 12 mos., then prevailing rate (currently up to $42) applies unless canceled by customer prior to end of promo period. 12 mos...

    WTF? 1.5Mbps?

    P.

    1. Number6

      Re: verbatim, from ATT...

      That's how it is in a lot of places, crappy low-speed DSL even if your line supports more. At least if Comcast is in the area there's an option for higher speeds, and when it's working there's nothing wrong with it (except the price). Perhaps the municipal broadband ought to work like Openreach with independent ISPs - here's the infrastructure, pay us to get access to it and offer services to your customers.

      1. edge_e
        Facepalm

        Re: verbatim, from ATT...

        But but but capitalism works........

        1. phil dude
          FAIL

          Re: verbatim, from ATT...

          To refine the point, I live <0.5 miles from a 100 Gb/s connection (to ORNL, home to worlds #2 supercomputer), and <0.1 miles from a University of TN building (with ~100Mb/s).

          For a giggle I called up Comcast (who promised 2Gbps!!!!!!!!!!!! in a press release for this Town), and they could not confirm it was possible for my location...unless I ordered it, in which case it may not be available but "it would make sure". $500 to install, $300/mth 24 months, $500 to disconnect(! WTF?).

          Comcast is basically offering an absurdly expensive "hypothetical" product so that when the FCC sues, they'll say "look we tried, but noone wanted it".

          Customer rip-offs occupy the space left by a vacuum of competition...

          P.

          1. JaitcH
            WTF?

            Re: verbatim, from ATT...

            Fibre Optic is easier to run than copper wire.

            I have a summer 'cottage' near Dak Lake in DakLak Province, VietNam. For years I have run a string of TP-Link Access Points in a daisy-chain from the village on the main road where there are Fibre Optic feeds. The village is way out in the boon-docks and it is about 1,2 kilometres to my property.

            The national telephone company was upgrading the main feed along the road and I asked the foreman what he could to improve my lot.

            He left three spools of Fibre Optic 'drop cable' at the house and instructions how 'joints' (splices) were to be positioned. Some tech friends and I had a beer party and we managed to string the drop line - professionally mounted - and on the following Monday a VNPT squaddy came by and spliced the joints (they were housed in plastic conduit on the poles) and terminate the drop on to a Huawei modem which outputs 100 Mbit data, 200-channel TV and 2 telephones.

            The drop line was extremely rugged, the mounts were plastic and secured with Tiewraps and a breeze to pull in.

            If we could do it, what acceptable excuse is there for telco's, including BT, not to do it other than pig-obstinacy?

            1. CoolKoon

              Re: verbatim, from ATT...

              No it's not. The moment you have to dig it underground (which you have to everywhere except in 3rd world countries) the costs are very similar to that of copper cabling, because the bulk of the expenses consist of paying the workers and machinery to dig out the holes.

        2. L05ER

          Re: verbatim, from ATT...

          capitalism works, people don't.

          that's why we regulate people with laws.

          1. I. Aproveofitspendingonspecificprojects

            Re: verbatim, from ATT...

            I wonder if the politicians this article is about are fit enough to supply both kidneys if required.

            Any ideas?

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: capitalism

            "capitalism works, people don't.

            that's why we regulate people with laws."

            And our schools fail us again, graduating illiterates with ease.

            Let's try this on for size:

            "capitalism" = "an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market"

            "private or corporate ownership" = "people investing work or funds to create the goods and services that build the capital value that is the foundation of the system"

            therefore,

            "capitalism" = "people"

            The dehumanization of the systems that we work under is why people suffer under the hands of individual who corrupt the system for their own personal goals. Learn something for once.

            1. dotdavid

              Re: capitalism

              "and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market"

              Of course few people are claiming that broadband is a free market, the regulatory and infrastructural barriers to entry being rather high.

            2. CoolKoon

              Re: capitalism

              There's just one slight caveat to your line of thinking: those corrupt bast...er individuals use the HUGE leverage they have by being board members/top managers of a big, powerful corporation to bully other people into making decisions which are VERY disadvantageous to themselves.

            3. Slef

              Re: capitalism

              Surely "capitalism" = "people" should read ""capitalism" = " some people"" as not everybody has the resources to Invest funds to create goods and services that build the capital value that is the foundation of the system" . Most of the people who actually invest their work do not benefit from the building of the capital value. Therefore Capitalism does not equal "people" but rather a small select band of people who benefit from the work efforts of others.

          3. lambda_beta
            Linux

            Re: verbatim, from ATT...

            That's absolutely correct!! People who are capitalist don't work, and require slave states to make more money. This is the absolute nature of capitalism. That's why we need to regulate these people with laws, just as we need laws for murderers.

        3. Fungus Bob
          Holmes

          Re: But but but capitalism works........

          No it doesn't. Worstall is no longer here.

        4. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: verbatim, from ATT...

          "But but but capitalism works........"

          You're not dealing with capitalism here, but government mandated monopolies.

      2. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

        Re: verbatim, from ATT...

        That's how it is in a lot of places, crappy low-speed DSL even if your line supports more

        Hell, I'd be happy enough with the 1.5 Mb/s DSL available from CenturyLink at our vacation home, if it stayed up for more than a day at a time without power-cycling the damn modem. As it is, it's useless for things like remote monitoring of the property, and it's a hassle for regular interactive use.

        But the local power co-op has run fiber to the whole area - low population density, mountainous terrain, and political enclaves notwithstanding - and by this summer we'll probably be able to get it hooked up. Their base package is 40 Mb/s for the same price as the unreliable DSL connection.

        I'll be paying double for a few months thanks to the gouging annual DSL contract, but I don't care.

    2. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      Re: verbatim, from ATT...

      1.5Mbs! - Why I dream of 1.5Mbs in Mississippi!

      Internet service here more closely resembles a cup of cold tea poured into a rolled up newspaper. 24kbs is good where my mother-in-law lives, of course if it rains that does drop off a little but you can do a few things with a 14kbs link.

  2. Throatwarbler Mangrove Silver badge
    Thumb Down

    Thanks, Obama

    I await the otherworldly explanation by The Usual Suspect for how this is somehow Obama's fault.

    1. Throatwarbler Mangrove Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      Re: Thanks, Obama

      Hah. "The Usual Suspect" was meant to be plural, but I made a typo. However, I see that The Usual Suspect has downvoted me, so I guess I was on target.

  3. Mikel

    Think of poor Comcast

    Won't someone think of the rights of the Internet giants to totally deny Internet access to the people they freely admit they have no intention of serving ever? Muni broadband is nothing but a socialist plot to thwart their God-given right to not compete. If rural areas give themselves gigabit in cow country, how will they look raising rates on 1.5mbps service in the center of the metroplex? It's anti-business and Anti-American and it must be stopped!

  4. Barbarian At the Gates

    Free market works

    Until your monopoly gets a competitor, then you need government intervention to come in and squash them before they make you work for your dominate position.

    I mean, really, what does a company that has decades of experience in serving and delighting their customers with a fantastic offering provided at the prices only an economy of scale can make possible have to fear from an upstart that has no experience in running an ISP?

    Sorry, I don't have tissues enough to go around, you'll have to wipe up those tears of laughter on your own.

  5. Mark 85

    Irony much?

    There's nice line early on about "restrictive state laws -- laws often passed by heavy lobbying support by incumbent broadband providers". The FCC, according to them is "overriding these laws". So.. these good Senators are concerned. If one reads the letter, one can follow the money behind it without too much thinking.

    1. CoolKoon

      Re: Irony much?

      Actually I think the path of the money (leading directly to the big brand ISPs) is blatantly obvious to everyone but the braindead....

  6. Stevie

    Bah!

    The correct response to the demand for the sum spent on public broadband is to ask how much money the broadband suppliers have funded each candidate in the coming brouhaha.

    1. Fatman
      Joke

      Re: Bah!

      <quote>is to ask how much money the broadband suppliers have funded each candidate </quote>

      AHHHH, So they (the politicians) did find those suitcases of campaign contributions in untraceable CASH!!!!

      1. CoolKoon

        Re: Bah!

        Yeah, I'm sure they stumbled upon them "by luck" somewhere in the middle of nowhere and their previous owner couldn't be traced even by DNA evidence....

  7. Lord_Beavis
    Pirate

    F'em

    Fuck Comcast. Fuck Time Warner. Fuck AT&T.

    Google, I haven't decided on you yet.

    What will they do when we all have a mesh node on top of our houses/in our neighbourhoods and don't need them anymore? Lobby to make them illegal?

    1. chris 143

      Re: F'em

      Health scare would be my bet.

      Then they'll all get taken down as radio waves cause autism

      1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

        Re: F'em

        "Then they'll all get taken down as radio waves cause autism"

        AH! It's all a dastardly plan by the Nestine Conciousness!

        1. Lord_Beavis
          Trollface

          Re: F'em @ John Brown (no body)

          AH! It's all a dastardly plan by the Nestine Conciousness (sic)!

          Is that what we are calling that cunt Jenny McCarthy now?

      2. CoolKoon

        Re: F'em

        Yeah, the same way as vaccines. I won't be surprised if politicians would then use those mindless morons to actually pass such laws (IF people would really start creating mesh networks, which is quite unlikely, since bad neighbors are still prevalent all across the world).....

    2. Trey Pattillo

      Re: F'em

      Well Capt. Obvious with the MBA riddle me this.

      I have a TWC 30/5 connection.

      T&S says I can not allow others to connect.

      T&S says I can not set up my on ISP.

      So, tell me. Who is going to pay the $10,000/mth for the direct internet connection for "your mesh"?

      1. Lord_Beavis
        FAIL

        Re: F'em @ Trey Pattillo

        Well, Capt. Oblivious, I will say this slowly so you can understand it.

        You won't have a T&S as you wont need them.

        You won't pay a dime as there will no longer be a "direct internet connection".

    3. Robert Helpmann??
      Childcatcher

      Re: F'em

      What will they do when we all have a mesh node on top of our houses/in our neighbourhoods and don't need them anymore? Lobby to make them illegal?

      That's a trick question, right? The more likely approach is to auction off the frequencies needed to run such networks as it would not require any changes to existing law, would bring more money into government coffers, and would move resources from the public to the private sector.

      1. CoolKoon

        Re: F'em

        Nah, you can't auction off the 2.4 GHz frequency band, because microwave ovens run at those frequencies too. And not even the cynical bastards at AT&T, Comcast, Tim Warner etc. would be able to lobby for scrapping microwaves in the whole US, even if they'd utilize the lunatics who argue that microwaving food turns it into a carcinogenic blob of organic material with no caloric value whatsoever.

      2. Lord_Beavis
        FAIL

        Re: F'em @ Robert Helpmann??

        And who will they auction them off to when they are to noisy to use?

  8. Cubical Drone

    The hypocrisy is breathtaking

    The Republicans always want governing pushed down to the most local level, except when that local level (in this case the municipality) wants to to something they don't like, then they want to push it back up to a level that agrees with them (the states in this case).

    1. David Hoffman

      Re: The hypocrisy is breathtaking

      If you examine the history of post World War 2 USA you will find that almost all political parties favor federal control over local control, except when it does not mesh with another part of their philosophy. At the same time they will favor local control over federal control, except when it does not mesh with another part of their philosophy.

  9. Joe User
    Megaphone

    What a joke

    The only "strides" that my private-sector broadband provider has made are to come up with any excuse to increase my rates while providing as little service as possible (I'm looking at YOU, Time Warner Cable).

    1. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      Re: What a joke

      Sure, but generating that excuse costs money so your rates will go up again next year. Locally our cable provider COCKS^H^H^HX charges $52.99 per month for 2.5/0.4 Mbs.

  10. ma1010
    Thumb Down

    It's a total joke

    As other posters have pointed out, these companies have no intention of even providing decent service at any price (much less a fair one). And they're so confused, even the big monster companies don't know what they're doing. I constantly get "U-verse" junk mail from AT&T telling me I should sign up. Only one little problem here: an AT&T engineer told my neighbor there is NO "U-verse" service available on our street, and they have NO plans at all to install the requisite equipment.

    I make do with slow DSL service from an independent phone company at a reasonable charge. The only alternative for high speed is CrapCast, and I know better than to open that Pandora's box.

    1. NotBob

      Re: It's a total joke

      It would be nice to have that option. We have local providers, but they only serve the rural areas around our small town. In town it's pick your nationwide crap-fest

      1. CoolKoon

        Re: It's a total joke

        Yep, and smart money's on them having bri...er lobbied the local government on making sure that it stays this way too.

  11. L05ER

    Greed > Freedom

    why can't i get and easy to copy-paste list of the rubes who put their name to this drivel?

    1. CoolKoon

      Re: Greed > Freedom

      Actually you can. You can open the PDF linked in the article and at the end you can see the names and signatures of the GOP 4ssholes who penned the letter. Expecting any more than that would amount to expecting them to stop using prehistoric equipment (e.g. faxes), which isn't happening......

  12. dan1980

    It's a canard of those in the GOP (and their various analogues around the world) that private corporations will always be able to do things better and cheaper and with more benefit to the user than could be achieved with public/state-owned services.

    So, you see, they're really only doing it to ensure efficiency and the best results for the consumers. Not at all because their ideological assertions only work because they deliberately hamper and ban public-run competition while offering huge benefits to the big corporate interests.

    Nope, definitely not that.

    1. Peter2 Silver badge

      As one of those people who think that private companies are better than state owned things, i'd note that the sole reason for this is because private businesses are self correcting in that if they fail to offer services efficiently and at a reasonable price relative to the competition then said company goes bankrupt and the competition takes over the business.

      State owned services aren't inherently bad. The problem is monopolies, which have no competition or reason to improve, which usually (but not always) leads to services not improving or prices (or taxes) going up to cover for their inefficiency. In the US (somewhat faster than dialup) market, you appear to have the same problem that's developed with private companies, which is just as bad.

      Can't you demolish the barriers to entry, or just create your own ISP's on a cooperative basis? Presumably if the local state can enter the market the barriers aren't insanely high.

      I have 80Mb/s VDSL at home we paying £30 (~$45ish) per month, for general reference.

      1. dan1980

        @Peter2

        Certainly in many instances, the natural forces of competition can work to make private services better (in whichever way) than an equivalent public service. The big exception is, of course, monopolies.

        The point here really is that there should be nothing to fear from the competition that a locally-run service would provide.

        The bit about private companies being 'self-correcting' is well made but the key issues is that it works kind of like evolution in that a major driver of evolution is natural forces present in the environment of the species, to which it must adapt or die. In the world of US ISPs, those forces simply don't exist and so there is no driver of the corrections you speak of.

        If these companies really are offering a good service at a good price then they have nothing to fear from these new initiatives.

        That they are fighting them so heavily tells you most of what you need to know about that.

  13. Jeffrey Nonken

    If the big companies would compete, they wouldn't have to work so hard to prevent competition.

  14. Mikel

    The US Department of Justice declined to defend the FCC in court

    Reading the letter now. The US DoJ is now a wholly owned subsidiary of the media and communications monopolists. From Kim Dotcom to Aaron Swartz, the past few years have been a DoJ war on people who want to communicate. Immediately after his first inauguration President Obama (probably at the urging of "Hollywood" Joe Biden) appointed a whole herd of their enforcement lawyers to prominent positions in the DoJ - presumably in appreciation for the support they gave the campaign not just in dollars but in tilted news coverage. This is a much overlooked aspect of their whole game.

    I'm a fan of the Prez, but this was not his finest hour.

  15. Wade Burchette

    It has been said the US has the best government money can buy

    This is just one of many example of politicians being bought and paid for. I can give you examples from both political parties where big money is behind their decisions. The US political system is a billion (thousand million for those across the pond) dollar industry. To me, that is wasted money. Think about how just some of that money could be used to feed the homeless. Or provide jobs for the homeless.

  16. TeacherMARK

    Don't Americans ever get tired of their elected officials working for corporations? Seems not.

    1. HighTech4US

      You are right in that we are tired but the problem is that a lot of registered voters DON'T vote.

      This results in those with extremist views (read Republicans) getting elected and even though they win with 15-25% of the registered voters they think they have a mandate to dictate their narrow self centered views onto the 75% who do not believe or want what they are trying to shove down our throats.

  17. sisk

    Why am I not surprised to see Robert's name on this? Yet another reason he needs to GTFO of Washington. Half the people he's supposed to be representing don't have decent internet speeds because these private companies can't be arsed to run fiber to a town of less than 2000 people. It's freaking KANSAS.

    I live here, so trust me when I say that fully half the state is every bit as rural as the stereotypes say. I live in one of the two biggest towns (which is bigger depends on which set of numbers you look at) in the western half of the state with a population just shy of 30k (that's right folks, at 45k Smallville would actually qualify as quite a large town and a major commerce hub in Kansas). And here we have a guy who's job is to represent us trying to block the government from providing broadband to these little towns that can't get it right now. This is why I keep voting against the man.

  18. Christian Berger

    Natural monopolies must be in the public hand

    Seriously, the lines into peoples houses should, just like the roads leading to them, be in public hands. Essentially we would need government agencies to build or order the infrastructure and then either do network access or telephony themselves on those networks, or lease them out to other companies.

  19. SolidSquid

    Private companies give a better service at a cheaper cost than government ever could, so of *course* they shouldn't have to actually *compete* with government

    Seriously though, if the local governments are able to give a better service and pay for it through the fees people pay, why not let them go ahead and do it? Hell, they could charge a bit more than the costs and have the extra go into the state budget to subsidise other responsibilities they have rather than having to increase taxes to do so

    1. Christian Berger

      "Private companies give a better service at a cheaper cost than government ever could, so of *course* they shouldn't have to actually *compete* with government"

      I'm sorry, but I hear this over and over again. So far I have only seen counter examples for this. For example the state run telephone company in Germany used to run the most modern and most reliable network in the world, now that Deutsche Telekom is privatised we are lacking even behind eastern European countries. Back when Deutsche Bahn used to be a state run company, the trains ran reliably and "unpredictable" events like heat in summer or snow in winter were no problem at all. You even had telephones on trains, and they worked!

      Is there _any_ example where privatisation actually improved the service?

  20. annodomini2

    Pratchett quote

    "The key is not to provide the best service, but the ONLY service!"

  21. timbow

    Do It Yourself

    I thought the USA was the Land of the Free and opportunity? Do it yourself like these guys did in the UK

    http://b4rn.org.uk/

    or these people

    http://www.gigaclear.com/

    or these people

    http://wireless.abinternet.co.uk/

    1. Christian Berger

      Re: Do It Yourself

      Well the problem is that in civilized and densely populated countries you already have a dense network of fibre optic cables you can rent at reasonable prices. Plus there are Internet Exchanges where you can peer cheaply with other providers.

      So effectively you are not going to get any decent uplink at a decent price. That's one of the big problems small ISPs are facing in the US.

  22. DerekCurrie
    FAIL

    The Actual GOP Died Years Ago, Murdered By The Neo-Conservatives

    There is no longer any Grand Old Party. Once the scum from the Neo-Conservative hell tank, 'Project For The New American Century', took over the US White House, IOW executive branch, the GOP was dead and gone. Anyone who still clung to the old ways of reason, sanity and fairness were cast aside as RINOs, or Republican In Name Only, a term that is a crowning achievement of Newspeak propagandist lunacy.

    This new, fake 'GOP' is run by Israeli, corporate and richest 1% interests. That's all they are and that's all they are good for. Welcome to their Neo-Feudal state of madness.

    They want to kill opportunities to bypass the parasitic ISP corporations? Of course they do. That's want they're paid for.

  23. Bakana

    Pound Sand

    Where are the Senators crusading for the Right of the Cities to tell the State Legislature to Go Pound Sand?

    They get all weepy eyed over keeping Government "out of our business" and the Overreach of "Big" Government.

    So, keep the State's Big Government out of the Small City's Business.

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    We got really good cable service

    But, being about 1/2 mile from the end of the cable line, we had to pay to run the wire to our house. All 13000 dollars of it.

    No copper phone line DSL (too far from central office). Satellite, sure, what a joke... high latency preventing connection to business related servers and low data caps unless one pays a huge price.

    On the other hand, lacking broadband pretty much means you are third world. Indeed, if there were no other options than satellite we would have picked up sticks and headed for greener data pastures rather than rot in barren data desert (and this, BTW, is the northern end of NY Metro not in some cold dark cleft of the Rockies).

  25. W. Anderson

    The sickness of political puppets

    The many tens of millions of American citizens who are ambivalent and ignorant about this ongoing fight by the large telecoms/Internet backbone carriers to have free rein over charging what "they" decide for Internet access and transmission services will rue the day they do not strongly and vocally, and legislatively support the current FCC ruling - ad infinitum - limiting the excessive greed demonstrated by these crass organizations.

    Every other developed nation (and some less developed), repeat every one knows the critical importance of equal, fair and freedom of access to the Internet, in that these countries have permanently mandated by law such freedoms.

    Not so in the USA, where every aspect of life is left to commercial , capitalistic decisions and gains. it is most likely that the money grubbers will prevail, probably sooner rather than later, particularly with the backing of dozens or even hundreds of Congressional politicians in their pockets.

    At that point, the whole country's educational system loses, other than filthy rich institutions, along with populace and every community organization as well as all small business.

    So much for the "greatest" political mantra being spouted incessantly at each recent US Presidential party convention. A sad and nauseating reality.

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