Minister: Waste wood is 'huge potential resource'

Yeah Right

I live down wind of Port Talbot where one of these word burners on steroids is being plaved. Waste wood ? B@ll@x all the local forestry is crammed full of recently felled trees all sitting there for when the power station needs them . They are basically chooping down the forestry to feed it and they have not even started yet

The wheel comes full circle?

So we've all been going wrong by filling in those fireplaces and installing central heating? Bring back the steam trains I say! And Jenny Agutter.

I'm just waiting for the advertising campaign...

Got Wood?

hmm...

burn coal or wood... whats the difference? both produce CO2... am i missing something?

What a waste of apples!

'Turning the 4.4 million apples thrown away daily into ethanol biofuel'

What a waste, what's wrong with turning all those lovely apples into Cider through the miracle of fermentation??

@Fred

yes you are missing something.

The idea is you cut down tree, burn wood, produce Co2, plant tree to replace cut down tree, uses Co2.

It's called the carbon cycle.

However

Burn fossil fuel, release co2, then what? The carbon has come from miles under ground, so unless you can place it back underground, you end up with extra i the air.

Burning wood is carbon neutral, but on one condition. Like for like is replaced. Cut down a broad leaf tree, replace with broad leaf. Not only that, cut down 100 year old tree, need to allow new tree to grow to 100 to balance out.

Wood Decays Naturally

"The idea is that wood in landfill would eventually rot away and give up all its carbon to the atmosphere"

So if a tree falls over in a forest and decays naturally does it not do the same thing?

The bigger issue is that large areas of the worlds forests are being cut down for cattle rearing.

Trees absorb Carbon Dioxide, less trees more Co2

The Cattle fart and produce methane which is bad

The Cattle is turned into Mcdonalds and they may us all fart.

i.e. Stop eating MaccieD's and save the Planet.

OK flawed logic, but I always like to blame McDonalds for all the ill's of the world.

"burn coal or wood... whats the difference?"

The CO2 from wood was taken out of the atmosphere years or decades ago. The CO2 of coal was taken out of the atmosphere millions of years ago.

By burning wood, you create demand for more wood. This stimulates supply resulting in planting more trees, which takes the CO2 you just produced back out of the atmosphere, to be burnt again a few years down the line.

There isn't any way to produce coal from CO2 in the atmosphere without waiting a few million years. Coal is finite, while wood, well, grows on trees.

Throw away line

"waste wood which is normally thrown away"

That would be why it's waste, presumably.. :-)

Pales into insignificance next to waste paper, though.

a minor typo

the government [has] cracked...

the government *is* cracked

mmm Jenny Agutter, thanks.

Burning Wood is Carbon Neutral?

My arse!

Are you bothering to factor in the carbon produced in felling, transporting logs, processing the logs into something burnable with any sort of efficiency, transporting said 'fuel' to biomass generator plant, disposal of the 'unburnable' (ie WASTE!) portion of the trees (leaves/needles/small branches etc.)

Oops.

Doesn't sound too 'carbon neutral' now!

Besides, I'd be far more worried about the effects of methane and NOx as greenhouse gasses.

Uh-Oh

Sounds to me like the first move in a campaign to drive humanity back to living around campfires and scavenging for food.

Bet the politicians get to live in the castle.

The flame icon because it might keep the wolves away at night.

I've got wood

Send Paris Hilton round to collect it!

@Stu Reeves

"Burn fossil fuel, release co2, then what?"

1. Burn fossil fuel

2. Release C02

3. PROFIT!!

@dervhied

As you may note it is WASTE wood, going to Landfill.

So lorries driving to tip, dumping wood, rotting in anaerobic conditions, producing methane and Co2

or

Lorries going to power plant, burning wood, producing Co2 that is reclaimed by said tree planting.

if your being pedantic, NO energy is CO2 neutral.

Solar, wind? Yes but what about power plants to make the electric to power the factories that uses chemicals and metals to make the panels, that then are transported to site, that are connected to metals made in factories that use power etc etc etc

What is wrong with this world?

ooo it's only tiny amount of total power consumed so what a waste of time.

Add that to tiny amount from wind, tiny amount from tidal, tiny amount from solar, and they start adding up. Bit like the my one light buld won't make a difference. But hey ho, lets keep hoping for the BIG fix....

Finally!

someone other than me gets it!

NO ENERGY IS CO2 NEUTRAL!

Now, you REALLY don't want to get me started on the waste of time that all that "renewables" pish is, believe me. But you have, so...

Wind; great in theory, crap in practice. Narrow wind speed envelope (don't work if its not windy enough or too windy) Do the maths, Our nearest coal fired station can crank out up to 2600 Megawatts. Averages about 1800 (worked there, I know!), your average Windmill is capable of, say 20 MW, but not CONSTANTLY, due to aforementioned envelope. let's give it the benefit of the doubt, and give it a massive 75%, so that's 15 MW

1800 / 15 = 120 windmills (at 75% production)

At a more realistic 50% you need 180, just to take up the load of ONE station.

Multiply that by all the coal/gas powerplants and you'd have to coat the nation in windmills, and then some.

Solar, in the UK, get a grip!

Wave/tidal.

Similar problems to wind, at least for wave power (operating envelope).

Oh, the BIG FIX, BTW, is (dahn dahn dahn!) Nuclear!

No carbon emissions once its up and running.

Consistant generation.

But I will concede that the waste's a bit of a problem!

Therefore;

electricity = pollution (one way or another, until we crack fusion)

Take your pick, eco warrior. Coz I don't see the developed world charging back to candles and campfires.

This is What Happens

when people who simply do not understand science try and find 'solutions' to real problems - they cannot comprehend the problem, so how can they possibly devise a solution?

I'll try one more time here to explain the CO2 climate change problem. IF human-released CO2 is causing and will cause significant climate change (and I suspect that it is and will) then IT'S FAR TOO LATE TO STOP IT. If we do want to stop it, nothing less than a reversion to an agrarian society/economy will do. We all know that's not going to happen absent a nuclear war, so let's stop arsing around trying to find new ways to tax people and get on with increasing energy efficiency through REGULATION (rather than taxation).

Re: Better than compact fluorescents (CFLs)

With our properly insulated 1930's semi, we usually have the heating on for a max of 4-5 months a year. That means that for 7-8 months a year our CFLs are saving the full wack of energy.

Still sounds worth it to me.

Smog?

Isn't the burning of wood just going to bring back smog? Particles thrown back up into the air? This is why burning wood is banned in citys - open fires need to use smokeless coal.

I know when my neighbour breaks those rules, there is a clear messy plume of smoke from the chimney and you can taste the rubbish in the air.

So I hope they are planning to add some good air-scrubbers to this power station. :)

OR... is this a cunning way to using Global Cooling to fight Global Warming? Stick lots of rubbish up in the atmosphere to block out the sun.... Errr.... yeah... clever planning.... (Sorry - wrong word - none of this is "planned"... it's all knee-jerk reactions....)

Waste wood is 'tiny potential resource'

Well if someone offered you a 0.7% pay rise would you describe that as huge or tiny?

I wonder...

...in a few thousand years after the human-race has died out because of excessive health+safety measures, if the aliens that come to infest the planet will be confused by the layers of different ores within our landfills?

Anyway, now I have your attention, my theory that global-warming (sorry, climate-change) is a man-made phenomenon. Over the past few million years, lots of CO2 was gradually taken out of the atmosphere, by animals and trees that had the misfortune to die and end up getting buried and turning to oil/gas/coal/peat/chalk/salt/whatever. Then in the past 200 years, we've released a large percentage of it back into the atmosphere - and the ecosystem we live in today isn't used to it. I know ice-cores have been analysed showing that the co2 levels fluctuate - but latest predictions are the ice-caps, including these million-year-old samples - will melt away. Which hasn't happened in the past as there are samples from previous fluctuations.

Personally I use CFLs because they last much longer than filament bulbs, and I can't be bothered with the hassle of changing light-bulbs. And they're not much more expensive now anyway.

Wood.

Does this mean that by using a Zippo lighter, which runs on petrol, rather than matches, which run on burning wood, I'm killing the planet, supporting the terroristically-inclined and contributing to the rebuilding of the Iron Curtain leading to World War three?

Now I'm very worried. Being worried, I'm off to have a cigarette to calm down, which means I'll use my Zippo to light it.

Conclusion: The end of the world is YOUR FAULT for publishing this article which caused me to be worried in the first place.

NuLab to bring in new tax

Since volcanoes are serious emitters of millions of tons of poison greenhouse gases (CO2,H2S,NO2 & SO2 etc.), your "Democratically elected, wise and caring Government" (c) has decreed that ownership and operation of volcanoes will now be taxed in varying bands, worked out on an above inflation adjusted scale that depends on how many MP's and their relatives may be claiming expenses and allowances.

In a seperate statement, The Mayor of "NuGreen" London stated that daily charges for eruptions within the M25 and any surrounding local area up to 500 Nautical Miles would be introduced, however electric and geo-thermal powered geysers and hot springs would be exempt or pay less than dormant or active volcanoes, extinct volcanoes would be offered a discount if they were already resident and registered with the Ordnance Survey.