BBC shifts some HD transmissions to 1080p... The BBC has quietly begun broadcasting HD content in 1080p, sort of. Since April, some BBC HD transmissions over Freeview HD have combined 1080i and 1080p material, switching between the two on a GOP (Group of Pictures) by GOP basis. A GOP is a batch of H.264 encoded frames combining an initial, reference picture followed by …
"Maybe it should have done that at the start, running the new approach to transmission by TV makers first"
Er, do you really expect the BBC to get hold of every freeview device to test it with their broadcast ? If the BBC are broadcasting according to the spec*, then it's the receiver's companys problem to sort it out.
* - Yes, I do know that just 'cause it's written in a spec it doesn't mean it's right
"it's the receiver's companys problem to sort it out"
Much as I hate coming to Sony's defence here, on the face of it they are doing just that. But yes, it's harsh to blame the Beeb. Although from a PR perspective they're probably doing all they can to assist as Joe Public would probably be inclined to say "the Beeb changed it and broke it!"
...which is curious, I didn't even know that mode was permitted on Freeview HD. It's certainly a CRT-unfriendly mode, not that anybody cares anymore.
Switching can upset TVs because they think they're starting a whole new program, hence the audio dropouts.
Hmm, couldn't they just have used PAFF/MBAFF, and rely on the TV to do smart de-interlace? Or as I've said before (but anonymously - must get self a cool handle) I don't know why they don't just stick with 720p and be done with it.
Because the perceived quality benefit of a higher frame rate (consistently 50hz) is arguably more valuable than a modestly increased horizontal (1280 -> 1440) and vertical resolution (720 -> 1080, but degraded by interlace artifacts). And it makes the TV's job easier.
(For a movie filmed at 24fps, obviously you'd want 1080p. But as for broadcast 1080i, I'm not convinced at all.)
Still using Win XP though.
"Maybe it should have done that at the start, running the new approach to transmission by TV makers first in order to prevent the problems Sony owners - and possibly those with other telly brands too - have experienced.... ...While the Freeview HD spec for set-top boxes mandates handling 1080p material at 50 frames per second, to cope with this kind of thing, that doesn't appear to be the case with tuner-equipped TVs"
Well it's either a standard or it's not. You can't blame the Beeb for assuming that the receiving equipment is compliant/fit-for-purpose surely?
"Maybe it should have done that at the start, running the new approach to transmission by TV makers first in order to prevent the problems Sony owners - and possibly those with other telly brands too - have experienced."
Well perhaps they did, and the sales-droid at the TV maker read his own spec sheet and said "Yeah, that'll be fine.". Now had you said, "Maybe the BBC should have bought whole ranges of TVs from all the major manufacturers, going back several years, and told their *own* staff to try the new signals on each and every one of them." then you'd have had a proper testing program. It would have cost a bit though.
and I get HD through Sky, but at the time, SkyHD was 1080i, so being the financially challenged person I am, I bought a perfectly acceptable not-a-known-brand TV that would do 1080i and not 1080p. This was several years ago, so I guess that you could say that I am an early adopter.
The TV still works find, but I would appreciate advanced warning if the Beeb do the same on Sky, because the TV won't handle it!
Mind you, by SkyHD box (a Thompson) is also a bit long-in-the-tooth, and I've had to fix it twice already (power supply and hard disk), so I doubt it would cope with 1080p anyway.
I also suggest to anybody who buys a TV in the sub-£250 price range to check the display panel resolution on their HD Ready TV (some of which I'm sure actually carry the "Full-HD Ready" logo). Chances are the panel does not have a resolution of 1920x1080 anyway, so it is a moot point.
I hate manufacturers being able to force new purchases on their customers.
The BBC started doing dynamic 1080i/p a couple of months back now (and yes, it's 1080p25, and yes, it's in the Freeview specs). It's only the BBC HD channel that they're doing it on, though.
It's not just Sony TVs that had/have problems. A lot of Samsung TVs had OK sound, but the picture blanked for each i/p switchover. Perhaps they've been fixed now.
The BBC and Sony have known about this problem for a while now, but it took them ages to respond to user complaints. In fact, Sony only admitted to the problem three or four days ago.
The BBC explained what they assume the problem is a couple weeks ago, but decided to keep running their dynamic switching experiments rather than wait for the manufacturers to get a fix in. Considering that a large percentage of Freeview HD viewers own the Sony / Samsung TVs, that's an odd decision.
That would explain why when I switch to BBC HD it does not show anything in the top left corner of my Panasonic G20. All other HD channels show 1080i @ 50Hz when I switch. Strange that nothing is shown when I switch to BBC HD. It's working though. I will have to monitor for any weird issues when they switch to 1080i for the credits. But as others have stated. I wish they did 24P for movies.
It has only fairly recently become clear that this switching will occur mid programme rather than just between them. That affected the priority with which it has been addressed by Sony.
BBC do have representative samples of all digital platforms for which they are not charged. They have also been aware of the issues this change will cause with Sony TVs for some time.
The specification for 1080p was a very late addition to the Freeview HD specification and I don't think it was added in time to be mandatory from the start (or at least on the fly switching wasn't). The Sony TVs passed all relevant tests available at launch and strictly speaking it should be the BBC's/Freeview's responsibility to keep the broadcasts within the capabilities of the approved receivers, there is no obligation to make such feature upgrades although Sony have clearly stated they will do so.
I haven't checked the figures recently but because they started earlier and offered Freeview HD on more of their range Sony will still be significant in the number of deployed Freview HD products, maybe 1/3. (STB/PVR sales are tiny compared to the TV Market. Anyone with time and GfK figures feel free to correct me.
I think that the BBC are being unreasonable pushing ahead in this case.
Joseph Lord
Human-friendly.com
(Ex Sony TV Product Planning - Recent)
(Ex BBC R&D - Not very recent)
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