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back to article Apple sued over iPhone location tracking

A lawsuit has been filed against Apple in the ongoing dust-up over its alleged tracking of the whereabouts of users of iPhones and iPads. "Irreparable injury has resulted and continues to result from Apple's unauthorized tracking of millions of Americans," alleges the lawsuit, filed on Monday in the US District Court for the …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Linux

    Open Source

    I know others will say this, but this is just the sort of danger from proprietary/close-source software that we are likely to see, compounded by the kind of lock-out attitude of the likes of Apple (and increasingly Google with Honeycomb ).

    You just couldn't get away with this kind of thing with Open Source.

    18 1
    1. Stuart Castle Silver badge
      Reply Icon

      Android..

      You can argue that open source software would stop you getting away with this, Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to get a phone with an entirely Open Source OS. Even assuming companies install Android without Google's closed source components, they often install their own closed source software that may or may not be doing anything dodgy.

      6 3
    2. Chris Hatfield
      Reply Icon

      You're correct

      ..but I still desire Apple sofware and hardware.

      2 4
  2. Anonymous Coward
    Stop

    Step away from the court and put the lawyer down.

    I dislike Apple as much as the next guy (maybe more so as I purchased an iPhone) but doesn't the speed of this just make it look like yet another cash grab in an overly litigious world?

    11 4
    1. Tim Bates
      Reply Icon

      Yes

      It does look like a cash grab or knee-jerk reaction... However the fact remains that this is about the only way to get Apple to respond to anything. Especially if said thing is related in any way to the iPhone. They seem to think it's perfect.

      6 0
    2. g e
      Reply Icon

      Yeah but

      Surely that's just following the Apple legal dept business model, after all?

      3 1
    3. JohnG
      Reply Icon

      Ts and Cs

      Isn't there something buried in the small print in which Apple mentions the use of geolocation to provide targetted advertising? If so, it will likely be a very short court case and the cash grab will fail miserably.

      0 0
      1. John Bailey
        Reply Icon

        Possibly..

        But there is something burred in many legal frameworks that states you can put anything you like in a contract, but good luck enforcing it if it tries to supersede the law.

        EULA does not equal automatically binding contract.

        1 0
    4. Daniel B.
      Reply Icon
      Go

      It's the American Way!

      Unfortunately, it seems to be the only way to get a US Company to do something about their users.

      McDonalds had to get sued for them to stop serving third-degree-burning coffee. (And the woman who won that lawsuit is now universally ridiculed.)

      Comcast, I think, got sued because of their RST mangling, and the FCC threat made them finally back down on that.

      A good bunch of class-action lawsuits have stopped companies from dumping toxic waste into rivers or soil.

      Ford stopped making deathtrap Pintos until they got slammed with lawsuits.

      The lesson is: if you want a US company to hear you, SUE THEM.

      2 0
  3. Uncle Siggy
    Big Brother

    I for one...

    welcome our invasive fruity overlords.

    7 3
  4. Richard Cartledge
    Stop

    Dumb and dumber

    From what I read, this is just a cache file stored on the device.

    Using this cache file actually reduces the chance of tracking as it reduces the number of network transactions. Nobody has access to the cach unless they have physical access to an unlocked device or an unencrypted pc backup.

    I sm happy to be proven wrong if anyone knows better.

    7 13
    1. The Infamous Grouse
      Reply Icon
      Big Brother

      Obtainable from a locked device as well

      An iDevice doesn't need to be unlocked to be jailbroken, and once jailbroken the full file system is available for access over USB. It is this aspect that seems to have some folks' knickers in a twist.

      In many jurisdictions law enforcement need to obtain a warrant or subpoena to get historical location information from telecoms providers, but may only need probable cause to seize and examine the phone itself. Because of this cache file, the latter may now be almost as good as the former when it comes to discerning an individual's movements.

      I'm somewhat on the fence when it comes to this whole thing. While I hate the idea of my own hardware keeping an easily readable log of my whereabouts, I'm not convinced Apple have actually done anything illegal here. There's no evidence that the data goes anywhere other than the users' handsets, so Jobs is right in that they're not actually tracking anybody in the normal sense of the word.

      On the other hand perception and opinion are everything these days and Apple's naivety in this regard is incredible. Stories of similar privacy concerns have been all over the technology media for years, and are becoming increasingly prominent in mainstream news as well. I can't believe that in the course of developing iOS not one Apple employee questioned the wisdom of leaving this data unencrypted, especially in the backup files. Or perhaps they did, and were shouted down. Who knows the mysteries of internal communication in the Cupertino citadel?

      4 0
    2. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      "Nobody has access..."

      I don't know any better, but if there is truly no way for others to get at the data, then the worst Apple has done is to carelessly provide a means for sensitive info to leak via the backups. The court case they face must surely fail unless it can be proven that they are also remotely lifting the data. Is there any evidence for that?

      2 2
      1. DZ-Jay
        Reply Icon

        That is correct

        The only way to access the data is to have physical access to the device. And then, you'll have to jailbreak it, or access an unencrypted back-up from a PC where it was sync'ed.

        If anybody has access to the physical device, they have access to much more damning and sensitive information than the location of cell-towers near the user. Consider that the address-book, e-mails, and browser history are also stored on the physical device.

        -dZ.

        2 6
        1. Daniel B.
          Reply Icon
          Boffin

          @DZ-Jay

          "Consider that the address-book, e-mails, and browser history are also stored on the physical device."

          You mean the iPhone doesn't support local data encryption on the address book, e-mails, browser history and such? Geeze, my BlackBerry does this. Hell, my previous 3.5 year old BB can do it as well, nobody can access that info unless it's unlocked...

          2 0
    3. Antidisestablishmentarianist
      Reply Icon

      Yeah but, yeah but

      umm. oh.

      0 0
    4. Tim Bates
      Reply Icon

      Ummm

      So that sleezy "genius" at the Apple store would never take a copy home, right?

      Nor would the random guy/girl at a computer/phone shop you hand it over to when you have a question about it...

      And of course no suspicious wife/husband/friend/relative would ever plug it into a computer and take a copy while you're off cooking dinner or taking a shower.

      Never. People just aren't like that...

      10 1
      1. DZ-Jay
        Reply Icon

        The could

        But they could also copy your pr0n collection, the phone number and address of your mistress, and report your incriminating e-mails to the police.

        -dZ.

        1 3
      2. Ammaross Danan
        Reply Icon
        Big Brother

        Another Angle:

        "Jobs reply: "Oh yes they do. We don't track anyone. The info circulating around is false.""

        Quick bit about Jobs' reply. Google tracks users web habits, and likely collects "anonymized" usage data (no different than Microsoft being able to determine which buttons in IE are used most often). Jobs is tracking a user's physical location indefinitely. Do they send it back to Cupertino? Likely not. The info circulating is not false, as anyone can pull up these specific files (depending on iOS version) and see for themselves. Jobs is a liar in this case.

        If you have an iPhone for work (because you requested it over a blackberry for instance), then your work would have every right to have physical access to your device. They can see where you've been, even during off hours. This in itself is a violation of privacy plain and simple. You might as well have a tracker in your work-issued badge (which is likely in your glovebox perhaps?). You don't have to have something to hide for this to be a problem. There's a privacy uproar for internet browsing, so much so there's "Do Not Track" methods being implemented in browsers now. Simply put, there's no need to keep an indefinite log of location on a phone. The last few hours? Sure. "Take me home" or the like. But not "Show me where I went on vacation last year."

        4 1
    5. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      More than just a cache

      A cache should just store a limited number of recent/frequently used entries. Shouldn't need timing data either (especially as it doesn't expire entries).

      4 0
      1. DZ-Jay
        Reply Icon

        Just a cache

        Date and time could be used to rank the entries, giving higher priority to those more recently updated. I'm not saying this is the reason, I'm just saying that there are legitimate uses for that information other than "ZOMG! Apple is tracking my movement!"

        -dZ.

        0 3
  5. JarekG
    Happy

    I guess

    "I guess if you don't have a iPhone, you are not being spy on."

    This is what the stupid commercial should say.....

    0 2
  6. JarekG
    Thumb Down

    RE ".reduces the chance of tracking.."

    There is a date, time and location. If you don't call that tracking, what the hell do you call that?!?!?

    7 1
    1. DZ-Jay
      Reply Icon

      @JarekG

      I call it a cache database of known network access points in the vicinity, along with the date and time when they were last updated.

      -dZ.

      1 7
    2. Bilgepipe
      Reply Icon

      Tracking?

      >>> There is a date, time and location. If you don't call that tracking, what the hell do you call that?!?!?

      A list of dates, times and locations. Without knowledge of who the data relates to - and what they were doing at each point - it's not an awful lot of use. Unless you lose the phone or it's stolen of course, in which case a list of locations is the least of your worries.

      I love how Tesco knows what brand of toilet paper I buy and no-one bats an eyelid, but the fact that Apple or any Android implementer might be able to work out approximately where some of their customers may have been standing the other day is suddenly a big deal.

      5 4
      1. Anonymous Coward
        Reply Icon
        Happy

        Well said sir!

        That always gets my goat!

        People bang about PC security this and phone security that, but they will happily have one of those nasty little loyalty cards from TESCO or Sainsbury's and always blindingly hand it over! TESCO, I believe, still have one of the biggest databases in the UK, every single purchase you make is recorded against your name and address. They know the make and number of sanitary products the ladies in your house have bought and used, the number of times you bought "something for the weekend" or when you last had to buy creams and ointments for that rather unpleasant rash you got on your private bits, yet most people seem to think nothing of handing this info over in exchange for £25 off their Crimble shopping at the end of the year!!

        Yes I tend to find the location info I see in Google maps on my iPhone rather unnerving, especially when I see how accurately it has pin-pointed my location but that's not that much of concern to me. I am more worried that TESCO will start sending me spam for erectile disfunction pills 'cos I bought from Prep-H 3 months ago after a very bad night on the curry and fizzy-pop!

        1 4
        1. Anonymous Coward
          Reply Icon
          Anonymous Coward

          RE: Well said sir!

          The key difference that you seem to have missed here is that loyalty card data is only captured if you hand over the card: a step that's optional and also one with a benefit, albeit a small one, for choosing to share that information.

          Apple's data is collected for all iphone owners. Burying that information deep in the Ts&Cs is a hell of a lot sneakier than asking 'Do you have a clubcard?'. And they're not giving you anything in return for your data either...

          If, say, you worked at a battered partners' refuge, or were on a witness protection programme, you might be a bit cheesed off to know that pinching your phone is enough to reveal that kind of data.

          5 1
  7. Stew

    Stupid is as stupid does

    Now before this information came to light there was no issue.

    Now they know they are, allegedly, being tracked there is suddenly an issue. What do these two people have to hide? Criminal activity? Or do they see this as an avenue for monetary gain.

    This information is NOT TRANSMITTED TO APPLE therefore there is no surreptitious act by Apple to secretly track users. Apart from that do these idiots realize the amount of storage and computing power required to process this much information for every device they have sold!

    Credit card companies track you, your GPS even stores details of your previous journey's, mine even keeps records of journey's that I took that I didn't ask directions. Didn't give it permission to do this either but I am not going to shit my pants and start a lawsuit against Garmin for doing it.

    Advertisers store cookies on your computer without permission and use these to show advertising for products and services that you have been looking at. Did they ask permission....

    ... didn't ask me! Still not shitting my pants and wanting to hire an attorney!

    What is it with people, you are all so god damn paranoid. Everyone has been tracked for years!

    2 9
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      FAIL

      @Stew

      "What do these two people have to hide? Criminal activity? "

      Privacy and the desire for privacy are not the sole domain of criminals.

      Unless, of course, you dont mind me looking through your bedroom window at night and following you around.

      Please let me know your home address and phone number. I mean, its not like you have anything to hide - do you?

      9 0
    2. dogged
      Reply Icon
      FAIL

      "What do these two people have to hide?"

      Tell us your PIN.

      5 2
      1. Bilgepipe
        Reply Icon
        FAIL

        Fail

        >>> Tell us your PIN.

        Knowing where his iPhone was last week does not make his PIN available, or any other personally identifiable information. Try again.

        3 8
        1. The Jase
          Reply Icon

          @Bilgepipe

          Seems you are unable to follow an argument.

          --"What do these two people have to hide? Criminal activity? "

          A variation of the "nothing to hide, nothing to fear" gambit is what has generated the comments.

          4 1
    3. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      oh

      Its the old nothing to hide then nothing to fear crap its all good then. how about this, I've nothing to hide its just nobody elses busness but my own!. The only thing I fear is having to prove that I have nothing to hide.

      Annon because I can.

      4 1
    4. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      Nothing to hide?

      Some people are paranoid for good reason. There are several reasons not in any way associated with the criminal law why one might want to keep ones movements secret. Cell-based locations are more than accurate enough to reveal that someone hasn't actually been where they were supposed to be that week when they said they had to be away on business. Not that I'm condoning adultery and such, but it's not illegal (yet).

      Ummm, and as for cookies, as from May 25th all EU websites will have to ask explicit permission to store them.

      1 0
  8. Dazed and Confused
    Joke

    Cash in bank.... errr woz

    Now we know what Apple needs the $67trillion dollar bank nest egg for, its to pay off legal costs.

    1 0
  9. Chris Hatfield
    Alert

    Apple legal stuff is water-tight, I betcha.

    There as so many fucking disclaimers in their EULAs, I bet the consumer has zero recourse.

    1 1
    1. The Jase
      Reply Icon

      EULA

      You cannot EULA disclaim against negligence or anything that may be against the law, or indeed an unfair contract.

      If I stick in an "indentured servitude" clause into an EULA it doesn't mean you have to serve after you tick the box saying you read it.

      4 0
  10. sleepy

    Apple is actually being rather careful with your privacy

    It's a cache file of cell locations that you MIGHT go near, data downloaded FROM Apple. It PREVENTS the iPhone from covertly emitting location data. And location services on the phone can come up with an answer even when GPS isn't working (you're deep indoors, or maybe you haven't even got any GPS hardware). With it, location services doesn't need internet connectivity, and can use any one of mobile signal, WiFi signal, GPS signal, to come up with a location. Even then, the user is in full control of location visibility, on a global and per App basis.

    The file doesn't tell anyone where you live, or work, or where you've been, except in the vaguest and most incomplete way imaginable. And seeing it requires physical access to your PC / iPhone. So the evil one has to know exactly where you are to find out within 50 miles or so where you may have been.

    The existence of this cache file enables the iPhone demonstrably NOT to covertly emit any location info about you to Apple, because the answers to Location Services' questions are already on the phone.

    Now the phone book is different. It's publishers should be locked up after paying every person listed thousands in compensation.

    1 8
  11. RichyS

    Networks

    People need to get a fecking grip. Have these people wondered how much data your network provider has one you, and the amount of location tracking they do.

    More importantly, under RIPA, how much acess the Police, local authorities, and others have to this? I'd take a local log file over this any day. One the pigs need a warrant to get access to.

    2 5
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      Difference

      Are you saying that because there is a lot of tracking available to law enforcement, everyone should just shut up and let everything they own track their habits?

      Seriously?

      Dont you see the difference between Police justifying a RIPA intercept / track vs J03 H4xxor getting hold of the data?

      Even if you think they are the same, that just means the RIPA legislation should be fought... I must admit I am a bit confused by the apparently defeatist approach to being followed 24/7 and the apparent attitude towards the police...

      7 2
  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Oh, the dilemma of being a fanbois

    The lure of money from a lawsuit with the potential to put Apple out of business.

    0 1
  13. Llyander
    FAIL

    So then....

    If the information is false, as the possibly real Mr Jobs claims, why don't Apple just explain what it is and then this will all go away? If it's innocent and nothing for people to be concerned about, then just explain what it really is. Then the problem goes away.

    Oh but wait, I forgot this is Apple we're dealing with. Someone could ask them if the sky is blue and they'd probably refuse to comment.

    4 1
    1. Allicorn
      Reply Icon
      Happy

      Jobs says

      It's green. Now shut up and buy our stuff.

      1 0
  14. LJRich
    Big Brother

    Remember...

    ... you don't have to worry about privacy unless you have something to hide! - Schmidt

    6 0
  15. petur
    Boffin

    RE: open source

    Which is why I'm holding on to my n900 and look forward to Meego :D

    2 0
    1. DZ-Jay
      Reply Icon

      @petur

      Sure, since we all know that the network companies do not track your every move expressly. We also know for sure that they don't share this information with the government, data brokers or advertisers. No, they wouldn't do that. After all, Open Source will save us all.

      -dZ.

      3 5
      1. dogged
        Reply Icon
        Stop

        They don't because they can't

        Cells just aren't clustered that closely together. You'd only get that kind of accuracy from an AGPS device (don't give me that bullshit about it locating cell towers, there are NOT 19,000 towers in central London).

        The limited triangulated tracking we used to be able to do via cell towers - which yes, was done at police request with a warrant - has nothing on the maps I've seen generated from consolidated.db

        I know you LOVE Apple - you always defend them no matter what - but seriously, you gonna get violated, son.

        6 2
        1. Gunnar Wolf
          Reply Icon
          Megaphone

          Cell triangulation is more precise than what you think

          Take a look at this experiment published about a month ago by German Green Party member Malte Spitz:

          http://www.zeit.de/datenschutz/malte-spitz-data-retention

          It is amazing, incredible, scary... And fun :)

          2 0
          1. dogged
            Reply Icon
            Stop

            It's improved, sure

            Microcells alone up the cell-count which improves triangulation calculations but regardless, that's not what the iPhone is tracking. Not a chance. And as I say, the generated maps blow cell triangulation out of the water.

            1 1
  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Personally I'd be more annoyed about...

    ... the much reduced battery life that comes with having the GPS chip on all the time.

    0 0
  17. dotdavid
    Coat

    No big of a deal

    It's not that big of a deal. Just hold your iPhone - voila, no tracking ;-)

    Mine's the one with the flame retardant sprayed onto it...

    7 0
  18. Anonymous Coward
    Black Helicopters

    In the UK...

    With the ANPR system that the plod have then they can find out where you have been anyway, doesn't really matter if you have the phone with you or not...

    0 1
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      Amazing

      You'd think with such flawless, omniscient Orwellian power in the hands of the said plod, there'd be no chance of thieves moving a stolen vehicle from one place to another without being spotted; yet it happens all the time.

      I wonder how that can be? I can think of two possible reasons for it. One would be that the ANPR network isn't as universal as certain comments might suggest... The other is that the network is indeed universal and sees and records all vehicle movements, reading VRM plates with flawless accuracy, but The Pigs only use it to spy on you (yes, you: you're *that* significant).

      In the absence of facts, I guess the choice comes down to your political leanings.

      1 2
      1. Anonymous Coward
        Reply Icon
        FAIL

        Not really...

        I couldn't care less about my iphone giving away information about where I am, or my Win Phone from what I am now reading. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. And I wasn't complaining about the ANPR system. With the ANPR system, which is real, regardless of your "political leanings" the police could, if they wanted, see where someone has been. That was my point, sorry if I didn't spell it out for you, maybe I should have used crayon.

        There are plenty of articles (some on the register no less) that explain that the police have issues because of how much data is in there. It seems it is less of a realtime tool than one they can mine after which is why it is used for serious crime and terrorism rather than where your vauxhall corsa went.

        My point was... all these people are freaking out about the iphone location database because the police may access it and see where they have been, well, the police can probably do that anyway, if you used a car and if they wanted to.

        Oh, and don't make it sound like I'm some paranoid conspiracy nut, I never said anything of the sort and you just look like a cock, especially since you posted anonymously. If you take the time to read, there are plenty of FACTS out there about the ANPR system. My post was just an observation and the black helicopter icon should have given you a clue that it was simply that.

        0 1
        1. Anonymous Coward
          Reply Icon
          Anonymous Coward

          Consistency

          Oh, dear. Yes, okay: *I* look like a cock because *you* used a black helicopter - a generally understood symbol of conspiracy (the text for that icon even implies as much) - and thought that I should have known you weren't suggesting conspiracy.

          Like it or not, there are those who - due to those political leanings we've mentioned - like to present ANPR as being much more than it is. You struck me as doing just that - though your second post gives me little to argue with.

          As for the FACTS you mentioned, I have a fair few. This is related to my use of the AC option.

          0 0
  19. Nameless Faceless Computer User
    Stop

    Smoke and mirrors

    Your location information is being broadcast to traffic data collection agencies, like Google, along with how fast you are driving. When you click on "show traffic" on Google Maps where exactly do you think all that data comes from?

    2 0
  20. nsld
    Paris Hilton

    inherently bad piece of programming

    Whether apple use it or not is less relevent than who else can use it.

    Those facebooks apps you use where you agree to share location will be slurping away on all that data, all so that you can "check in" when you dont have GPS available.

    And thats before any of the other apps that use location suck up all that lovely location info stored for months showing your habits.

    And that will form the basis of all the targetted ads you dont want.

    As for the lawsuit, its electronic ambulance chasing of the highest order, unless the two plaintiffs have never used social media in any form what are they exactly complaining about.

    2 1
  21. Anonymous Coward
    Megaphone

    Jobs said:

    "We don't track anyone. The info circulating around is false."

    No - they don't track people, they just track their phones...

    Anon so they can't track me down :-P

    2 1
    1. R.P.Charlie
      Reply Icon
      Paris Hilton

      No - they don't track people

      They just make sure that others can get at the info and "track" people.

      Why Paris cause one cannot deny that she was "in the vicinity" at the same time.

      2 1
  22. R.P.Charlie
    Big Brother

    CelleBrite UFED used by Michigan police

    tested by the US Department of Justice found that "the device could grab all of the photos and video off of an iPhone within one-and-a-half minutes. The device works with 3000 different phone models and can even defeat password protections."

    http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/04/20/police-apple-watching-logging-and-downloading-every-move-you-make/

    and according to the writer, one doesn't have to be arrested, or even suspected of a crime. During a routine traffic stop, in evident violation of Fourth Amendment protections the police can "glean" a lot from an iPhone.

    That's got Americans worried cause we know what the police can get up to there.

    And in dear old Blighty, one's camera/iPhone can even get damaged if one takes pictures of Mr Plod parked illegally. (El Reg had some of this really democratic behaviour noted some time back).

    2 0
  23. NoneSuch Silver badge
    Big Brother

    I love his comment...

    The noises coming from Apple sound like this is a random programming mistake. Some third rate programmer slipped one day, hit his keypad wrong and accidentally embedded a hidden function to track your location with a date time stamp and log it in a file.

    I take Apple at their word when they say they do not track people. Well, today they don't. However, you don't build that sort of functionality into a phone without the eventual intent to do just that at some point.

    By no means do I absolve Google of their tracking issues either. They are just as bad, but at least they give you the option (in the Android phones) of turning off the GPS when you run the set-up wizard. Oh and don't look to the government to protect you in these cases of location tracking. They want this tracking to find terrorists / criminals and just to be safe best track everyone else, just in case.

    1 1
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Black Helicopters

      Re: I love his comment...

      I'm not sure turning off GPS helps the paranoid. Android phones don't seem to need GPS to geolocate; Wifi appears to be sufficient. And presumably without Wifi they can fall back on tower location.

      Google appear to have the co-ordinates of every "known" wireless base station. My guess is that this data is collected by every Android handset out there that has GPS enabled. It seems they cache the location of visible base stations and report that info back to Google - much like the original Streetview cars did.

      How do I know this? I recently moved house. For the first month or so, as soon as my Android handset connected to my wireless router it showed my location in Google maps as my old address (this is with GPS off). When I enabled GPS, it would then update my location once it got a satellite fix. Now however, it shows my (Wifi) location at the new address. I wonder how Google learned that the wireless router had moved?

      My guess is it the Android wot done it.

      1 0
      1. Anonymous Coward
        Reply Icon
        FAIL

        Denmark calling

        We tested this today. http://samy.pl/androidmap/

        We hit pay dirt every time, and the accuracy of location was unnerving - in our test cases never more than "next door" away from the actual location.

        Personally I am appalled that Google has infested the world with devices collecting data such as this. The Apple issue is limited, essentially they have failed to encrypt some information that should have been encrypted. OK, FAIL, but not overtly evil, and trivially fixable in the next iOS update should Apple wish to remedy the situation. The Google case appears to be that every Android phone "phone's home" with all the information it gathers - somewhat scary I think, and definitely in the "overtly evil" bucket

        Actually, I tried an Android (2.2) "pad" this week. It was the worst piece of crap I have encountered in decades. A slug, full of bugs, trivially easy to crash, and very possibly the worst, least intuitive UI I have seen for some time. I guess Google put the effort into the "spying" code - because that bit provably works.

        Dweeb

        1 0
  24. Pet Peeve
    Stop

    Damages

    Don't you have to prove actual harm to sue for damages? Being unhappy about the existence of a file is not damage. Idiots.

    1 4
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Big Brother

      For the hoplessly-dim...

      Loss of reasonably-expected, and legally-protected, "privacy" IS considered... "harm" (both by the law, AND by MOST people). Back at ya... IDIOT.

      0 0
  25. Mark .

    Re: Well said sir!

    "People bang about PC security this and phone security that, but they will happily have one of those nasty little loyalty cards from TESCO or Sainsbury's and always blindingly hand it over!"

    Can you prove that the people complaining about the Iphone's security, are people who also hand all their data to Tesco?

    (Also, show me a Tesco card that tracks my movements.)

    3 1
    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Pint

      Also, show me a Tesco card that tracks my movements

      The card (as an entity) doesn't track your movements - but it tells mr Tesco that at 1746 on April 25th 2011 you were in the Tesco Metro in Doncaster buying a case of Stella. It also told mr Tesco that on April 24th at 2239 that you stopped at the Tesco petrol station in Retford, put in 20 litres of petrol, bought a 6-pack of Stella and a packet of Cheese and Chive Pringles.

      On the 23rd of April it told Mr Tesco that you had been into the Tesco in Princes Risborough at 1407, bought a Hosin Duck wrap, a birthday card and a 6-pack of Stella.

      Not only does Tesco know where you've been over that last three days - it also knows that it's your wife's birthday very soon and that you have a drink priblem.

      3 1
    2. Jedit Silver badge
      Reply Icon
      Headmaster

      Tesco sell iPhones

      So, yes, Tesco can prove it.

      0 0
  26. Fred Flintstone Gold badge

    Yippie - the flame's in the pan now

    Multiple reports of regulators stepping in and asking questions. The funny thing is, as far as I'm aware Apple has not actually *used* that data, but the fact that it's being collected is bad news already.

    I guess that the Android data collection is next up.

    Roll out the popcorn..

    1 0
  27. Benchops

    Dr

    Type your comment here — plain text only, no HTML

    0 0
  28. Benchops
    Jobs Horns

    Have Apple sued Google

    for copying their location tracking file idea?

    0 0
  29. Law
    Paris Hilton

    not all bad....

    Recently I found out my phone was physically being fixed because my latitude location got updated as the depot it was being repaired in... :S

    0 0
  30. Anonymous Coward
    WTF?

    Nothing to hide?

    I was just wondering.

    The old "Nothing to hide, nothing to fear" mantra that some people keep throwing out there. Shouldn't that also work in reverse?

    It would seem that Apple, Google and Microsoft have something to hide (at least they appear to act like it) - doesn't that also mean that they have something to fear?

    If they don't, then surely they can explain what this whole deal is about? Appease the consumers? No -- not interested?

    Darn!

    1 0
  31. Anonymous Coward
    Black Helicopters

    Good grief Charlie Brown, talk about paranoid

    Just what damage do you think a 'hacker' can do with some dumb file with a few co-ordinates on it? It's not like it contains intimate details about your penis, or your bank account is it?

    Good grief people, do wake up and smell the latte.

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