back to article Microsoft takes us to 2004 with new Windows 10 so you don't mistake it for Server 2003

Microsoft crossed the streams last night as both the Fast and Slow Rings of the Windows Insider Program synchronised ahead of the final fit and finish of next year's Windows 10. While build 19033 was light on features, as is depressingly the norm with 20H1 these days, that watermark remained absent and, more importantly, the …

  1. Blockchain commentard Silver badge

    Could be '04 rather than '03 because they know it won't be launched in March? Expect the '09 to be renamed '11 as well !!!!

    1. katrinab Silver badge

      Unlikely because there is a Small Business Server 2011.

      1. doowruc

        Also Home Server 2011

        (I still have a server running it)

      2. LeahroyNake Silver badge

        I remember that, still have a few running as well.

        The last time MS released a server OS for SMB before they tried pushing everything to cloud...

        1. 404 Silver badge

          Server 2016 Essentials? Server 2019 Essentials? Those are the SMB server software you seek, yeah?

  2. Dippywood

    That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

    Do you not mean "that thing Santa's reindeer left on the lounge carpet?"

    1. MJB7 Silver badge

      Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

      Quite possibly not

    2. d3vy Silver badge

      Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

      No - reindeer being herbivores produce relatively dry unscented pellets.

      Santa on the other hand has a diet consisting mainly of reindeer meat, so would leave a truly offensive sticky mess behind.

      1. Nick Ryan Silver badge

        Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

        Mince pies are not made of reindeer meat... or if they are, you are doing it wrong!

        1. Oh Matron!

          Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

          Mince pies were originally savoury..... Hmmmmmmm.....

      2. NeilPost Bronze badge

        Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

        So why is a herbivore Cow Pat a thing then ???

        1. stiine Silver badge

          Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

          Chewing cud.

      3. Wayland Bronze badge

        Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

        This is why meat eaters squat.

    3. Excellentsword (Written by Reg staff)

      Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

      I thought they remained on the roof?

    4. WolfFan Silver badge

      Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

      Obviously they have a cat named Santa.

      1. Twanky Bronze badge
        Devil

        Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

        Obviously they have a cat named Santa.

        It's a typo - Satan.

      2. Maximum Delfango

        Re: That thing Santa left on the lounge carpet

        Santa Claws.

  3. theOtherJT

    "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

    Good.

    The last thing I need from windows is any more "Features". I don't like the ones we already have. Fix your goddamned bugs. It is utterly ridiculous that we're in a situation where my laptop occasionally just "forgets" that it has an HDMI output and requires a reboot to fix it. Sometimes it boots and the USB-C port is just... gone. Reboot, and there it is again. Sometimes it will drop _all_ sound at the end of a skype call. Sound hardware is still showing as there, but there's no output any more no matter what you do with the volume sliders. Guess what you have to do to fix that?

    Same machine booted into Ubuntu _never_ has these problems. If it weren't for gaming Windows would have been ditched entirely (as opposed to just relegated to a secondary partition) a long time ago just because it's become so damn unreliable.

    1. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

      Windows 10 is not an operating system, it's a gaming platform. Gotta admit I'm amazed that business is still using it!

      Oh wait, my mistake - "business" is just a gaming platform too these days.

      1. MJI Silver badge

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        Gaming Platform?

        Mine uses Orbis OS

        1. TheProf
          WTF?

          Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

          "Orbis OS is an OpenSUSE-based operating system designed in mind for anime and manga fans."

          Because anime and manga fans demanded a flavour of Linux just for them?

          1. katrinab Silver badge
            Paris Hilton

            Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

            Or the FreeBSD variant that runs on Playstations

            https://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/11/16/sony_playstation_4_kernel/

            1. MJI Silver badge

              Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

              Or the FreeBSD variant that runs on Playstations

              Hence I don't need Windows for games.

          2. Asylum_visitor

            Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

            It's USP is that data hygiene tasks are a lower priority than with other Linux builds, to more closely fit it's userbase.

      2. Groove-Cat

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        I think that it also has something to do with Office..... Now i know that you get free and in most cases betters versions of an office suite. But, it's Outlook and most businesses are still wary of free OS's, like Mint.

        1. 404 Silver badge

          Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

          Have clients who would disappear me if something happened to their Outlook... Suicide by Train most likely...

          Do NOT fuck with their Outlook....

      3. Giovani Tapini Silver badge

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        @version 1.0 it's not a gaming platform, it's not a business platform, it's a collaboration platform which is why actually interfacing software with technology is increasingly missing...

      4. Jakester

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        Not just a gaming platform, but an advertising platform, a send info about user to MSoft HQ platform, a platform to automatically install incorrect device drivers, and above all - a platform that makes linux users happy knowing they made the correct decision to not use Windows for important uses.

        1. 404 Silver badge

          Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

          > a platform to automatically install incorrect device drivers

          I fucking HATE that! Does wondrous things to an HP Designjet T120... And the client thought it was just me until I made him watch it happen...

      5. Mike 137 Bronze badge

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        Actually, it's not primarily a gaming platform or a business platform - it's a revenue stream. Hence the subscription model and the fact that it doesn't actually have to work reliably.

        1. theOtherJT

          Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

          Problem with revenue streams that don't work reliably is they tend to dry up as people go in search of others that do. I can only hope that Microsoft realise this before Windows is irreparably damaged (if it's not been already) because believe it or not I actually think it's a good thing that there remain multiple choices in the OS space.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

            The OS space might end up a little healthier if Windows did get a bit damaged, as it's still far too dominant in desktop/laptops. This won't affect the availability of multiple choices of OS - no matter how damaged it gets, Windows isn't going away for the foreseeable future.

      6. Wayland Bronze badge

        Re: gaming platform

        I've been building PCs for Gaming this year. Both Windows 7 and Windows 10 are suitable but the BSOD that happens in Windows is really causing me problems. I did build a Linux Mint gaming machine and insisted they only play games from Steam. This works amazingly well but the Gamers insisted that it should play Fortnite hence the switch to Windows 7 and the subsequent blue screens.

        Microsoft needs to fix their OS for this market because Linux is growing more and more capable. Once the developers stop trying to block Linux then Windows will be over as a gaming platform, as it is for a business bookkeeping platform. Most people seem happy with Zero Accounts.

        1. FuzzyWuzzys

          Re: gaming platform

          Much as a Stadia is a bit of a pile of poop, online, streamed cloud gaming is where it's going like everything else. Sooner or later they'll be no need to a monster PC to play games.

          1. Zack Mollusc

            Re: gaming platform

            Neat. I won't need a powerful PC to render locally generated 500fps 8k video, I will just need a stable 90TB/s internet connection.

            1. Mephistro Silver badge
              Angel

              Re: gaming platform

              Nah, for gaming you'll have enough with a stable 50 MB/s connection...

              ... and a latency smaller than 20 milliseconds.

              Great news for people who live at less than 100 Km from their Stadia server!

        2. F Seiler

          Re: gaming platform

          I dont know fortnite, but it doesnt appear to be a q3a class game ie no need for sub-degrè rotation accuracy in milliseconds even for beginners. As wikipedia lists switch, ps4,ios and android as platform why not just use a smartphone or get a console...

          /ex pc now longtime console, but the change was made along with a shift in kinds of games i play (no fps any longer)

      7. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

        "Windows 10 is not an operating system, it's a gaming platform. Gotta admit I'm amazed that business is still using it!"

        Not this boy, Linux Mint Xfce for my main biz workstation. When we lost AD a few months back I was one of the few who could login and keep working, plus I was one of the few who could get over to the AD server to help out with fixes as Xfree2 RDP client works 10x better than anything MS offer.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "light on features to enliven a keynote, but heavy on fixes"

      Just buy an iMac. There... much better.

  4. Kay Burley ate my hamster

    So will....

    So will 2009 be 2010? Causing many a sense of déjà vu.

  5. Hans 1 Silver badge
    Joke

    As a reminder, the next version of Windows 10 is known as "20H1". Or "2004". Or "that thing Santa left on the lounge carpet". We made that last one up, but you get the idea.

    Copyright, that was my joke, Santa is the name of my Yorkshire ...

  6. MJI Silver badge

    Have they fixed?

    The UI yet.

    How can I get Windows borders wider so I do not get confused?

    Also am I the only person to not touch the new start menu at all as it sets me off. Used it once, no sign of shutdown or restart and things kept moving, luckily I know Ctrl-R and most of the dialog names, and of course shutdown /r and its friends.

    1. Anonymous Coward Silver badge
      Boffin

      Re: Have they fixed?

      Try right-clicking on the start menu - most of the useful stuff is hiding in there.

      Also, you can empty and close the right-hand column ("tiles")

      The 1909 release seems to expand the left-most icons a lot more freely too, so it's gradually becoming more logical.

      1. stiine Silver badge

        Re: Have they fixed?

        Personally, I've installed 7+ Taskbar Tweaker and Open-Shell because an unusable user interface is the last thing I want to fight every day.

    2. Philippe

      LTSC?

      You, my friend, are ready for Windows 10 LTSC.

      No start menu, no telemetry, no Edge, no Apps, no interface or "features" changes for 2 years.

      You just get Windows 10 and security updates.

      It has been ultimate bliss since I moved over to it at the end of last year. I thoroughly recommend it.

      1. Aleph0

        Re: LTSC?

        Only available to corporations with a suitable number of licenses, I'm afraid... I've recently bought one such license off Amazon, and the seller subsequently reimbursed the purchase when I messaged them to the effect that the Microsoft dowload page they pointed me to only offered Pro and Home editions.

        I haven't been able to find a download option on Microsoft's site that doesn't require credentials for the Volume Licensing Service Center, and I'm not going to use a dodgy torrent site to download my OS...

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: LTSC?

          Also on Visual Studio Software and Services Subscription (what used to be Technet Plus before that was killed off). One of the few remaining benefits of being an MCT.

          Anon because I don't want to lose it....

        2. kmedcalf

          Re: LTSC?

          You can "change" the version of Windows using "slmgr.vbs" that is found in the Windows Toilet on every version of Windows 10. You can "convert" any version of windows into any other, at any time, with no muss, no fuss, and no bother at all since all the myriad of SKU of Windows 10 are all the same and there is no difference between them, other than the license and a registry entry.

          1. katrinab Silver badge

            Re: LTSC?

            Except that the LTSC image doesn’t contain any of the bloat that other images contain.

          2. F Seiler

            Re: LTSC?

            still not really a valid option. As long as there is no mode how Ms would ack a mode where i run that version as a private person, it doesnt exist for me.

            Not that im particularly afraid of ms or cracks, but some time ago, once i spent enough time in the industry or just got old enough i decided that i will only run sw in legal mode - most of the time it means that i prefer open source and non-commercial free, but if the commericial offer is reasonable i have no problem to pay for what i use.

            ...back to windows, yes if that desktop no nagging windows was somewhere maybe 50% more (maybe up to 500 or 1000 ◇), id buy it. But if they dont hurry getting their shit sorted i might have settled on an acceptable desktop working on bsd*.

            *yeah pretty much set. I run freebsd already on anything that doesnt need a gui or only a minimal one. Nothing against linux, and i work with some on the job regularly, but freebsd appears so much simpler, cleaner more intuitive to me. I just havent found a desktop environment i like so far (except from windows, kind of, it also only went downhill after w2k).

        3. katrinab Silver badge
          Paris Hilton

          Re: LTSC?

          Download the trial version and update it to the full version using the usual techniques, which I won’t publish here for legal reasons.

      2. Carpet Deal 'em Bronze badge

        Re: LTSC?

        There is the downside of Office 365 arbitrarily not working(MS really doesn't want people using the LTSC). Not a concern for 99% of home users, but it's there.

  7. LDS Silver badge

    Meanwhile, they are telling me to test the beta of the new chromEDGE in Windows 7.

    I wonder if it will be out of beta before Windows 7 is EoLed in January.... and I'm forced to switch to 10.

    1. Yorick

      Re: Meanwhile, they are telling me to test the beta of the new chromEDGE in Windows 7.

      Barely so. Edge should go live Jan 15.

      WSL (2) is great. If you code even a little for a living, say you’re in IT broadly, that thing will come in quite handy.

      I remember Win 7. It’s a good OS; I don’t feel any particular nostalgia for it.

      1. KSM-AZ
        WTF?

        Re: Meanwhile, they are telling me to test the beta of the new chromEDGE in Windows 7.

        Actually WSL kind of reminds me of Wine, only backwards. After dinking with Cygwin-X (And some other BS for a fiver from the "Store") and this and that for a few months, I finally got something that mostly worked. Then my brain unclogged and I loaded Kubuntu. . . Which I'm typing this on.

        The esoteric driver support is the Linux problem. Intel (for one) is notorious for buggy chipsets with lot's of software/driver work-arounds... Have been since the 8085 days, timing specs were pure fantasy. This OneMix-2S required a dozen manual tweaks, and it still won't wake up a USB-C hub to the external display more than 50% of the time. Windows is not that much better. Hit's around 85% but hey, Linux sucks, Windows is awesome. If the vendors would just publish the API's for their hardware some hack would have it 100% on Linux in days, but reverse engineering is painful and time consuming.

        Frankly though the other comment hit the nail. It's office/calendaring and AD/SSO cruft (The latter being a constantly moving target, GRRR modern auth grr, but I shant digress) that drives business. MS support is as abysmal as the rest, but no CIO ever got called out for buying microsoft, and of course this year they jacked our licensing 8% (E3, K9999 anyone?). If they keep it up at that pace there will definitely be a move at point, as the other 90% of Desktop activity is web these days, and for most of that, I can run Chromebooks, or BSD, or Linux, or even DEX on my Samsung Note 9. The latter is about 80% there, 'bout like WSL...

  8. Roland6 Silver badge

    Hum... given how stable WS2003 as a workstation (aka XP Pro x64 Ed.) was...

    You would have thought MS would have encouraged the association...

    1. jelabarre59 Silver badge

      Re: Hum... given how stable WS2003 as a workstation (aka XP Pro x64 Ed.) was...

      You would have thought MS would have encouraged the association...

      They didn't want to raise anyone's expectations.

  9. jelabarre59 Silver badge

    Cheat codes

    Those pesky compatibility problems with anti-cheat software continue to linger

    Maybe they should partner up with the Wine/Codeweavers folks then. Often the reason a game fails to run under Linux/Wine is because the games will mistake Wine as "cheat" software(*). Fix it in one platform and it might get fixed in the other.

    (*) unless you're talking about Roblox. *THAT'S* just a case of shit programming.

  10. Boris the Cockroach Silver badge
    Windows

    Quote

    "this does remain very much preview code and should be treated with caution lest something explode messily in your face"

    I think that just about covers windows 10 completely..... .updating.. updating... update failed, please install updates to continue

  11. Just a geek

    Microsoft need to find a number convention and sodding well stick to it.

    1. Paul Hovnanian Silver badge

      "Microsoft need to find a number convention"

      I thought they had one.

    2. /dev/null

      "Windows 10.n" where n is a monotonically-increasing positive integer works for me, and would avoid this silly ambiguity nonsense. But proper understandable version numbers seem to be out of fashion at Microsoft.

  12. Wemb

    Money

    <sigh> I still use MS Money - it's a damn good product and a cracking shame MS dropped it.

    1. cb7

      Re: Money

      Add Windows Media Centre to that list. Sigh.

  13. N2 Silver badge
    Coat

    Server 2003

    Now, that was actually quite good.

    Coat, stick and grey beard.

    1. MJI Silver badge

      Re: Server 2003

      Not a patch on Netware though still prefered 5.x over 6.x.

      1. N2 Silver badge

        Re: Server 2003

        3.11 was the best for Netware

        1. MJI Silver badge

          Re: Server 2003

          Good but this was early 2000s, once you got the hang of NDS later versions were fine.

  14. Wzrd1

    Well, it'll have a benefit

    One will have to keep one's drivers up to date or one's entire enterprise will, again, go titsup.

    As usual.

    Like some Intel drivers, from a while back, which borked loading, due to expired certificates.

    Microsoft, being ever so helpful suggested "Well, download the updated driver".

    "We can't, the NIC was one of the drivers you forced offline and now the entire enterprise is down!"

    "Get a new enterprise."

    "Linux is looking better and better..."

    "Well, if you're going to be abusive - <click>."

    Contracting, I want your entire department to meet me on the 100th floor conference room - now.

    Maintenance, take an early lunch, got some emergency patching to perform on the elevators...

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Lol, losers...

    I exclusively use iMacs and MacBooks and I laugh at your Windows troubles, in the same way as I laugh at your systemd discomfort. Life is beautiful in the walled garden. You all think the walls are to keep people like me trapped. Wrong. They're to keep people like you out.

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