back to article After 72 hours of recurring outages, you'd be forgiven for wanting to slightly tweak the first syllable of Bitbucket

Bitbucket, Atlassian's hosted software version control service, has been afflicted by a series of service disruptions over the past three days, to the predictable consternation of programmers. Git and Mercurial, separate software version control applications supported by Bitbucket, began misbehaving on around 2241 UTC on …

  1. jeff_w87

    The "Cloud" is great until it's not

    This is why on premise installations will never go away (hopefully) as an option.

    1. J27 Bronze badge

      Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

      On premises can have the same problems, server goes down mysteriously and needs to be troubleshooted for days. The main difference is that your organization has to/gets to do the fix themselves which can be good or bad. I'm not saying that "cloud" solutions are better, you're totally reliant on the cloud provider, but on-premise solutions have similar reliability problems.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

        Yes and no, Yes on premise also have problems, but they are unlikely to have such reliability issues as often as they will be a far simpler install, not requiring the scaling and vastly more complex setup to run with millions of users at a time.

      2. Pascal Monett Silver badge

        Re: On premises can have the same problems

        Of course it can, but when it's the cloud provider, it's all of that provider's customers that have the problem. When it's your on-premises server that has a problem, it's only your customers that are impacted.

        Let's try avoiding humongous single points of failure, shall we ?

      3. hmv Bronze badge

        Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

        On the other hand, on premises loads on a service are rarely quite as much as loads on a cloud-hosted service, so fewer load-related problems are likely to occur.

        On the other hand (I'm running out of hands), a cloud service provider may well have more in-house expertise. Or less!

        There's pros and cons for both. Of course if you're stuck with a PHB who just follows fashion, you're fucked in cloud or on premises.

        1. katrinab Silver badge
          Flame

          Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

          "a cloud service provider may well have more in-house expertise"

          You definitely haven't met our cloud service provider. The support orangutan had never seen an xml file before, and insisted that he was an expert on the subject of data formats.

          1. Long John Brass Silver badge
            Windows

            Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

            Ook?

            /apologies to pTerry

        2. dgc03052

          Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

          "On the other hand (I'm running out of hands)"

          The phrase for this would be "On the gripping hand"

          :-)

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        On-premise solutions have similar reliability problems?

        > On premises can have the same problems, server goes down mysteriously and needs to be troubleshooted for days .. but on-premise solutions have similar reliability problems.

        I beg to differ, no they don't troubleshooted for days, swap-out the hardware and roll back to the last backup. Competent tech people usually know the local set-up better than their own back garden.

        1. Orv Silver badge

          Re: On-premise solutions have similar reliability problems?

          "Competent" is a big ask there for a lot of companies.

          I've seen situations where systems were down for days due to RAID array rebuilds, for example.

      5. JohnFen Silver badge

        Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

        "server goes down mysteriously and needs to be troubleshooted for days"

        But you'd have replaced that server with a spare very quickly, so those days don't represent downtime.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

          :D :D :D :D

          Oh, that's a good one.

    2. A Non e-mouse Silver badge

      Re: The "Cloud" is great until it's not

      I'm pretty sure on-premise services have problems too. The difference is that the outside world rarely notices when an on-premise system goes off-line.

      Outages in public cloud services, by their nature, are, well, more public.

  2. Long John Brass Silver badge
    Terminator

    Spokesdroid?

    "At Atlassian, ensuring system performance and reliability are of the utmost importance to us," a spokesperson said. "We are aware of the issue and are providing real-time updates to customers via the Bitbucket Statuspage."

    Spokesperson? SpokespAI?

    These chat bot systems always seem to say the same damned thing :(

    1. IGotOut

      Re: Spokesdroid?

      Yes, along with the boilerplate "security is....."

      1. Sgt_Oddball Silver badge

        Re: Spokesdroid?

        You forgot 'lessons will be learned'

        1. Pascal Monett Silver badge

          Hopefully, one day they will.

        2. Hans 1 Silver badge
          Thumb Up

          Re: Spokesdroid?

          That is their problem, outages happen, are fixed, yet, lessons are never learned, so outages re-occur....

    2. Phil O'Sophical Silver badge

      Re: Spokesdroid?

      "At Atlassian, ensuring system performance and reliability are of the utmost importance to us,"

      This from the people who brought us that steaming pile of poo called Confluence?

      1. Allonymous Coward
        Devil

        Re: Spokesdroid?

        I mostly manage to avoid our corporate Confluence install, in favour of putting docs into our team's GitLab instance. Sadly I can't completely avoid Jira, Confluence's smelly cousin.

        Atlassian should be some kind of case study for what happens when a small company who "gets it", gets big and starts selling "enterprise" rubbish.

      2. Long John Brass Silver badge
        Unhappy

        Re: Spokesdroid?

        To be fair; Confluence & Jira are pretty good as far as commercial Wiki & Ticketing systems are concerned. I know that's not saying very much, The the alternatives are so much worse.

        I can't really understand how people can make software so truly awful; To the point you can actually *SEE* the effort that the put in to make it bad :(

    3. macjules Silver badge

      Re: Spokesdroid?

      I was wondering about that. Do you suppose there a degree in Spokesperson Speak, where you learn how to say everything by saying nothing? Either that or there must be some special iOS SpokesPerson app that takes "We are really, really sorry but we have not got an idea of what is happening or how to fix it." and translates it into, "We are aware of the issue and are providing real-time updates to customers".

      1. DCFusor Silver badge

        Re: Spokesdroid?

        Politicians take the next level of this course. They appear to say things, that are what you want to believe. When those things don't happen, on later examination of their words, they didn't actually say those exact things - just close enough to allow your biases to believe they did before the election.

        Bureaucrats are somewhere in the middle level of competency at this game.

        "Oh, piebald, you had nothing to say, yet you made it into words and said them anyway!"

        -- CS Lewis, Perelandra

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Spokesdroid?

          That's still true for bureaucrats, but from what I see, although they used to, politicians these days don't bother to employ that level of subtlety. They'll just say exactly what you want to believe (including mutually-exclusive things to different people, if necessary). When those things don't happen, you can later examine their words, find that they really did say those things - and then cry a little when you realize that this doesn't really affect elections much, if at all.

      2. katrinab Silver badge

        Re: Spokesdroid?

        There is indeed. Not technically a degree, but it has the same number of NQF points as a degree.

        https://www.cipr.co.uk/content/professional-qualifications

  3. Bronek Kozicki Silver badge

    A good occasion

    ... to remind that there are alternatives to bitbucket, some of them are open source and easy to setup for self-hosting. For example: gitea, gogs, gitlab, gitolite ...

  4. sorry, what?
    Devil

    Cloudy with a chance of missed pulls?

    What's great about git is that it doesn't really matter if the remote repo becomes unavailable for a while because you've still got all those commits in the local clones. Sure it may take a little while to get yourself out of the bind but it is ultimately doable even if the remote repo can't be recovered at all.

    It may be a bit inconvenient to be unable to share updates in a team in the normal way but there are simple ways around this (e.g. using generated patches and the like).

    I'm not saying I want downtime from that cloudy git, but actually there's no real chance of missing those pulls or losing commits unless you are a complete noob and delete or mess up your clone.

    1. iron Silver badge

      Re: Cloudy with a chance of missed pulls?

      Indeed the beauty of distributed vcs is that you don't need a server, ever. Just nominate a local repo as the authoritative one and sync with it. That is the way it was meant to be done in the first place, Bitbucket, GitHub, etc are trying to force dvcs into the classic vcs mould.

  5. Tom 7 Silver badge

    Consonant Birley?

    some random text

  6. e^iπ+1=0

    "tweak the first syllable" - or second?

    Works better for me.

    1. katrinab Silver badge

      Re: "tweak the first syllable" - or second?

      s/Bi/Shi/

      1. sorry, what?
        Trollface

        Re: "tweak the first syllable" - or second?

        I think by second they meant:

        s/it/itch

        Then again, it could be:

        s/it/otch

        :D

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "tweak the first syllable" - or second?

      When Obama was leaving office, someone asked if he had a bucket list. He said sonething like: "No, I don't have a bucket list. I do have a list though, and it rhymes with bucket"

    3. eliasbats

      Re: "tweak the first syllable" - or second?

      hmm... I initially thought of SpitBucket

  7. SVV Silver badge

    We're going to have to remove BB as a production dependency

    If you've made your production systems dependent on someone else's cloud then you should have prepared for that cloud to be not available. I find it amusing how the people who were stupid enough to make their IT systems so dependent on services and companies whose technology and processes they know so little about are the ones who publicly whine about it on social media as soon as there's a problem, thus loudly announcing how stupid they were to do that to the entire world.

    1. Claptrap314 Silver badge

      Re: We're going to have to remove BB as a production dependency

      This. If your CI/CD pipeline is introducing external dependencies, then fire who created it & bring in someone competent. As I've mentioned before, I considered rubygems.org to be an unacceptable dependency risk BEFORE it was taken down for a week. Double mirrors, people.

  8. JohnFen Silver badge

    This is why

    This is another example of why I avoid stuff like this like the plague. Anything mission-critical has to be on machines that I actually have access to and control over.

    1. Imhotep

      Plausuble Deniability

      The lack of control is what allows you to point the finger at someone else when things go sideways. God, I've grown cynical.

      1. JohnFen Silver badge

        Re: Plausuble Deniability

        I was speaking about my own uses. There's no point in fingerpointing when it's your own stuff, because you're the only one who cares.

        Having stuff in the cloud means that I am at the mercy of the provider and have exactly zero control over what's happening, and I can't fix stuff when it goes wrong. That's too dangerous of a situation for me be comfortable with.

  9. Orv Silver badge

    Karma is punishing them for deciding to terminate Mercurial support.

  10. fredesmite Bronze badge
    Mushroom

    Remember - Cloud computing is ...

    Nothing more that posting your crap on the same computers millions of other people are using and expecting the equipment owners to care more about it than you do

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