back to article Pay row latest: We aren't biased against Big Tech, says Uncle Sam as it rolls eyes at Oracle

The US Department of Labor has insisted it isn't targeting America's tech industry, as it presses ahead with its discrimination lawsuit against Oracle. According to Bloomberg Law, a town hall meeting in San Jose, California, this week saw the DoL's Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs (OFCCP) director move to …

  1. Giovani Tapini Silver badge

    People with the same job title dont do the same work

    I know job titles are a bit cosmetic, but you would expect there to be some fundamental similarities between similarly named roles in general.

    Are Oracle routinely giving people fake job descriptions?

    1. Balding Greybeard

      Re: People ith the same job title dont do the same work

      I have the same job title as several of my peers. We each bring different skills and experiences to the job. Some skills are highly in demand in the market. I’m a security guy. Should a security guy be paid the same as a Linux admin, no offense to admins, I started my life as an admin on DOS 26.2 (I think - too many brain cells lost in the sixties). It depends on a number of factors. Should a security industry recognized expert be paid more than me? Am I coin-operated pain-in-the-butt, or a creative problem solver? There’s a lot of intangibles to consider.

      That said, does the DoL take into account role, expertise and performance meeting goals on time?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: People with the same job title dont do the same work

      but you would expect there to be some fundamental similarities between similarly named roles in general.

      Oracle job titles are things like "Individual Contributor level 5"or "Manager level 3".

      1. LucreLout Silver badge

        Re: People with the same job title dont do the same work

        Oracle job titles are things like "Individual Contributor level 5"or "Manager level 3"

        No idea why you got downvoted for that description of Oracles "lovely" job titles....

        However, an individual contributor level 5 might find someone with 5 years experience, 15 years experience, and 25 years experience in the same role. To say they're all doing the same work to the same level is pure fantasy.

        Theres a lot of research around job performance, but the two factors which overwhelmingly influence job performance within a role are experience and IQ. Obviously, that's for a given level of drive, because if you're smart and lazy and have been such for a long time, you're quite possibly going to get out performed by someone with a bit more oomph.

    3. a_yank_lurker Silver badge

      Re: People with the same job title dont do the same work

      It depends on how Larry's Minions set the descriptions and associated grades. And with the grades how does one get assigned a grade is important. Say they are hiring a Ruby programmer. They could hire someone at a grade 3 or grade 2 depending on their Ruby experience and overall experience. The key is not the pay is different but how did differences occur. If the procedures were done correctly and ethically (remember who we are talking about) then there will be few cases of misassignment but no blatant discrimination. However, the suit alleges what appears to a systemic problem of different pay based on what does not appear to be job/experience related factors.

      Also, another key is how much flexibility is there in pay system to reward your buddies at the expense of others, something I do not know. So if there is too much flexibility then you will get pay discrepancies that look like discrimination.

    4. JohnFen Silver badge

      Re: People with the same job title dont do the same work

      In my experience in the tech industry, all job titles are essentially made-up BS.

  2. nerdbert

    New Oracle HR activity: generating an infinite number of new job titles

    "Such concerns about the DoL's requests for data are said to have been raised at the meeting, as well as the department's reliance on job titles and roles to assess pay disparities."

    I can foresee a new activity for HR drones: generating new titles for every employee. I can foresee things like "Reversion Testing Level 2 Manager", "Individual Contributor for Scripting Checkers of Product XYZ Data Entry." Things that are totally meaningless for making comparisons.

    (We had similar silly things in IBM when the DoJ tried their antitrust suit. We had to keep every slip of paper for anything we did in product development and submit a copy of it to the lawyers, who promptly buried the DoJ in an avalanche of paper that was completely meaningless for them, but had to be provided given their broadly framed requests.)

  3. ratfox Silver badge
    Paris Hilton

    I recall that Google was also sued by the DoL a few years back. Google also complained that they were innocent and that the DoL demands were overbroad. Anybody knows how that story ended?

    1. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

      Google

      It went nowhere. The officials' demands for internal information was deemed overly broad by the judge.

      https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/17/google_told_to_provide_details_of_8000_employees_in_gender_discrimination_case/

      C.

  4. Forum Name 2

    Oracle... Yeah I've had them call

    Their "harassment" department which they call sales used to call me wanting to sell licenses. They got pissed when I told them we don't use Oracle nor ARE we going to use Oracle. They thought they were Microsoft or something and I was obviously a thief. No, I will never buy Oracle anywhere I ever work.

  5. JohnFen Silver badge

    Even if they were

    Even if they were targeting Big Tech, that'd be OK. Big Tech's failures are such that a bit of targeting is justifiable.

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