back to article Accused hacker Lauri Love tries to retrieve Fujitsu lappie and other gear from Britain's FBI in court

Accused computer hacker Lauri Love is in court today arguing with the National Crime Agency over whether the British government agency should return PCs they seized from him. Background Back in 2013, the US indicted Lauri Love over allegations he had hacked thousands of PCs in America and other countries. In the same year, …

  1. chivo243 Silver badge
    Facepalm

    Confiscated 5 years ago?

    My guess is there are a few updates to be run when he gets his kit back. Geeesh...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Confiscated 5 years ago?

      "a few updates" - the first thing I'd check for would be NSA rootkits.

      1. Muscleguy Silver badge

        Re: Confiscated 5 years ago?

        How exactly does one spot an NSA rootkit? Asking for a friend . . .

        1. Charles Calthrop

          hate it. use it

          it says “Press Ctrl+Alt+Del to Log on”

          1. sum_of_squares

            Re: hate it. use it

            Actually the combination Ctrl+Alt+Del is used exactly to prevent rootkits:

            The reasoning is you can't capture this combination with a program that looks like the login screen and does a login in the background while capturing your password.

            ..yeah I still got the joke, sorry for being "this guy".

  2. Halfmad

    "Britain's FBI"

    If only our American visitors could understand that other countries have different law enforcement agencies..

    I don't know if I was from the USA I'd be rather annoyed at the need to dumb down like this. What next El' Reg? Headlines like "Teresa May (Sort of Britain's President, but not really) met in Brussels (not the vegetable, the city) with Jean Claude Juncker (More like our Pres.. but not as gropey) to discuss stuff which doesn't relate to oil, so President Trump isn't interested."

    1. Old Used Programmer

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      Well... Yes... I'm afraid that most of my fellow residents of the USA have difficulty understanding that "head of state" and "head of government" are actually separate jobs...even though the US combined them into one office.

    2. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      It works all ways - Brits always run into problems over here because they don't realize that American states (and counties within states) have different laws, let alone law agencies. What's legal on one side of the road and get you busted on the other side.

      1. Muscleguy Silver badge

        Re: "Britain's FBI"

        You would think the existence of a separate and distinct legal system and practice here in Scotland in their own polity would make them wise to the possibility. Let alone travel in modern Europe where there's little except a sign to indicate a border now.

        But then we still get people from south of the border surprised at the fact. They think that our Sheriffs and Procurator Fiscals are just quaint names and the law is the same.

        The Welsh, since Devolution, have built up a sufficient corpus of different Welsh law that they are thinking about separating out their legal system from England's for the first time since the 15thC.

        And I haven't even mentioned the Channel Islands, Man and NI.

        So really there is no excuse.

      2. Halfmad

        Re: "Britain's FBI"

        State laws is something that I found really odd although I guess you could say that as Scotland has it's own legal system and some of it's own laws the situation here isn't that different, just not as fractured. Then again, the distance from London to Edinburgh is far less than the drive across most states in the USA!

        Oddly enough you could get caught out just crossing our invisible England/Scotland border as Scotland has extremely low drink drive limits so you're legal on one side, then bam - breaking the law once you pass that "Welcome to Scotland" sign.

        1. lglethal Silver badge
          Trollface

          Re: "Britain's FBI"

          then bam - breaking the law once you pass that "Welcome to Scotland" sign.

          It's just a different type of welcome...

        2. J.G.Harston Silver badge

          Re: Drink drive limits

          And in some cases, vering unsteadily from one side of the road to the other will get you under different drink-driving limits.

      3. Pen-y-gors Silver badge

        Re: "Britain's FBI"

        Brits always run into problems over here because they don't realize that American states (and counties within states) have different laws, let alone law agencies

        Worryingly many 'Brits' have problems in Britland, and don't realise that different parts of this scepter'd isle have different laws and regulations. Scotland and Wales are devolved nations, with (limited) law-making powers, and this means that visitors to Abersoch have to remember "We're not in Birmingham any more, Toto"

        Oh yes, and in some parts we even speak a different language!

    3. Aodhhan Bronze badge

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      You actually think anyone in the USA gives a rat's ass about the law enforcement agencies in lil ole England? LOL It's almost a criminal act of humor.

      That's like saying England cares about the different law enforcement agencies in Andorra.

      1. lglethal Silver badge
        Trollface

        Re: "Britain's FBI"

        What you mean you dont keep track of what the El Cos de Policia d’Andorra are doing???

    4. Robert Helpmann?? Silver badge
      Paris Hilton

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      I did a search for "Britain's FBI". All the top results were for UK sites. I am not sure who it is being aimed at though I think there is some need for compensation being implied by the phrase.

    5. chivo243 Silver badge
      Pint

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      @Halfmad

      +1 is all I can give, but have one on me!

    6. STOP_FORTH
      Headmaster

      Re: "Britain's FBI"

      It's not just institutions being different that is the problem. I was reading a report in an American newspaper a few years ago about the Pakistan Department of Defense (sic) testing out chilli sprays for crowd control. It's a proper noun and it's Department of Defence.

      I am aware that they probably have an official Urdu title as well but I don't think the Yanks would put "funny" characters in their newspapers any more than we would.

      1. Waseem Alkurdi

        Re: "Britain's FBI"

        Department of Defense

        Erm, go to this URL: www.defense.gov

        This would be the title:

        U.S. Department of Defense

        (Yeah, I know about defense vs, defence)

  3. AustinTX
    Paris Hilton

    Flinders, Keepers!

    "But Your Honor, if we're not allowed to keep our pile of seized loot to admire, we'll lose a significant motivation to do our jobs!"

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Interesting, I wonder if I can get my handmade, tulip-wood, chillum back from them? The house got raided while I was at work about 40 years and that was all they took ... I'd really like to get it back.

    1. Muscleguy Silver badge
      Joke

      Seized drug paraphernalia are not usually returned. But have you sent them a stern letter at least? Probably got sold at auction to fund the police benefit. You should have been checking the charity shops and seizing it as stolen goods.

      1. detritus

        Back when I ..er.. sold magic mushrooms for a living (legally, I might add), I had a couple of sets of electronic scales taken by the Police and after a few months of no actual charge (again, because it was legal) we were able to get our hands back on them.

        They'd also taken some of our stock and some other bits and bobs alongside, but I had no real interest in getting back x month old thoroughly-rotten fungal matter, just the scales, which were quite good ones and not cheap.

        Annoyingly, the rotting fungal matter had conspired with the batteries to thoroughly rot the contacts, so we had to throw the scales out anyway.

        Can't be too annoyed - this happened early on during those few short years where fresh mushrooms were legal, and we DID just try and walk into a festival with 4 large cooler boxes full of psychedelic wares. I shouldnt've been TOO surprised to not have been greeted with warm smiles and open arms by Police-backed security.

  5. Paul Hovnanian Silver badge

    He's lucky ...

    ... he wasn't apprehended in the USA. All that kit would have been auctioned off years ago. To buy the chief of police a comfy office chair or something along those lines.

    1. mark l 2 Silver badge

      Re: He's lucky ...

      The only reason they are still holding on to it all was in case the US were successful in getting him extradited as obviously they computers might contain evidence.

      Generally any evidence seized during a search warrant would be kept until either after trail, unless the charges were dropped.

  6. RunawayLoop

    Wonder what encryption he was using... 5 years and they still didn't crack it??

    1. eldakka Silver badge
      Big Brother

      AES, the de-facto go-to symmetric encryption algorithm was published in 2001.

      128-bit AES is still currently not brute-forceable. There are some 'side-channel' attacks on implementation-specific vulnerabilities, i.e. dodgy coding on the encryption software.

      Therefore 128-bit AES encrypted material from 2001 (we,, say 2003 to allow time for implementations to be available) is still secure from brute-force attack.

      If the encryption software used isn't one of those with known implementation vulnerabilities, and the key wasn't just found lying around on a post-it note or stored in a ROT13/XOR'ed-type hash in the "my passwords.txt" file, then the rubber hose/telephone book method on someone who has the key is still the most effective attack vector.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Just use something you know and something you have. Make sure the have can be deleted upon a raid occurring. Hand of the bit you know straight away. No getting back the bit you had.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        The most effective attack vector is not to bother. Get court order demanding the key, if not provided lock up indefinitely. To think the government talks about human rights abuses in other countries.

      3. RichardB

        Ah yes, the telephone book punishment

        Colour all the e's red, unless they follow a vowel. Then they are blue. Unless they preceed a vowel, in which case they are purple.

        Reverse the rules on odd pages.

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