back to article Microsoft decides Internet Explorer 10 has had its fun: Termination set for January 2020

Microsoft has warned that it isn't only Windows 7 for the chop in 2020. Unloved Internet Explorer 10 will be joining it. Finally. Internet Explorer 10 first appeared back in 2012 and in 2016 Microsoft made a concerted effort to kill the thing by focusing its support efforts on Internet Explorer 11. Anything not Edge-related or …

  1. Herring` Silver badge

    Browsers

    Can't we have a moratorium on developing browsers? Just bug fixes and security patches to existing ones - no more features. What started off as a way to display HTML pages has turned into a bloated monster that eats all your RAM and lets the bad guys get to your stuff. Enough.

    1. Ragarath

      Re: Browsers

      Hear, hear. And while you're at it make them all work consistently though I suppose the bug fixing may do that.

    2. Khaptain Silver badge

      Re: Browsers

      And I can easilly imagine how that could be assisted by simply stopping advertising...

      1. bombastic bob Silver badge
        Flame

        Re: Browsers

        At least, stop advertising that uses SCRIPTING... or any OTHER means of tracking people.

        That "bloated feature creep" in browsers seems to be a universal problem, as well as the 2D FLATTY McFLATFACE FLATSO so-called "modern" [vomit] "the Metro"-like UI and its Chrome-clones.

    3. FastOlly

      Re: Browsers

      Who needs a graphical browser anyway? Green text on a black screen was always good enough in the past... Bloody progress *grumble*

      1. alain williams Silver badge

        Re: Browsers

        I test my web sites using lynx, partly because that is how someone using a text to speech program (ie eyesight problems) will 'see' it.

        It is sometimes the best way of viewing a web site that have been over CSSed.

      2. Mark 85 Silver badge

        Re: Browsers

        You forgot to add: "Now get off my lawn".

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Browsers

        Here, here!

        Lynx was good enough 25 years ago, it's good enough today.

    4. Claverhouse Bronze badge
      Stop

      Re: Browsers

      Definitely a moratorium on UI/UX changes.

      I get a lot of crap from sites ( and Mozilla's nauseating attempts to wipe out all their past browsers ) for using a Firefox 45 --- and even this is too modernistic for me, even with Classic Theme Restorer : but a/ I use Linux and magically avoid malware ( and yes, I check to avoid giving it to non-linuxians ) and, b/ I use the internet a lot, and there's no way in hell I'm going to stare at filthy fugly minimalism all day, it's bad enough most websites went over to Fat Slab.

      If new iterations had the aspect of browsers c2012, when they just did the job they were asked, I would upgrade or adopt gladly --- apart from Google's Chrome, whose wretched engine, inferior to Google's puppet Mozilla [ Fx and Seamonkey ] or the old Opera, has destroyed the Web in Google's image.

      1. Gene Cash Silver badge

        Re: Browsers

        I use FF 43 (because 44 removed fine-grain cookie control) and Pale Moon 27 (same reason) and I just update the user-agent until the bank or whatever quits whining. I've never seen an issue with that.

        I ran into a Mozilla developer at KSC the other day. I said "how can you be a developer if all you do is *remove* features?"

        For some reason, he never spoke to me again. Good riddance.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Browsers

          I get where you're coming from...but that's a bit harsh...why not become a Mozilla dev and give something back to improve it?

        2. DBH

          Re: Browsers

          Firefox Developer Edition has fine gain cookie control. I can freely add/remove/edit cookies very easily.

          Currently on v65.0b12

      2. Timmy B Silver badge

        Re: Browsers

        Why not have the browsers use native controls for the OS that they are running under by default. By all means allow theming for people that care - but otherwise allow me to skip the bloat of a whole new set of ui controls and stick to the look of the OS I am using.

        I will get a slap for this but as I use windows 10 I use Edge - I try others for a while when new releases come out and still don't find them as fast or stable. But Edge - why do you have silly tabs at the top of the window? Why no proper title bar? At least your tabs look decent, unlike the badly drawn curvy horribleness that is Chrome. chrome who don't even respect the inactive windows colours set in windows. And while I'm on it - Chrome has dialogs - like the task manager - that don't even use standard controls for the buttons and Icons that vanish (default highlight colour in windows is blue - so don't use the same blue for your icons and buttons without inverting when selected.

        UI is what I do all day. I like the modern flat look as it allows less clutter and more user focus on the important stuff. But do it right...

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    >keeping IE10 patched for another four years is doubtless keeping the engineers awake at night.

    Dunno about that, light relief for those currently charged with the security updates of IE6 (which still 4 months of patching scheduled) for Windows POSReady 9 (XP) - and all the naughty boys who've tweaked the registry to keep desktop XP installs fresh

  3. Ol'Peculier

    The first thing I've done on pretty much every Windows server I've worked on was to install Firefox. And that probably took an hour or so each time accepting security warnings.

    Just had a look and we had 22 visitors to our site last month using IE10, so think most of our user base has already said good riddance.

    1. kain preacher Silver badge

      Ahem I would firefox would stop changing things

    2. Timmy B Silver badge

      "The first thing I've done on pretty much every Windows server I've worked on was to install Firefox. And that probably took an hour or so each time accepting security warnings."

      It took you an hour to install Firefox on a Windows Server? What the hell were you doing? I just did the same in under 2 minutes - including downloading it.

  4. Lee D Silver badge

    "This would be a good a time as any to enable Enterprise Mode to make the browser behave like older versions of IE for those pesky corporate intranet applications that insist on a specific incarnation of a specific renderer."

    Or just finally rewrite those obsolete pieces of junk in something even vaguely modern with proper security controls.

    Sorry, but if your product is "IE / ActiveX -only" in this day and age, you are failing at IT, it's as simple as that. Not just from a "Ooops, that's a bit old" viewpoint but because it's useless cross-platform, it's inherently insecure by design, and the warnings have been there for 10+ years.

    "Legacy software" you cry? Yes. So ditch it. Like you should have before it became legacy. If that costs, then that costs, but it's like expecting a 1960's Morris Minor to be the company car and I bet that doesn't happen.

    Honestly, if you even SAY the words "Internet Explorer" nowadays when on a tech support call - unless it pertains to finding out if I'm using some obsolete piece of insecure junk - then you've failed. If that's the customer's ONLY option to use your product/service, you should really get out of the industry.

    I honestly judge our banking supplier (Barclays) SO harshly because their online smartcard-based super-duper sign-in to authorise payments for a multi-million-pound business has a minimum spec of "IE 10, or Firefox ESR"... and it literally doesn't work on Chrome at all. That's just so ridiculously stupid nowadays that I can't fathom why we give them the business. And that's orders of magnitude better than "only runs on IE".

    If you are at all affected by this, for anything, at all, whatsoever, then you are using dangerously out-of-date software (whether "just internally" or not) and have been for years. Try doing something about that, this time round, rather than enabling backward-compatibility (a.k.a. "please pretend to be as useless and insecure as you used to be") and propagating into even greater levels of ludicrousness.

    1. Anonymous Custard Silver badge
      Headmaster

      Not to mention examples like (the now Microsoft owned) Github, which doesn't support IE at all (even IE11) and presents you with a banner suggesting to use Chrome, Edge or Firefox if you open it up in IE.

      That said it does generally seem to work under IE11 (at least last time it did when I had to quickly do something from work using their supplied IE11 anyway).

    2. Updraft102 Silver badge

      I honestly judge our banking supplier (Barclays) SO harshly because their online smartcard-based super-duper sign-in to authorise payments for a multi-million-pound business has a minimum spec of "IE 10, or Firefox ESR"... and it literally doesn't work on Chrome at all.

      Does it use a Java applet, by any chance?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        I can just hear Larry diving into his gold ala Scroge McDuck.

    3. Dan 55 Silver badge

      "Legacy software" you cry? Yes. So ditch it. Like you should have before it became legacy. If that costs, then that costs, but it's like expecting a 1960's Morris Minor to be the company car and I bet that doesn't happen.

      I guess it's the age old problem of someone paying a not insubstantial something to someone else to re-do their software all over and test it to make sure it works in exactly the same way as before all because Silicon Valley had another fit of re-arranging the deckchairs. By the way, the differences between a 1960's Morris Minor and a modern-day car are about the same as the differences between IE 10 and 11. You can't use the car industry as a comparison because there's far more change in IT and at a far faster rate.

      Honestly, if you even SAY the words "Internet Explorer" nowadays when on a tech support call - unless it pertains to finding out if I'm using some obsolete piece of insecure junk - then you've failed. If that's the customer's ONLY option to use your product/service, you should really get out of the industry.

      What about if your support call is about something which needs a Java? Only IE does that now.

      I honestly judge our banking supplier (Barclays) SO harshly because their online smartcard-based super-duper sign-in to authorise payments for a multi-million-pound business has a minimum spec of "IE 10, or Firefox ESR"... and it literally doesn't work on Chrome at all. That's just so ridiculously stupid nowadays that I can't fathom why we give them the business. And that's orders of magnitude better than "only runs on IE".

      Knock on Google's door and ask them to implement FIPS.

      I'm not defending it, that's the way it is. Change management has to be better than "raaaaargh, throw it all out and start again lusers" because that obviously doesn't work for everything.

    4. kain preacher Silver badge

      Are you going to pay for that? First question is does it work. Not does it work well. there has to be a businesses case to replace this software . Often times security just is not one of them unless you can convince them that it will cost them much more money not to do it .

    5. Gene Cash Silver badge

      Well, sometimes the 1960's Morris Minor is the only thing with the right connections to get the job done.

      You don't like it much, but you sit and deal with it.

      Unfortunately, I can only use Firefox 43 because later versions dropped a ton of features I depend on. So did Pale Moon and Waterfox, so there's no alternative.

      > it literally doesn't work on Chrome at all

      Hm, I don't consider this a problem.

    6. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Honestly, if you even SAY the words "Internet Explorer" nowadays when on a tech support call - unless it pertains to finding out if I'm using some obsolete piece of insecure junk - then you've failed. If that's the customer's ONLY option to use your product/service, you should really get out of the industry.

      Tell that to the university I work for, which last autumn "upgraded" the Siebel CRM software we use to keep track of students and in doing so broke the browser agnosticism introduced two years ago. It's now IE only again, and it doesn't run very well on that.

    7. electricmonk

      "I honestly judge our banking supplier (Barclays) SO harshly because their online smartcard-based super-duper sign-in to authorise payments for a multi-million-pound business has a minimum spec of "IE 10, or Firefox ESR"... and it literally doesn't work on Chrome at all."

      Funny - it works fine for me, using Chrome on Windows 10. Maybe you're holding it wrong?

      Actually the sign-in is the only good thing about my Barclays business account - features like tabbing between form fields working properly, the fact that the time-limited single-use passcode is not hidden as you type it in, and (shock horror) a single sign-in that gives me access both to the business account and to the personal account of a relative for whom I hold LPA, all indicate that somebody actually thought about usability for once. Shame the rest of their service is so dire.

    8. Charlie Clark Silver badge

      Sorry, but if your product is "IE / ActiveX -only" in this day and age, you are failing at IT, it's as simple as that.

      Sure, but you can also pity the poor mugs who've been given the job of maintaining whatever it is that was bought from supplier XYZ in 2003 because "as it runs in the browser, it won't need anything installing". Along with the software required to use the machine that goes ping or can the read the health insurance card…

      It's really quite amaying that in all the hoohah we had about browser choice, not one government ever got tough with Microsoft regarding the restricting OS releases to particular versions of IE.

      As IE 9 - 11 share largely the same codebase, shifting to IE 11 shouldn't in practice pose too many problems. And, there is also the issue of whether such a server should really be open to the internet at all, but that's a separate issue.

    9. Julian Bradfield

      Barclays' website for personal customers is equally crap. It refuses to run on Firefox on Linux at all. Until recently, it wouldn't run on Chrome on Linux, either...for the last few times, I have been able to use Chrome...just hope it lasts long enough for me to complete the transfer of all my business away from them, and even close the bank account I opened when I was 16 (rather a long time ago)...

  5. J J Carter Silver badge
    Linux

    Re: Must say it..

    Not used the internet since the last Gopher server was turned off

    1. Steve Davies 3 Silver badge

      Re: Must say it..

      Apart from posting here that is...???

      1. Dan 55 Silver badge
        Trollface

        Re: Must say it..

        El Reg has been comfortably Gopher like for a long time, but lately it's been having all these Web 2.0 airs and graces. I don't feel happy with that change.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Must say it..

        FYI the last Gopher server has not yet been turned off. I was responsible for writing the one security patch needed since 2004. There is no sign of being turned off anytime in the next few decades either - they fully support the latest data types and even IPv6 transport. Which is something that cannot be said for many "modern" servers.

  6. Mr Dogshit

    a specific incarnation of a specific renderer

    I read that as "reindeer"

    1. tim 13

      Re: a specific incarnation of a specific renderer

      And you know which specific reindeer that is...

  7. a_yank_lurker Silver badge

    Good Riddance

    Now if we can get rid of Imbecile Explorer 11 while we are at it.

    1. Daniel von Asmuth Bronze badge

      Re: Good Riddance

      As long as we get a free upgrade to IE6.

    2. veti Silver badge

      Re: Good Riddance

      There posts one who's never used it.

      IE11 is a really good browser. Granted it's some years since I tested it, but back then it was significantly ahead of both Firefox and Chrome in some important-to-me ways (most notably, standards-compliant SVG support).

      IE10 was OK, too. The days of mocking Microsoft as the non-compliant jerks of the web world are long past.

      1. N2 Silver badge
        Trollface

        Re: Good Riddance

        "IE10 was OK, too. The days of mocking Microsoft as the non-compliant jerks of the web world are long past."

        Providing you have an air gap to the Internet.

  8. IGnatius T Foobar !

    Too long already

    Seriously, after all these years, anyone who is still running software that depends on Internet Explorer deserves whatever failures they get.

  9. The Oncoming Scorn Silver badge
    WTF?

    Unfortunately our enterprise, needs Chrome for one outside system (Those who inadvertently find themselves using Edge, invariably start complaining they can't cut n paste into another part of the system for their job role - I can get away with FF as its only needed for password duties) , IE for our training (Those that inadvertently used Edge on one set of training courses find that Edge doesn't record their passing grade) & another one of our outside suppliers\clients.

    1. DJSpuddyLizard

      Don't worry, soon Edge will be Chrome underneath.

  10. Dwarf Silver badge

    What’s an Internet Explorer ?

    Is that another name for the tool that you use to download Chrome or Firefox ?

  11. This post has been deleted by its author

  12. LenG

    IE 11 ??

    I have to admit I didn't even know that there was an IE11. Of course, as I do have a Win 10 box (for games) it is possible I even have it installed. Just never used it.

    Ahhh - found IE. Started it to check the version and it told me I should be using Edge.

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    IE10? Modern. My beloved employer - a very large UK university - has a travel expenses claim system which won't run on anything newer than IE7. They keep an entire virtual machine system running just so we can do our expenses.

    1. kain preacher Silver badge

      Um wow. Well looks like you will be using IE 7 till you retire since they found a way to keep on using IE7 instead of I don't upgrading the expense system. But hey I guess if it works don;lt change it cause that cost money .

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        The system was written about fifteen years ago (when you try to log in with anything else it demands "IE5.5 or higher") by someone long gone. Nobody apparently knows how it works, documentation not having been seen as priority. But hey, our main student records system is now almost twenty five years old and the last person to understand it retired in the 20th century.

        1. kain preacher Silver badge

          Ouch. I hope you retire before it breaks

  14. The Quiet One

    IE 10 goes EoL - Dozens mourn the passing....

    Is ANYONE actually using IE10, anywhere?? If so, have a word with yourselves.....

  15. macaroo

    I had given up on Internet Explorer several years ago. It was unstable and unworkable. I went to Google's Chrome....it was like a breath of fresh air. Faster, cleaner and full of nice options that MS's abortion did not offer.

  16. Potemkine! Silver badge

    Will anyone notice?

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Try working in Pharmacy/NHS

    Those of us who are in the pharmacy/NHS sector have no choice but to use a form of IE as all of the smart card software will only function using it. FML

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    As long as they keep supporting IE6, I don't mind. Still got quite a few 'enterprise' applications that require it.

  19. TRT Silver badge

    Oh! I see!

    The tiny thumbnail image is Madame Guillotine, not a two-post telecoms equipment rack.

    Tsk! Silly me.

  20. Countryfied Linux

    Trackers!

    I'm glad I use Brave as my web browser. It detected and blocked 3 ads/trackers. Is tracking people really necessary?

    1. julian_n

      Re: Trackers!

      Only 3? ABP shows 10.

  21. sgrier23

    Windows 7 & ie10

    Well, well, well. Finally Mickysoft dumps Windows 7 and ie10... Not until 2020.

    Why???

    Because they want more punters to spend more of their hard earned cash on systems which will no doubt need a Service Pack or bug fix after a few months. They want everybody using their latest super-duper software and want them to spend the money to get it. I gave up on MS years ago, and quite frankly I am glad.

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