back to article That amazing Microsoft software quality, part 97: Windows Phone update kills Outlook, Calendar

Microsoft has thrown gasoline on its quality-assurance dumpster fire by disabling the Mail and Calendar apps on some of its Lumia Windows 10 Phone devices. The app hobbling, an awkward second act to Thurday's unplanned downgrade of Windows 10 Pro, appears to be the consequence of what Microsoft charitably calls an update, …

  1. Voyna i Mor Silver badge

    It's obvious

    You haven't heard back because Outlook isn't working on their Windows phones.

  2. GBE

    As long is customers put up with it...

    The quality of Microsoft's "produts" will continue to get worse for as long as the customers put up with it, and they show little sign of rebelling yet...

    1. Version 1.0 Silver badge
      Pint

      Re: As long is customers put up with it...

      We can all wring our hands over this and blame Microsoft but really, this is just the way the world works (or doesn't) these days - apps get upgraded and services depreciated all the time. Here today and gone tomorrow after an "upgrade" ... today it's Microsoft, tomorrow it will be Google, then Apple and so on down the line.

      Nothing has worked as long as beer - it's the only user service that's been around for 4000 years and it does help you get over today's "upgrades"

      1. Voyna i Mor Silver badge

        Re: As long is customers put up with it...

        "Nothing has worked as long as beer "

        You have obviously never heard of Watney's Red Barrel, which was a beer that, owing to its manufacture involving the very latest technology, didn't work.

        1. Tomato Krill

          Re: As long is customers put up with it...

          OK I'm sure I'm not the only who just spent twenty minutes opening tabs in search of the story behind that statement - but to no joy - care to elaborate?

          1. Roland6 Silver badge

            Re: As long is customers put up with it...

            re: Watney's Red Barrel

            Google CAMRA, although they don't explicitly name check Watney's.

            Watney's Red Barrel (and others) were a bit like the mass market US beers of the time: which were more caramelised water (as opposed to the sugared water of coke etc.) than beer.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: As long is customers put up with it...

              You can also try looking for "Monty Python Watneys Red Barrel" on YouTube or similar

              1. Avatar of They Silver badge
                Thumb Up

                Re: As long is customers put up with it...

                Brilliant sketch, have an upvote for reminding me...

            2. AndyMulhearn

              Re: As long is customers put up with it...

              There used to be a saying that you shouldn’t take the piss out of Watneys Red Barrel because all you’d have left is water...

              It was a very bad rime when that kind of beer was popular. Britain was not a good place...

            3. Voyna i Mor Silver badge

              Re: As long is customers put up with it...

              Beer making is by its normal nature a batch process. Details are readily available, I won't go into it.

              The idea of WRB was to use a continuous flow process. The ingredients went in at the bottom of a (stainless steel?) tower. They gradually rose up and as they did so passed through horizontal screens and temperature zones until the final product was decanted from the top (as the ABV increases the density decreases, which is what the process depends on to work.)

              The problem with a continuous process is quality control, because if something goes wrong you have a lot of stuff in the middle of a big tower that somehow has to be removed. So the product has to be absolutely lowest common denominator to have any chance of working.

              I suspect that the Microsoft update pipeline is a bit like this, it's very difficult to stop the process and remove bad stuff.

              1. DJV Silver badge

                "very difficult to stop the process and remove bad stuff"

                In Microsoft's case that sort of thing is for the official testers* to do!

                * i.e. the users.

        2. Teiwaz Silver badge

          Re: As long is customers put up with it...

          You have obviously never heard of Watney's Red Barrel,

          Can't blame MS for Watneys Red Barrel - although as a mostly fashionable fizzy so-so (some quite liked it, some hated it with a passion) driven by a good Marketing machine for a while, Windows is actually quire similar.

  3. Dwarf Silver badge

    What a bunch of cowboys

  4. AMRone

    Not affecting all users?

    This issue isn't affecting the phones in my household (950XL and several 950s, US variants), all on OS build 15254.538, and we did receive the Mail and Calendar update recently to 20083.0. Perhaps it is a UK only issue?

    That said, our phones have been acting even flakier than usual with the last couple of OS updates. I am beginning to look seriously at moving to Android, even though I hate G**gle. Ugh.

    1. TheGreatCabbage

      Re: Not affecting all users?

      To remain Google-free you could flash Lineage OS, which incidentally gets regular security updates. Or you could just avoid signing in with any Google services.

      In either case you can install apps from F-Droid (all open source), Aptoide and Apkmirror.

      1. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: Not affecting all users?

        Two things strike me about Lineage OS (Formerly known as CyanogenMod),

        1) Its still Googles underlying Code (Android Open Source Project),

        2) (A matter of personal preference sure), But, to make it useful you're going to want to install some GAPPs which again kinda moots the point.

        Again the only real point in running this Software as such is if your OEM (coughing loudly), Samsung has decided to just feck off and, support the next device, (Insert any Tab/Plablet you like here), instead. then yes as long as your Device still has a Dev behind it may still continue to see the next OS version. Or as of late the latest Monthly Security Patch. Although in my experance that only turns up every so offten anyway. It might also explain why other People, like nVidia with the Shield TV, were reporting future monthly Security Updates (From Google...), but have thusfar been mostly silent for the past few Months. When the last update from them hit, they were actually looking like they would continue to actually do this. Which at the time kind of impressed me.

        But, let us remember the Shield TV came out, back in 2015... So nobody shouldn't say that they haven't been supporting it.

        As to third-party Appstores.... Is it just me are were they also very shady AF?! Aptodid, is a place to get pirated (e.g. hacked), *.apk's, and Apkmirror, is only useful if you want to let your Device, mine Coin for someone else. I think we're well past the days of such Malware, just spaming something as innocent as a Porn Website.

        Now I grant you Google are NOT much better at protecting themselves, (or us for that matter!), as it comes to all that. But, they have a vested intrest to keep that knind of crap off the System. Those other Two? Naghh I don't think so.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Not affecting all users?

      Been getting worse since they put win 10 on the phones. I still have 950, but have ordered my replacement, not happy really as I don't like android, like the win phone interface, but just poor updates. I have had mail problems for about a month now. My google mail doesn't show unless I select it twice. Had another mail problem for don't know how long, pick the mail in the notification bar, doesn't go to it, shows the last mail viewed and says I have now read the one I picked in the notification.

  5. JohnFen Silver badge

    I am genuinely shocked

    I'm genuinely shocked to learn that there are people still using Windows phones.

    1. Terry 6 Silver badge

      Re: I am genuinely shocked

      I gave up my Winphone and lay down in front of Google's Android less than a year ago. I kept going with the Winphone because it was a nice phone to use (as well as not being Google's) and meant that my calendar was easily shared across to my desktop and PC. I kept with Outlook on my PC for the same reason. It was when things like the BBC apps stopped working, that I really needed, that I started to give in and accepted that I needed to jump ship.

      I now keep my calendar in Outlook.com and Thunderbird with Lightning respectively. But that only syncs because of a third party addon for TB (TBsync). Otherwise I'd be stuffed. It's only when I found TBSync that I was fully able to make the switch.

      So for MS to screw up that aspect of Winphone is to break the only part that would have kept me using it.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        "So for MS to screw up that aspect of Winphone is to break the only part that would have kept me using it."

        Wouldn't surprise me if that's what they're trying to do - it's a dead platform for them, just a pit of money to throw money into - the sooner they can dissuade people from using it the cheaper it'll be for them.

        I loved my Nokia 1020, best camera ever, and the interface was actually really nice. But I ditched it a long time ago due to the lack of a decent app ecosystem. I didn't want to be locked into a Microsoft only ecosystem for this very reason.

    2. AegisPrime

      Re: I am genuinely shocked

      I'm still using my Lumia 520 'cause I haven't found anything cheap that can run Lineage OS yet - anyone got any recommendations for a Lineage-supported sub-£100 phone?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        I have an ageing Sammy S3 very happily running Lineage OS

      2. Ledswinger Silver badge

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        anyone got any recommendations for a Lineage-supported sub-£100 phone?

        Sub £100 I can't comment, but a Xiaomi Mi A1 can be had new off Fleabay for a tad over £130, and I believe has Lineages support.

        1. Ledswinger Silver badge

          Re: I am genuinely shocked

          Sub £100 I can't comment, but a Xiaomi Mi A1 can be had new off Fleabay for a tad over £130

          Oops, I meant Mi A2 Lite. As Chinese phone followers will know, marginal differences in designation sometimes mean vast differences in spec, sometimes none at all. The Mi A1's lowest price is around £150, the Mi A2 Lite can be found as low as £120.

      3. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        How about you have a look :HERE

        and then take a look over :THERE (subheader: Shoping)

        The First Link has the list of actvely supported Devices. going all the way back to the days of CyanogenMod. The other is of couse Google....

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I am genuinely shocked

      "I'm genuinely shocked to learn that there are people still using Windows phones."

      "I'm genuinely shocked to learn that there are people still using Windows ".

      1. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        To be far.. I never had problems getting something as basic as a Fingerprint Reader on my Lappy, to just work under Windows. On Linux Mint... After a fresh install. It can be quite the fiscking chore. That said, most of the stuff I like to use, primaraly being Darktable, and Gimp (i.e. Open Source versions of Lightroom, and Photoshop), are pretty much at home on Linux any how. And, I'm not about to touch anything less than Enterprise grade Windows X. But, good luck trying to get a personal Copy of Slurps latest. Hackentosh was kinda cool for Five minutes, back in 2009. So that leaves me with either FreeBSD, which I still havent tried, or Linux. Of which I'm more famillure with the Debian structure. So my go to Disto in that case would be Mint.

        Mores the pitty that I can NOT seem to install it properly unless I cut my WiFi off compleatly. Which also kinda sucks major balls.

    4. aje21
      Thumb Up

      Re: I am genuinely shocked

      Will be very sad when my Lumia 1020 stops working - I was never that into having lots of apps but some of the fairly useful ones have fallen by the wayside over the last couple of years. However there are still quite a few which I use that are still working...

      Tempted to give Sailfish a try at some point as I find Android to be very frustrating as a phone OS (the rest of the family have been using it for years and often can't work out how to do things which are really simple on Windows Phone - I help when I can, but just find it frustrating).

      1. Def Silver badge

        Re: I am genuinely shocked

        I have a Lumia 950 and a (work issued) Huawai P20 Pro. I much prefer using the Windows phone *because* of the lack of apps. When I'm carrying the work phone, I catch myself wasting time with all kinds of shit apps that I really should know better than to use. (But they're there, and I don't.)

        Unfortunately, I have to carry the Android these days because the one app that I really need (ticket app for public transport) doesn't work on Windows anymore. :(

  6. SVV Silver badge

    The synergistic phone, slab and PC strategy reaches fruition

    Windows 10 updates have managed to screw up every single one of them.

  7. This post has been deleted by a moderator

  8. bombastic bob Silver badge
    Unhappy

    How long before

    some malware-maker pwns a network someplace, and forces people to "upgrade" their windows devices to a version that has even MORE built-in malware than the Micro-shaft version, which THEN spreads itself by taking over MORE networks (public wifi, whatever) until everyone's windows "device" has been "upgraded" to something that CANNOT BE REMOVED, etc...

    and without the choice to turn it off, it "just loads the 'up'grade". And it "cleverly" marks itself with a newer revision than anything ELSE that might show up to overwrite it, hides itself, puts itself into the BIOS, etc. to keep it on the "device" forever and ever and ever...

    It's bad enough when Micro-shaft totally SCREWS THE POOCH on their *LACK* of quality control. But this kind of "we forced you to accept something that broke what you had" mentality can ONLY end very, very, badly.

    1. Tomato Krill

      Re: How long before

      How long until someone 'pwns' Microsoft's update server? Presumably after managing to develop a build of the OS close enough not to be obviously different, and steal the private key they use to sign the builds?

      Not soon, I would stick my neck out and say...

    2. DJV Silver badge

      Re: How long before

      Yeah, but would anyone notice?

    3. FozzyBear Silver badge
      IT Angle

      Re: How long before

      "upgrade" their windows devices to a version that has even MORE built-in malware than the Micro-shaft version,

      Not Possible. What the malware-makers do through intention, Micro$lop achieves through complete incompetence and indifference. Plus they have more people to do this than the malware crews

    4. hplasm Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: How long before

      The dawn of Biglysoft!

    5. Michael Habel Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Re: How long before

      You mean this hasn't already happend MULTIPLE TIMES already with Windows X?!

  9. Joe W

    Meh, all part of a grand plan

    They want to make people move from that platform...

    Even as a long term (I guess 20 years is enough to qualify) Linux user I have to admit: I was really happy with my Windows 8 phone. Brilliant interface, responsive (even on poor hardware)...

    1. Sandtitz Silver badge

      Re: Meh, all part of a grand plan @Joe W

      They want to make people move from that platform...

      Why? MS has committed to maintain Win10 Phone until 12/2019. I'm not seeing MS gaining or losing anything even if people keep using the service until then. After that it is not Microsoft's problem, even if people continue to use phones that are not up-to-date. People still use pre-5S iPhones, Gingerbread Androids, and older Nokias happily even if they're considered obsolete by many.

    2. MacroRodent Silver badge

      Re: Meh, all part of a grand plan

      Indeed, it is as if Microsoft wants users to switch to Android. I agree WP8 was a huge advance over its successor! I switched last summer as a experiment (to the Samsung my son used to use - nowadays he get the latest tech, and me the second-hand :-)), but the WP10 Lumia phone has been sitting in my drawer as a backup. I guess better not switch it on, until MS fixes their latest fix.

  10. vmistery

    If they want people to update quickly then they need to ensure their updates are reliably not mucking up peoples devices. We live in an age that threats can be exploited very quickly so enterises and consumers need the confidence to be able to patch fast.

  11. Thought About IT

    Fixed

    Microsoft seem to have fixed the problem this morning.

    1. Anonymous South African Coward Silver badge

      Re: Fixed

      Microsoft seem to have fixed the problem this morning.

      More fun is coming to every M$-based platform and Orifice installation. Better disable or block windowsupdates until they got things sorted out properly.

      1. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: Fixed

        More fun is coming to every M$-based platform and Orifice installation. Better disable or block windowsupdates until they got things sorted out properly.

        But, I thought the whole point of Windows X was so that you HAD to take MicroSoft's Medicine, whether, or not it needed addional Chemo. As its not like you're on a Corporate Network any how? I thought that was the fun, adventurous part of running Windows X. Was to count the Days till the next or, after the next System-wide spectacular.

  12. Michael Jarve

    It’s a game...

    Since the release of Windows 10, be it mobile or else which, Microsoft has been treating Windows as Bethesda treats an Elder Scrolls game- release it now, and we’ll fix it later. The difference, of course is that people rely on Windows operating correctly from day one (or at least reliably enough) whereas people playing Skyrim can wait 6 days or months for a mostly functioning version of the game through patches. It’s not really an important thing. This Windows as a service scheme is not suited to a consumer/semi-pro OS. It works for Linux, because Linux users tend to be more savy ( nevermind that many problems can be circumvented with config/command line mojo). Not to mention that most major Linux distros have a 3+ year LTS version with regular patches, but also have an army of user/developers who also contribute code, based on real-life scenarios and a now more polite overlord who demands the best (even if/when bugs get through), and MS’s new “throw it at the wall and see what sticks, we’ll fix it later” looks even more daft. Peter Bright, Microsoft apologist, recently wrote on another site about how MS’s OS’s were always crud out of the gate, and took a service pack or two to be considered good enough for deployment, and that the fix it as we go Windows 10 meant continual bugs improvements not seen in previous versions. What he failed to concede was that while, yes, the initial release was usually rubbish, the service pack, released a year or so later was solid enough to keep you going for 10 or more years, if you updated, because it was tested up the wazoo before release. The first version of anything is not as good as the later version. Companies learn from mistakes, and not only from the mistakes they made, but why those mistakes were made. Further, you could choose not to bork your system every 6 months with a service pack feature upgrade foisted upon you whether you want it or not.

    1. a_yank_lurker Silver badge

      Re: It’s a game...

      "Microsoft has been treating Windows as Bethesda treats an Elder Scrolls game- release it now, and we’ll fix it later." - This does not work for any long term success for anyone. Burn customers enough and they will vote with their wallets. What Slurp has forgotten is customers do have options, not necessarily great options now, but real options.

      Another issue for Slurp is the family IT department might get fed up with constantly fighting updates that bork systems. They might say enough and convert their families and friends to other OSes/devices for their personal sanity. Technical problems with many Linux distros are often much easier to solve and tend to stay solved.

    2. Michael Habel Silver badge
      Linux

      Re: It’s a game...

      And since this pile of excrament landed, there has been the.....

      November Update

      Anniversary Update

      Creators Update

      Fall Creators Update

      April 2018 Update

      October 2018 Update

      So when do you recken enough of these Updates will have come, and gone again, before Windows X actually starts to get good again?

  13. h4rm0ny

    So that's what happened. I noticed I couldn't open Calendar on my phone - it starts to open and then just shuts down.

    I really like the Windows Phone OS. I'm pissed off with Microsoft for dropping it. They may not have had as much initial success with it as they liked but it is a solid OS and ceding the market entirely to Google and Apple is a huge mistake. I've stuck with it since because I like it, but I'm going to have to get an Android phone soon just because nobody writes software for WP anymore.

    1. Sandtitz Silver badge
      Holmes

      "I'm pissed off with Microsoft for dropping it. They may not have had as much initial success with it as they liked but it is a solid OS and ceding the market entirely to Google and Apple is a huge mistake."

      MS ceded the market to Google and Apple not because they wanted, but because they were too late in the market, and the poor management and poor technical decisions bungled it afterwards. Not gaining developer love had some part in their undoing as well.

      MS could only have had a better chance with underhanded tactics, like hampering O365/Exchange connectivity from non-Windows devices. Similarly, Google didn't code a Youtube app for WinPhone (perfectly excusable), but Google did have a hissy fit when MS made their own Youtube app and blocked access. Well documented on El Reg site.

      1. L05ER

        BS

        There is no such thing as being too late to market with a unique product.

        The problem was that they didn't commit to the vision of winphone7... all the core things people did with their phones were super streamlined and built-in.

        Winphone8 stopped that and forced everyone back to apps... with the thinking that they would get updates faster. Microsoft should have published (or heavily incentivized) themselves, since attracting devs was already a tall order for a small marketshare phone.

        Basically they broke their own feet, and then put their head in a noose... it had nothing do with "being too late"... you trend whore.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: BS

          attracting devs was already a tall order for a small marketshare phone.

          Nothing to do with the small market share. Everything to do with the fact that it was a company with a long track record of abusing developers.

      2. Richard Plinston Silver badge

        > but Google did have a hissy fit when MS made their own Youtube app

        Google blocked the Microsoft Youtube app because it deliberately did not follow Google's Terms of Service. Specifically, Microsoft blocked Google ads which is what pays for the service.

        Note that this did not block user's access to Youtube, they could watch using the browser.

        It was Microsoft being evil (again).

        https://www.windowscentral.com/google-microsoft-remove-youtube-windows-phone-store

        1. Teiwaz Silver badge

          Google blocked the Microsoft Youtube app because it deliberately did not follow Google's Terms of Service. Specifically, Microsoft blocked Google ads which is what pays for the service.

          Note that this did not block user's access to Youtube, they could watch using the browser.

          It was Microsoft being evil (again).

          Nice feature though - The bloody ads are annoying and even signed in to youtube for all your youtube watching they still manage to fail to feed me advertising tailored to my interests

          - What's the f****ing point of all that data collection and tracking me everywhere to then conclude i'm a thirty-something social-climbing young professional female woman interested in make-overs, fashionable perfumes and travel and not a sad single geek in his mid-forties who watches tech-channels, ghost tales and ancient aliens...?

          This wasn't Evil - blocking Googles ads and replacing their own or ones where the ching ching went in their pockets instead would be Evil....

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      but I'm going to have to get an Android phone soon just because nobody writes software for WP anymore.

      But nobody ever did in the first place.

  14. Anonymous South African Coward Silver badge

    More fun to come yet. And it may take a while to resolve as people now will disable windows updates front, left, right and center.

    Won't it be a real hoot if M$ inadvertently causes some critical servers to crash and burn badly due to some dodgy server updates? (Bound to happen sooner or later, given the lack of QA).

  15. TVU Silver badge

    "The app hobbling, an awkward second act to Thurday's unplanned downgrade of Windows 10 Pro, appears to be the consequence of what Microsoft charitably calls an update, issued earlier this week"

    These days, when Microsoft uses the term "update", it turns out that it is their gentle euphemism for "clusterf*ck".

  16. Joe Montana

    Simple business...

    Microsoft have a choice of...

    1, invest in proper QA and development, keep customers happy and lose very few customers.

    2, save money on QA and development, piss customers off but still lose very few customers because most of them have no choice.

    Shareholders will force them to choose 2, the users are locked in and they can't go anywhere - why would they bother offering a better product if the users are still buying the shoddy one?

    1. Anonymous South African Coward Silver badge

      Re: Simple business...

      Simple business...

      Microsoft have a choice of...

      1, invest in proper QA and development, keep customers happy and lose very few customers.

      2, save money on QA and development, piss customers off but still lose very few customers because most of them have no choice.

      Shareholders will force them to choose 2, the users are locked in and they can't go anywhere - why would they bother offering a better product if the users are still buying the shoddy one?

      This....I think we're looking at an option 2 future :(

    2. Cavehomme_

      Users are locked in and they can't go anywhere

      "Shareholders will force them to choose 2, the users are locked in and they can't go anywhere"

      I don't believe so. The consumer market can walk away to re-use their PC for many more years with Linux Mint, or walk away to Apple or get a Chromebook. Most consumers are happy not to use a PC anyway, prefering their phones and tablets / pads.

      That leaves it to the corporate market to decde which way it will go. With more and more software being delivered as a service, there's less need to worry about the OS. When the OS borks and is more and more unreliable, businesses will also walk sooner or later.

      I've put up with MS for 30 years, they revolutionised home and business computing whether we like them or not, it's a fact. But the pain now is getting worse, with Fragile used for developing the OS and beggar all testing in-house, plus all the worries about trying to keep safe from malware too, it's a big headache. I expect to cut free finally from Windows in 2019 and use Linux Mint and OSX.

      1. Teiwaz Silver badge

        Re: Users are locked in and they can't go anywhere

        I don't believe so. The consumer market can walk away

        The user isn't really locked in by MS anymore, they are locked in by their own belief that there is no alternative but to put up with it.

        Walls of their own making, 'cause aren't we all trapped by walls of our own making?

      2. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: Users are locked in and they can't go anywhere

        I expect to cut free finally from Windows in 2019 and use Linux Mint and OSX FreeBSD.

        There Fixed that for you...

    3. Richard 12 Silver badge

      Re: Simple business...

      Management picking #2 is management that kills the company entirely - albeit not immediately.

      There is a wall around Windows, made of business critical applications.

      That wall has been getting lower.

      If MS continue to screw up in this way, eventually a large corporation will tell their IT minions "We can't afford the risk of Windows anymore, fix it"

      That will be the end of Windows.

    4. Michael Habel Silver badge

      Re: Simple business...

      2, save money on QA and development, piss customers off but still lose very few customers because most of them have no choice.

      You can't loose Customers you never really had. (Which I gather kionda works both ways if you think about it.). Most Plebs only have an OEM version of MicroSoft's finest. And, that Sale was to the OEM. (e.g. Dell), MicroSoft have discoverd the shear joys of Microtransations via their XBOX Live!, and saw, how both Apple, and Google were using that premise to make more money after the sale of some iThing, or other Android Device. And, of couse MicroSoft wanted to get into that act. The long game is undoubtly to make Windows a Monthly Subscribtion Sevice. Problem is if they just up and run with it. MicroSoft would be gone with-in a Week. So what else can they make Money / Use out of.... Oh yeah that Big Data, Cloud thing...

      Now, you can either chose to move in locksteep with 'em. Or you can still leave. either way. The only Customers in that exact scnce of the Word would to me be the Windows X users. Not those running some OEM copy of Windows 7.

      Which is why I never saw myself as being a Customer of theirs, and why I have no rights to call them up and complain how shite their Software is. As they will rightfully tell me to take it up with the OEM (i.e. Dell), who sold me the Computer with Windows on it.

  17. This post has been deleted by its author

  18. The New Turtle

    It's a damn shame, what happen with winpho & Nokia. We migrated earlier this year to Android because various things simply stopped working, so I guess this isn't really a surprise so much as just discovering where the lightening was due to strike next.

  19. arctic_haze Silver badge
    Gimp

    Worse than a shot in the foot

    It is an eye opener how Microsoft treats "those who cling to Windows Phone devices" (as the article calls them) or in other words its most loyal fanboy cadres.

  20. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Potential

    Well I know of 1 east midlands county council (rhymes with rottinghamshire) that very heavily use Lumia 650s.

    Can't help but wonder what fun their IT Dept has had with this.

    They've only just started looking at Android phones.......

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Potential

      They are not the only council saddled with MS phones, depending on your product replacement cycle there was a significant issue around retaining Public Sector Network Compliance on Android devices.

      I managed a project at another LA where winphones were selected as the replacement for Android devices as the entire android fleet had to be binned due to lack of security patching availability. You cannot use rooted devices so a non manufacturer ROM was not an option. Apple could offer the continued support required but the Lumia came in at 25% of the cost of an Apple device at the time. The investment has been justified over a 4 year period. As long as you were just using the MS office apps, mail and web browsing the phones were still functional and patched. The main issue I came across for core apps was when MS updated its authenticator app but deprecated the winphone 10 version. The work around for that was hilariously to use the google authenticator available in the windows store. I'm genuinely at a loss to what will happen at the next re-procurement. Unless vendors will commit to providing security patches for the expected economic life of the phone (4 or 5 years) then councils will be either faced with a 2 year replacement policy using cheaper android handsets or the market will be ceded to Apple by default, although the near £1000 handset cost could foil that. Another requirement for PSN compliance was that devices must be securely managed. One of the biggest costs of moving estates to a new regime will be the cost of implementing the required policies for MDM and integrating a new manufacturer with the MDM solution. I've not been involved in mobile for a couple of years but back then the MDM products all seemed to be flaky and integration with a different model was problematic let alone changing operating systems. AC as I still consult in this space.

  21. Scroticus Canis Silver badge
    Devil

    The lead-in picture is wrong ...

    ... should be missing 6 toes and sporting a few see through holes.

    1. tekHedd

      Re: The lead-in picture is wrong ...

      ... and you're not going to be doing much self-foot-shooting with an uncocked gun, for that matter.

  22. L05ER

    If only...

    If the rest of the phone industry would stop chasing nonsensical features... and charging a premium for nonsense... maybe they could tempt me away from my 1020.

    I want a good camera, and a phone OS that doesn't rearrange itself every few months...

    NOT some bullshit edge to edge screen (because reasons!), redundant camera lenses for stupid photo party tricks, fingerprint sensors for ppl too impatient for a pin, stupidly thin to the point of being not fit for purpose, and absolutely requiring an aftermarket case which almost always interferes with touch recognition (see edge to edge screen).

    Deride us all you want, when the phone industry moves beyond it's teenager-in-high-school levels of nonsense chasing, I'll buy.

    1. Cavehomme_

      Re: If only...

      Agree with all you say, except fingerprint recognition, that, for me, is a great feature...not so Face ID.

    2. Voyna i Mor Silver badge

      Re: If only...

      Sony tried most of that. They lose money.

      1. Michael Habel Silver badge

        Re: If only...

        That could be a thought for th things that they (S0NY), are doing wrong? Sure way back in the day S0NY actually stood for something. What's the first thing to roll of the top of your head these days?

        Tintitron?

        Bravia?

        The Walk / Disc -man?

        Their Robotic K9 Unit?

        Perhaps those VIAO Laptops?

        Nope They are that Company who's in a war for the Livingroom, with MicroSoft's XBone. With their latest Playstation. Your damn right if you think I think that S0NY beanded Phones were too expensive (back in the day), when compaired to the better looking Phones coming out of South Kerea (again at the time). Today the South Korean Firms ar at, or at least surpassed S0NY on many of those fronts, are are now finding themselve being erroded by other Chinese OD/OE -M's who can pretty much parrot what the big boys are doing, but again at a fraction of the price.

        The simple fact is if S0NY would make a decent Flagship Phone, with most of the Bells, and whistles, of the day, and then tryed to sell it for about half of what Samsung are asking for with the S/Note 8/9/10. I think they would suddenly start to sell some Phones again. Add Playstaion Vue as Blotware crap to make even more money streaming Playstaion Games to said Phones. Yeah they did kind of tryed that once before. But, that PSP Phone thing was way to niche. Not to mention it probably wasn't really ready for primetime. What with UTMS / 3G just starting to roll out. but, now with 4&5G. That could actually probably even be a thing.

  23. thexfile

    MicroGlitch.

  24. Michael Habel Silver badge
    Alert

    Nice eMail Client you got there, shame if something were to hapen to it. But, I'm sure Mr. Nadella isn't the kind of guy to let such an excelent opportunity to shrill the benifits of Oriface 365, to not go by.

  25. AndyJT

    Looks like a fix was made

    Looks like a fix was released (or a downgrade, who knows?) on Saturday. I'm using a windows phone, I actually prefer the interface compared to Apple or Android (I actually moved from Android to Windows Phone when it was Windows Phone 8.1 with a Lumia 735). The problem is, not everyone can jump to a different platform/new phone. My phones usually last 5-8 years, I'm not a big app user, I just want to basics, (email, basic internet, Skype instead of text messages). Whoever experienced this problem, Microsoft managed to turn a number of "smartphones" into feature phones overnight. The responses I got on the Microsoft Community to the problem weren't really any good so it was basically a waiting game (with me thinking I'd go back to my old HTC Wildfire until they fixed the issue, thankfully I didn't need to do that).

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