back to article Once more with feeling: Windows 10 October 2018 Update inches closer to relaunch

Microsoft’s efforts to recover from the Windows 10 October 2018 Update debacle continued last night as a fresh build of the troubled operating system was emitted to Windows Insiders. Build 17763.104 is the second release of the update to Insiders since the file-eating monster was unleashed on an unsuspecting public back on 2 …

  1. Pascal Monett Silver badge
    FAIL

    I'm just wondering

    How long will it be before companies start phoning Redmond offices to say "hey, cut the bullshit releases out - we are working here !".

    Constant uproar in the IT area of a company will inevitably have consequences on revenue at some point. If these shenanigans continue, Microsoft just might find itself in legal hot water.

    1. AMBxx Silver badge

      Re: I'm just wondering

      Hopefully, they've made such a mess of the updates that the people at the top may take notice. It's worked before.

      1. Anonymous Custard Silver badge
        Headmaster

        Re: I'm just wondering

        Most companies that do use Windows 10 are probably rather more picky about if/when they do update stuff, so that the unfortunate public can act as the canaries for all of this.

        For example I'm typing this on my company PC, which has a fairly much uneventful Win10 config, albeit the 1703 build rather than anything too cutting edge. I doubt our corporate IT group are unusual in such caution.

        Aside from the public users (of which I'm also one at home, although I don't rush to update there either) it's the small business users I feel especially sorry for. Those not large enough to be able to be so choosy about what, when and how they run, but in real financial danger if it does go tits-up.

        1. Julian 8

          Re: I'm just wondering

          Depends if you need to have SOX compliance. If you do, you need to be pretty good with all the security updates and that will include builds.

          However, running an old OS - as long as it is patched - is fine for compliance which is one of the many reasons it takes some companies time to update from Win7 to Win10

          1. stephanh Silver badge

            Re: I'm just wondering

            I think most companies are on the "Semi-annual channel" (SAC) and will only upgrade once the proles, I mean Windows Home users, have fully beta-tested the new Windows.

    2. nematoad Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: I'm just wondering

      You know something? I'm really glad that I have retired.

      The shit hitting the fan courtesy of MS is enough to drown any IT department. God knows there are enough problems around without the OS vendor joining in.

    3. Usermane

      Re: I'm just wondering

      Micro$oft won't have many problems even if the next update format all the hard disks as the foollowers will keep using that O$ because most of the users don't know so much and others are proud of using it.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I'm just wondering

      If these shenanigans continue, Microsoft just might find itself in legal hot water.

      I think it's in the Terms of Service that they can "upgrade" you at any time. Businesses get to pay extra for business or even LTSB versions of windows so that they're NOT forced to update.

      Strange that isn't it? You want the latest hardware, but you never ever want the latest Windows version.

    5. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Re: I'm just wondering

      even though many of us (former?) insiders have made the SAME kinds of comments in the past, i.e. that it's not our job to constantly fiddle-fart with 'updates' in lieu of getting work done, I'd expect the same response to companies [even big ones] making the same kinds of complaints.

      Micro-shaft does not care about customers. They are 'minions' and 'revenue generators', and so the customer is NEVER right, MICRO-SHAFT is right, your computer is a means by which they can exploit you, and you're lucky to even get something that works MOST of the time. The rest of the time, you're a slave of Micro-shaft Marketing, your computer's maintenance is the end-all be-all of your day, Win-10-nic and any 'CRapps' they CRam into your body orifices are MORE IMPORTANT than ANYTHING ELSE you do, yotta yotta.

      It's the same kind of arrogance that used to crap up your 'autoexec.bat' and 'config.sys' files back in the DOS days, when "whatever application" was _THE_ _MOST_ _IMPORTANT_ _THING_ on your computer, so "of course we can take it over".

    6. Nolveys Silver badge
      Windows

      Re: I'm just wondering

      Constant uproar in the IT area of a company will inevitably have consequences on revenue at some point.

      I doubt it. MS has been sodomizing their "customers" for decades and the customers just keep coming back for more.

      It's like watching an episode of "COPS" (is that still a thing?) where the police go on a domestic. There's some mullet-headed grease ball and a burn-out woman with an eye swollen shut, blood everywhere and teeth missing saying "Bobby-Joe done did this, but he don't mean it! He loves me!" The sane thing for her to do would be to go to a woman's shelter and sort her life out, but you just know that she'll stay with Bobby-Joe and receive regular beatings for ever and ever.

      It doesn't matter what happens to them, the people who make the software purchasing decisions will always jump at the opportunity to skip gleefully through the gates of hell. And you know what? I'm fine with it.

      I used to hate this state of affairs, but at some point I realized that being paid by the hour to fix a perpetual nuclear cluster-fuck ain't that bad. The trick is to abandon all hope for the future of computing. Just crank the cynicism to 11 and set the "rapetastic hourly rate" toggle switch to the on position.

    7. leexgx

      Re: I'm just wondering

      all my computers and other systems i have touched are only just getting 1803 upgrade offer now

      win 10 pro (pro keys are like less then £3 ignore the site if it says it has to be a clean install of windows it will change to pro fine) set it to non targeted mode and +100 day delay on upgrade and 15 day delay on normal updates

      this more or less prevents buggy normal windows updates (as MS pulls and fixes them normally within 7 days) and very tested feature build is going to be used (my systems are not going to be used for not very well tested release updates)

  2. malle-herbert Silver badge
    FAIL

    The only thing Microsoft is shovelling these days...

    Is sh*t....

    1. beep54

      Re: The only thing Microsoft is shovelling these days...

      "...the troubled operating system was [excreted] to Windows Insiders." FTFY

  3. MrMerrymaker

    A powerful sense of dread

    Ugh, my gaming PC has Windows 10... I dread updating it.

    So no wonder I spend 80% of my computer time on my efficient little refurbed ThinkPad T450 running Linux Mint.

    I've used Windows so long I think I carry that Windows Dread around with me. It's virtually a feature baked into the OS!

    1. wallaby

      Re: A powerful sense of dread

      "So no wonder I spend 80% of my computer time on my efficient little refurbed ThinkPad T450 running Linux Mint."

      they just cant help themselves can they

      yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn

      1. Waseem Alkurdi

        Re: A powerful sense of dread

        Does Linux give you some allergy or something?

        1. hplasm Silver badge
          Linux

          Re: A powerful sense of dread

          "Does Linux give you some allergy or something?"

          Marsupials are scared of advanced technology..

          And penguins.

          1. wallaby

            Re: A powerful sense of dread

            Advanced technology PMSL

            "They" are people who (in a forum which has nothing whatsoever to do with Linux), insist in posting about what version or mint (other Linux variants are available) they have.

            And scared of Linux - I use both windows and Linux FYI - each as their place

            (advance technology my rear).

            1. JohnFen Silver badge

              Re: A powerful sense of dread

              "I use both windows and Linux FYI - each as their place"

              True, although the proper place for Win 10 is straight in the trash. (Regardless of one's opinion of Linux).

              1. Nick Ryan Silver badge

                Re: A powerful sense of dread

                Meh. I'll reserve my hatred for every damn Operating System. Every one. They all have issues, they all do stupid things, they have crazy omissions, they all have stuff that I don't need therefore should be there :)

                I'll use whatever OS is required for the task at hand, I'm not going to be blinkered by idealism. Unless one is talking about AmigaOS of course... :)

            2. Waseem Alkurdi
              Devil

              Re: A powerful sense of dread

              in a forum which has nothing whatsoever to do with Linux

              That's Neowin over there, not El Reg.

            3. MrMerrymaker

              Re: A powerful sense of dread

              [quote]"They" are people who (in a forum which has nothing whatsoever to do with Linux), [/quote]

              Ah but I was explaining how Windows 10 pushed me away. How the insider builds create dread, how when the time came to choose an operating system, the unreliability of it, based on my prior experience, led me to turn away from Windows 10, and not miss anything.

              Indeed, it would be remiss to not mention what I replaced it with. I could have replaced it with a heroin addiction, but the post would still scorn Windows 10.

              Yet I used the dreaded L word... From my point of view I was merely telling the truth. If my tale was 'I decided not to use Windows 10 and used an alternative OS I am happy with', it would beg the reveal anyway.

      2. MrMerrymaker

        Re: A powerful sense of dread

        Who is They? People who use both OS's? Lifelong Windows users who couldn't be arsed buying a license for their refurbed laptop?

        I don't mind if you insult me, but you're not exactly clear what you're having a go at here. Should I jump over to Linux in full? :)

        Could do with a report on how the gaming side is. Only just getting into Wine.. (not the drink. Got into that years ago)

        1. RRJ

          Re: A powerful sense of dread

          Been using Win10 since it first came out and gets update as and when there sent out.. and I cannot remember ever having a problem.. This is on a home built PC..

          OK I did switch to Win7 on a Sony laptop I have as the Win10 video drivers did not work.. but the laptop is 8 years old so I understand the video driver issue..

          I think most users don't have any problems is the same 80/20 rule i.e. 80% are fine..

          Cheers

      3. bombastic bob Silver badge
        Devil

        Re: A powerful sense of dread

        "they just cant help themselves can they"

        I spend at least 80% of my time working in FreeBSD. Same idea as those who use Linux.

        Windows is for accounting applications, occasional e-mail, and music authoring [because I bought cakewalk almost a decade ago, and might as well use it]. And it runs Windows 7. Best e-bay purchase I made, a Lenovo box for 'cheap price', dual core 3Ghz reconditioned model with 4G and Windows 7 pro. While I still could.

        So yeah. couldn't help myself mentioning THAT.

        1. Kizzume

          Re: "Windows is for accounting applications, occasional e-mail, and music authoring"

          Yes, Windows is for music authoring because Windows is for doing anything creative, Windows is for creating consumable content.

          Linux (or BSD) is for consuming content without limits, without much worry of viruses or malware. Linux is also for problem solving and hosting and delivering content--sure one can be creative in problem solving and in the methods of delivering content, but it's a different mindset than actually creating consumable content.

          If companies like Adobe were to ever release their flagship software for Linux, you'd see a real change. Right now, all the good creative software suites are simply not available for Linux.

  4. J J Carter Silver badge
    Facepalm

    For shame!

    How many users were too embarrassed to ask for help recovering multi-TB of carefully hoarded pr0n?

    1. MrMerrymaker

      Re: For shame!

      I do the responsible adult thing and, in time honoured yet slightly updated tradition, pop into the woods at night and leave android tablets streaming porn strewn about for the younger, tech-savvy generation.

      1. Nick Ryan Silver badge

        Re: For shame!

        Are these things not left in phone boxes any more? Just asking because many phone boxes claim to have WiFi which might help with the streaming side...

  5. Dan 55 Silver badge

    Congrats to the Windows Insider team

    They've stopped playing ping-pong while wearing taco hats long enough to fix the bug.

    They're in charge of your enterprise's OS by the way.

    1. DJV Silver badge

      Re: Congrats to the Windows Insider team

      Interesting that the build number with the specified problems was 17763.17 and the new release is called 17763.104 - does that mean that it took 86 internal builds between 17 and 104 that didn't fix those particular problems?

      1. Waseem Alkurdi

        Re: Congrats to the Windows Insider team

        Once upon a not so long time ago, I've read that Microsoft has different "labs" (or branches) for compiling Windows. Looking for the source, but I couldn't find it. It's certainly got to do with Longhorn though.

        There's this, however: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/previous-versions/technet-magazine/jj663498(v=msdn.10)

      2. Jon 37

        Re: Congrats to the Windows Insider team

        High build numbers are normal. It’s good practice to set up automated builds which build whenever someone commits any change.

        Fix a typo in the UI? That triggers a build. Fix the Spanish translation of a different part of the UI? That triggers a build.

        There will be many people at MS working on many small fixes to go in this release, it won’t just be the dataloss bug fix.

  6. Adrian 4 Silver badge

    insiders

    I'm no fan of Microsoft, but these are insider test builds, right ? Not passed out to all and sundry, but only if you want to take them, warts and all ?

    While I think they ought to be tested better than they apparently are, I don't see why anyone running them should have cause to complain.

    1. Dave K Silver badge

      Re: insiders

      You seem to forget that this version was released to the general public, only for it to cause numerous issues resulting in MS pulling it, fixing it, then running it back through the insider rings.

      That's the main problem here. Major bugs are not being caught during insider testing (or if they are, MS aren't spotting them all in their Feedback hub). The more this keeps happening, the more people will continue to shout at MS due to their QA being hopeless. Right now, MS are up against the clock because this release was supposed to be good enough for general release. I wonder if the rushed rounds of insider testing will leave more issues to emerge once it's pushed out onto the general public's PCs...

    2. MrMerrymaker

      Re: insiders

      Well I haven't opted in but it is galling when I follow what issues the Insider build has and lo and behold, I end up with the same issue in the proper release.

      I understand the mentality that, beta = unsupported, its a key tenet of commercial software, but the entire idea is surely to get things tested for a future commercial standard.

      So I think basically you're allowed to worry about showstoppers. It's your equipment after all. Your data. So to be utterly blasé about what can potentially come along is negligent.

  7. stephanh Silver badge

    what to do

    So if you are stuck with Windows, and you have a Home SKU, you may want to get a Pro SKU, OEM versions of which can be bought cheaply through sites such as kenguin.net.

    Catches: you need to reinstall Windows from scratch and OEM version gives you no tech support.

    But now you can postpone updates until, presumably, they are really ready.

    Of course this means you are effectively paying MS for their incompetence but that is SOP in IT.

    1. Steve Aubrey
      Facepalm

      Re: what to do

      Erm - always one to look for a good bargain, I popped over to kenguin.net to check the prices and found out I could buy the whole domain!

      Didn't check those prices. Enuff Z'Nuff.

      1. Waseem Alkurdi

        Re: what to do

        The same deals can be also had on ebay.com.

        (And apparently, that domain costs a lot! xD )

      2. stephanh Silver badge

        Re: what to do

        Apologies, the correct URL is www.kinguin.net. I am not affiliated and there are indeed many other vendors. It's called "grey market" but it's perfectly legal.

    2. LDS Silver badge

      "OEM versions of which can be bought cheaply through sites such as kenguin.net"

      Which usually are violating the license terms. AFAIK, you can't sell an OEM license but preinstalling it on the hardware you're selling.

  8. Tom 35 Silver badge

    Sounds like

    They released alpha quality code, and have reached maybe beta now. I have my computer updates paused for now. Not in a rush.

  9. Scroticus Canis Silver badge
    Facepalm

    "polish away some of the rough edges " ... ha ha ha etc... because you can't polish a ...

    insert your answer here ____

  10. MadocOwain

    Turn on metered connection in your network preferences

    ..if you haven't already. I have, it works great to stop those pesky unwanted, untimely updates. It can't update if it can't download.

    1. Stese

      Re: Turn on metered connection in your network preferences

      There is a time limit on that option... it will time out and do the update on its own' regardless of this setting.

  11. hotdamn

    I finally said the hell with it after the April update

    After the April update, A bunch of my programs were no longer compatible. The only way to make them work was to buy new updated versions of them. Before the update, they worked fine. Not wanting to fork out a grand for newer versions of the programs, I installed Mint with Wine and haven't looked back. Good riddance Microsoft. Also, I have retired from fixing Microsoft related problems. I couldn't take it anymore.

  12. LDS Silver badge

    In different news... Adobe CC dropped even 8.1 support.

    Now, to run the latest Adobe Creative Cloud you need Windows 10. It looks MS found allies in trying to force people to switch. Maybe Adobe telemetry suggested it - but if you wished a stable system, you're in trouble...

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