back to article Find these, er, appealing? UK.gov takes red pen to spy court rules, asks for Parliament's OK

The British government has finally offered up its proposed changes to the way the UK's spy court operates – including the right to appeal its decisions – for approval by the country's Parliament. The Investigatory Powers Tribunal, established in 2000, is the only judicial body that can hear complaints against the intelligence …

  1. Dan 55 Silver badge

    Isn't this just for show until Brexit in about six months time, when the UK is finally free from Mayhem's arch-nemesis, the European Court of Justice?

    1. TeraTelnet

      But not the European Court of Human Rights.

      1. John Mangan

        But not the European Court of Human Rights.

        So far.

        1. phuzz Silver badge

          Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

          Pah, if people had rights then they might do things that the government doesn't like.

          1. codejunky Silver badge

            Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

            @ phuzz

            "Pah, if people had rights then they might do things that the government doesn't like."

            Like vote brexit even when directly threatened by the government who was losing a rigged vote. Or leaving a supranational group imposing its will on people who reject it.

            Of course the EU gov gets twitchy when people vote for who they want to lead, but dont share the EU 'ideals'.

            1. Ben Tasker Silver badge

              Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

              @codejunky

              I suspect he was thinking more of things like asking where our employment rights have gone post-brexit, and when the NHS will see the funny money promised to it, and why farmers are worse off.

            2. phuzz Silver badge

              Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

              Actually yes, I was thinking of things like voting for brexit, even though everyone in government thought it was a terrible idea and now they have to go along with it, whilst trying desperately to distance themselves so they can't get the blame for when everything goes horribly wrong and causing the entire tory party to figuratively wet itself in public.

              Yeah, I'm pretty sure they wish people had voted for the safe choice. Bloody democratic rights.

              1. Teiwaz Silver badge

                Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

                Actually yes, I was thinking of things like voting for brexit, even though everyone in government thought it was a terrible idea and now they have to go along with it

                It is a terrible idea.

                I don't think there are any left 'in government' with a pro EEC mindset (might be a few tory MPs, but only backbenchers)

                May might have been on the other side earlier, but only because she expected the result to be different and feared being on the loser side. Being the former Home Office Minister, she's never liked Europes higher courts interfering.

                She doesn't seem to like anyone telling her she's wrong or anyone else getting involved in the decision making but her. Fought tooth and nail over Parliament having a say in the process, insists her plan and no other,

                As to Democratic rights, we're denied a say on the resulting deal/no deal.

                As to if/when or how badly it all goes, I expect those responsible will retire from politics fairly quickly and be safely cushioned from the worst effects.

        2. MrXavia

          Re: But not the European Court of Human Rights.

          "But not the European Court of Human Right"

          Hopefully we will never leave that.

      2. Dan 55 Silver badge

        I think it was an ECJ ruling which prompted this change.

        The ECnHR can be made much more difficult to access by rescinding the 1998 HRA so British courts won't have to take it into account in its rulings. Anyone who wants to argue something using the convention will have to escalate it to the top in the UK then go to Strasbourg.

        The Tories said in their 2017 manifesto that they'd keep the HRA... during Brexit.

        1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

          "The ECnHR can be made much more difficult to access by rescinding the 1998 HRA"

          I think the Good Friday Agreement obligates us to keep the HRA. However, post Brexit it looks like that could be a dead letter anyway.

          1. Spazturtle Silver badge

            Yeah the Good Friday Agreement will almost certainly end. The EU will force Ireland to withdraw from it because the GFA prevents there being border checkpoints.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Obviously I don't want the violence to start again in real life

              and nor do most other people, but it would be interesting to consider one or more of NI's extremist groups coming right out and threatening that they will no longer consider themselves bound to peace if a hard border is imposed. Hopefully it would put the shits right up our government.

      3. teebie

        "But not the European Court of Human Rights."

        It's not clear that the prime minister knows the difference.

  2. Conrad Longmore
    Trollface

    RIPA 18?

    Just sayin'..

  3. Walter Bishop Silver badge
    Big Brother

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

    Didn't the spooks actually request powers to monitor the people supposed to be monitoring them. I don't think the IPT will make much of a difference as the spooks will just ignore it. The spooks have effectively been given carte blanche to engage in criminal activity and immunity from prosecution ref. The politicians can't control them as the spooks have possession evidence of various indiscretions. There's evidence that even the House of Commons is bugged with IMSI catcher (stingray devices) placed about the vicinity, purely to protect the honorable members from the protestors.

    1. amanfromMars 1 Silver badge

      Re: Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

      Howdy Walter Bishop,

      The real scandal/disappointment/opportunity being epically missed is their services and assets being so ineffectually used. And that is tantamount to a systemic abuse.

      A major problem rooted and led by that and those not held responsible and accountable right at the top of the command and control chain and lacking vivid and vital and viable imagination.

      I wonder when the supposedly smarter than the average bear work force will find a pair and start leading with inventive programs of their own, rather than be as puppets and drones following the Orders of Others and Third Party Wishes.

      Or would that be spun and classified as Mutinous and Revolutionary?

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