back to article 70% of Windows 10 users are totally happy with our big telemetry slurp, beams Microsoft

Microsoft claims seven out of ten Windows 10 users are happy with Redmond gulping loads of telemetry from their computers – which isn't that astounding when you realize it's a default option. In other words, 30 per cent of people have found the switch to turn it off, and the rest haven't, don't realize it's there, or are …

  1. J J Carter Silver badge
    Thumb Up

    Yes!

    Another two-minute hate on MSFT! You are spoiling us Mr El Reg.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Yes!

      I think it will be rather longer than 2 minutes.

      1. eldakka Silver badge
        Coat

        Re: Yes!

        I think it will be rather longer than 2 minutes.
        In my case it's been over 30 years now.

    2. Avatar of They
      Thumb Up

      Re: Yes!

      Well they are shit and carry out bad practices, so only fair.

    3. JLV Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: Yes!

      Another _brilliant_ rebuttal by JJC that will do much to further his, and Win 10's, credibility.

      Soooo articulate n insightful.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Just one question Microsoft...

      How the fcuk can you have a "Privacy portal" that requires access via the web, is stored on Microsoft servers, accessed via a "linked" Microsoft Account to change/view it's settings. Can't people see there is a second way of indirectly routing grey data here, back to Microsoft.

      Are the UK regulators ICO just plain stupid, or being paid to be plain stupid?

      1. RedCardinal

        Re: Just one question Microsoft...

        >>Are the UK regulators ICO just plain stupid, or being paid to be plain stupid?

        The UK privacy regulator has always been feeble and showed little interest in actually protecting individual privacy.

  2. roknich

    No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

    The first thing I did with my ASUS laptop - factory loaded with WIN 10 - was to format, wipe, and repartition the hard drive. Debian 9.1 works just fine - I send no data to anyone unless I explicitly decide to, and there is no fee or registration requirement.

    Anyone who bows to the illegal monopoly is a fool, and makes the world less safe for us all.

    David Roknich

    "The future of radio belongs to us"

    Indyradio.info

    1. RyokuMas Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      "Anyone who bows to the illegal monopoly is a fool, and makes the world less safe for us all."

      Hear, hear! Too bad that so many seem to be so blinkered that they can only see one monopoly...

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "Too bad that so many seem to be so blinkered that they can only see one monopoly."

        Are you implying multiple monopolies?

        ROFLMAO

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "they can only see one monopoly..."

        See title - any further comment needed?

    2. Tigra 07 Silver badge

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      This likely makes little difference to them since you still paid for a Windows licence.

      Should have gone to System76

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "Should have gone to System76"

        For those of us in the UK this seems rather a long way to go.

        1. Paul Crawford Silver badge

          Re: "Should have gone to System76"

          UK options for Linux machines are Entroware (www.entroware.com - offer Ubuntu /MATE, for example, pre-installed) and Novatech (www.novatech.co.uk - offer OS-free laptops).

          1. Tom Paine Silver badge

            Re: "Should have gone to System76"

            ...or Dell or HP, like the one I have.

        2. Tigra 07 Silver badge

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          I'm in England and I bought from pcspecialist.co.uk and installed Ubuntu.

          System76 is apparently very good, though the prices are eye watering

          1. Chemist

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "I'm in England and I bought from pcspecialist.co.uk and installed Ubuntu."

            I'm typing this on one of their i7 laptops - installed OpenSUSE 13.2 about 3 years ago with no issues.

            Just ordered a simpler machine from nimbusoft - https://nimbusoft.com/ which comes with a choice of installed Linux - we'll see what they are like.

      2. picturethis
        Childcatcher

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "This likely makes little difference to them since you still paid for a Windows licence."

        I'm not sure that I agree with this where Windows 10 is concerned.. MS has made no secret that they want to move to the OS as a service and along with that Office. The service model requires renewable subscriptions to supply revenue to MS.

        If the user removes windows 10 and replaces it with something else, then MS loses the projected revenue from the services over the life of the product. This cost will be significantly more over the life of the product than it was with previous versions of windows products, where the initial purchase price was all the MS received. - MS is moving from product space to services company.

        So in the long run, I think it does matter to MS and people should remove Windows 10, if one has to get it in the first place. The cost savings over the long run will be significant - not to mention less privacy issues with alternatives.

        1. shade82000

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          If they want to use the OS as a data collecting and advertising platform then they should make the OS free. That's the way it happens in most other areas but no, not MS. They want to charge you for the OS, collect all sorts of data about your usage and then use it to push targeted ads at you amongst other things.

          Free OS with advertising and telemetry, or a paid for OS with all the crap removed.

          1. DougS Silver badge

            Charging for the OS versus selling your personal info

            Why choose one strategy when you can have them both? That's the advantage of having a near monopoly in the PC OS market, you don't have to worry about competition. They even have a way to solve the problem of the PC's lengthening replacement cycle by making it subscription based.

            That way they can move to charging $0 for the OS up front to better compete in case Chrome OS ever gets any traction at all, while insuring they make a lot more money if someone keeps running that PC for 10+ years as is becoming all too common for their liking these days.

            That's what happens when Google catches them flat footed on search, something they didn't think was important until Google showed them how much money that could make off the data collection and advertising, which they tried too late to ape. And when Apple catches them flat footed by showing them how to make smartphones a mass market product everyone wants, instead of being limited to geeks and PHBs like they were in the Windows Mobile days.

        2. TheVogon Silver badge

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          "MS has made no secret that they want to move to the OS as a service"

          There will likely always be a free or minimal cost version though where they make money from the Windows Store.

          People seem to view "Windows as a service" as a bad thing, but imo It's actually a better model for consumers to pay via a rental model, rather than pay a lump of cash up front for each Windows version. Stop using Windows? Sell your PC? You stop paying Microsoft....your choice. So surely it's ideal for those that wish to use Linux instead?

          1. Updraft102 Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "People seem to view "Windows as a service" as a bad thing, but imo It's actually a better model for consumers to pay via a rental model, rather than pay a lump of cash up front for each Windows version."

            Well, that would be how it is if "Windows as a service" were actually a service, but for consumers, it's not, and MS has claimed that it never will be for consumers (though we know how reliable Microsoft's promises can be). Even though consumers have been told for two years that Windows is now a service, It's still a pay-once, use-forever deal, only now Microsoft uses the consumer as a beta tester, releasing largely untested updates twice a year to the consumer market, using the forced update system to ensure that the consumers get the version MS wants them to test, and using the non-optional telemetry to collect the testing data from the user.

            MS sets the parameters for the beta testing by altering settings as it sees fit, installing whatever drivers it wants, and installing or removing whatever software it wishes. You're a beta tester, home user; did you really expect a full-featured, unrestricted, tested product to be released under the new beta program? Did you forget about your primary purpose, your obligation to provide Microsoft with the test data they require?

            None of that implies that Windows is now a service to the consumer. None of that even touches on what defines "software as a service." The subscription model of which you type is the real definition of "software as a service," and maybe MS is trying to get there in the consumer market despite their protestations, but until they do, it's still a product, same as it always was... it's just a really crappy one now.

            Perhaps what MS means by "Windows as a service" is that a service is being provided by the end users to Microsoft. Then it makes sense. It makes a lot of sense.

            1. TheVogon Silver badge

              Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

              "But for consumers it's not

              Not as yet. Obviously my comment was referring to a future rental only model. Which as per my comment is probably a good thing for Linux fans as it would potentially remove any upfront OS costs from hardware, whilst still letting manufacturers ship an installed OS with crapware that subsidises the hardware costs...

          2. roknich

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            Then you can be a regular trainer for their AI and hand over all of your personal and biological data to Microsoft every time you touch your machine. Great idea!

        3. Mark 85 Silver badge

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          MS is moving from product space to services company.

          Some call it "services"... I call it blackmail: "Pay up or your data goes away.". along with: "Nice bunch of applications you have there... pity if they won't work anymore."

          1. TheVogon Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "I call it blackmail

            That's not the model they use. If your windows is unlicensed it switches to annoy the hell out of you mode but you can still access your data. Ditto cloud storage switches to read only if you are over your limit....

        4. Kev99 Bronze badge

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          You mean you're supposed to pay for Windows 10? Funny, I got my copy free simply by saying I needed special adaptive software for my disability. My disability? I'm a left-handed, over six feet tall, Gaelo-German protestant, pragmatic to liberal, compassionate married male living in the USA. Oh, I'm also legally blind in one eye.

          1. eldakka Silver badge
            Coat

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            Hmm, good idea.

            Wonder what disability support I can get for being ginger, I imagine it's pretty good.

          2. David Nash Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "Oh, I'm also legally blind in one eye."

            Is it possible to be Illegally blind?

          3. TheVogon Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "I got my copy free."

            You got a free upgrade to an already licenced OS, so you paid originally. I would say anyone that hasn't upgraded probably qualifies as you must have been blind to miss all the pop ups they inflicted on you....

        5. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          "MS has made no secret that they want to move to the OS as a service "

          They are already heading that way with Windows 10 S. Which amusingly completely screws over Google.

          With Windows 10S, you can only install apps from the Windows Store, and one of the requirements for that is that you must use Microsoft's HTML and JavaScript engines. So no Chrome!

        6. roknich

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          You won! Thanks for sharing the clue only you seem to have. I thought everyone knew about Microsoft subscription plans. They're trying to seed copies of Virus10 on as many machines as possible and deserve a stinging rebuke before the harvest begins.

          Why hand over your computer and your personal data to the thieves at Microsoft?

    3. Just Enough

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      Where would the comments section on a Windows news story be without someone taking the time to tell everyone that they use Linux? It's traditional.

      Well done. Have a biscuit.

      1. Not That Andrew

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        At least it was Debian not that flavour of the month distro, whatever it's called.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          "not that flavour of the month distro, whatever it's called."

          Well I'm guessing the version of Ubuntu in the Windows 10 Store is now the worlds most popular desktop Linux version....

          1. joed

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            Why Linux machines are tiny percentage of PCs, the percentage of Windows user that stumbled (likely by mistake or MS coercion) into the Store is just as small. Not all of these lost souls "bought" Linux (to register in statistics) - it's simply unlikely that anyone that cared for Linux went for the trouble of getting Windows PC, signing up for MS account and shopping at their dingy Store.

        2. Tim99 Silver badge
          Linux

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          @Not That Andrew

          "At least it was DebianDevuan not that flavour of the month distro, whatever it's called."

          FTFY: Debian == Systemd

      2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "Where would the comments section on a Windows news story be without someone taking the time to tell everyone that they use Linux?"

        Don't you find it just a touch ironic that Microsoft not only collect money for the licence want ongoing payments in data collection and displaying advertising whilst Linux distros don't demand either and yet it's the latter you implicitly criticise?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          "...Linux distros don't demand either and yet it's the latter you implicitly criticise?"

          No he didn't. You might want to re-read his comment. He didn't criticise Linux.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          Its hardly implicitly criticising

          more the inevitable wittering on of the penguinistas

          ITS SO TEDIOUS

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      "The first thing I did with my ASUS laptop - factory loaded with WIN 10 - was to format, wipe, and repartition the hard drive"

      Many of us want to run all the latest games and / or an Office suite that actually works though so Windows 10 is then a requirement.

      1. j2f8j8j2fj

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "Many of us want to run all the latest games and / or an Office suite that actually works though so Windows 10 is then a requirement."

        Things that run on Windows 7....

        Other than running them elsewhere, vote with your money. Stop buying games until they release them for Linux. I absolutely will not buy any game that requires Windows 10. I don't care how good people insist the game might be, no game is worth installing Windows 10.

    5. FuzzyWuzzys Silver badge

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      I'd love to but as a semi-pro photographer I need Adobe Photoshop and Lightroom with the now unsupported Nik filters. When you get those running perfectly on Linux Mint, I'm all ears. And no, don't even mention GIMP. Yes, it's bloody good but it won't cut it with what I need to do. So Windows or Mac is my only choice for that stuff. My dayjob, I'm more than happy to use my Linux Mint box.

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

      2. Chemist

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "I'd love to but as a semi-pro photographer I need Adobe Photoshop and Lightroom with the now unsupported Nik filters."

        Darktable - www.darktable.org for Linux & Mac

        I've used it for years for my Canon 550D & 6D, my cousin, a retired industrial photographer, is very impressed and so is his son ( a very well-known sports photographer)

        RawTherapee also gets good reviews although I've not used it personally.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          'Darktable'...

          You will lose all processing done in Lightroom, it won't run the plug-ins, the camera and lenses profiles are made by who knows whom.

          Plus my hardware calibrated monitors don't support Linux, nor my photo printers have drivers for Linux. Again, drivers made by who knows whom are a no-no for high quality printing.

          If you don't like Windows 10, macOS is the true alternative. All the tools are available, and fully supported. No need to play with an house of cards of tools with very different degrees of quality, if available.

          I guess if MS stubbornly keeps on slurping, Apple will see more and more people turning to its products again, as soon it understands it needs very good hardware beyond the iPhone.

          1. fidodogbreath Silver badge

            Re: 'Darktable'...

            I guess if MS stubbornly keeps on slurping, Apple will see more and more people turning to its products again

            I did, at least partially. I just got sick of the amount of time and effort I spent trying to protect my privacy from my computer and my phone.

            How many times have we heard: "if you're not paying for it, you are the product?" Windows and Android are not free, but they are subsidized by ad revenues and user-data collection. I came to view the "Apple tax" as declining that subsidy -- essentially, paying extra for a modicum of control over my personal data.

            1. DougS Silver badge

              @fidodogbreath - "Windows and Android are not free"

              Windows isn't, but Android is. You pay for the Android phone, but you don't pay for Android and neither does the OEM. At least not in dollars - as you point out, you are paying for it with your personal data.

              If Windows really goes to a subscription model then I wouldn't be surprised to see it become free as well. Free to acquire, but you have to pay a yearly fee to keep it running (or more likely, to prevent pissing off customers, if you don't pay still run in some sort of degraded fashion that disables some functionality or limits performance)

        2. LeedsMonkey

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          My only potential issue with darktable is printing. I've not had a chance to test the print module, but would be interested to see how effective it is.

      3. John Miles

        Re: I need Adobe Photoshop and Lightroom

        I am not sure there is anything other than GIMP to replace Photoshop atm. - but there are FOSS alternatives worth looking at, a place to start looking is FOSSPhotography on Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/FOSSPhotography/

        1. IsJustabloke Silver badge
          Meh

          Re: I need Adobe Photoshop and Lightroom

          "I am not sure there is anything other than GIMP to replace Photoshop "

          GIMP is not even close to being a replacement for photoshop.

          yes, there are alternatives to lightroom and photoshop but nothing integrates with my website or social media channels as well as lightroom. I can publish directly from LIghtroom into my portfolio, dropbox, facebook, instagram, twitter, I don't need to create multiple jpeg copies of any given image, I simply publish the raw files using lightroom, they are converted to the correct format on the fly.

          This is such a huge advantage over everything else. all my images are contained within a single environment and greatly simplfies my workflow.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        If you don't like what's offered for free, you're perfectly within your rights to go on paying a single company to 'safeguard' ALL of your data.

        Or you could stop expecting the community to service your niche use case for free and pay to for features that you need to run your business on. Talking to people about free software is like dealing with primary school children sometimes. [1]

        FFS, how many times do we need to say it. Free, as in speech. Not beer.

        [1] - No. I'm not going near the "open-source" weasel words.

      5. roknich

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        Try GIMP - it also works on Windows so you can try it out, but it works better and has more features on Linux. gimp.org

    6. BobChip
      Linux

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      Hi David. I'm curious. Why did you buy a laptop with Win 10 pre-loaded, when there are bare machines available out there? I quite understand your wanting to use Linux, but why pay the Microsoft tax on the way there?

      That would stick in my throat.

      1. Updraft102 Silver badge

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "Why did you buy a laptop with Win 10 pre-loaded, when there are bare machines available out there? I quite understand your wanting to use Linux, but why pay the Microsoft tax on the way there?"

        The crapware that comes on nearly all new PCs offsets the Microsoft tax and (at least in one case) partially subsidizes the cost of the hardware.

        Dell responded to customer demand and started releasing one of its laptops pre-configured with one of the Linux flavors some years ago. The customers were delighted, but only until they saw that the Linux-equipped model cost more, not less, than the standard Windows version. Why, the potential buyers demanded to know, was the version without the "MS tax" more expensive than the one with the tax?

        Dell's explanation was that the Linux version was "clean," and thus Dell was not getting paid by every crapware manufacturer out there. Those trial versions of crap you don't want don't just appear there at random; they're put there because someone paid Dell to put them there. According to Dell, the sum total of all of the money they receive for each PC's worth of crapware more than covers the cost of the Windows license.

        Linux users get the best deal on a crapware-laden PC (as compared to one sold with no OS). They get the benefit of the price subsidy, but they don't have to actually deal with the crapware, as it gets immediately wiped. Setting Linux up on such a machine is no harder than on one offered bare.

        Windows users are the ones who have to deal with trying to uninstall all that crap, hoping that it actually uninstalls cleanly and leaves the system running smoothly (or else having to wipe and install Windows cleanly, which some people do).

        In addition, if you ever want to sell the PC, having the Windows license can be a benefit; your buyer is more likely to be a Windows user than a Linux one.

        The selection of machines available bare is also extremely limited compared to those with Windows-- and given the poor direction laptop design has taken lately (as I see it), just being able to find one model I am completely happy with would be a miracle, let alone finding one that I am happy with AND that is offered bare.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          > Dell responded to customer demand and started releasing one of its laptops pre-configured with one of the Linux flavors some years ago. The customers were delighted, but only until they saw that the Linux-equipped model cost more, not less, than the standard Windows version.

          Interesting. I buy Dell OptiPlex desktops many dozens at a time, directly from Dell with Ubuntu instead of Windows. Typically shaves about 10% off the order cost. And yes, we use Ubuntu on them in production.

          It's sad that most corporates pay for Windows included with their new PCs, then pay for it again under their enterprise license agreements.

          1. TheVogon Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "they saw that the Linux-equipped model cost more, not less, than the standard Windows version."

            A relative worked for Dell and he tells me there were three reasons for that with systems targetted at consumers - a) Linux got more support calls - that might not be what you would expect but apparently was the case, b) it costs X to build, manage, release drivers for and update an OS image and this cost was washed across a relatively low number of systems with Linux, and c) consumer Pcs with Windows on have crapware installed that subsidises the cost....

          2. TheVogon Silver badge

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "It's sad that most corporates pay for Windows included with their new PCs, then pay for it again under their enterprise license agreements."

            No they don't. You get a specific discount to cover Pcs that come with an OEM license on your ELA.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              'It's sad that most corporates pay for Windows included '

              We do buy PCs without any operating system preinstalled. Then install licenses from our license pools (Windows, RedHat, VMWare...)

              B2B sales channels offer them. It's just the consumer sales channels that make harder finding models sold without a pre-installed OS, but those who sell "assembled" desktops.

              Which makes me wonder how many here really work in a business environment, and how many write just knowing what their local mall sells.

          3. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "I buy Dell OptiPlex desktops many dozens at a time, directly from Dell with Ubuntu instead of Windows. Typically shaves about 10% off the order cost. And yes, we use Ubuntu on them in production."

            But then you do need to pay $150 a year / PC for Ubuntu support with a minimum quantity of 50. Which over any time period of more than a few years costs you more than Windows 10 + Software Assurance + the saving on the desktop. I do appreciate that obviously you didn't want Windows, but it's not quite as great as you made it sound!

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

              > But then you do need to pay $150 a year / PC for Ubuntu support with a minimum quantity of 50. Which over any time period of more than a few years costs you more than Windows 10 + Software Assurance + the saving on the desktop.

              Incorrect - we don't need to pay anything in ongoing support costs. If we did then we don't need to pay for everything anyway as just the base support price to cover a small hardware sample in the lab is more than sufficient to reproduce any issues - the fixes can then be distributed more widely. We haven't actually needed to do that yet though, but the option is there if needed. There are also other commercial support options other then Canonical.

              I wasn't pitching TCO either - that's a different issue and something that's not simple to quantify or compare. I'm just merely stating that the purchase cost is slightly lower, not higher as some folks suggested above.

          4. Col_Panek

            Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

            "Linux-equipped model cost more, not less, than the standard Windows version..."

            Around these parts y'all can get Linux Dells for $50 less than Windows. One of the few perks for living in 'Murica.

      2. roknich

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        Hi - I got an ASUS 540S for US$199 - they were about to take it off the shelf, and tried to not sell it to me at that price. This was BestBuy. It took all day for me to complete the purchase, because they cocked up the processing of my card, then reported me for fraud. After I called my bank, the regional head of their electronics department personally apologized and helped me escape. One of the employees is no longer there.

        I have never seen this laptop so cheap anywhere, before or since. I'm using it now, just about exactly a year later - it has a full year parts and labor warranty, btw, almost expired - and nothing is ever sent to Redmond Washington or their collaborators at Ft. Meade.

        David Roknich

        "the future of radio belongs to us"

        indyradio.info

    7. ad47uk

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      The problem here is that as much as I like Linux, the software is not there and even if there is software to do a task, it is not always that good.

      Blender is great if you are into 3D and there are some good audio software, but sadly Linux lacks on Video editing.

      I do have Linux on my laptop and it is fine for what I use that for.

      1. Chemist

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        "but sadly Linux lacks on Video editing."

        kdenlive

      2. JimboSmith Silver badge

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        but sadly Linux lacks on Video editing.

        Take a long look at this article

        theregister.co.uk/2015/12/26/linux_video_editors

        1. roknich

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          If you really understand video editing, and your hardware, linux is tops for video editing, but yes, it's a learning process.

      3. InNY

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        Shortcut

        KdenLive

        Open Broadcast Studio (limited editing, but still it is there)

        To name but three of the myriad of video editors available on the Linux platform.

        1. Not That Andrew

          Re: Video Editing

          OBS is streaming software not a video editor

          KdenLive is probably an OK alternative to Windows Movie Maker

          As far as I'm aware the only NLE for Linux is Cinelerra, and that's a bitch to set up and get running, crashes constantly and has an even more obtuse interface than GIMP used to. I don't think is still being developed either.

          1. Chemist

            Re: Video Editing

            "As far as I'm aware the only NLE for Linux is Cinelerra,"

            That's interesting as to quote the Kdenlive manual : "Kdenlive is an acronym for KDE Non-Linear Video Editor "

            https://userbase.kde.org/Kdenlive/Manual

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Video Editing

              Windows Movie Maker too is non linear, but it's still very limited, and good for some amateurish video. kdenlive is more or less at the same level.

              When the main editing suites are from Avid, DaVinci, Adobe and Apple, AFAIK only DaVinci is supported on Linux, but only on very specific certified hardware.

              Those are the tools you will find in pro environment. Other tools mey be OK for your personal or indy projects, but do not expect them to be used where money matters.

              1. Chemist

                Re: Video Editing

                "Those are the tools you will find in pro environment. Other tools mey be OK for your personal or indy projects, but do not expect them to be used where money matters."

                I didn't realise that the topic discussed in this sub-thread was money. I thought it was video software for Linux.

                So, professional video software then - well let's guess what Pixar and Dreamworks use for their operating system.

                <hint :One thing that all of the larger studios have in common is they use Linux as their operating system. >

                1. Anonymous Coward
                  Anonymous Coward

                  Re: Video Editing

                  Pixar and other 3D animation studios develop their own software, and they don't have video footage taken with cameras, they have just rendered images. Linux clusters for such tasks make sense.

                  But what they use for the final editing? For example, Disney for 'the Force awakens' used Avid tools. I'm sure most of the CGI rendering has been done on Linux, but the editing has been done on Avid, and that means Apple or Windows.

                  Editing video footage shot with cameras is a different job. And like any professional job, money matters. Subpar tools with subpar support for cameras and editing devices are not what you're looking for. The price for the tools are just a small fraction of the overall expenses, but the time wasted to achieve the desired result can be very, very expensive.

                  Take a trip, if you like, to the Canon new Burbank facility, where movie makers can test their equipment and edit on the tools their used to, and see what's in use.

    8. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      Indeedy. New PC purchasing process...

      1. buy PC

      2. swap out SDD/HDD for a blank SSD or hybrid

      3. fix brain-dead UEFI defaults

      4. install Linux Mint (and donate $)

      5. install commercial WINE version for better gaming support

      6. install Windows <10 VM for "those special cases" (ie: corporate teleworking).

      7. shelve original drive in case you need a warranty claim.

      Net number of times need to worry about the "telemetry" == 0.

      1. EVMonster

        Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

        8. Never be able to do any useful work.

        9. Hide behind the sofa (you must have done something bad to be worried about your data being slurped)

        Listen up Linux punks.

        I have three PCs on my desk two Windows 10 and one Linux Mint. I am an IT professional and never play games and I do not do video processing either. Every time a new distro airs I try it 'cos I would love any distro to be useable. I have tried them all and they are not useable on any level. If you can get them installed they are all like going back twenty years and generally have an amateur feel. On the few occasions I have suggested Linux to customers they have all swapped back to Windows PDQ.

        I have no axe to grind with Linux but please please stop bleating on about Linux as if it is a rival to Windows, IT AIN'T and will never be.

        The down vote button is the one on the right (just to help Linux punks find it)

        1. Chemist

          Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

          @ EVMonster

          Thank you for joining the Register today . (You really, (no really ) would not believe how many Linux bashers are like you) Glad you are a IT professional?. I've been using Linux since ~1995, quite a lot of the time professionally with a major pharma ( but there again I'm NOT an IT professional) just a user.

          (Oh,please !!)

          Why do you have a Mint desktop ?

    9. eldakka Silver badge

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      Did you return the unused license to Microsoft as per their shrinkwrap agreement and get a refund?

    10. BlackKnight(markb)

      Re: No need to change the default settings! Erase all of WIN 10

      Unfortunately for those of us that partake in the pastime known as "gaming" the pengiuns lagging behind in driver and software support. should they catch up i'll happily swap teams and cop an earful for "making the darn computer more complicated"

  3. Novex

    Still not going there

    Win 10 is currently what I have to use at work, and to be honest, as an OS it works fine despite the schizophrenia that is control panel (two different places, still?)

    But on my own PCs (personal or business) I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole. The data collection policies of Microsoft are just too much like malware. Give me the option to completely turn it off, and proveably so, and to be able to permanently reject unwanted updates, and I'd happily reconsider.

    Until then it's Linux Mint, and VMs with older MS OSes (if only I could get the updates to install properly on them without 100% svchost.exe usage for days on end).

    As for the 70% accepting full telemetry, I doubt many of them even know that they're sending data to MS. Of those that do and keep the setting at maximum, they've probably bought into the Cortana thing, which requires way too much personal data to be shared with MS in order for it to work. Most people would probably be very uncomfortable with it if they really knew just where the data had to go in order for Cortana to work.

    1. TReko

      Re: Still not going there

      Windows 7 and 8 updates now contain telemetry - not as much as Windows 10 though.

      1. Ian Emery Silver badge

        Re: Still not going there

        "Windows 7 and 8 updates now contain telemetry - not as much as Windows 10 though."

        Anyone smart enough to stop their system being "upgraded" to M$ Spyware10 should also have been smart enough to block the attempts to port the spyware onto Win7 - and possibly Win8.

        As for the 70% being fine, the word you are looking for is sheeple; even when you tell them how much of their private data M$ is slurping, they either dont care, or dont believe you; besides, they have already given most of it to FarceBook, Twatter, and InstantGran.

        The latest Win10 saga is that it is deleting and/or blocking programs without warning; several complaints every week on the LOTRO forums.

      2. ad47uk

        Re: Still not going there

        Easy enough to stop it on Windows 7 and 8, but it is integrated into Windows 10. there is software that say they stop it on windows 10, but I wonder if they really do.

    2. Ken Hagan Gold badge

      Re: Still not going there

      "Win 10 is currently what I have to use at work ..."

      Me too. Speaking as a developer, there are an infinite number of non-default configurations that we can't test against but there is one default configuration that we can test against and if we don't then we look a bit foolish if that's a configuration that doesn't work. So all my test systems stick largely to the defaults. They also have no personal data on them, (and no source code, as it happens) so if MS want to slurp then there is nothing for them to find except for usage patterns that will skew their stats towards "None of your newly-introduced features are getting *any* usage whatsoever.".

      So I am "several" of the 70%, despite switching the telemetry off on the systems I actually care about.

    3. Joe User

      Re: Still not going there

      Novex: "Until then it's Linux Mint, and VMs with older MS OSes (if only I could get the updates to install properly on them without 100% svchost.exe usage for days on end)."

      If you're running Windows 7 in that VM, give Windows Quick Patch a try:

      https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/fixed-windows-7-sp1-never-ends-searching-for-updates.221756/

  4. Tim Seventh

    29% Windows users

    reported to Microsoft about how unhappy they are with the slurp in Windows 10. The remaining PC users pulled out the Windows 10 hard drive and directly threw it out the Window without reporting.

    1. Don Dumb

      Re: 29% Windows users

      If Microsoft were really confident that people are happy with telemetry, they would have it *off* by default. Because people would be happy to turn it on right?

    2. Infernoz Bronze badge
      Alert

      Re: 29% Windows users

      And some of us use microsoft-spying killer-software and a lot of router-firewall, domain-name, blocking-rules, ha!

      1. ad47uk

        Re: 29% Windows users

        But do they work?

    3. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: 29% Windows users

      29% of Windows users probably have non-linear minds, and as such, can't be so easily HERDED like the other 70%. Except for the remaining 1%, who are hackers and IT pros, that threw away the Win-10-nic license for something SANE.

      (this is based on the assumption that ~1/3 of the population are non-linear-minded "creative/hunter" types, and the other ~2/3 are linear-minded "farmer" types - the percentages based on centuries of natural selection because farming is a more effective means of getting food than hunting/gathering, though the creative/hunter types are highly ADAPTABLE and as such fill _OTHER_ important roles in society like craftsmanship and ranching and military/police, and thus the relative percentages of these "classifications" of thinking patterns, either linear time-based 'farmer' thinking, or non-linear now-based 'creative/hunter' thinking - yeah, it's an old theory, the 'hunter/farmer' concept, but it works and explains a lot)

      1. Tinslave_the_Barelegged Silver badge
        Joke

        Re: 29% Windows users

        > this is based on the assumption that

        Just need a gender assumption in there for the full google employee of the month award for gratuitous misdirection by science*

        (Note icon...)

        *-acknowledgement: D. Adams.

    4. LDS Silver badge

      Re: 29% Windows users

      They should also all those who didn't upgrade for exactly the slurp features...

    5. JohnG Silver badge

      Re: 29% Windows users

      My experience with atechnical Windows 10 users is that they are typically blissfully unaware of Microsoft's data grabbing. A few will have chosen to turn off some options such that stop certain data being sent and will assume (wrongy) that their data is then secure. IMO, the majority of Microsoft's 70% are oblivious to the whole issue.

  5. BeerTokens

    Irony

    The Irony is without collecting this data they wouldn't be able to tell us how many installs had requested less data to be slurped.

    What about those win10 installs that never hit the interwebs, or as some other posters have noted where a n other os is installed.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    MSFT and Facebook

    The kings of slurp, way worse than Apple or Google, who are both transparent with what's collected and honest about rentention. I did a paper on some tests I did about data deletion and it's after affects, it was crystal clear that Google and Apple did the right thing and truly forgot me, but Facebook and Microsoft didn't. Even 3 years later, Facebook data is still retained about me, my IP address, and people I may know.. Microsoft are still using things it knew about me for advertising.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: MSFT and Facebook

      Google does seem more competent than MS with regards to slurping, so it's no wonder they're better at pretending they've forgotten you.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: MSFT and Facebook

        Then they are doing it very well, as there is a huge difference between targeted advertising from my "known" profile and the untargetted data from my deleted profile data.

        I think more likely, the Internet told you that Google are the kings of search and that they must have been dishonest to get to that place, which is totally untrue, as the real data suggests they do exactly what their privacy policy says they do.

        1. Jonathan 27 Bronze badge

          Re: MSFT and Facebook

          The Google option not to serve targeted ads does just that, they still slurp all your data all the time. I don't really see much practical difference, they still have all your data.

    2. Elmer Phud Silver badge

      Re: MSFT and Facebook

      ISTR that data collection has been around a hell of a lot longer than either FaceAche or Microsoft or Google or or or . . .

      It would be preferable if you could name ALL the guilty parties, thanks love.

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: MSFT and Facebook

        "It would be preferable if you could name ALL the guilty parties"

        Unfortunately the margin isn't big enough.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: MSFT and Facebook

      "way worse than Apple or Google, who are both transparent with what's collected and honest about rentention"

      LOL, Google are the king of slurp and way way worse than Microsoft for what they use your data for.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: MSFT and Facebook

        I get tracked by MS when I use their OS, I get tracked by Google when I use pretty much any internet site, on any device that doesn't have no-script stopping Google Analytics and a cookie filter.

        So explain to me again how MS are worse than Google.....

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: MSFT and Facebook

          ...because NoScript can block Google, only heroic effort can block MS tracking?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: MSFT and Facebook

            "...because NoScript can block Google, only heroic effort can block MS tracking?"

            No - the Spybot app can block Windows 10 spying. So a single app, just the same. And no script only blocks the browser, not the rest of Googles spyware by default....

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: MSFT and Facebook

        and what evidence do you have to support this? I have plenty that says otherwise.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: who are both transparent with what's collected and honest about rentention

      Yeah, of course they are.

  7. Teiwaz Silver badge

    Most People

    Most people when they get a new 'whatever' just click through and accept defaults unless they know and understand what they want.

    Most people just want their new system to be up and running and ready to use WOW or Facebook or whatever as quick as possible and with little thought as possible.

    Low hanging fruit is just easy, not necessarily preferred...

    1. Elmer Phud Silver badge

      Re: Most People

      just WTF's wrong with WOW or FaceAche?

      O.K. you don't like them, not everyone jumps in with all ports blazing and blindfolds on.

      I wonder how much data is spunked out all over the place by those who are so bloody smug.

    2. Baldrickk Silver badge

      Re: Most People

      Exactly, most people will just "next> next> next>" their way through the installation and configuration.

      The default setting will be perfectly fine, right?

      For something like this, 30% is actually a pretty significant number.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What is the position on W7?

    There was a list of patches to remove that had retrofitted the telemetry to some extent. Have the rolled up "security" patches sneaked some back in?

    1. ph0b0s

      Afraid so..... MS went to a cumulative model for Win 7 / 8 updates. So you get one 'quality update' a month that includes all new updates and previous ones. The only way not to get those updates is to install the security only cumulative update from the MS catalog. Then you just get security updates not function updates. Does not stop MS from deciding that telemetry updates are needed as part of the security updates as well.

      Essentially MS have retroactively made the deciding what updates you want a nightmare....

  9. Timmy B Silver badge

    Most people.....

    This is a telling thing. And a reason that massive comapnies like Apple, Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Amazon, etc exist and operate. They cater for most people. Most people don't care about sharing what websites they view, or what they buy, or where they go. They don't care because having other people know, or governments know, or companies know just isn't as important as doing these things at a price that makes them convenient and easy. They, mostly subconsiously, make the decision that a kind of trade is going on where they give up some privacy for ease, convenience and cost. This is the trade that makes saying "Alexa play my favorite songs" so appealing. I don't think it will ever change and I don't think it's a totally bad thing - I do think it'll increase, though. Ford will track journeys to make sat-navs and autonomous cars better for example.

    All I think is needed is simple rules that makes what they gather clear in the T&Cs and then you have a choice to use it or not. This is kind of like the current rules changes in the UK to do with marketing mail.

    1. Adam 52 Silver badge

      Re: Most people.....

      That's what we have now, supposedly.

      It's not working, hence the new rules.

    2. DropBear Silver badge

      Re: Most people.....

      I don't necessarily condemn those who accept this "deal" consciously - but I really doubt most do. Funnily enough, we take it for granted that the warning "you have the right to remain silent, anything you say can be used against you in a court of law" is NOT optional, yet the exact same thing outside the judicial context suddenly becomes a "no need to talk about it" deal...

    3. HollyHopDrive

      Re: Most people.....

      Yes that's true, but for Google I get email, search etc in return for letting them know my browsing and purchasing habits, some of my privacy is the payment (they also let me see what they know). With Microsoft I *PAY* them for my overpriced licence therefore I expect I get at least the option to maintain my privacy. But I'm not given the option. The phrase "Cake and eating it" springs to mind.

      I can't help but notice there that the enterprise option gets a very minimal option (less than basic) so they know the big corporates wouldn't upgrade if anything of real value was spaffed out so it's a case of we'll listen to the big corporates but fuck the rest of you.

    4. FuzzyWuzzys Silver badge
      Coat

      Re: Most people.....

      Get your coat and get out Timmy, we don't like your sensible, well considered posting type antics in the Reg forum! Leave and never come back sir!

      1. Timmy B Silver badge
        Pint

        Re: Most people.....

        For you Mr Fuzzy....

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Most people.....

      I was on a Apple forum the other day (sorry), and people were genuinely excited that the next generation of apple watch might be able to measure your blood chemistry, nobody seemed to worry what that might do for health insurance etc etc.....

      I bought a heart rate monitor recently and the computer interface took the readings straight to Osram - no opportunity to store my data on my machine .... so I sent it back.

      IMHO - where possible we should all try to reject this encroachment ...

  10. djstardust Silver badge

    It's easy .....

    All you need to do is install DWS lite and Spybot anti-beacon.

    Between the two of them it kills slurp stone dead in Windows 10.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It's easy .....

      "All you need to do is install DWS lite "

      Were you aware that disables Windows Update?. Not a good idea unless you want to become the next ransomware victim!

      See https://www.howtogeek.com/273513/why-you-shouldnt-use-anti-spying-tools-for-windows-10

    2. Jonathan 27 Bronze badge

      Re: It's easy .....

      I'm assuming you're never accessing any web sites as well then? Because that's where the real data gathering is.

      1. TheVogon Silver badge

        Re: It's easy .....

        "I'm assuming you're never accessing any web sites as well then? Because that's where the real data gathering is."

        uBlock Origin and other similar options are now available as Edge extensions in case you were not aware...

  11. Ian 45

    spends most of its time updating

    Biggest mistake ever upgrading to it, spends half its time switching itself off as its decided to update, right in the middle of what am doing. Then the other half it spends slamming the disk so not much works, hardly ever use it now because its unusable.

    1. Elmer Phud Silver badge

      Re: spends most of its time updating

      Soooooo . . . .

      Someone who has yet to set up W10 then.

    2. Timmy B Silver badge

      Re: spends most of its time updating

      "spends most of its time updating". A serious question... "What have you done?" I have half a dozen w10 PCs at home and use one full time at work. I don't see this at all on any of them. Or is that just hyperbole? Is this an upgrade? From what? What software is running?

      1. Peter2 Silver badge

        Re: spends most of its time updating

        To be fair, the less often that you use a bit of software like Winx the worse it gets. If you only turn it on for an hour a month then it downloads and starts installing all of the updates, you turn it off in disgust as it's used half of that updating and then try again a month later and it does the same thing then your going to have a pretty poor view of it.

        1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

          Re: spends most of its time updating

          "If you only turn it on for an hour a month then it downloads and starts installing all of the updates, you turn it off in disgust as it's used half of that updating"

          The great mystery to many of us is why it needs to do updates this way. Earlie todayr I got an alert that my system had one update. The system's discovering that had no noticeable effect on performance. I don't set the system to autoupdate so a few moments ago I ran the update. One package was updated: 258kB downloaded at 636 kB/s and installed with no noticeable effect on performance. The whole update took seconds of elapsed time.

          Clearly there'd be many more packages to update if I left it to be a monthly task. Even so I know from large updates, say the mass that occur when, as you describe, an infrequently used box is switched on, that it doesn't take anything as long as the equivalent Windows update, it doesn't impede performance to any noticeable extent, it stops and restarts any services which have had an update without reboots, it doesn't require long delays to shut down after an update nor on the consequent restart and, in fact, the only sort of update that requires a reboot at all is when the kernel itself has been updated.

          FreeBSD is pretty similar (it's a while since I tried PC-BSD, based on FreeBSD and found it to be inexplicably similar to Windows in this respect).

          So why is it that Windows updates are such a major production?

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: spends most of its time updating

      "spends half its time switching itself off as its decided to update, right in the middle of what am doing"

      You know you can set up to 18 hours a day as "active hours" when it won't try and install anything?

    4. BobChip
      Happy

      Re: spends most of its time updating

      Linux Mint. This is how updates SHOULD work. Fast, silent, no reboot, keep on working throughout etc.etc. 'Nuf said.

  12. Adam 52 Silver badge

    Windows privacy portal

    I've never been. It involves creating a Microsoft online account, agreeing to the terms and associating your pc with it.

    My Mrs did. All it achieved was Microsoft spam to her email address, she wasn't happy but rather than file a complaint with the ICO she took it out on me.

    1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Windows privacy portal

      "All it achieved was Microsoft spam to her email address"

      Set up an address beforehand specifically for this. Then discontinue it or at least ignore it forever afterwards. Added bonus, make it a HotLiveOutmail address and let Microsoft store their own spam indefinitely.

      1. Adam 52 Silver badge

        Re: Windows privacy portal

        With Windows 10 your Microsoft account is your Windows login. So it's quite hard to dispose of it. We did eventually migrate to a new Windows account to avoid all the linked account rubbish.

        1. Rattus Rattus

          Re: Microsoft account is your Windows login

          Mine isn't. I told Windows to get stuffed every time it tried to tell me I should create a Microsoft account instead of a local one, and every time it said I should "upgrade" to one. This means I cannot use Windows Store apps, so it's a win-win really.

        2. TheVogon Silver badge

          Re: Windows privacy portal

          "With Windows 10 your Microsoft account is your Windows login. So it's quite hard to dispose of it."

          That's completely optional though. You can still choose to use local accounts. However anything from the Windows Store that requires a license won't work in that case...Just like on OS/X / Android, etc you need to be signed in for the App Store to work fully.

  13. Bloodbeastterror

    How-to

    No doubt Reg readers know already (and no doubt can expand on this if there's more), but for those who don't...

    Windows-R, services.msc, double-click "Connected User Experiences and Telemetry", stop the service, disable the service.

    I remember reading of another item to disable - maybe someone can add it if they know?

    And check occasionally that it hasn't been re-enabled by updates, as happened with mine when the Creator's Update hit my laptop.

    1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: How-to

      "check occasionally that it hasn't been re-enabled by updates"

      That's the rub.

      Eternal paranoia is the price of freedom. Vigilance is not enough.

    2. Wade Burchette

      Re: How-to

      (1) If you are using Windows 8 or 10, install Classic Shell.

      (2) After install, click the start button for the now proper and logical start menu, right-click 'This PC' or 'Computer' in Win7, then left-click Manage.

      (3) Find System Tools, then expand Task Scheduler, then Task Scheduler library, then Microsoft, then Windows.

      (4) Find the 'Application Experience' task list and 'Customer Experience Improvement' one and disable all tasks therein.

      1. Adam 52 Silver badge

        Re: How-to

        "(1) If you are using Windows 8 or 10, install Classic Shell"

        Doesn't work - Windows Update automatically removes Classic Shell as "incompatible".

        1. TheVogon Silver badge

          Re: How-to

          "Doesn't work - Windows Update automatically removes Classic Shell as "incompatible"."

          Classic Shell has supported Windows 10 since August 2015.

  14. Aristotles slow and dimwitted horse Silver badge

    I did it another way...

    I just Wiresharked my PCs network interface and after my own piece of investigatory fun blacklisted all of the suspect Microsoft telemetry domains and IP addresses on my router. Seems to do the job.

    1. Adam 52 Silver badge

      Re: I did it another way...

      Would you share please.

      1. Stumpy

        Re: I did it another way...

        +1 for a share.

      2. cd / && rm -rf *

        Re: I did it another way...

        "Would you share please"

        127.0.0.1 a-msedge.net

        127.0.0.1 a.ads2.msads.net

        127.0.0.1 adnexus.net

        127.0.0.1 aidps.atdmt.com

        127.0.0.1 az361816.vo.msecnd.net

        127.0.0.1 az512334.vo.msecnd.net

        127.0.0.1 b.ads1.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 b.ads2.msads.net

        127.0.0.1 c.atdmt.com

        127.0.0.1 c.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 cdn.atdmt.com

        127.0.0.1 cds26.ams9.msecn.net

        127.0.0.1 db3aqu.atdmt.com

        127.0.0.1 ec.atdmt.com

        127.0.0.1 feedback.microsoft-hohm.com

        127.0.0.1 flex.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 g.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 h1.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 lb1.www.ms.akadns.net

        127.0.0.1 live.rads.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 m.adnxs.com

        127.0.0.1 msedge.net

        127.0.0.1 msnbot-65-55-108-23.search.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 msntest.serving-sys.com

        127.0.0.1 preview.msn.com

        127.0.0.1 reports.wes.df.telemetry.microsoft.com

        127.0.0.1 sO.2mdn.net

        127.0.0.1 schemas.microsoft.akadns.net

        127.0.0.1 secure.flashtalking.com

        127.0.0.1 settings-win.data.microsoft.com

        127.0.0.1 statsfe2.ws.microsoft.com

        127.0.0.1 telemetry.appex.bing.net

        127.0.0.1 wes.df.telemetry.microsoft.com

        plus probably others.

        Also be aware that Slurp's "telemetry" bypasses the hosts file and talks direct to the relevant IPs, so you need to block in an external firewall or your router.

        Another vote for Spybot Anti-Beacon here. Re-run after any updates. You'll see how Slurp resets all the privacy settings you've carefully and laboriously set.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Unhappy

          Re: I did it another way...

          adnxs.com and flashtalking.com are, unsurprisingly, ad parasites. Microsoft is truly vile.

        2. poopypants

          Re: I did it another way...

          I had no problem with the minimum telemetry setting until I tried to record sound from a microphone onto my PC. It turns out on my system the telemetry causes the audio device driver to fail to fill all the input buffers, causing audio drops. That's when I added some rules to the firewall, and now audio recording works fine. The fact that I had to go out of my way to disable something just so that my PC could function correctly is, to put it mildly, annoying.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: I did it another way...

            The NSA has noted the absence of your real time audio feed, and has scheduled you for enhanced data collection.

          2. DropBear Silver badge

            Re: I did it another way...

            I have seen network activity obliterate basic audio usability before, although in that case it was _any_ network activity. I don't remember the details, only that it wasn't a simple "just make sure drivers are up to date" issue - it's all the more annoying considering those two functions are often both implemented using Realtek chips so one would expect them to get along better. I blame it on the modern "everything is software-only" mantra which makes things that need to happen at the same time totally fail to do so whenever the programming is sub-par (which is just to say "practically always").

        3. Electron Shepherd

          A (possibly better) and certainly longer list

          See http://someonewhocares.org/hosts/

          That's around 13,000 entries, covering telemetry and a lot of other spyware / ad serving and generally unpleasant domains.

        4. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: I did it another way...

          "Would you share please"

          That list contains lots of entries completely unrelated to telemetry. I would suggest using the Spybot app as a safer option.

          1. Mark 85 Silver badge

            Re: I did it another way...

            Indeed it does contain lots of entries unrelated to telemetry to MS. But those other entries are worth blocking, IMO. They block ad, data collection to the ad throwers, etc. Well worth the minimal time and effort to install.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: I did it another way...

              "They block ad, data collection to the ad throwers, etc."

              Which the Spybot app will also block. There are things in that list that will break other stuff too...

              Strongly suggest you don't just pick stuff at random but use a list from someone that has actually researched what you actually need to block...

  15. Carl D

    So... why, after over 2 years of massive data slurping by MS, is Windows 10 still no better than an early beta version (and that's me being polite)?

    Looks to me like the data slurping is more about pushing ads rather than improving the operating system.

    I'll just stick with my Windows 7/Linux Mint dual boot thanks. That's Windows 7 minus all the telemetry BS, of course. And, fully up to date with Windows security updates using a Kaby Lake 7th generation processor despite MS's lame attempt to block updates for 7th generation back in April.

    1. TheVogon Silver badge

      "why, after over 2 years of massive data slurping by MS, is Windows 10 still no better than an early beta version"

      Have you not installed the "creator" update? It's massively improved from the RTM version.

      About the only thing I can still complain about is that we are still in transition between to old style control panel and the new touchy-feely interface for settings. However, the vast majority of required settings can now at least be reached via the new interface which certainly wasn't the case at RTM...

  16. VinceH Silver badge

    (Not so) optional

    From the article:

    "In other words, 30 per cent of people have found the switch to turn it off, and the rest haven't, don't realize it's there, or are genuinely OK with the data collection."

    Or don't realise it's happening, which is not quite the same as not realising there is an option to reduce it (not turn it off).

    "She cited comments from shill users like "Very well done," and "The privacy settings added to clean installs are a boon for the privacy minded."

    FTFY!

    1. DryBones

      Re: (Not so) optional

      Actually, you've missed the biggest gawper, too.

      In order to comment/give feedback, you are required to have full telemetry on. Windows 10 will not allow you to give any kind of feedback unless it is on, full stop. I occasionally turn it on, just so they can track my keystrokes as I tell them they are pushy, nosy, and rude. And then turn it off again.

  17. Chz
    Stop

    Interpretation

    I think it's a bit of a stretch to look at a result that suggests - to me - that people just don't give a fuck and spin that into users are "happy" with it.

    1. Elmer Phud Silver badge

      Re: Interpretation

      Or: "I'm not fiddling around with things I don't know" ?

      I am the one who goes round and turns off all the 'useful' stuff on W10 for my mates, most have no experience with computers other than the 'keyboard, mouse, screen' experience. They are scared of screwing up and wrecking things.

      I'm happy with 'turn almost all of it off, if anything really needs access it will ask'.

      1. Ken Hagan Gold badge

        Re: Interpretation

        "I'm happy with 'turn almost all of it off, if anything really needs access it will ask'."

        Then you have presumably discovered that, in practice, most software does not ask but instead just fails quietly and it is up to you to figure out why. You sound like the sort of person who is willing to do this.

        Your mates sound like the sort of people who aren't. They've discovered that switching things off screws up and wrecks things, so they don't.

        A 70:30 split between these two populations sounds surprisingly heavily weighted on the "clued up" side.

  18. Haku

    "Happy" or "Ignorant"?

    You can often substitute those two words with each other without changing the meaning of the statement/sencence etc. Look:

    "70% of Windows 10 users are totally ignorant with our big telemetry slurp, beams Microsoft"

    Still works.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The beatings will cease once morale improves!

    We just love (your) data

  20. DropBear Silver badge

    "Very well done"

    You can set out to commit genocide and still have _some_ people tell you "very well done". Was that the opinion of the majority of said 70% or the isolated gushing village idiot...?

    1. LDS Silver badge

      She shouldn't have reported Nadella's comments....

  21. msknight Silver badge

    Also doesn't help...

    ...when Microsoft issues an update that turns it all back on again without telling the user.

  22. Spasticus Autisticus
    FAIL

    Isn't every version going to be "the best Windows ever"?

    Microsoft make me sick.

    1. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Linux

      Isn't every version going to be "the best Windows ever"?

      Yeah, Micro-shaft is running out of actual IDEAS. So they'll recycle this one unti it stops working. The only market THEY care about is "the 70%".

      I'd like to start a NEW campaign, to replace Windows with desktop Linux:

      MAKE! COMPUTING! GREAT! AGAIN!!!

      We'll go after the 30%, the "unsatisfied". It _COULD_ turn into a real revolution...

      you're welcome.

      1. Anonymous Git

        Re: Isn't every version going to be "the best Windows ever"?

        only way to get 30% on linux, would be to get the major software developers to produce products for linux.

        I am one that will switch if this happens. and would switch the entire office over to linux if i could get Autodesk software on linux. add to that photoshop etc etc etc. unfortunately there isnt alternatives that do the same job.

        Like the old saying, if they build it they will come.

        I know plenty of engineers / architects / designers / manufacturers that would switch in a instant, if only the software would support linux without lame WINE or other work around crap. Ditto improved driver support to prevent crashes of said complex software.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      And whatever happened to the one billion devices running Win 10 the first year it was out. It's been about two years now and still only half....

  23. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    In other news

    Very few negative responses were received from Turkeys to our Xmas-feedback-form sent in January.

  24. TRT Silver badge

    70% of Windows 10 users...

    And what is more, we didn't even need to ask them!

  25. adam payne Silver badge

    "As evidence for this claim, she said 71 per cent of people choose the default option of sending a full load of diagnostics data back to Redmond's servers. She cited comments from users like "Very well done," and "The privacy settings added to clean installs are a boon for the privacy minded."

    71% of the users from a specific set of data your removed from the actual full data.

    Of these 71% of people how many understood what they were being told? and how many understood privacy implications?

  26. ibmalone Silver badge

    Wonder how they will square this with GDPR when it arrives.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      "Wonder how they will square this with GDPR when it arrives."

      Already largely compliant I believe. The most important things about GDPR is getting your explicit permission for data use, and storing your data securely.

  27. FuzzyWuzzys Silver badge
    Facepalm

    "Windows privacy officer"?

    "Windows privacy officer"? Ha ha!

    You mean like Cadbury's Health Rep or The National Fruiterers Chocolate Sales Chief?

    1. Updraft102 Silver badge

      Re: "Windows privacy officer"?

      ""Windows privacy officer"? Ha ha!"

      Well, consider that the homicide squad's job isn't to promote homicide, it's to eliminate it...

  28. Lion

    The only Windows User Feedback Program that Microsoft pays any attention to, is in the Insider Program. As a participant of the Insider Program you are obligated to NOT turn off any telemetry. This program has 10 million fanboys. Considering that MS is their 'Dear Leader', it is more than likely that the positive feedback cited by Marisa Rogers came from this camp.

    Consumers (est. 400 million) upgraded to W10 primarily from an OEM W7/8 Home or Pro pre-install. The additional 100 million after GWX probably bought new OEM hardware with W10 pre-installed. The OEM defaults were set on those systems to benefit MS (partnership agreements and all that). Windows is a closed system and even more so with W10. The Privacy configuration options range between 'all' and 'almost all', so user satisfaction feedback based on this is an insult to their customer base.

    Memo to MS Rogers: PR is a weapon best used as a preemptive strike. It has a lot less impact when your lead ship is under the constant barrage of devastating salvos.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Exactly what I was thinking. How many are Insiders?

      Exactly, how many are Insiders with no option but having Full Telemetry, App suggestions, and tonnes of nags constantly.

      1. TheVogon Silver badge

        Re: Exactly what I was thinking. How many are Insiders?

        "App suggestions, and tonnes of nags constantly."

        I have used the Windows 10 insider build as my primary laptop OS for well over a year and I don't see any nags or app suggestions (except in the Windows Store - which you would expect). Sounds like you are not speaking from any actual experience.

        As to full telemetry I really don't care if some random at Microsoft gets anonymised information about what I use it for. If you do care - just kill it with the app mentioned above.

    2. Updraft102 Silver badge

      "The only Windows User Feedback Program that Microsoft pays any attention to, is in the Insider Program.

      ...

      Considering that MS is their 'Dear Leader', it is more than likely that the positive feedback cited by Marisa Rogers came from this camp."

      They only pay attention to the Insiders that still remain after the Great Purge, where all of the Insiders that were offering feedback that didn't boil down to "Great job!" were purged from the Insider forum, effectively removing their opinions from Dear Leader's awareness. They eliminate voices of dissent, then crow about how everyone who speaks up loves what they're doing.

  29. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Telemetry, Cortana, Bing

    "This is great news to us because what we hear from you directly impacts the improvements we make."

    You've not heard from me - I had no idea it was possible to even tell you what I think, which is that I hate the idea of this Cortana monstrosity monitoring everything I do and feeding details of my private life back to Bing.

  30. CAPS LOCK Silver badge

    Seventy percent is good, when it's the default?

    I would have said that was very poor under the circumstances. I assume MS recognise this and have a plan to eliminate the option to turn off telemetry.

    The US gubmint gets a special build I understand, but outside the US I think governments will have to look at the alternatives. I was most surprised that the Chinese government embraced Windows, in spite of developing their own OS. Most Odd. What can it mean?

  31. zaax

    85 year old

    My 85 year old dad does not know he is being spied on, as do most of the windows 10 renters who hardly understand computers let alone M$ spyware.

  32. sisk Silver badge

    In this context "30% of users have turned it off" is more or less equivalent to "almost everyone who knows it's there and how to shut it off has done so".

  33. inmypjs Silver badge

    "Windows privacy officer"

    Wow - does she double up as a rocking horse shit clean up officer?

  34. TVU Silver badge

    "70% of Windows 10 users are totally happy with our big telemetry slurp, beams Microsoft"

    Rather them than me. Microsoft will end up knowing them better than their relatives.

  35. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Not out of luck for me

    I don't use windows 10, an unfinished and unfit problematic o's I just stick with win 7 much better or win 8 on tablet with shell much better

  36. charlyw64
    FAIL

    Out goes the Windows

    The moment it became clear that M$ will start slurping as they slurped never before it was out with the Windows from the one system I had to run a commercial OS on (Linux on every other system ever since 0.99.13 with a Slackware distro) and in came a brand new, expensive MacOS system. It was the excessive slurping that was the final nail in the coffin of my M$ usage...

  37. Mark 85 Silver badge
    WTF?

    Privacy Portal?

    Really? It must be so private that it's very difficult to find.

  38. TheGriz
    Stop

    Wake Up Marisa Rogers

    After I read this article I logged on to https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/concern/privacy and left a message for Marisa Rogers, as follows...

    Marisa Rogers, if you and your company truly want to support Windows User's privacy, you'd stop setting the "default" data mining "feature" (cough, spying) to OFF, and/or make the privacy settings during the initial setup of Windows 10 more VISIBLE to the general public, who are not certified data security professionals.

    Hiding Windows 10s data slurping behind "Microsoft cares and listens to it's user base" is at best a naive approach, or at worst a disingenuous tactic adopted by a mega corporation trying to catch up in the modern world of corporate attitudes that are inching society as a whole to a true state of 1984-ism. We want your identity, and we are willing to lie to you, as long as we can make a buck off of it.

    In the past at least we as society could make you stand up and pay attention, by hitting you in the wallet (because that is the only thing that has worked in the past, i.e. Windows ME, Vista, and Windows 8), but now that you have taken to role playing as PC Operating System Savior, and "given away" Windows 10, you seem to now think that means you can do anything you want with people's data, because you feel we are indebted to you.

    Wake up, and if you want to really stand out in the global market place, stop trying to be like Google and Facebook, and REALLY respect the people using your software, and stop spying on them, just because you can and you think you can drive up revenue by doing so.

    It takes a much stronger ethical standard to stand up and state, Microsoft is not going to stoop to the same tactics as these other mega corporations, we BELIEVE in privacy, and believe that each individual's privacy is an inherent right given to anyone with a heartbeat, and a PC connected to the world wide web.

    1. TheVogon Silver badge

      Re: Wake Up Marisa Rogers

      "and/or make the privacy settings during the initial setup of Windows 10 more VISIBLE to the general public"

      They are pretty clearly displayed with an option to set them during the install process, and the impact of not setting them is also clearly displayed.

      The vast majority of people simply don't care what data Microsoft (and anyone else!) collects within reason....

  39. Will Godfrey Silver badge
    Unhappy

    Interesting wording

    "Chose the default".

    Umm, surely the default is what you get if you don't choose at all.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Interesting wording

      "Umm, surely the default is what you get if you don't choose at all."

      It forces you to make a choice to be able to proceed.

  40. gkroog
    Trollface

    That Malicious Software Removal Tool doesn't work...

    ...after running it, Windows 10 is still installed...

  41. Dwarf Silver badge

    More proof that Microsoft are still smoking their funny stuff and believing that they understand what the users want.

    Its a bit odd that with all the customer feedback, the have still not worked out what people really want.

    Something that works like Windows 7, Isn't constantly changing "just because Windows", has no telemetry and doesn't need any form of subscription service.

    Its not that hard MS.

  42. Jimbo in Thailand
    Facepalm

    Windows 10? What's that?

    No thanks M$. I've tried it and... yawn... I'll stick with ancient Windoze 7, of course with the infernal Windoze updates turned off for 3 years now without a problem. And Windows as a service? Stick it up your a*** Satya Nutella!

  43. Nameless Faceless Computer User

    Everybody Does It

    Google slurps all your search keywords, browsing history, and if you connect to your car's radio Google will slurp your engine's performance. Apple is bit more polite. They give you shiny new toys, like Siri, yet fail to mention Siri is quietly collecting everything you express interest in. Apple calls it "learning." Amazon Echo places a live speaker in your home which is connected to a server farm. XBox Live puts a camera in your house. Smartphones track your GPS coordinates to provide traffic data then sell you back the data they've collected from you.

    So, Windows 10 is snooping? You're just swimming against the tide at this point.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Everybody Does It

      At least with Apple you can choose to not enable any of the data sharing/mining functions in the first place, which is certainly more than you can with Google.

  44. MachDiamond Silver badge

    The bigger problem of de-evolution

    A portion of those that haven't opted out are too stupid to realize that continuously handing the Big Data Machine® all of your personal information (because you have nothing to hide) is a seriously bad idea. Showing a potential or current employer where they can find pages of selfies where you have an adult bevy in hand or or smoking something other than ciggies (actually, those might be of issue too) is not a great idea. Yet, it seems that it is precisely at this times that people think to whip out a camera and take a picture of themselves instead of that pivotal moment where they make a breakthrough discovery during an experiment they designed at the VVLHC (Very Very Large Hadron Collider) or they are at the microscope just after they discover a universal cure for cancer. Nope, they have to document the more base enjoyment of mood altering substance usage, in full. Might as well copy Bevis and Butthead quotes into ones resume cover letters.

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