back to article London Mayor slams YouTube over failure to remove 'shocking' violent gang vids

The Mayor of London, Sadiq Khan, has singled out Google's YouTube for failing to crack down on online videos that "inflame" gang violence and knife crime. YouTube has refused to take down four violent videos reported to them by the Metropolitan Police since December, which have been viewed 356,000 times. The Mayor's office …

  1. Unclezip

    How about parents do their part, instead of demanding corporations raise their children?

    1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

      "How about parents do their part, instead of demanding corporations raise their children?"

      Yes, that will be easy to implement. Please go ahead and fix this.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        One way could be to make parents equally responsible for the actions of the child.

        I'm not advocating this approach but you did ask for a solution to the problem.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          "One way could be to make parents equally responsible for the actions of the child.

          I'm not advocating this approach but you did ask for a solution to the problem."

          Won't work, this has been tried before. All it does it lead to the breakdown of the relationship between parent and child, if it hasn't already been destroyed prior.

          A better solution would be for police to apprehend and send those identified on the videos to institutions which could help or charge them with a crime, threatening behaviour is one such law that could be used; rather than the police spending their time asking Youtube to remove evidence so they don't have to do any work.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            That is another possibility however the problem with those "institutions" is that they get a detrimental education in all things crime.

            As someone who got on the wrong side of the law in my youth and spent time at hmp Hindley I can speak first hand about the information traded between criminals. Luckily I was not completely stupid and changed my ways (it was only remand because I absconded so I wasn't a hardened crim). However on release I then knew how to rob pretty much any car or motorbike and knew most reset methods for popular burglar alarms, never used them, never would.

          2. Terrance Brennan

            It does not have to be either or. Parents need to do a better job, even though as some others have pointed out, many parents are not up to the task. yes, the Police should do more than just ask the videos be removed and visiting the thugs in them would be a good start. And, yes, often institutions for criminals, especially juveniles, can often be nothing but criminal prep schools. However, corporations reaping profits from the videos also need to do their part and not just make a quick buck from clearly anti-social, dangerous, and possibly criminal videos. Life is not a reality game show (the current prick in the white house notwithstanding) and it is rarely a clean binary option; there is a lot more shades of gray than definitive black or white. But, just because the issue is complicated and involves lots of players is not an excuse to do nothing.

      2. Chris G Silver badge

        @ABC.

        If yoy are,a parent you are probably crap at it, part of being a parent is to.instill values and a sense of right and wrong in your children.

        It is part of what you should be considering when you decide to have them , unfortunately a lot of parents now regard sex and child bearing as a ' fire and forget' experience, when the kids go wrong it is always someone else's fault.

        Parents are responsible for how their kids behave a d should be held to task to some degree.

      3. WolfFan Silver badge

        "How about parents do their part, instead of demanding corporations raise their children?"

        Yes, that will be easy to implement. Please go ahead and fix this.

        Not my job. Not Google's job, either.

        1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

          "Not my job. Not Google's job, either."

          Shwooosh..

          Point in clear text then: YouTube can implement their own rules within, say, 10 minutes.

          Your solution would take at least one generation, probably longer. In the UK I suspect it would take about 70 years to implement.

          Get it?

      4. Tim Seventh

        "

        "How about parents do their part, instead of demanding corporations raise their children?"

        Yes, that will be easy to implement. Please go ahead and fix this.

        "

        Just use the Darwin Awards. /s

        On the serious side, you are pointing to OP to fix this when OP said the Parents themselves should fix it. What am I reading. If you are talking about a feasible way for the implementation, then it's easy. All the parents need to know is the Parenting 101 tips.

        Parenting 101 tips

        Rule #1: Take care of your kids.

        Rule #2: Please take care of your damn kids.

        Rule #3: Refer to Rule #1 and #2

        Most parents don't take care of their kids, let alone being responsible for their kids. At most they feed the kids like any other pets, but that's not taking care of their kids. Kids doing drugs, joining gangs, skipping school; They all come down to one thing, the kids is having problems due to lack of care from their parents. And no, caring doesn't mean spying your kids 24-7, but giving support to the kid when they really need you.

        Kids don't normally do drugs, join gangs or skip school, but they do when they are depressed, bored, and uneducated. Guess what? Taking care of the kids fixes all of them. Lead them something happy when they are depressed, give them something to do when they are bored, and educate them to avoid the bads are the simple basic of parenting. In return, the kids may at one point will take care of the parents when needed.

        If they are too busy, lazy or incomptent to do that, youtube, gov't and/or whatnot aren't going to babysit for them. It's back to the Darwin Awards.

        1. strum Silver badge

          >Most parents don't take care of their kids

          What!!!. A tiny, tiny minority of parents neglect their kids (and a few more try but fail). Don't generalise from the few to the many.

  2. ForthIsNotDead

    All they have to do...

    ...is claim that Paul Joseph Watson made the video and they'll take it down immediately.

    I don't want to live in a censored world where the likes of Mr. Khan get to decide what we can and cannot see. What makes *him* the arbiter of censorship in the UK?

    I want to see these scum bags for the scum bags that they are, right out in open, whether it be members of violent gangs; racists; mysogynists; KKK; far-left Antifa; or Black Lives Matter.

    I don't need the likes of Mr. Khan to hide it and obscure it, so that he and other members of government can claim that a problem that clearly exists, doesn't exist.

    It's pure censorship.

    1. tony72
      Black Helicopters

      Re: All they have to do...

      It's pure censorship.

      Actually it's worse than that - it's backdoor censorship.

      If the content of these videos contravene any current laws, then Mr Khan or the police should prosecute the individuals concerned. If Mr Khan feels new laws are needed in order to criminalise the contents of these videos, well there's a procedure for that too.

      But by trying to manoeuvre the likes of Google into performing the censorship without any law being broken, or any legal procedure having taken place, means the censorship would happen without any transparency or accountability whatsoever. Content would disappear into a black hole, administered only by internet companies' internal policies.

      If Mr Khan wants to censor content that he finds distasteful, he should man up and call for a law that allows him/the government to do that, and take any electoral heat that results from passing such a law, instead of posturing.

      1. ForthIsNotDead

        Re: All they have to do...

        Actually it's worse than that - it's backdoor censorship.

        Yes. You're right. Have an up-vote!

      2. John Lilburne

        Re: All they have to do...

        The content of the videos contravene YTs own Terms&Conditions. The problem is that YT and many other tech companies like to hide behind web statements and do nothing to enforce them.

        over a 60-day period it raised concerns in 526 cases where the site's guidelines were believed to have been violated but only received responses to 15 of the reports.

        One volunteer says he has 9,000 complaints still awaiting responses from December.

        http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/05/youtube-systematically-failing-protect-children-watchdog-claims/

        According to Google 90% of the Trusted Flaggers reports are correct. Its not censorship so much as the local pub posting notices saying that racism isn't tolerated and every Saturday selling booze to a group of yoiks goosestepping and cry "Sieg Heil" in the car park.

        1. Kernel Silver badge

          Re: All they have to do...

          " a group of yoiks goosestepping and cry "Sieg Heil" in the car park."

          But just doing this is not actually racist, is it?

          Be very careful to differentiate between expressing a political opinion and racism, they're not the same thing.

          1. Prst. V.Jeltz Silver badge

            Re: All they have to do...

            if someones marching in the carpark crying "Sieg Heil"

            It doesnt mean "all hail our glorious leader" or whatever the literal translation is , it means "We are right wing xenophobic thugs with chips on our shoulders who blame everyone else for our failures in life and

            hate everyone not like us and are prepared to express that in violence "

            1. Pompous Git Silver badge

              Re: All they have to do...

              "if someones marching in the carpark crying "Sieg Heil"

              It doesnt mean "all hail our glorious leader" or whatever the literal translation is , it means "We are right wing xenophobic thugs with chips on our shoulders who blame everyone else for our failures in life and hate everyone not like us and are prepared to express that in violence ""

              Really? My friend Julian and I do that. Both of us are of German and Jewish parentage. We think it means we are both John Cleese fans and that we like giving the politically correct the shits. Instead "we are right wing xenophobic thugs with chips on our shoulders who blame everyone else for our failures in life and

              hate everyone not like us and are prepared to express that in violence". Whoda thunkt?

      3. strum Silver badge

        Re: All they have to do...

        >If the content of these videos contravene any current laws, then Mr Khan or the police should prosecute the individuals concerned

        Which should, perhaps, include those making money out of them - like Google?

    2. John 110

      Re: All they have to do...

      That's all very well, but scumbags don't think that they're the scumbags, they think everybody else is.

      These videos reinforce and validate the poster's actions in the eyes of those they see as peers.

      Where once they would boast and threaten in front of their mates and 10 people would agree and egg them on, now they can post Youtube videos that are viewed 300,000 times. That's a hell of an egg on and can only serve to amplify a problem that we should be trying to scale down.

      1. Prst. V.Jeltz Silver badge

        Re: All they have to do...

        "censorship without any law being broken"

        I'm pretty sure the majority of these are "threatening behaviour" , and a good slice are "Death threats"

        Isnt that against the law?

        1. WolfFan Silver badge

          Re: All they have to do...

          I'm pretty sure the majority of these are "threatening behaviour" , and a good slice are "Death threats"

          Isnt that against the law?

          Excellent. Use the videos to identify those breaking the law and prosecute them.

          1. Prst. V.Jeltz Silver badge

            Re: All they have to do...

            "Excellent. Use the videos to identify those breaking the law "

            Excellent plan , but you forgot one tiny detail , those London gangstas have got hoodies and gangsta-chieves on their faces innit.

            foiled again!

  3. SkippyBing Silver badge
    Trollface

    Surely it's part and parcel of living in a major world capital?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      "Surely it's part and parcel of living in a... squalid urban shit hole?

      FTFY, and no charge.

      1. David 132 Silver badge

        @Ledswinger "Surely it's part and parcel of living in a... squalid urban shit hole?

        To paraphrase Pratchett, who was in turn paraphrasing Dr Johnson: "When one is tired of London, one is tired of ankle-deep slurry."

        Ghastly place.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Surely it's part and parcel of living in a major world capital?

      Absolutely! File under cultural enrichment.

  4. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

    YouTube is a profit first entity (owned by Google).

    The made shedloads of money from allowing stolen material to be viewed on their platform. I wouldn't expect them to take any responsibility.

    "I want to see these scum bags for the scum bags that they are"

    Fine. These scumbags actually like this sh*t. They feed on the scumbaggery. YouTube helps them doing this. This is not a good thing.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      They didn't really, they made most of their money by showing cat videos. Any child can easily get material removed from youtube, if Alex Mauer can manage it then I'm pretty sure the Metropolitan police or Music industry could too.

      1. John Lilburne

        Really! Really! Really?

        Google makes most of its money from YT by data mining its users, you get far more information from categorising music, film and TV video users then from cat antic videos.

        After all other than marketing pet food there is very little extra value you can derive from cat video. Music, film, and TV OTOH indicate lifestyle choices.

  5. Thomas Steven 1

    Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

    Like identifying these people from the video

    Like identifying the crimes of these people from the video

    Like using the video as evidence to arrest these people

    Like using the video as evidence to convict these people

    Perhaps showing how they use the video to identify these people, identify their crimes, secure an arrest and conviction, perhaps even in their own video. Instead of whining about videos glamorizing gang violence that they want taken down, how about leaving them up with a counter video showing how the police are doing their fricking job and rounding up and arresting the kind of idiot that makes a Youtube video like that.

    Oh, that's right, the above looks like work and a proper job, whereas bitching at YT about the video being up in the first place just involves firing off a couple of emails and a press conference, about how they can't protect the children unless censorship.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

      I'm guessing it's not a trivial matter to:

      a) identify the people in the video,

      b) link the people to reported crimes,

      c) gather enough evidence to secure a conviction.

      1. Thomas Steven 1

        Re: Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

        No, its not trivial, its their job.

        If what is happening in the video isn't a crime then why are they whining about it? If it is a crime then they should be doing their job. My guess is that there is very little glory in doing your job and a whole lot of looking like you're doing something while achieving virtually nothing in pointing fingers at YouTube in press conferences.

        If they did their job and then demanded the video was taken down after the miscreants were behind bars, then all well and good, or even better demanded it was taken down and replaced with a re-edited version, perhaps highlighting the characters and their fates.

        'Sean Dickwad, seen here making gun gestures at Petey Arsehole, 10 years for dickwaddery',

        'Petey Arsehole, here recorded saying he is going to kill Dickwad and his gang, 5 years for aggravated arsehole'

        Pour encourager les autres.

        Ditto extremist/sexist/racist/homophobic inciting violence blah blah blah video.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

          Given it's not trivial, why would anyone expect a private company to police public morals instead?

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

          'Sean Dickwad, seen here making gun gestures at Petey Arsehole, 10 years for dickwaddery',

          'Petey Arsehole, here recorded saying he is going to kill Dickwad and his gang, 5 years for aggravated arsehole'

          I'll confess I can't actually be bothered to look these videos up, but I'm assuming that Sean and Petey are not appearing holding up their passports at the photo page...

          1. WolfFan Silver badge

            Re: Why doesn't the Met do something useful with these videos

            I'll confess I can't actually be bothered to look these videos up, but I'm assuming that Sean and Petey are not appearing holding up their passports at the photo page...

            If the cops have a clue, they'll have a Gangs Unit, and the Gangs Unit will have pix of many/most gang-bangers. Create stills of Sean and Petey from the YouTube video, compare to pix of known gangsters. You won't find all the twits making the vids, but you will find some. Charge 'em if they're actually doing something illegal, prosecute them based on the video evidence, find them guilty and lock them up. If they're not actually doing anything illegal, or if the video evidence isn't enough to charge them or to get a guilty verdict, then what in God's name does anyone expect Google to do? If it's illegal, charge them. If it's not, stand back, the twits will do something illegal soon enough.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Clearly the solution is for politicians to start posting videos to you tube using gang speak and pretend guns with their hands dissing each other. I can only imagine Boris Johnson in a hoody dissing and blarting down Corbyn for his non-dope policies.

    That way posting to you tube will instantly become uncool and they will all stop doing it.

    1. Haku
    2. Chris G Silver badge

      Boris Johnson may(or may not) have a hoody but after decimating the London Fire Brigade reducing it by some 3000 people in the name of ' making it more efficient' he is at least partly responsible for the deaths at Grenfell Tower and other fires in London so he shouldn' t be permitted on YouTube either as he sets a bad example.

      Regarding the video thugs, what's going on with the fuzz' much vaunted facial recognition?

      I think a local beat bobby would have had the little scrotes identified and nailed in a trice, (that is if beat bobbies still existed).

  7. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

    I believe most countries have laws against inciting violence.

    If a video doing so is also the means of of doing so, then obviously the video must be taken down.

    YouTube are only behaving, as always, as immature profit-first irresponsible ^&%. Their mechanism for filtering contents for children is a joke as well. They just don't care as long as the money rolls in.

  8. s. pam
    Thumb Down

    Sad dick is so full of him self

    He and Amber need to either take a chill pill or quit trying to erode by stealth the very measures meant to protect the public.

    They need to man/lady(?) up and force the Met Police to hunt the scum down and the CPS to actually police it!

  9. moiety

    If a crime is being committed, it's being done ON VIDEO, so there's evidence. You would have thought it would be a police wet dream instead of them whining about it.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    In my day

    Crap like this appeared on the toilet wall.

    Now it's on a different wall.

    Same, same though.

    Nothing really changes.

  11. inmypjs Silver badge

    Twat

    I thought such gang activity was just "part and parcel of living in a big city"

    The best London could come up with was this slimy vacuous toad is as unbelievable as Trump being the best the Yanks could do.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Sorry, it is part of living in a big city init!

  13. Primus Secundus Tertius Silver badge

    Obviously wrong

    Any ordinary person with a grain of common sense can see that these videos are obviously criminally wrong. The Mayor is not trying to impose his personal wishes, he is acting on behalf of millions of ordinary voters.

    It is time the myopic "freedom fighters" in the computer industry woke up to their civic responsibilities. If they refuse to do that in the British way they may end up doing it the Peking way.

    1. Chris G Silver badge

      Re: Obviously wrong

      In Peking they would be dealing with the people in the video as well, not just trying to push it out of sight to keep the tourists coming.

  14. Moosh
    Unhappy

    Mr Part and Parcel comments about this, and yet has remained silent on things such as the increasing acid attack rates?

    Anything where he doesn't have to rock the boat. He's not a politician, he's an idiot trying to be like Tony Blair. He'll shout out when he thinks it will impact him positively (arbitrarily banning adverts for promoting attractiveness, for example), but stay silent when people actually expect comment.

    1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

      "Anything where he doesn't have to rock the boat. He's not a politician, he's an idiot trying to be like Tony Blair."

      Anyone saying something political is a "politician". It's not a real job, only reserved for certain self-important people such as BoJo the Clown. Perhaps you are thinking of elected representative? Well, he certainly is one of those. Just not for the Parliament.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    It's an American company.

    Just look carefully to see if a nipple is briefly exposed.

    1. Pompous Git Silver badge

      Re: It's an American company.

      "Just look carefully to see if a nipple is briefly exposed."
      I always do that; it's a hobby of mine. Often I find myself wishing the exposure were of longer duration, but that's just in the nature of my hobby.

  16. Wolfclaw Silver badge

    London Mayor slams YouTube over failure to remove 'shocking' violent gang vids ... yeh, have you seen what Khan, his PC lefty, socialist, luvvies look like when they are on a pub crawl, after a meetings and 5 rounds of Labours favourite battle hymn ?

    1. Jamie Jones Silver badge

      No, I haven't. Please enlighten me.

      Do they threaten "righties"? Do they describe how they are going to murder them? Do they make shooting gestures?

      Nope? I've not seen the videos, and aren't making a statement one way or the other regarding them, but damn, you "righties" bang on about "pc lefties" and free speech, yet act the biggest bunch of "delicate triggered little snowflakes" ever.

      Just about everything you do, from whining about "safe spaces", to being an outwardly homophobic closeted gay is classic psychological projection.

  17. Howard Hanek Bronze badge
    Childcatcher

    The Tyrant's Answer To Everything

    ..not enough censorship. I NEED MORE POWER.

  18. israel_hands

    I think a lot of you are missing the point here. I'm no fan of the filth so don't think I'm defending them.

    When you've got a video of something that society has decided is unacceptable say, 5 or 6 guys kicking the absolute shit out of another guy, or making serious threats against someone (which are very likely to be acted upon), that's a problem. Also, to be fair to the idiot plod, many of the guys in these videos wear things called "masks" which can make it fucking difficult to identify them.

    Google making fucking billions out of YouTube, it's not OK for them to simply toss out the "we're just a platform"* excuse and wash their hands of it. They need to be able to moderate the content they host properly, and if doing so makes it unprofitable then I guess they need to reconsider their business model, the same as any other company would.

    You can froth and whine about it being "censorship" all you want, but they already censor plenty of content which is far less of a problem than what's being discussed here. They're fucking hot on removing any images of nipples, despite nipples being legal in pretty much every jurisdiction on the planet**. On the flipside, making threats or attacking someone are illegal in most, if not all, jurisdictions.

    Personally, I think they should work much harder to remove things which are actually illegal and if that impacts their bottom line then maybe they'll rethink their "just a platform" attitude.

    By the way, everyone banging on about this being outrageous censorship, where are your voices when Google get told to take down beheading videos from IS?

    *Remember, this is the same defence used by the likes of Uber to try and sidestep pretty much every law they're asked to operate under, so don't be so quick to allow Google to use that defence if you don't also accept Uber can get away with same.

    **Yes, there are public nudity laws in many places, but if the subject of a nip-slip is in private and of age then public decency won't be offended.

    1. Pompous Git Silver badge

      "When you've got a video of something that society has decided is unacceptable say, 5 or 6 guys kicking the absolute shit out of another guy, or making serious threats against someone (which are very likely to be acted upon), that's a problem."
      No. The video is not the problem. It's "kicking the absolute shit out of another guy" that is the problem.

      "Also, to be fair to the idiot plod, many of the guys in these videos wear things called "masks" which can make it fucking difficult to identify them."
      Assertion. Link to youtube vids establishing this as fact rather than speculation required.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        No. The video is not the problem. It's "kicking the absolute shit out of another guy" that is the problem.

        The video is almost certainly illegal all by itself: there's a whole load of laws about public order, incitement, standards of decency in media, etc.

        The attack itself is the greater problem, but one has to ask whether the attackers were partly motivated by the opportunity to become notorious in a very public way. Most of this shit is all about showing off, so why give them an opportunity to do so on the global stage, effectively anonymously?

        1. Pompous Git Silver badge

          "The video is almost certainly illegal all by itself: there's a whole load of laws about public order, incitement, standards of decency in media, etc."
          As others have already noted, if the law has been broken, then the miscreants should be prosecuted. Thus far nobody linked to any of these videos, so I went looking. Found the following on the first page:

          Muslim Gang Attacks With Hammer After Prayers in Bradford UK

          I note the absence of masks/hoods that some commentards claim prevents plod IDing the perps.

          "Most of this shit is all about showing off, so why give them an opportunity to do so on the global stage"
          Most of Hollywood is about showing off and a great deal of Hollywood's output is gratuitous violence. And it's boring to boot. If you don't like violence, don't watch it.

      2. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

        "No. The video is not the problem. It's "kicking the absolute shit out of another guy" that is the problem."

        BOTH are a problem! Unless you want to live in some voyeuristic shit society where people do anything to get views on YouTube? Perhaps if it was a relative of yours being almost killed and shown on YouTube you would be able to conjure up the empathy needed to understand this?

        1. Pompous Git Silver badge

          "Perhaps if it was a relative of yours being almost killed and shown on YouTube you would be able to conjure up the empathy needed to understand this?"
          I'm told that as an Aspie, I don't do "real" empathy and truth be told, I don't even know what real empathy is. That said, I had the shit seriously kicked out of me back in the mid-70s. Local pub I ate at almost every day kicked me out when I walked in seeking assistance. Doctor's surgery around the corner: ditto; I didn't have an appointment. Staggered past a building site and the builders' labourers rendered me first aid commie bastards* that they were. I couldn't have given a flying fuck about these events appearing on film. I just wanted the pain and the bleeding to stop.

          You can stick your "real" empathy where the sun don't shine.

          * At the time the Builder Labourer's Federation were constantly in the news as the bad guys of Australian industry.

          1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

            "I'm told that as an Aspie, I don't do "real" empathy and truth be told, I don't even know what real empathy is."

            Well, that certainly ends that discussion!

            Perhaps you are in over your head in a discussion about moral and ethical issues, then...

            1. Pompous Git Silver badge

              @ anonymous boring coward

              From the OED: "This is a silent music, a matter of tensions and resolutions, of movements (but again not rhythmical movements) sustained or broken, of ease or effort, rapidity or languor. What we mean, in fact, is empathy." Dunno what if anything that has to do with moral and ethical issues... Supposedly makes sense to NTs...

            2. Julian Bradfield

              On the contrary. As someone without empathy, Pompous Git may be better placed to discuss morality and ethics. See Paul Bloom's "Against Empathy". (OK, I haven't read it, but when did that ever stop anyone:)

              1. anonymous boring coward Silver badge

                Well, Dr. Mengele was perfectly placed to study it. He didn't feel it, but he could observe it while performing various forms of torture. Didn't make him UNDERSTAND it though.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Well Said

      One can't help but feel that the social networks are heading for a fall. Their efforts to police user content are coming to nothing. The legislatures across Europe will not tolerate that forever, and the business model will become unworkable as law changes in response to things like this.

      We can all see that coming, so the companies themselves ought to be thinking about how to change their business model to survive that. One way would be subscription-only services; it would double up as a means to strongly identify users posting such material.

      And if a user can be easily traced through their credit card which they've had to use to get the service in the first place, it starts becoming far easier for the companies to assist the police with their enquiries. That takes the heat off the companies and onto the users.

      That doesn't stop bad shit happening of course. But it does suppress the inspiration for copy-cat losers, which will result in less bad things happening.

      1. Pompous Git Silver badge

        Re: Well Said

        "We can all see that coming, so the companies themselves ought to be thinking about how to change their business model to survive that. One way would be subscription-only services; it would double up as a means to strongly identify users posting such material."
        It would also reduce the already modest income of people like this:

        Alan Gogoll: Mulberry Mouse

        Tiff Eckhardt: Drive

  19. J J Carter Silver badge
    FAIL

    Mayor Khant!

    Belly-aching is all Sadiq ever does, that and blaming the Tories. Epic fail as the Mayor of a global city.

  20. scrubber

    UK politicians

    Whining about people saying things they don't like and rather than use their bully pulpit to replace it with better speech they call for the silencing of dissenting opinions.

    If it's not criminal stop whining and explain to the people why what they're saying is wrong. Free marketplace of ideas!

    1. Pompous Git Silver badge

      Re: UK politicians

      "Whining about people saying things they don't like"
      is not confined to politicians. Internet acquaintance of mine retired from the US Marines to NYC. He didn't take kindly to the neighbourhood he chose to live in being terrorised by a gang of hoodlums. So he door-knocked the neighbourhood and assembled a group of recently retired Marines. They confronted the gang and told them in no uncertain terms what was going to ensue if they continued operating where they were not welcome. Undisciplined mob meets disciplined, highly trained killers no contest! Problem solved.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: retired US Marines

        COOL STORY BRO!

  21. Skwosh

    Possible medium term fix for YouTube

    Compromise: change the law to hold Google to the same rules as publishers like newspapers – but *only* for content that Google is or has been making money out of.

    By 'making money out of' I mean Google running ads against it *or* tracking views of it for data-mining.

    This prevents Google from getting any income from content that would be illegal to conventionally publish in a given country – but it would *not* add any new restrictions to non-monetised posting/publishing of such content, so the existing 'light-touch' laws (safe-harbour and take down procedures etc.) would still apply unchanged to videos that aren't being monetised by Google in any way.

    This defuses the freedom-of-speech/artistic-expression argument: If Google is sincere about freedom of speech/expression then they could continue to host - but in return for *no* income and no juicy data mining - all the un-conventionally-publishable and thus un-monetiseable vids (including these gang vids for example) simply for the joy of enriching global culture - or whatever.

    This may not make any difference in the short term in this (gang vids) instance but it would be an interesting first step and might appeal to the ideologists on both sides (or possibly just annoy the ideologists on both sides).

    Someone must surely have thought of this before. Any good?

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Risk averse

    - Drain the oceans

    - Flatten the mountains

    - Cut down all the trees

    Stay in your chair, DO NOT go outside!

  23. Kane Silver badge

    The Mayor's office says...

    "...the videos depict gang members threatening rivals, describing how they would murder them, and making shooting gestures."

    Sounds like a late 90's/early 00's hip-hop video!

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    You have lost - wake up

    The Poster Child for the end times in the UK, Sadiq Khan, slams YouTube for showing what "his" citizens are up to in London. https://imgur.com/gallery/whSgX

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