back to article Drupal sci-fi sex scandal deepens: Now devs spank Dries over Gor bloke's banishment

Scores of Drupal developers have formed a protest against the exiling of a project veteran who dabbled in kinky sci-fi hanky-panky. An open letter and website called Drupalconfessions.org, signed by 85 devs, calls on Drupal lead Dries Buytaert to end the exclusion of people based on their sexual appetites. The letter comes …

  1. This post has been deleted by its author

    1. K Silver badge

      Re: The real surprising news:

      Lots of companies used it as a framework to build internal applications on, as it provides a lot of core features pre-baked into it (Authentication, plugins etc, database).

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

    Are defended on condemned depending only on political correctness.

    I would like to stay away from him just like I'd like to stay away from a racist or sexist. No difference, really.

    1. Geoffrey W Silver badge

      Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

      And I'd like to stay away from you, Mr Anonymous Coward. Tell me who thou art, so I can make my wish come true.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

        Don't worry, I'll stay away from people like you as far as I can.

        It's funny to see people believing everything related to sex is fine, even when it is a mix of sexism, racism, violence. But ready to blame everybody else who thinks sexism, racism and violence are disturbing, and our society has already enough of it.

        I understand too many people don't use their brain, but just an organ far below to drive their life. Sure, far easier... Grow up, and learn RESPECT. Others aren't meat for your pleasure only. I just pity those around you.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

      When you learn too much about anyone's sexual appetites, wanting to stay away from them is the most normal response. Doesn't matter if it's some software dev or your grandma.

      1. mrjohn

        Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

        thus the human race is doomed

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

      It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

      Are defended on condemned depending only on political correctness.

      Ah, but your problem is your definition of normality, which appears a tad on the narrow side.

      In my experience (and I've clocked up a few decades by now), people with a bit of eccentricity and personality tend to be far more interesting and engaging than people who seek mainstream or are too scared to drift off norm.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

        What is interesting is how normal this all would have seemed in the 90s if someone had been targetted for being gay the same way. Even the comment above wouldn't have done much more than attract a few eye-rolls.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

        Sure, slavery was normal. In some cultures, it's normal women are inferior. In the Western wold we blame that, but then we wont to assert it's "normal" whatever has to do with sexual exploitation of others. What is better to brain wash people than an obsession with sex?

        On one side we blame sexism and the "bro culture", in this case we're celebrating it... how do you believe this idiot would look at women around him? What will he do once in a position of power?

        Eccentricity has nothing to do with violence and sexual exploitation - it's the actual mainstream culture that put sex everywhere - just because it sells, it's easy money, and when you're in power you can easily exploit others. while people like you are exactly blaming those who dares to think differently...

        1. dan1980

          Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

          @AC

          You are conflating private sexual fantasies with active "sexual exploitation". In doing so, you are making two assumptions: first, that this person was actively engaging in practices as per the books, and second, that those practices amount to "sexual exploitation".

          Exploitation of other human beings is bad and so if this person was actively exploiting others sexually, then that is problematic. But what evidence do you have that that is what was going on?

          It seems to me that your views do not allow for someone to be in a submissive sexual role without them also being exploited. It's like the ridiculous Gail Dines who asserts that all porn - in and of itself - is violence against women. In her anti-porn world, she can't see how any woman could ever willingly be involved in pornography and enjoy it.

    4. Potemkine Silver badge

      Re: It's interesting that some higly disturbed people...

      He who hates vices hates mankind.

  3. DCFusor Silver badge
    FAIL

    Was the article author speaking of his own hands? I see no tiny hands in the picture.

    Oh, dragging in some other form of discrimination. Clever if you're a child, I suppose.

    1. Paul Crawford Silver badge

      I think he is referring to the orange one's misogynistic "pussy grabbing" tenancies.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        He's grabbing tenants now?

        Look, I don't like many orange things and Trump's no exception, but I've grabbed a few pussies in my time and it was always 100% consensual. Can we stop attacking people for having performed sex acts and start attacking him for bombing the stuff he warned us Hillary would bomb if he didn't win the presidency?

        1. Geoffrey W Silver badge

          Look, he wasn't talking about consensual sex acts with his "Pussy Grabbing" comment; he was talking about grabbing the genitals of random women he happened to meet, whether they wanted him to or not, because "you can do that when you're famous."

          It isn't something to ignore but something to add to all his other sins, such as warmongering, and criticise him for all of them. Which I do.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            No he wasn't.

            We all want him to have been talking about grabbing the genitals of random women, just like we all want David Cameron to have fucked the pig, but if you calm down and listen to the interview in question, that's not what's being said. Also David Cameron probably never fucked a pig.

            We don't need to add this to his other sins such as warmongering. Warmongering is plenty bad enough without diluting it with easily rebutted drivel. Stop taking the bait and weakening the case against Trump.

            1. Geoffrey W Silver badge
              Happy

              Well, possibly. Mea culpa if so.

              I would counter that comments about his orange-ness are likewise irrelevant in the face of his current activities abroad, but that would risk getting embroiled in pointless argument entirely beside the point, so I won't.

              :-)

  4. Chris Harden

    That is OUTRAGEOUSLY perverse! I can't believe it, there should be jail time for such disgusting behavior. Even thinking about that makes me feel physically sick.

    Unless you actually sent Buytaert an ICMP packet and are currently waiting for an Echo Reply you should not be using that rather horrific business word on a tech journal.

    (but seriously, that's sexual discrimination and I hope they get some kind of kicking for it)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      (but seriously, that's sexual discrimination and I hope they get some kind of kicking for it)

      Tell that to Teresa May. If memory serves me right, she is trying to make one way or another most BSDM material illegal under UK law.

      Personally - it does not turn me on. I however, could not care less if it does turn on someone else provided that nobody gets killed or maimed and it is in the privacy of their own homes. Sex, sexual orientation and sexual life should be (reasonably) private. Once again - I could not care less if you do it in public, but the majority of the population find it disturbing.

      At the end it is a question of: "Are you seriously disturbing other people's inner peace and invading their private space". If you are, that is wrong regardless of is it in a sexual or non-sexual context.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "Tell that to Teresa May."

        Actor Teresa May apparently has no such aims.

        However - UK PM Theresa May definitely does - even though she likes to wear leather trousers. Her religious convictions will exempt Church artworks' expressions of rapturous torture intended for the indoctrin education of children.

        Teresa May's IMDB profile - NSFW

        http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0562138/

      2. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

        "Tell that to Teresa May. If memory serves me right, she is trying to make one way or another most BSDM material illegal under UK law."

        I wonder if that includes the wearing of leather trousers?

  5. Stevie Silver badge

    Bah!

    Fake outrage over a thought crime.

    How last century.

    1. cray74

      Re: Bah!

      Fake outrage over a thought crime. How last century.

      Fake outrage never gets old, it just gets new targets.

  6. Walter Bishop Silver badge
    Facepalm

    A clear case of double standards ..

    Where were these when Brendan Eich was forced out of Mozilla over his support of Proposition 8?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: A clear case of double standards ..

      > Where were these when Brendan Eich was forced out of Mozilla over his support of Proposition 8?

      Why double standards? As far as I am aware, the developer in question chooses to engage in some sort of consensual role play of a sexual nature (please correct me if I am wrong). Everyone participating do so of their own free will and with the purpose of obtaining sexual gratification.

      On the other hand, Mr Eich had donated money to a cause that sought to discriminate against part of their society, putting those targeted at a real, observable disadvantage.

      Those two look like very different cases to me. I may not be comfortable with Mozilla interfering with Mr Eich's exercise of his political rights (which I deeply disagree with), but I really do not think it is the same thing at all as one case does not imply discrimination while the other does.

      1. Walter Bishop Silver badge

        Re: A clear case of double standards ..

        Regardless of the issues, the problem is who gets to decide it's a firing issue and the unaccountability of these self appointed guardians of political correctness.

  7. streaky Silver badge

    Equals.

    seemingly at odds with the whole "hey, let's treat women as equals" thing going on in technology right now

    "Lets treat them as equals as long as they don't enjoy something we don't like" is what you mean.

    Why do people put up with this nonsense? Be who you gotta be, if you like kinky shit go nuts, if you're asexual don't go nuts, and everybody in between do your thing - and lets stay out of each other's personal shit.

  8. Grade%
    Paris Hilton

    Oh Canadaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa We are number ONE!!!

    Pierre Elliot Trudeau's famous words of pith are equally applicable the rest of you scurvy lot: http://www.cbc.ca/archives/entry/omnibus-bill-theres-no-place-for-the-state-in-the-bedrooms-of-the-nation

    If it ain't hurtin' (less'n that be the bag ye be lookin' for and ye find the hurtee and hurter ye be like'n) 'n' they ain't flagrante in the public square...keep your nose out.

    As Archer would say, "How hard is that?"

    And if that got/gets you hard, then we'll find the shit that shuts you up. Totally joking. Not. Yes. No. No. *nod*

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Oh Canadaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa We are number ONE!!!

      Pierre Elliot Trudeau's famous words of pith are equally applicable the rest of you scurvy lot: http://www.cbc.ca/archives/entry/omnibus-bill-theres-no-place-for-the-state-in-the-bedrooms-of-the-nation

      That remarkable ability to disregard truth for the sake of a pithy phrase clearly runs in the family[*]. Canada was quite happy to intrude in the bedrooms of the nation when these words were said; it is still doing so now, many years later.

      https://www.mtlblog.com/lifestyle/sex-acts-that-are-banned-in-canada

      [*] kindly resist the urge to tar this messenger as a conservative shill. I do find liberals preferable to conservative on the whole, even though I choose to vote for neither party; with this said I would rather have Lester B Pearson than either P.E.T. or his pugilistic offspring.

  9. Vince Lewis 1

    What is it was tiny handed women...

    Dominating him? Would there have been such an witch hunt.

    Human nature is complex, with wants and urges that can seem odd.

    As long as he wasn't treating women as inferior outside his fetish then he should never have had such action against him.

  10. SolidSquid

    Sounds like an over-reaction from the Drupal guys if I'm honest. Unless that kind of thing was showing in his attitudes outside of occasional, fully consensual, events, I don't see how it has any impact on whether he's able to do his job or treat others fairly

  11. jason 7 Silver badge

    Another case of...

    ...kids being self appointed SJW types.

    "Anything I don't believe in or agree with is wrong and should be destroyed!"

    or

    "If you don't believe in or agree with me you are wrong and should be destroyed!"

    As mentioned on the failed US sitcom Joey.... Maybe we should go take a look in a few folders on their laptops?

  12. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

    I've been following this for a while now because I too became highly upset. The sheer display of hypocrisy really got under my skin a bit. Basically: I believe that the Drupal management is plain out lying through their teeth.

    They keep saying that Larry was not expelled because of his sexual preferences while also sharing that part of the information they based their decision on was obtained through "unethical ways", that Larry did not violate the Drupal code of conduct, and that they cannot disclose the full reason why Larry got expelled, not even to Larry himself. Yeah, sounds very trustworthy to me indeed.

    Next they also started a campaign (it's how I call it) to apply changes to the whole process. Basically making it so that the decision to expel someone is not solely made by Buytaert. Although an admirable effort it does come across as odd that this only happened after the whole incident started escalating. And the most important aspect is that this doesn't change anything to the current situation.

    All people asked for was transparency. If that would have been given, then I doubt this would have escalated as much as it has. Yet this is what you get when you're not being honest (or: if you send out that strong impression) while the community you're part of keeps asking for that one simple thing: be honest and transparent about it.

    Instead they got a fake apology. Buytaert apologized, not for the expelling but "for causing grief and uncertainty, especially to those in the BDSM and kink communities who felt targeted by the turmoil. This incident was about specific actions of a single member of our community. This was never meant to be about sexual practices or kinks, so it pains me that I unintentionally hurt you. I do support you and respect you as a key part of our community."

    Of course only after the escalation. Initially he stated: "I cannot in good faith support someone who actively promotes a philosophy that is contrary to this (= equality). The Gorean philosophy promoted by Larry is based on the principle that women are evolutionarily predisposed to serve men and that the natural order is for men to dominate and lead.".

    So what is it? And also interesting: what about all those (adult) women who knowingly and willingly participate in all this as well?

    Not to mention the fact that Larry didn't promote anything, something which becomes painfully obvious when you read the dozens of comments on those blog posts: many people, including women, had no idea at all. Even (male & female) developers who had closely worked with Larry. How do you rhyme that with "actively promoting"? It just doesn't add up!

    My take: they opened Pandora's box, got surprised by the massive backlash and are now doing everything in their power to apply damage control. While in the end not resolving anything at all, merely changing statements, changing opinions and throwing up a gigantic smokescreen.

    I've said this on several places as well: it's the kind of reaction you'd expect from a multi-billion IT company caught with their pants down. NOT from a so called honest, inviting and transparent open source community project.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

      it's the kind of reaction you'd expect from a multi-billion IT company caught with their pants down. NOT from a so called honest, inviting and transparent open source community project.

      Indeed, it strikes me as self flagellation. Oh, wait ..

      :)

    2. Geoffrey W Silver badge

      Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

      @ShelLuser

      What this is, IMHO, is an effect of the old Christian doctrine of sex being a sin which still bounces and echoes around the human psyche after all these years and refuses to relinquish its hold on our mores. This states that anything just a few percentage points off the bell curve centre is sinful and to be abhorred, and even the centre ground is wrong and to be kept to a minimum.

      It has become much less acceptable now to criticise someone for their sexuality, at least in public, so instead we apply a layer of something else which we still find objectionable, female inferiority and subservience in this case, and criticise for that instead; though at its heart it is still sexuality which is the main driver of our distastes. I fear it will take a long time for this distaste for sex to die, if it ever does. Human beings are a strange animal.

      1. John Brown (no body) Silver badge

        Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

        "the old Christian doctrine of sex being a sin"

        the old Judeaic doctrine of sex being a sin, eg Xtian, Muslim, Jew etc

        FTFY. May apply to non-Judeaic religions too, but I don't know as much about them

        1. Zoopy

          Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

          "What this is, IMHO, is an effect of the old Christian doctrine of sex being a sin"

          I can't think of any Christian doctrine which considers sex to be a sin. Can you explain that claim in a little more detail?

          1. Geoffrey W Silver badge

            Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

            Did I use the wrong words? Perhaps doctrine isn't the word to use? I'm no theology academic so forgive me. Christianity, and all the variations as the other commenter commented, seems to me to be littered with anti sex, from original sin onwards. No sex outside marriage. Sex for pro-creation only. Institutionalization of women who conceived outside marriage. Even nasty little boys playing with themselves needing to be restrained by devices that look more like torture implements. Is any of that a sign that sex is considered sin?

            1. Voland's right hand Silver badge

              Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

              Even nasty little boys playing with themselves needing to be restrained by devices

              That is inherited from Judaism. So is most of the other stuff.

            2. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

              Did I use the wrong words? Perhaps doctrine isn't the word to use? I'm no theology academic so forgive me. Christianity, and all the variations as the other commenter commented, seems to me to be littered with anti sex, from original sin onwards.

              Original sin wasn't about sex.

              No sex outside marriage.

              Yep, fair. This has downsides and upsides. The upsides are never mentioned.

              Sex for pro-creation only.

              This is a Catholic church thing - don't think it's intrinsic to Christianity at all.

              Institutionalization of women who conceived outside marriage. Even nasty little boys playing with themselves needing to be restrained by devices that look more like torture implements. Is any of that a sign that sex is considered sin?"

              Both definitely not intrinsic to Christianity.

              C.S. Lewis had a good take on it:

              “If anyone says that sex, in itself, is bad, Christianity contradicts him at once. But, of course, when people say, 'Sex is nothing to be ashamed of,' they may mean 'the state into which the sexual instinct has now got is nothing to be ashamed of'. If they mean that, I think they are wrong. I think it is everything to be ashamed of. There is nothing to be ashamed of in enjoying your food: there would be everything to be ashamed of if half the world made food the main interest of their lives and spent their time looking at pictures of food and dribbling and smacking their lips.”

              Of course, these days people do photograph their food and look at their friends' photos of food. And they watch lots of TV programmes about food. So I guess we're baser than we were when he wrote that :-)

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Buytaert opened pandora's box, and doesn't know how to close it...

        This isn't remotely unique to Christianity.Just about every religious and political doctrine on earth has some variety of condemnation for "immoral" sexual activities, because if you can make people feel guilty about their natural behaviours, you can deliver just about anything as a means to assuage that guilt

  13. Andrew 99

    saving your soul

    I understand the root of the sin of sex is the idea that sex destroys your soul. The next logical step for believers is to ban sex in any way possible, also including the non believers who don't buy into it.

  14. Winkypop Silver badge
    Angel

    Sin and sex

    Only one of these things actually exists.

    1. Jedit
      Devil

      Re: Sin and sex

      Speak for yourself, you God-benighted sinner.

  15. TrumpSlurp the Troll Silver badge
    Unhappy

    No sex outside marriage?

    I think this is more a society's formalization of a common feature of many higher animals; the attempt by a dominant male to prevent access to his female(s) to ensure the propagation of his genes.

    Often found in birds, I believe.

    Not as far as I know directly linked to a belief in god(s) but more linked to "organised religion" which majors on organisational power and tends to conveniently forget the basic tenets of the religion they are supposed to espouse.

    Most major religions seem to start out being about being nice to each other plus some very sensible advice about hygienic living. Then the organisation starts adding a few little rules just to "clarify" what the founder really meant.

    So please don't confuse religion and "organised religion".

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Not shocked

    This is "Code of Conducts" working as designed. They are written by the Rainbow Haired "Diversity" crowd, and then used as a club to beat anyone they don't like, and get them ejected out of the community.

    The result is all the actual people who do the work leaving, and you're left with the increasingly smaller pool of "approved" members, who all use the same club to beat each other out of the group.

    It just becomes one big purity spiral.

    We in Gamergate tried to warn you about this stuff, but you decided to listen to the Diversity crowd instead.

  17. This post has been deleted by its author

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