back to article IETF 'reviewing' US event plans in the face of Trump's travel ban

The United States' temporary ban on seven nations' citizens seeking to walk on it soil has wrung a rare almost-political statement out of the Internet Engineering Task Force. The standards-rough-consensus-reaching setting body for Internet communications, the IETF still relies, perhaps paradoxically, on face-to-face confabs to …

  1. Gray
    Boffin

    Only the second week

    given the toxic combination of an anti-intellectual and racist presidency

    Hang tight... this is only Trump's second week. There's lots & lots more 'toxic combinations' to come.

    1. Version 1.0 Silver badge

      Re: Only the second week

      And now Pence's puppy has just taken a piss on the Australian Prime Ministers leg during a conversation.

    2. Ian Michael Gumby Silver badge

      Re: Only the second week

      Wow.

      Take away the anti-Trump vitriol and look at the facts.

      In 2015, Obama identified 7 countries and halted their ability to be part of the visa waiver program. Why? Because these 7 countries represented a threat. Not a 90 day ban, but complete removal from the program.

      Of two of these countries, ISIS has the ability to create fake documents. This is a widely known and reported facts. One of these countries is known for state sponsorship of terrorism.

      Yet not a peep from anyone.

      It so happens that these are the same 7 countries where Trump enacted his 90 day ban.

      Why 90 days? The WH says its so that they can come up with a plan to enforce 'extreme vetting'.

      Makes sense right?

      In legal terms, the president has the ability to stop immigration from a country or countries if the immigration represents a national security threat.

      Jimmy Carter suspended Immigration from Iran until the US Hostages were released.

      Obama suspended immigration from Iraq for 6 months because two terrorists came thru the system.

      And now Trump bans immigration for 90 days so that he can get a plan put in to place to counter a threat?

      Take away all of the FUD. Consider the legal rights granted to the office of the President. Consider the news reports detailing the threat. And you call his actions "anti-intellectual and racist" ?

      Really?

      It seems to me, those protesting Trump are the ones acting in an emotional , anti-intellectual manner.

      Also, its not racist. The claim is that its anti-Muslim. Muslim is a religion, not a race.

      1. David Nash Silver badge

        Re: Only the second week

        Removal from the Visa Waiver is not the same as banning people who have valid Visas.

        By the way, you are right, Muslim is not a race, but it's a pretty effective proxy for one especially in the context of people from certain countries being banned.

      2. HausWolf

        Re: Only the second week

        Carter suspended immigration from Iran due to the hostage crisis...

        Obama did not suspend immigration for six months, he increased the scrutiny and requirements for visas and that was due to a known threat.

        You may have your alternate truths, but you do not get alternate facts.

      3. Aristotles slow and dimwitted horse Silver badge

        Re: Only the second week

        Muslim is not a religion. Islam is a religion. A muslim (generically speaking) is a follower of any branch of the Islamic religion in that same way that a Jew is a follower of any branch of the religion Judaism. So yes, broadly speaking it is rascist, or at the very least highly discriminatory because in its intention it is targetted directly against one particular set of ideological beliefs as well as specific geographical ethnicity. Even more so, this dragnet will also entangle people of other religions from those same countries named.

      4. nsld

        Re: Only the second week @Gumby

        Ending of a visa waiver just means you need a visa.

        Even countries within the visa waiver programme still have visa requirements.

        So your comparison is nothing of the sort, you need to remember your audience here is clearly better educated than the shitkickers you drink with.

        As for his plan to "counter the threat" its just going to be the same extreme vetting which already takes place for many people trying to get a US visa of any sort.

  2. This post has been deleted by a moderator

    1. veti Silver badge

      Re: Hey Chirgwin...

      That's right BJ, keep it classy.

      Note that Vaseline is made by Unilever, a non-American company, so you might want to research alternative products to suggest.

      1. P. Lee Silver badge

        Re: Hey Chirgwin...

        While "classily" framed, the policy is decidedly nationalistic rather than racist. Note the TPP is also out the window (though good riddance to that) which hits the Australians.

        The policy plays to irrational fears - fears that both Republican and Democrat presidents, parties and media of the recent past have delighted in stoking in their quest for an ever more intrusive grip (or advertising ratings) on the populace.

        Congratulations on your creation, this is US mainstream politics taken to its logical conclusion.

        1. Adam 1 Silver badge

          Re: Hey Chirgwin...

          > Note the TPP is also out the window (though good riddance to that) which hits the Australians.

          Hits? I am yet to meet an Australian who admits to supporting the TPP. We don't want your gene patents or lawsuits against plain packaged cigarettes or Methuselah aged copyright so we can get a 4 week GDP improvement over 20 years.

          A true free trade agreement would be about a paragraph long. The TPP is just about pandering to this or that interest.

          So for his many flaws, he got that one right. Even stopped clocks show the right time twice a day.

          1. Updraft102 Silver badge

            Re: Hey Chirgwin...

            He's gotten a lot of things right, but the media thinks it's a lot more fun to make things up and call it news.

            1. Rich 11 Silver badge

              Re: Hey Chirgwin...

              but the media thinks it's a lot more fun to make things up and call it news.

              Oh no, it's a conspiracy!

              1. Diginerd

                Re: Hey Chirgwin...

                Paraphrasing - "Seldom reason to suspect a conspiracy if incompetence will produce the same result".

                Blocking entry out of fear of a forged passport is one thing - blocking lawful permanent residents from returning home to the USA calls into question how good the (already very stringent) green card process is. Purely a Fed problem (if it exists).

            2. Hollerithevo Silver badge

              Re: Hey Chirgwin...

              So far nothing seems to be made up, as we get it straight from the POTUS himself.

              1. nijam

                Re: Hey Chirgwin...

                > So far nothing seems to be made up, as we get it straight from the POTUS himself.

                And that's the nub - the POTUS himself is a complete fabrication, a "fake president", if you will, representing the views of people who believe fake news.

        2. Mycho Silver badge

          Re: Hey Chirgwin...

          While "classily" framed, the policy is decidedly nationalistic rather than racist.

          Yeah, but people like nationalists these days.

        3. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Hey Chirgwin...

          @P.Lee

          A grown up! I must lay down.

    2. Gray
      Facepalm

      Re: Hey Chirgwin...

      you might need vaseline.

      Only for the ignorant; informed folks prefer KY.

      No thoughtful person would ever suggest Vaseline petroleum jelly. And no, petroleum jelly isn't suited for purpose either.

      Idiot!

      1. Voland's right hand Silver badge
        Paris Hilton

        Re: Hey Chirgwin...

        Only for the ignorant; informed folks prefer KY.

        Which is still made by a non-US company - Reckitt Benckiser

        1. kmac499

          Re: Hey Chirgwin...

          I'm told that the oil extracted from Scotch Bonnet chillies is quite err relaxing.

          The image of selected people trying to stick their arse in a freezer whilst applying a yoghurt enema is strangely pleasing somehow.

    3. jake Silver badge
      Pint

      Re: Hey Chirgwin...

      Looks like Big John is starting to crack, now that he is starting to realize that his big, fat, orange love interest is a really, really awful human being.

      I think that calls for beer all around! :-)

    4. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: Hey Chirgwin...

      How's the first week of your beloved Trump presidency working out for you, Big John? Better than you expected or is it dawning on you yet that he's just a useful idiot with neo-fascist Bannon behind the scenes pulling the strings yet?

  3. Denarius Silver badge

    an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

    why would one expect anything else from management of an oligopolistic empire ? Just that new boss not as subtle as old boss in selling out citizens to the corporates. Aside from the new rulez not being racist, merely discriminatory. Now lets see how how Oz PM handles his "your fired" moment.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

      The thing is he's so dull witted that the only thing he could think to do with his father's money is set up a property empire and go bankrupt several times. If I had that amount of money to start with I could lose it in so many more interesting ways.

      1. Baldy50

        Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

        'If I had that amount of money to start with I could lose it in so many more interesting ways.'

        Oh! yeah, I could do that too.

        http://www.lifezette.com/polizette/5-ways-intellectual-property-trade-policy-can-promote-american-jobs/

    2. Ian Michael Gumby Silver badge
      Boffin

      Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

      Trump has thin skin and the Aussie Prez reminded him of an obligation made by Obama to take 1,250 detainees who are from these 7 countries.

      Think about this ...

      The Aussies blocked the same set of immigrants who are trapped on a bunch of islands off the coast of Australia because they (Australia) recognized the threat posed by immigrants from these countries.

      I don't see the world up in arms over it.

      Trump bans access from these countries for 90 days so that they could formulate a plan... the world goes ballistic.

      The irony seems to be lost.

      And the call went poorly because Aussie Prez told Trump he had to honor the agreement.

      1. Loyal Commenter Silver badge

        Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

        The Aussies blocked the same set of immigrants who are trapped on a bunch of islands off the coast of Australia because they (Australia) recognized the threat posed by immigrants from these countries.

        I don't see the world up in arms over it.

        Maybe you just weren't paying attention to all the people saying Australia's immigration policy is racist and discriminatory?

      2. Tom 38 Silver badge

        Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

        The Aussies blocked the same set of immigrants who are trapped on a bunch of islands off the coast of Australia because they (Australia) recognized the threat posed by immigrants from these countries.

        Do you ever say anything that is factual? Australia does not accept any refugees who arrive by boat. It has nothing to do with what country they originate from, and lots of the world disagrees with the policy.

        And the call went poorly because Aussie Prez told Trump he had to honor the agreement.

        The concept of "honour" must be quite alien to him... do you think he should not abide by the treaty because he doesn't like it? If Russia rolls tanks in to Latvia, can Trump decide he doesn't like NATO any more either? If Trump decides he doesn't want to keep giving money to China, do you think it OK for him to cancel their T-bills?

      3. missingegg

        Re: an anti-intellectual and racist presidency?

        @Ian Michael Gumby

        You don't seem to be doing too well with the facts in your comments on this story. First, Australia is receiving refugees from more countries than just the ones banned by Trump. Sri Lanka, for example. Second, Australia isn't refusing these refugees because they're dangerous. They take thousands of refugees every year, including from the 7 countries, just not ones who arrive by boat. The Australian government feels that accepting boat refugees will encourage criminal gangs of human smugglers. Those same people would have been able to apply as refugees if they'd been able to arrive by air.

  4. inmypjs Silver badge

    "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

    So not quite as many as got murdered and wounded by a Muslim terrorist loon in Orlando. That's just one night club.

    "The brains of the future are also caught up in the insanity."

    So I look and find CUNY bragging

    "Every year, hundreds of thousands of students – including a record 274,000 degree-credit students – choose The City University of New York!"

    So about one in 2740 brains who are not actually affected unless they want to cross US borders in the next 9 months anyway. How is America going to survive with a 9 month gap in the supply of brains from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen?

    Strong the bullshit in this one is.

    1. Oh Homer
      Mushroom

      Re: "not quite as many as got murdered and wounded by a Muslim terrorist"

      You're more likely to die in the bath than by an act of terrorism, so why hasn't your Nazi leader banned baths?

      As William Pitt the Younger once noted; "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves."

      For those following the score, your fascist regime's hegemonic ambitions are responsible for the genocide of 3.3 million innocent Iraqi civilians, prompted by an attack on some suspiciously overinsured buildings filled with asbestos, that may or may not have been conducted by an Afghan and former CIA operative, not an Iraqi.

      But that's OK though, because Iraq had oil "WMDs". Honest.

      Yes, there are many terrorists in America, mostly in Washington.

    2. Terrance Brennan

      Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

      "You're missing the point, which sure does not need making."

      Seriously, are you as stupid as pumpkin puss? Or, simply as racist and insane as the clueless clown?

      There has never been a terrorist from any of those countries in America. The countries that have sent us terrorists were not on the list, amazingly enough, they are also countries where the twittering twerp has business interests. This is nothing more than a show piece to placate the racists who voted for the bumbling buffoon and has nothing to do with keeping America safe. Refugees already go through a 2-3 year process that includes more than 20 steps, interviews with counter-terrorism experts from multiple agencies, and more biometric checks than you have IQ points.

      All you Iraqis and Afghans who risked your lives helping us will just have to fend for yourselves. Good luck finding the next batch of suckers to help us. And, ISIS is already using this as propaganda to prove there is a war between the west and Islam, and not just a war against a bunch of crazy murderers.

      All thanks to the little man with little hands.

      1. Updraft102 Silver badge

        Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

        Actually, the countries chosen are Obama's list of countries that are the most dangerous to the US.

        Also, if we fight wars with the aim of not offending the enemy because it might make them even madder, it does kind of limit the options a bit, ya?

        1. Hollerithevo Silver badge

          Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

          Yes, Trump has business interests in countries already deemed to be friends of the USA. Saudi Arabia was too valuable an ally to be ostrasized for supplying (from memory) 11 of the 9/11 hijackers. He wouldn't have gone into, say, Yemen. But odd how the USA can stay friendly with countries despite their actual proven involvement in terrorism on American soil. Some things, i.e. strategic resources, are more important.

      2. Ian Michael Gumby Silver badge
        Boffin

        @Terrance ...Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

        "Seriously, are you as stupid as pumpkin puss? Or, simply as racist and insane as the clueless clown?

        There has never been a terrorist from any of those countries in America. "

        That would be A No Talent Ass Clown or a reference to Michael Bolton.

        But I digress.

        I suggest you actually do some research before going off on someone.

        2015 Obama identified these 7 countries as a threat and removed them from the visa waiver program.

        So Trump halts immigration for 90 days so that the US can plan and implement 'extreme vetting'? This per the WH.

        Seems reasonable to me. And also its able to withstand any legal challenge.

        Where Trump fscked up is in implementation and messaging.

        So I'd say lighten up Francis.

    3. GingerOne

      Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

      Oh the level of stupid hurts so much. This has nothing to do with keeping terrorists out of the US, if it did then the countries that actual terrorists come from would be on the list (like Saudi Arabia).

      All this is for is placate the dumbass racists like Big John and you, inmypjs.

      1. Ian Michael Gumby Silver badge
        Boffin

        @ Ginger ... Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

        So it must be true then.

        Gingers have some recessive and defective gene traits.

        So your logic is that because a terrorist who attacked the US came from Country A, that there is no threat that a terrorist from Country B can't also attempt to attack the US?

        Parroting the fallacy doesn't make it true.

        The truth is that one country on the banned list (90 day ban) is known for state sponsored terrorism. (Iran)

        Two countries on the list have ISIS (the terrorist baddies) in the countries and have had known access to government papers and can make fake documents. (Libya and Syria)

        And of course I have to ask... of the terrorist attacks in Europe, what were the terrorists backgrounds?

        I mean their countries of origin? Seems they too didn't come from the countries that attacked the US either. Were they not a threat either?

        1. goodjudge

          Re: @ Ginger ... "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

          "The truth is that one country on the banned list (90 day ban) is known for state sponsored terrorism. (Iran)"

          Israel is known for state-sponsored terrorism - invading all its neighbours, occupying bits of at least 2 of them for decades, carrying out various, documented, security service kidnappings and assassinations in foreign countries. Saudi money has built hundreds if not thousands of wahahbist-based schools and colleges in many developing (and developed) countries. Both of those are a far bigger threat to regional and global stability than Iran could ever be.

        2. Terrance Brennan

          Re: @ Ginger ... "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

          Unlike Europe where refugees and a small number of, but highly dangerous, terrorists simply walked into the countries refugees entering here have to go through a lengthy vetting process already. The implementation was as stupid as the stated reasons for the order. This order will not improve security in the US at all; it was to placate the xenophobes he whipped up during the campaign without hurting his own business interests. No consultation with Custom and Border Patrol (CBP), the State Department, or Congress before issuing the order. The CBP being ordered not to talk to members of Congress who asked questions and ignoring federal court orders. Conflicting information about whether it applied to green card holders who have their rights through law, not executive order and the usual lying when the shit hit the fan. The chaos at the airports was due to Delta's IT problems? Really? This is the Narcissistic Ninny at his best.

    4. HausWolf

      Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

      The ban would not have stopped Orlando as he was a citizen.

    5. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

      "So not quite as many as got murdered and wounded by a Muslim terrorist loon in Orlando. That's just one night club."

      It's nowhere near the number killed and injured by NI terrorism over the years. That was supported by many US citizens. Maybe we should ban all US citizens from travel to the UK or Ireland. It's the same "logic".

    6. JMcL

      Re: "City University New York has more than 100 affected. That's just one university."

      @inmypjs

      "So not quite as many as got murdered and wounded by a Muslim terrorist loon in Orlando. That's just one night club."

      Or not as many killed in the Oklahoma City bombing by a Mus.... oh wait.... a New York born, Irish American, Gulf war veteran loon.

  5. cageordie

    Even the Rethuglicans don't argue with the main point

    President Bannon. Yup, with his attack dog Trump fronting for him.

    1. jake Silver badge

      Re: Even the Rethuglicans don't argue with the main point

      I think you mispleled "foaming for him". HTH

  6. bombastic bob Silver badge
    Facepalm

    *facepalm*

    I struggled to find any coherence in this article, or the comments thereafter. One which had 10 downvotes and no upvotes got an upvote from me. Other than that... W.T.F. ???

    <facepalm>

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: *facepalm*

      Its just classical social information theory style 'virtue signalling'.

      Jump in to express disgust at what you think will make you look moral in the eyes of the peer group,thus absolving you from actually having to do anything about it.

      In days of yore, they went to church and bought indulgences for similar reasons.

      1. Rich 11 Silver badge

        Re: *facepalm*

        Its just classical social information theory style 'virtue signalling'.

        Curiously enough, exactly the same argument can be applied to people jumping in to express support for something. It's almost like it's a near-useless concept when applied to many unknown people rather than to an individual whose character is well-known.

      2. DavCrav Silver badge

        Re: *facepalm*

        "Its just classical social information theory style 'virtue signalling'.

        Jump in to express disgust at what you think will make you look moral in the eyes of the peer group,thus absolving you from actually having to do anything about it.

        In days of yore, they went to church and bought indulgences for similar reasons."

        Cool theory bro. Unfortunately downvotes are not recorded with names attached, so this isn't really virtue signalling so much as a signal of your lack of virtue.

      3. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: *facepalm*

        "Jump in to express disgust at what you think will make you look moral in the eyes of the peer group"

        There's a little flaw in that. Votes are anonymous - rather like your post - so they're not effective in making the voter look moral in the eyes of the peer group; the eyes can't see them. Please engage the brain before setting the keyboard in motion.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

    ..you can't beat radical Islam. You even get anti-semitism thrown in.

    What's not to like?

    1. Edwin

      Re: For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

      Ah yes, the "but he did it too" argument so beloved of five-year-olds and those with no leg to stand on.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: For real sexism, anti intellectualism and racism...

        No. The post does not exonerate Trump, it exposes the hypocrisy if those who would castigate him, but not a radical organisation that has killed millions and made the world a far more miserable and dangerous place.

        Take the beam out of thine own eye, brother...

        1. hplasm Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: For real sexism, anti intellectualism and racism...

          "... it exposes the hypocrisy if those who ..."

          Not me, pal- I dislike everyone. I'm not biased.

        2. Rich 11 Silver badge

          Re: For real sexism, anti intellectualism and racism...

          it exposes the hypocrisy if those who would castigate him, but not a radical organisation that has killed millions

          What makes you think no-one here is against radical Islamism too? Are people obliged to append a statement to that effect with every comment?

        3. Tom 38 Silver badge

          Re: For real sexism, anti intellectualism and racism...

          The post does not exonerate Trump, it exposes the hypocrisy if those who would castigate him, but not a radical organisation that has killed millions and made the world a far more miserable and dangerous place.

          No, you are wrong, I can castigate Trump and the US both at the same time, no problem.

    2. LDS Silver badge

      Re: For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

      Exactly. There is very little difference between radical Islam and far-right ideology.

      Far left may be only a little less sexist (on paper) - but everything else is still the same.

      I wish I could get rid of all of them... not being forced to choose one.

    3. Hollerithevo Silver badge

      Re: For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

      I'm happy to despise every form of extremism that justifies hatred and oppression. Thus most extreme religions as well as politics. Any creed or philosophy that supports the dehumanising of groups of humans is one I'm happy to condemn.

    4. Mike Moyle Silver badge

      Re: For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

      "For real sexsim, anti intellectualism and racism...

      ..you can't beat radical Islam. You even get anti-semitism thrown in."

      Well, to be fair, you get all of those with Dominionist (radical) Christianity. They cover all of that and THEY'VE had almost 700 years LONGER than Islam has had to get over themselves.

  8. PTW
    Mushroom

    Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

    Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Pakistan, Syria and Yemen all banned from obtaining visas for entry to Kuwait and have been since 2011 IIRC so fellow muslims see them as a problem, but... Trump! Waaaah!

    Maybe doesn't fit the leftist narrative? Never mind, on with your shouts of "love trumps hate" and "tolerance for all" as you burn Berkeley to the ground

    What was the quote about the new fascists arriving calling themselves anti-fascists...?

    1. DavCrav Silver badge

      Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

      "Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Pakistan, Syria and Yemen all banned from obtaining visas for entry to Kuwait and have been since 2011 IIRC so fellow muslims see them as a problem, but... Trump! Waaaah!"

      I don't know the answer to this, but did they revoke the visas of people who already got them, or just stopped issuing any more? The former is the cause of the chaos here, not the latter.

    2. LDS Silver badge

      Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

      So you believe it's OK USA became like Kuwait (a country defined *semi-democratic*)? So the new model for US is an Arabic, islamic state? Oh well, Trump would like to become an Emir...

      Guess they also ban - like many Arab states - any Israeli citizen, or any foreigner who has been in Israel. Is that OK too? And Pakistan is an obvious source of terrorists, and where Bin Laden was hidden... why the exception?

      What about Bangladesh, where many people were killed in a terrorist attack not so long ago? The Boston marathon bombers were Chechens from Kyrgyzstan... why not block Russia and many *stan countries too?

      Was it an Obama list? Wasn't everything made by Obama a mistake to clear?

      Trump orders are just plain propaganda. To lull its supporters, while trying to obtain the wrong reaction from the opposition, and get a reason to silence it. Something already seen... and never ended well.

    3. Voland's right hand Silver badge

      Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

      Wait a second.

      Did you just put a petrol-driven cleptocracy which is still discussing if women should have full rights or not (they are slightly ahead of Saudi but not by much) as our shining beacon in the night?

      Are we supposed to raise our heads and say, woah, this is our ideal of Democracy, Kuwait!!!

      That is probably the strawman argument of the century by all accounts. What's next? Copy our LGBLT rights legislation from African cleptocracies and put Brasil as our shining beacon of anticorruption drive?

      Where is the icon for bleaurghh... (that is one thing which skype got right - it has one).

    4. Patrician

      Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

      ..."Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Pakistan, Syria and Yemen all banned from obtaining visas for entry to Kuwait and have been since 2011 IIRC so fellow muslims see them as a problem, but... Trump! Waaaah!..."

      Country "A" does it so it's okay for the USA to do the same? Really? You want to go down that route? Surely it's up to the more socially and politically enlightened countries of this planet to lead the way in human rights and freedoms etc?

    5. John Sanders
      Facepalm

      Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

      >>> Maybe doesn't fit the leftist narrative?

      Yes, that is what it is, the left has deemed Mr Trump to be a Nazi, and you shall not question the left.

      The modern left is just virtue signalling and SJW, they are willing to suicide you so they can keep signalling.

      Arguments or reason are of course out of question.

      1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

        Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

        "The modern left is just virtue signalling"

        This term "virtue signalling". Those who signal virtue must have virtue to signal. So when you use it as a derogatory term is it a signal that your PoV lacks virtue?

        1. inmypjs Silver badge

          Re: Where's the outrage at "racist" Kuwait?

          "Those who signal virtue must have virtue to signal"

          Yes but only in their head.

  9. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    It looks as if the likely result is going to be the gradual movement of any form of intellectual endeavour out of the US.

  10. Will Godfrey Silver badge
    Facepalm

    So the stories were in fact predictions

    You know, all those 1950s SciFi ones where the USA is isolated from the rest of the world/universe.

  11. Pen-y-gors Silver badge

    Evidence based policy?

    I think the real problem with the Trump approach is that it's not based on evidence. That's a common failing with a lot of politicians, but Trump has taken it to a new level. In theory the ban is based on 'risk', but totally ignores where terrorists who have attacked in the US have actually come from. There's an interesting article in Atlantic (https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/01/trump-immigration-ban-terrorism/514361/) that looks at attacks over the last 40 years. 3 were committed by UK born people - shouldn't the UK be on his list? And 190 by US citizens - should he ban US citizens from the US? And let's face it, the biggest threat to the lives of US residents is other gun-totin', car-drivin' US residents. Road fatalities in 2015: 35,000 (that's 20 x the UK, which has 1/5 of the population), and shooting fatalities: 13,000 (excluding suicides). Compare that with civilian deaths in Iraq: 16,000 - the biggest threat to the US is the US itself. The US is at war with the US.

    Twitter-inspired policies that tickle the surface look good, but won't save many lives.

    1. Mycho Silver badge

      Dude...

      It's not his list.

      He knew people would take issue with the choices of countries, so he went with a set that Obama approved in 2015. Like everything else he makes a statement that sounds objectionable but that is readily defensible and lets his critics take the bait.

      And having just insulted Trump and anti-Trumpers, let the downvotes commence.

      Remember, nobody likes it when a Trump follows through.

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