back to article Australian Greens don't believe Silicon Valley can save the world

If there's one thing that Australia's two main political parties agree on, it's that replicating Silicon Valley on local shores is a Very Good Thing. The governing Liberal/National coalition and opposition Labor party are both advocating more spending on Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics (STEM) teaching and back …

  1. Oengus Silver badge

    Just like all politicians

    "he's out of touch with mainstream Australia" which is exactly he fits in so well in Canberra.

    1. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

      Re: Just like all politicians

      Why is that?

  2. Strumadrum
    Mushroom

    The Greens.....

    ....are idiots!

  3. Tchou
    Pirate

    "a new generation of coding-capable kids will come up with lots of great ideas"

    "a new generation of coding-capable kids will come up with lots of great ideas"

    >> IT-learning kids are less and less capable, not more. Yes they can start to code earlier than most of us could. But 'coding' doesn't mean anything. These days they barely know how to 'talk' properly to a PC, academic education favor the scripting languages, .Net, Java, Python. Yes they are easier to teach, end pretty much guarantee the education big sponsors (Microsoft, Oracle,..) a mass of pretty much ignorant future clients.

    Some innovation can happen, but only in the form of 'business' innovation (Uber, Facebbok, ..) for the tech side they will be forever bound to the big solution providers, incapable of understanding that all the work done by these tools (no memory management, absurdly complex mandatory OO designs and architectures, design patterns,...) is precisely what guarantee said sponsors the new cool kids will NEVER come up with competing solutions that work better, faster, are more reliable, easier to use and less buggy.

    I know what you think. It would be impossible to compete with, say, a big MS product because of the 100's engineers they throw at every project and the 10's of millions budget they can get.

    Well you've been well 'educated', pretty much like the Australian politician.

    1. GrumpyOldBloke

      Re: "a new generation of coding-capable kids will come up with lots of great ideas"

      Rob Ashton in his blog 'you have ruined javascript' makes a similar point about business innovation plus its an entertaining read. We are still in an era of big government and big business. Innovation outside this paradigm is inconceivable to a mainstream politician. Where would the donations come from?

      1. Dan 55 Silver badge
        Meh

        Re: "a new generation of coding-capable kids will come up with lots of great ideas"

        If we're being honest JavaScript started life as a ruin, then it got worse over time.

  4. psyvenrix
    Flame

    Equal hatred

    I like the idea of more of a focus on STEM and yet do not regard silicon valley as it currently exists as something worth bringing over here.

    Likewise, I dislike the policies of the Green party but agree that blockchain wont solve hunger problems. Putting robots in 1000 KM square fields to autonomously harvest food *might*.

    At the end of the day, I want a job, I want a salary and I dont mind hauling my surplus labour to my employers work place each day. Apparently this makes me an evil capitalist. I'll cry my self to sleep in my warm bed over the fact some dirty unwashed AGEING hippies hate me for being born white.

    *edit* %:s/found/food/g

    1. GrumpyOldBloke

      Re: Equal hatred

      It only makes you a semi evil capitalist. With debt based fiat money there is no way society can get ahead and your efforts while appreciated don't amount to a hill of beans in the grand scheme of things. Your value to society is as one who borrows and one who consumes others borrowings hence our tax and legal structures which penalise life and labour but reward debt and speculation. This was all decided with the advent of mass production. We could have gone with more leisure or more consumption - sadly it was just a jump to the right.

      As productivity increased the positives were not shared equally across society. This means that there are too many people spending way too much time hauling their surplus labour to a place of employment and there is no time for interests and innovation. After a 12 hour day of labour and tediously slow transport who has time to bang together another HP in the garage. I am also not sure how you foster innovation in a nanny state but that is something even the Greens haven't resolved. Personally I would prefer less hauling of my surplus labour and more leisure time. This would afford me less salary but I would use less infrastructure and fewer resources. I would have less health issues and be happier. The hippies didn't get it all wrong.

  5. Flat Phillip

    Not exactly sure

    But something about the article makes me think the author is taking the piss at our new-fangled STEM will save the world, or at least Australia, idea our pollies currently have.

  6. GrumpyKiwi

    Hmmm, Australian Greens don't believe Silicon Valley has anything to offer.

    But do believe in homeopathy, crystal therapy, organic farming based around moon phases and various other loads of pseudo science.

    Thanks, I'll take Silicon Valley (imperfect though it may be) over your return to the dark ages.

    1. Mark Exclamation

      "The Greens

      ...are idiots".

      Just needed to be repeated!

    2. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

      Homeopathy and crystals? Which Greens are you thinking of?

      1. GrumpyKiwi

        To be fair, I am thinking of the ones in my country that offered as a serious option homeopathy as a solution for the opossum infestation we have.

        Who signed the "Ban Dihydrate Monoxide" petition before backpedalling and claiming they did it ironically.

        Who have Members of Parliament that are anti-vaccination.

        And who put forth that crystal therapy should be offered as a tax-payer paid for therapy for people with mental illness....

        Those Greens. Australian may get a better quality of Green - but I doubt it.

        1. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

          Like all political parties, they're a mixed bunch.

          Which is why I think it's a bit ridiculous to claim they (or any group) are all idiots or all peddlers of woo. As if there's a major political party in existence that doesn't have its own coterie of cranks and wackos.

        2. kiwimuso
          Joke

          @ GrumpyKiwi

          "crystal therapy"

          I hadn't heard about that.

          Maybe the crystal to which they refer is actually crystal meth, which seems to also be quite popular around these parts.

          Not sure about which icon to use, so I'll resort to this ------------------->

    3. julian.smith

      "But do believe in homeopathy, crystal therapy, organic farming based around moon phases and various other loads of pseudo science."

      Citation required or you are a lying dickhead

      The Greens are on record as supporting evidence based public policy

      1. Paul 129
        Stop

        RE: julian.smith Read the post and do a google search.

        I believe they are referring to New Zealand Greens.

        Unfortunately in Australia most vote for the Australian Greens as you would vote for a centralist party.

        Our Greens are not. They tend to be more left wing than the ALP. The Australian Democrats (wish they were still around) used to play the centralist role, and 'Keep the bastards honest' The greens don't.

        Its either their way, or you can go away!

        This has lead to the awful situation that we have suffered for the last 9 years. Parliaments unable to properly govern, and oppositions playing silly buggers. Due to lack of control of the senate.

        Gonsky and Public health funding were NOT ALP programs for the future benefit of Australians. They were scorched earth political games, so in opposition they could howl cuts, when the Libs actually funded at or above trend increases, to make up for the fact that they initially were ALP funding cuts!

        The Libs, may deceive, and lie by omission. Labour doesn't bother, they go the 'BIG LIE' route. They make it more plausible by all reciting the same line, over and over and over. Yes they promise the moon, they have changed they're not the same team that they were,.... um look through their ranks... they are!

        Labour has in opposition, opposed everything that involves budgetary restraint, suggested about 2 impossible savings options, and voted for any program that involves a higher spend. This is so they can take aim at the coalitions economic "mismanagement".

        So vote for these economic vandals. People who will happily sell the national interest down the drain for decades, to attain power. People who screw everyday employees, cause they're going to be screwed anyway, and they can get cash in their slush fund ( enterprise agreements, LOL read the [redacted] ones, legally allowed to pay below minimum wages, thanks Labour!)

        The Parliamentarians with integrity tends to be portrayed as mad arsed independents.

        Greens are better you say? A vote for a green is not a vote for Labour? Actually listen to Parliament. Make an informed decision.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: RE: julian.smith Read the post and do a google search.

          Is it you, Andrew Bolt?

          1. Paul 129

            Re: RE: julian.smith Read the post and do a google search.

            Lol:

            No a small business owner, who dispairs at what happens in Australian politics. Really it's worth listening to. This year the posts in the Internet are getting really feral. I simply got my hackles up at the personal attack above.

            From listening over the years, the system is broken. Labour most of all, then the libs and greens to about the same amount. It's looking more and more like the only solution is for us ( real people , not political players since university ) to get more involved.

            Labour unfortunately has the additional issue of it's Caucusing system. If they took the recommendations of that Royal commission to heart and reformed, they would get my vote.

            This election I expect the Libs to get punished, cause we all see real issues that need to be fixed.

            Trouble is that could leave us with again an unworkable parliament. If Labour gets in, well, with this current lot.....

            It won't be pretty for small businesses. Of course some will be more equal than others.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: RE: julian.smith Read the post and do a google search.

              It would be churlish of me to draw attention to the fact that you can't even spell the name of the party you're ranting about, so I won't.

              I like how you label the party that dragged us through the GFC relatively unscathed "economic vandals". What do you have to say about the party that has doubled the deficit since then?

              In other news, white is black and we've always been at war with Eastasia.

        2. DeKrow
          Facepalm

          Re: RE: julian.smith Read the post and do a google search.

          Jesus, talk about Scorched Earth. julian.smith merely asks for citations for seemingly outrageous claims and you start a politically biased rant.

          Admittedly, julian.smith didn't also provide citations for his claim of "evidence based" policy from the Australian Greens, but you seem to have missed that entirely in favour of said rant.

      2. drygreen

        drygreen

        Greens policy is developed by all members, based around the 4 core principles of grassroots democracy, social justice, ecological wisdom and non-violent action. We have members from all parts of the political spectrum discontented with the political process and wanting to make a positive personal contribution rather than just whinge. The national policies are here: http://greens.org.au/policy-platform

  7. Mark 65

    Here at El Reg we think his remarks about technology are far more dangerous, because as we all know Big Data and the Blockchain will revolutionise everything, more or less instantly, so that the Internet of Soil becomes a reality and deals with that depletion problem.

    Everyone knows the soil needs electrolytes, stupid.

    1. LaeMing Silver badge
      Go

      Yes!

      It's got what plants need.

  8. robbiejena

    Silicon valley

    We Green people know that...at least not yet...

  9. Urh

    Annoyingly....

    ....I kind of agree with him, but that is most likely a coincidence (I like to call The Greens the watermelon party - green on the outside, red on the inside). I have been rather disappointed in silicon valley in recent years - they seem to be more interested in finding new ways of slurping and selling people's personal information.

  10. lockeptrv

    Parents know best...or else!

    The best advocate for kids is (are) their parents. Then the larger family, the village, then the Nanny state. The best of the past that will continue is that kids with ability will probably get along in the World. Hopefully, the best will excel. Ability will find mentors, disability will find champions. Woe to the mediocre middle.

  11. Semaphore

    Defence Strategic Goods Listing of Cryptology.

    1. The Greens voted NO to criminalizing cryptology.

    2. D.S.G.L. was imposed by the 'Wassener Arrangement', supposedly due to concerns over cryptologies use in weapons of mass destruction but it actually appears to have been imposed due to bitcoin's adoption, and U.S. influence.

    3. I now have a permit to leave the country with my computers and my cryptology, which is now under Defence Export Control.

  12. Arthur 1

    So....

    Yes to 'overthrow of capitalism', a violent coup that would require taking all worldly possessions (and likely lives) of hundreds of thousands on the low end let's not forget.

    No to 'technology can solve problems', where he lists two problems, including one problem (water scarcity) that a Silicon Valley has already made history in Israel and another (agriculture) which is a favourite field of biotech and making huge progress. I guess looking at facts in cold, hard reality land would disqualify you from running a class warfare party, so no surprise he has chosen ignorance.

  13. rtb61

    Every single economic zone rabbits off about the same shite, lets all go high tech, no problems, labourers can be computer programmers, factory workers can become computer programmers, tradespeople can become computer programmers, all a straight up lie.

    The chances of a sub 120IQ becoming a good computer programmers is pretty much zero, so why the rant, simple politically marketing, empty bull shit claims about nothing but it might get votes because it is all hight tech and stuff.

    Lets sell our farms, dump all our resources overseas at a discount, export all our jobs by importing all our products and we will finally break the backs of the unions and turn the majority of Australians into working in poverty servants. Let them bow and scrape and learn to serve their betters, let them learn to bend over and take it.

    Screw fair trade where local companies compete with importers upon an equal regulatory bases or pay duties on the differences, bugger preserving resources for future generations of Australians and high tech screw that, wind the NBN down to dial up speeds and make Foxtel payments compulsory for all Australians, don't pay, lose you home and privatise all medical services, can't pay then die.

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