back to article Nokia France leak: Windows Phone DUMPED in Microsoft Lumia revamp

The French wing of Microsoft's Nokia mobile device division appears to have confirmed some Windows Phone rebranding efforts that have been rumored for the past few months. Earlier this year, leaked legal documents related to Microsoft's acquisition of Nokia's Devices and Services business revealed that Redmond was only given …

  1. Adam Jarvis

    More Marketing woes for Microsoft. When will they learn.

    In 12 months from now, looking back - the cut-off for previous support will be the Nokia->Microsoft Brand change.

    i.e.

    Microsoft Lumia 735 running Windows, gets support.

    Nokia Lumia 735 running Windows Phone doesn't.

    Reason: Nokia who? Microsoft is going to want to remove the word Nokia on their support pages ASAP.

    What does this mean?

    Another Fire Sale of all Microsoft 'Nokia branded' devices, even the just launched 735.

    Given Windows Phone 'WP - Work in Progress' is now in transition towards Windows 10, this is starting to feel like the disaster Microsoft had between their 'stepping stone' WP7 -> WP8 transition, where loyal WP7 users were left high and dry, with no upgrade path.

    You really have got to be committed to stick with the Microsoft Marketing shambles, this time round. Let's not even mention now defunct current ARM powered devices such as the Windows Surface running Windows RT and Nokia Tablets running Windows RT, dead in the water, pretty much.

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

    What did MS buy if not the right to the Nokia brand? If they just wanted to control the hardware experience they could have bought a cheap phone manufacturer - but the game is brand + device surely? If they wanted to build up market share on the back of the glow from the Nokia brand then I'm not sure that strategy has been a runaway success. Look to the Surface tablet for the relative strength of the Microsoft brand in this mobile/tablet space.

    1. Charlie Clark Silver badge
      Headmaster

      Re: And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

      FWIW OLEDs don't have backlights.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

      Microsoft did not buy Nokia.

      Microsoft bought Nokia's phone business division.

      The rest of Nokia still exists but to make things easier for the transition period, Microsoft was allowed to use the Nokia brand for a limited time.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

      " If they just wanted to control the hardware experience they could have bought a cheap phone manufacturer "

      Nokia has some of the best tech in the phone business - best microphones, best touch screens, highest contract screens, best cameras, best maps / nav, etc, etc. Microsoft bought the license to that and the expertise to use it..

    4. Phil_Evans

      Re: And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

      In the world of the 'ever-new' wet dream, Nokia is a backwards 'legacy' device maker of things that are now completely useless. That's pretty much what you will hear from the MSFT execs when they pin their names to this.

      Reality is that the Nokia brand is responsible for keeping a large part of the non-smartphone world communicating. A rock-solid (if ugly) operating system that underpins millions of service contracts. That we have blithely tried to copy with a brick called the NOKIA 130 and flog it instead. But let's ignore that. Let's pin our hopes on a market where there has been no real penetration of our OS. Let's pretend that the kids love it (a kid is younger than 35, right?). Let's kill the brand that has the most value.

      Like a suicidal dope smoker, they just can't resist the last toke before they hit the ground.

    5. Dabooka Silver badge

      Re: And with that a thousand smartphone backlights just went out...

      "If they just wanted to control the hardware experience they could have bought a cheap phone manufacturer"

      Nokia were a cheap phone manufacturer surely? What was it, $4 billion? And I think that gave up fab plants, design team, support etc.

      Anyway, does this mean the 'true' Nokia can now design it's own handests again, even if it can't make them? I'm not too clued up on the implications of this deal TBH.

  3. bex

    Someone at theregister uk is on the juice

    Defenestrated is a word someone came up with to be clever but does not mean what the above title supposes. I know on a hump day you need to come up with something but throwing a person through a window does not fit this none story.

  4. Eddy Ito Silver badge

    Not to be impolite but, you're just noticing now?

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

    Changing the name from a former industry leader and a no longer relevant company to that of a fading industry leader that is becoming increasingly irrelevant is simply rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic...

    1 billion Android users worldwide earlier this year and growing at an alarming rate. The OS gets more mature and PC like with every release and it is free and can be run on everything from watches to games consoles today.

    Microsoft are late to the party and have a lot of work to do with Windows 10 to be able to compete with the likes of Google, Apple and Amazon while still making a profit.

    Personally I think they've been too late to the mobile space despite the fact that I like Windows Phone 8. The 'switch' from version 7 to 8 has been a disaster and they seem to think that by paying all these TV shows to feature their products it'll make people want them more, but as a friend of mine recently pointed out when he upgrades to another Android he just needs to sign in and everything is there for him again. No fuss no hassle

    1. Waspy

      Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

      I agree completely with your "they are too late to the mobile space" sentiment. I too really like WinPho 8 (I have a lumia 1020) but fear the glory days of nokia r+d = amazing hardware innovation are over, and from the sounds of it Microsoft aren't interested in continuing the tradition of making top tier innovative handsets. Which is unfortunate because that's exactly what I want.

      To top it all, Microsoft seem to completely lack focus and direction in other areas too - I used excel on wp8 the other day for the first time...it's awful. you can't copy cells or insert rows/columns. Wtf? Every crappy clone on every other platform can do that.

      On the phone to MS USA the other day about a replacement keyboard to be sent to my partners NY apartment - "can I have a number to call you back on in case we get cut off". "Well no, I'm on skype as I'm in the uk, just skype me". "Sorry sir, we are unable to skype here". Wtf? You paid $5billion for this stuff and your own employees can't use it? And don't get me started on missing functionality in the WinPho version of skype vs iOS and android.

      Ms is a big lumbering beast in search of direction and it's frustrating because they seem to have some nice ideas and excellent hardware these days. They need to start rowing in the same direction or they may find themselves totally adrift.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

        There's the problem. In terms of being a partner with Microsoft, Nokia was the ideal company you'd want as a partner.

        They added countless refinements to the OS, produced decent map software for it, extensions and plugged gaps in the OS. It was Nokia that made the slow progress of Windows Phone tolerable.

        But now it's all part of the same company it's going to be slow progress again. Thankfully none of the other mobile OSes are actually adding that much to their offerings now, they're all mature platforms. Much of the "hype" is about apps and services now.

        When Apple adds stuff like "making phone calls using your laptop" as a cool new feature you know the ideas box is getting empty. They've effectively made your laptop a Bluetooth headset.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

          When Apple adds stuff like "making phone calls using your laptop" as a cool new feature you know the ideas box is getting empty. They've effectively made your laptop a Bluetooth headset.

          I agree to a certain extent, but I disagree with the example. I've got a MacBook Pro and I've got a Galaxy S4. I spend a lot of time working and typing on my laptop and it can be quite annoying when I have to pick up my phone reply to a text using the on screen keyboard (which I can rarely seem to get to write what I think I am typing) and then constantly go back and forth between working on the PC and texting on the phone while I converse with someone especially if I've got the phone charging somewhere.

          Hangouts as an extension for chrome has helped the problem a little bit, but not everyone I contact frequently is willing to use it, so the ability to switch applications to one where I can continue typing on my laptop keyboard and reply to text messages regardless of whether they use iMessage or not is one I would find handy.

          Hopefully this is one thing that Google will add to hangouts in Chrome as it would be a very useful feature for me

          1. wyatt

            Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

            Funny, you use to be able to do that with Nokia PC Suite/OVI Suite..

      2. Thoguht Silver badge
        Big Brother

        Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

        Skype is Microsoft's consumer VOIP offering, enterprises are supposed to use their Lync product instead. The company I work for uses Lync, and if anyone starts trying to use Skype, a man from IT will appear in their office a few minutes later and tell them off.

    2. andreas koch
      Unhappy

      @ AC - Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

      . . .

      >

      when he upgrades to another Android he just needs to sign in and everything is there for him again. No fuss no hassle

      <

      no privacy no security.

      Exactly what puts me off.

      If I store my stuff on my device I'm responsible for it. Outsourcing resposibility for private data (to whatever OS) doesn't sound like an advantage to me.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: @ AC - Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

        "when he upgrades to another Android he just needs to sign in and everything is there for him again. No fuss no hassle"

        Just like with a Windows Phone then. Except no Google scanning your content for targeted advertising....

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: @ AC - Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

          Just like with a Windows Phone then. Except no Google scanning your content for targeted advertising....

          Yeah and iOS works the same, but the point is that when the average customer goes to upgrade from a say a Sony Xperia and there are two HTC One phones that look identical in the shop the only difference being the OS the sales person is just going to want to close the sale as quickly as possible, so they'll push the Android version "oh yes just put your email and password and everything will reappear" they won't want to go into the details of why one differs and how you'll have to set everything back up and import your contacts if they are stored in the cloud etc.

          As these phones do more and more the more locked in to the ecosystem users will become and they won't bother switching as a result.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: @ AC - Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

            "As these phones do more and more the more locked in to the ecosystem users will become and they won't bother switching as a result."

            For business users, ever fearful of a need to train employees, you're right. Private users are much less fearful of swapping, and buy what suits them at the time. The kidz swapping from BB to Lumias without even stopping to consider Android shows how quickly consumer sentiment can shift Personally I can't stand the WP interface and all that "tiles" sh1te, so I won't buy a Lumia now, but that's aversion to Microsoft's "like it or lump it" interface not any loyalty to Android. If the UI on WinPho were made less garish, in-your-face, WIndows8-like, then I'd happily consider a Lumia next time round. Likewise Apple. I don't like the price, but I'd be happy to tolerate the UI. In principle it's Apple's decision on pricing that mean another Android is a probable purchase, not any USP of Android.

            And Google and Android makers are actively tilting the playing field in favour of other phone OS by the fragmented update and weak post-production support, by pre-installed non-deletable apps, and by the dubious privacy of anything associated with Google. I'd happily consider Sailfish, Tizen, Firefox, or Ubuntu phones if they work well enough and can offer the few basic apps I'd use.

            For home users, far from being locked in, I'm seeing less lock in, and more opportunity for OS-makers to get it right, although that's an opportunity where Google, Microsoft, Apple and the rest seem to be falling over themselves to seize defeat from the jaws of victory. In large part that's because in different ways these three businesses are committed to creating products and foisting them on the market without really listening to the market.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

      Pretty sure there are more Ford Fiestas sold than many other cars. But I don't want the same shit car as other people.

      Android is just a commodity OS now.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

        Then you need to start looking to bespoke custom tuning houses to make your Fiesta unique....at least you have that option with 'droid, iOS and WP just let you shuffle the shit in the glovebox and boot around - but you're still stuck with the same shit wherever you put it.......

      2. Adrian 4 Silver badge

        Re: Rearranging deckchairs on the Titanic

        More fool you.

        By all means get a Jaguar instead of a Fiesta. I have no doubt at all that you'll prefer it. But don't get one that only runs on special fuel, you'll be the loser.

        The OS provides some services in the phone. It can be enhanced by the manufacturer and the hardware can be built in many different qualities. It doesn't need to define the phone, and this is where Nokia went wrong - first by wanting to differentiate themselves with a different OS (Symbian) and then by falling for Microsoft's gilded tongue (Elop).

  6. Stuart Ball

    Not so. I use MS account on my windows phone, and my android tablet. As I have setup Outlook as an account on the tablet, all my mail, contacts etc are available on both devices.

    The same with Google, Yahoo, and iCloud on the Windows Phone.

    Lock in is only there through lack of education and awareness.

    Apps is a different matter though, but some apps are buy once, run agnostic, like MLB.TV. Where you pay for the service, not the app.

  7. Slx

    Nokia is very significant behind the scenes like Ericsson and Alcatel-Lucent.

    Nokia handsets were just a consumer focused division and that's all Microsoft bought.

    The Nokia Company is predominantly an infrastructure development company and R&D house.

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