back to article Philip Morris seeks pay-per-puff patent to help you STOP smoking

Philip Morris, one of the world's larger tobacco concerns, is attempting to patent a connected e-cigarette. The company's application outlines a device that appears very similar to the e-cigarettes available today. But the invention described takes the idea further by suggesting that its e-cig would include a puff-detecting …

  1. DougS Silver badge

    Better hurry

    My state already banned cigarettes in most indoor locations back in 2008, and there is talk of banning e-cigarettes in those places now.

    1. Fluffy Bunny
      Coffee/keyboard

      Re: Better hurry

      An e-cigarette is still a drug delivery system and that drug is still nicotine. So if cigarettes are banned is a place, so are e-cigarettes.

      BTW, you owe me a new keyboard because of the stupidity of the idea that e-cigarettes could be allowed indoors.

      1. Henry Wertz 1 Gold badge

        Re: Better hurry

        "An e-cigarette is still a drug delivery system and that drug is still nicotine. So if cigarettes are banned is a place, so are e-cigarettes.

        BTW, you owe me a new keyboard because of the stupidity of the idea that e-cigarettes could be allowed indoors."

        In US states with indoor smoking bans, the purported (and I think actual) reason was the air quality issue from the copious second hand smoke from the cigarettes, not that these people were getting a nicotine fix. E-Cigarettes don't smoke. So if the state law is based on use of nicotine or tobacco indoors then you can't do it indoors; if it's based on smoke or combustion then you can. The vast majority of E-Cig smokers I've seen go outdoors to do it anyway though to hang out with the smokers.

      2. Corinne

        Re: Better hurry

        "BTW, you owe me a new keyboard because of the stupidity of the idea that e-cigarettes could be allowed indoors"

        Can you give any good reason (other than being an ignorant killjoy) why something that is legal & causes no harm to others should be banned anywhere indoors? I can completely understand why smoking cigarettes, which give off harmful smoke, should be banned in enclosed places due to the effects of "passive smoking". E-cigs don't give off any harmful smoke just a harmless vapour, and they don't smell like cigarettes either - despite someone trying to persuade me they could smell "fags" on me when I was using apple liquid!

  2. Ole Juul

    I bet they did their research

    And noted just how well paying for other addictions has worked to stop the addicted. Is this some kind of word game?

  3. Chris G Silver badge

    Brought to you

    By people who will knowingly sell you a product that is proven to cause:

    Cancer, lungs, mouth , throat etc

    other lung diseases,

    heart disease

    and can contribute to problems with conception and pregnancy , affects diabetes and so on.

    Buying anything from them is like buying a used car with bald tyres, intermittent brakes and an accelerator jammed on when you live on a steep hill.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Brought to you

      Yeah but their car is fun an makes you look cool....

      1. Otto is a bear.

        Re: Brought to you

        I wasn't aware that any Morris car made anyone look cool, certainly since the 1960's anyway.

        A patent on an eCigarette really, come on, it's obvious, they already use USB chargers.

        1. Elmer Phud

          Re: Brought to you

          "I wasn't aware that any Morris car made anyone look cool"

          Bloke round our way used to love working on Minors (of the Morris Motors sort).

          His trade vehicle was a six-wheel stretch Traveller and his personal runabout was a pink Morris Minor with a Rover V6 under the bonnet.

          Cools as . . . .

          1. JetSetJim Silver badge
            Coat

            Re: Brought to you

            Morris Minors were cool.

            1. launcap Silver badge
              Happy

              Re: Brought to you

              >Morris Minors were cool.

              And still are (or at least my wifes MM is..). and tax free :-)

          2. david bates

            Re: Brought to you

            If thats a KV6 lets hope it wasn't the first gen one - more Kettle than Kool.

          3. Fluffy Bunny
            Angel

            Re: Brought to you

            I think the original poster was thinking of something more coffin-shaped.

      2. jake Silver badge

        Re: Brought to you

        "Yeah, but their car stinks (badly), and makes you look like an idiot ..."

        There, I fixed that for you.

  4. Bloodbeastterror

    Newsflash

    Fox Sells Barbed Wire to Protect Chickens

    (Editor's note: Scum...)

  5. jake Silver badge

    Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

    ... to legally make more of a profit from the addicted and the "recreational" user.

    It's going to get worse, as fewer & fewer kids become addicted in the first place, and more and more adults manage to kick their Jones.

    Lobbyists are a lower form of scum than the lawyers that feed on them.

    (e-cigs are just a nicotine delivery system, and not an answer ... )

    1. Elmer Phud

      Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

      (e-cigs are just a nicotine delivery system, and not an answer ... )

      Thanks -- when kids see an adult use a fake-fag and look releived once the nicotine hits the system then they get the hint that these plastic straws are worth investigating.

      The makers of fake-fags do not want anyone to give up - that's why they are selling an addictive drug.

      Keep puffing and telling yourself you are breaking the habit while showing al the signs of a junkie.

      Now ask why the biggest increase in the market is for 12 to 16 yr olds.

      1. Grifter

        Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

        >>Keep puffing and telling yourself you are breaking the habit while showing al the signs of a junkie

        I call shenanigans. I smoked for 14.5 years, switched to vaping and never touched cigs again. 29th of december 2010 was my last cig. Started at normal nicotine levels, and gradually went down to zero nicotine. Eventually vaped less and less. Take it out every once in a while like a bag of crisps now.

        Your post is full of self-righteous misinformation about nicotine, it's not the nicotine that's addictive, it's all the other shit.

        1. A Twig

          Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

          Not quite old chap - it's the nicotine that is addictive - it is all the other shit that kills you (from inhaling the products of combustion of dried plant matter, various added chemicals etc).

          Nicotine itself has relatively few harmful effects on the body - and indeed some positive ones (when taken in low doses) - its the delivery methods that are the issue.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

        Thanks -- when kids see an adult use a fake-fag and look releived once the nicotine hits the system then they get the hint that these plastic straws are worth investigating.

        The makers of fake-fags do not want anyone to give up - that's why they are selling an addictive drug.

        Keep puffing and telling yourself you are breaking the habit while showing al the signs of a junkie.

        Take your sanctimonious bullshit and shove it up your arsehole.

        I don't care that I'm not "breaking the habit", because, most importantly, I'm no longer breaking myself by smoking. I don't rightly care if I look like a junkie, or if you disapprove, or if 4 year olds start puffing on e-cigs - that is something for their parents to take care of, not me.

        Using e-cigs has allowed my lungs to recover to the point I can exercise, lose weight, just be happier in life. It might be better if I didn't ingest any nicotine at all, and there are some unknowns about long term use of e-cigs, but there is no argument that using an e-cig is orders of magnitudes less harmful than smoking a cigarette.

        Now ask why the biggest increase in the market is for 12 to 16 yr olds.

        Such a fascinatingly specific age group and claim, and yet I can find no evidence of this research on the internet. In the UK, we don't even use those age ranges for statistical measurement. I can tell you that in the UK, 95% of 11-15 year olds who are aware of e-cigs have not tried them, and 90% of 16-18 year olds have not tried them ("E-cigarette uptake and marketing", Public Health England).

        Morons like Elmer Phud will soon try to tax, restrict, legislate or ban e-cigs on the basis of "protecting the children". Like almost every time someone brings up the kids, he is trying to bullshit you and remove your freedoms. Do not let him.

        1. Elmer Phud

          Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

          Oh, great -- I illustrate the way that children are encouraged to take up inhaling nicotine by copying thier 'betters' and some junkie slags me off.

          Moron me?.

          Let's see you with out your 'vape' for a day and watch you climb the walls.

          but you are addressing someone who was once on Capstan and Woodbine - there is no bullshit from me, and I'm not even a reformed addict.

          YOU ARE STILL A JUNKIE -- or 'person of habit' as you may prefer.

          This is not about 'freedom' but addiction though mimicking those who don't realise the way they behave when inhaling.

          Vaping is 'cool'?

          1. This post has been deleted by a moderator

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

            Oh, great -- I illustrate the way that children are encouraged to take up inhaling nicotine by copying thier 'betters' and some junkie slags me off.

            You illustrated it by drawing a picture in crayon of kids and an e-cig and writing BAAAAD over it in the red crayon. It's a better illustration if you use facts and numbers.

            Moron me?.

            Let's see you with out your 'vape' for a day and watch you climb the walls.

            but you are addressing someone who was once on Capstan and Woodbine - there is no bullshit from me, and I'm not even a reformed addict.

            YOU ARE STILL A JUNKIE -- or 'person of habit' as you may prefer.

            Oh, OK. Now everything is clear. You are an ex-smoker, and you quit by training your mind that smoking is evil, and now you are self-righteous in your criticism. Well done for quitting smoking, bad luck on reprogramming yourself to be a sanctimonious moron.

            This is not about 'freedom' but addiction though mimicking those who don't realise the way they behave when inhaling.

            Vaping is 'cool'?

            You keep saying it is cool. I only say it is less harmful to me than smoking, and that something non harmful that adults do that does not affect you is none of your business. If you hadn't speciously used the "think of the children" argument I wouldn't have said anything.

            1. Oninoshiko

              Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

              "You keep saying it is cool. I only say it is less harmful to me than smoking, and that something non harmful that adults do that does not affect you is none of your business."

              Point of order: Even if it was harmful, as long as you're only harming yourself, it's STILL none of my business.

            2. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

              I use an e-cig, and I think of my children by not smoking it anywhere near them, or anyone else's, just like I didn't when I smoked cigarettes, only now it's because I don't want them to start, rather than having the added worry of slowly killing them (and me) too.

          3. M Gale

            Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

            "Vaping is 'cool'?"

            With Ice Menthol flavour? Incredibly cool actually.

            As for the patent, whut? I can go out right now and buy an e-fag that you can plug into the computer and it'll tell you all kinds of stuff about how much you've used it, what the battery health is, various graphs and figures. I just don't fancy spending that much.

          4. Long John Brass Silver badge

            Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

            @Elmer Phud

            Mate ... Given the magnitude of your arsehole-ness; Don't go out when it too windy, you may well invert.

          5. cigarbabe

            Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

            Sorry "Elmer Phud" nobody climbs the walls when they go all day without vaping.

            Eliminating the cigarettes also takes away the desire to need to smoke every ten minutes or so....

            Most of us go for hours at a time without vaping and never have any form of withdrawals.

            Since when did smoking make folks "junkies"?

            Nobody is robbing the local drugstore to get a fix of nicotine nor are they mugging their neighbors for cash to buy smokes/ecigs. You need to get real. Stop judging everyone.

            Addiction denotes consuming a product that has severe detrimental damage to you and everyone around you.

            "Addiction is a chronic brain disease that causes compulsive substance use despite harmful consequences. Health, finances,relationships, and careers can be ruined. The abuse of drugs and alcohol is by far the leading cause of preventable illnesses and premature death in our society. Drug and alcohol use is associated with high-risk sexual behaviors and injection drug use, two major modes of HIV transmission. The importance of substance abuse treatment cannot be overstated, and fortunately many effective treatments are available."

        2. cigarbabe

          Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

          Well said Anonymous Coward!

          Once again those who disagree with adults having a choice make up stats and figures to sway folks from using a great product that has been beneficial to many thousands of us.

          I quit a 3 pack a day habit where I also smoked 3-10 cigars on any given day in three days time.

          This could not have been done without ecigs. Nothing else worked for me so I am eternally grateful.

          Most ecig users won't buy into Phillip Morris's bs and by the time it comes out those of us in Harm Reduction will be telling people the facts and reality about the technology.

          I made the switch!

          C.B.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

      I've heard talk e-cigs can also deliver the "devil's lettuce"

      1. M Gale

        Re: Once again the drug dealers attempt ...

        I've heard talk e-cigs can also deliver the "devil's lettuce"

        If that's what I'm thinking it is, then not very well by default. E-cigs are designed for evaporating a mix of propylene glycol, glycerine and some water with nicotine dissolved in there. Basically they are small versions of disco smoke machines.

        The thing you're interested in vaping is a fat-soluble oil. That has its own requirements, for which standard e-cigs are not well suited. Standard e-cig batteries on the other hand, might well be able to power a re-engineered Magic Flight Launch Box or similar design.

        Not that I'd know.

  6. baalel
    FAIL

    prior art?

    Joytech already have software, MyVapoursthat records vaping habits on some of their high end devices. Seems like big tobacco trying to pull a 'rounded corners' stunt.

    http://www.joyetech.com/support/down_video.php?no=46&k=7

    1. Rabbit80

      Re: prior art?

      Yep - I have an eVic and it can do everything mentioned in this patent - count puffs, limit puffs, connect to PC - it even monitors the length of time I puff for and the strength it is set to for each puff - as well as the time of day.

      1. Elmer Phud

        Re: prior art?

        Assisted Addiction, well done.

        1. M Gale

          Re: prior art?

          Oh, Phud. I guess you're one of the smartybrains behind Arriva and Network Rail's recent banning of e-cigs everywhere including open fucking train platforms.

          Seriously?

          Take your shit and cram it up your arse. If you're going to ban e-cigs, I want a ban on 70 and 80 year old grannies getting on the bus with enough perfume that it gives me an asthma attack. And I don't even have asthma.

          Oh what, that's not the same thing is it? You're right. It's far worse.

      2. Vic
        Joke

        Re: prior art?

        I have an eVic

        Should I be concerned?

        Vic.

  7. Only me!
    Mushroom

    Will it see the light of day

    Just because they have a patent, does not mean it will see the light of day, they will be able to block other firms from trying to help you give up smoking. Or make it that expensive, people will just carry on puffing away.

    Of course I could be wrong,.......

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Mushroom

    SCUM

    "For example the user buys daily or weekly or monthly smoking time from the Internet application supported on the PC"

    So when they run out of credit, then can easily pop down the shops and buy some lovely, REAL cigarettes. Is that what you want, lovely cigarettes. Hmmmm smooooth...

    Give me a gun and I'll happily shoot the owners in the head having buried my brother aged 42 who died from lung cancer and brain tumours.

    On the good side of that, 6 friends and family immediately gave up smoking and NO ONE close to me no smokes,

    1. Mystic Megabyte Silver badge
      Unhappy

      Re: SCUM

      >>NO ONE close to me no smokes,

      You shot all your friends?

  9. VinceH Silver badge
    Coat

    "Philip Morris seeks pay-per-puff patent to help you STOP smoking"

    It'll never work!

    NEVER!

    Erm, because I don't smoke to start with.

    Oh, you didn't actually mean me specifically... COAT!

  10. This post has been deleted by its author

  11. Winkypop Silver badge
    Mushroom

    Philip Morris?

    Get stuffed you heinous bastards.

  12. Otto is a bear.

    Don't forget

    Nicotine is one of the most addictive and lethal narcotics going.

    1. Elmer Phud

      Re: Don't forget

      Which is why world+dog are selling them.

      Make a mint before the game is up.

    2. M Gale

      Re: Don't forget

      "Nicotine is one of the most addictive and lethal narcotics going."

      Incorrect. That would be alcohol. Not many narcotics out there that will kill you from the withdrawal symptoms. Alcohol very much can though.

      ...but I suppose I'd better not mention that around here. Beer o'clock already is it?

    3. Corinne
      Facepalm

      Re: Don't forget

      "Nicotine is one of the most addictive and lethal narcotics going"

      I'll accept the "addictive" part of that, but one of the most lethal? Yes it CAN be lethal if you drink comparatively large quantities, like many things available. But suggesting that nicotine on it's own as used in vaping is inherently harmful is bullshit. If it was that harmful, do you think that any other form of NRT on the market today would be legal? There's very little difference between the nicotine sprays people who are trying to give up can buy, and how do you think patches etc work if not giving a smoker their nicotine in another form?

  13. Lionel Baden

    bleh

    already been done.

    My mate had one which showed how many puffs per day he used and the battery life.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Stupid idea

    Why would anyone want to collect data on their inhaling habits.

    The only data a user is interested in is when an individual cigarette finished.

    Traditionally the sensors in your fingers detect the heat and your eyes tell you it has burnt down.

    On an E-Cigarette you can puff away as long as you like with no sense that you have finished.

    A little row of LEDs showing it 'burning' like the real thing down would be handy. (have a 'docking out' facilty for when interrupted)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Stupid idea

      Makes people chain smokers without knowing

      1. Steven Raith

        Re: Stupid idea

        On the flipside, I'll find myself not touching it for a few hours at a time, too.

        If you spark up a fag, you *have* to finish it. If you take a few puffs on an e-cig, you don't have to do any more. I needn't explain why that's very handy in the car! No more fiddling with lighters at the lights...

        I have considered getting one of those logging batteries to see what my usage is actually like, but TBH, I don't care enough. I tend to go by how many batteries I go through in a day.

        Steven R

    2. Mark 85 Silver badge

      Re: Stupid idea

      Why would anyone want to collect data on their inhaling habits.

      Why indeed. However since it's connecting to a PC (IoT?) you can be monitored either willingly or unwillingly. Uncle Sugar and his friends can see what your using and how much. Insurance companies would love to get their hands on this data for premium rates, etc. And if they go for the "pay per puff" and take the money from your bank account... there's possibilies for all sorts of fees and add-ons (extra profit) which follows the cell phone companies lead. And lastly, there's the advert side... if they incorporate some goodies like GPS or tie it to your cell phone, they can target you for cigs, beer, food, and much, much, more.

      Oh yes.. this can be a very good thing for many companies and not necessarily the consume.

      I guess I'm getting a tad on the tin-foil hat side with all the revelations lately about who's watching who.

  15. Chronos Silver badge

    Joyetech eVic

    The eVic has had a puff counter from day one. It's one of the most annoying features ever to be built into an e-cig. IIRC, the Darwin, Evolv's first foray into variable power, also had a puff counter.

    As for nicotine being "more addictive than cocaine" and other nonsensical utterances, that may well be true when combined with additives to enhance that effect along with MAOIs and other naturally occurring substances in tobacco but, on its own, it's about as dangerous and addictive as caffeine.

    As for PM and the other big tobacco players (no pun intended), most vapers are happy to be free of their clutches so, frankly, they can just sod off.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This is just another way

    of making people addicted to or keep people addicted to nicotine.

    Philip Morris is not interested in helping people stop using tobacco with e-sigs.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Asthma Inhaler

    I can see the use in a 'connected' asthma inhaler logging times and qty delivered, synched via bluetooth to your phone it becomes an IOThingie.

    Taking standard canisters and powered by the squeeze and suck of use, it could scavenge wireless from the phone when it communicates, if it used the ARM IOT protocols it could talk with other stuff.

    1. Spleen

      Re: Asthma Inhaler

      My inhaler has a dial which tells you roughly how many are left. It clicks down each time you twist the bottom to release a dose. Much cheaper...

  18. Graham Marsden
    Coat

    "Giving up the gaspers" - Prior art

    Stogie as used by Sam Slade (that's S-L-A-Y-E-D to you) from Robo Hunter in 2000 AD :-)

    1. Havin_it
      Mushroom

      Re: "Giving up the gaspers" - Prior art

      Ay-yi-yi! I hope their liability insurance is up to date...

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Per-per-puff

    Isn't this how rent boys have been charging for years?

  20. Valerion
    Coat

    Bad joke

    So does this product actually exist? Or is it just vapourware?

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Quitter's Inc. had the way to get people to quit smoking

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl4-b91QgnQ

  22. Aulty

    As M Gale and others have mentioned, you can buy ecigs with bluetooth that have an app on your phone that log data and display it in nice little graphs :)

  23. zen1

    that's stupid...

    To use an old analogy, that's like fucking to save your virginity

  24. Paul

    Sometimes The Onion turns out to be an Oracle

    http://www.theonion.com/article/tobacco-companies-ordered-to-pay-reparations-of-80-833

POST COMMENT House rules

Not a member of The Register? Create a new account here.

  • Enter your comment

  • Add an icon

Anonymous cowards cannot choose their icon

Biting the hand that feeds IT © 1998–2019