back to article iPhone rises, Android slips in US, UK

Apple's iPhone is gaining market share in the US and UK, while smartphones based on Google's Android operating system – which continue to lead all smartphones in both markets – see their share slipping. According to the latest report from the market-watchers at Kantar Worldpanel ComTech, in the three months ending in July of …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    That's what happens when you use Linux.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Must be coming out of a recession and less people are buying the cheaper opposition, and that in the face of a phone that has half the attributes of the latest Androids.

      So maybe the additional features on the Android phones mean Jack Sh*t?

      1. aaronj2906_01

        Oh, I dunno. Something about paying a lot of money for the "ooh, shiny" Apple phone where the walled-garden of apps is in full effect.

        No thanks...

        When I buy a smart phone. It does *exactly* what I tell it to do, or no sale. Period. A rooted droid phone will do this. the iCrap (pun abso-friggen-lutely-intended) that comes out of Apple will not.

        Frankly, I'm surprised Apple exists as a company. But, since stupid is not illegal and can't be fixed, and is incredibly profitable, that company exists. And there are a TON of stupid people in the world.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Did you forget your meds this morning?

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          wow enough butt hurt here?

          why do you care, you like android and have android.. quit whinging

  2. Bernard

    I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

    Apple was always the aspirational option for those who could afford and wanted to pay the extra, so Apple made more profits but sold fewer handsets.

    Now that Samsung is a genuine competitor at the fashionable end of the market and its profits are starting to match it feels to me like older Apple phones are becoming available on contract deals that look attractive to people who wouldn't pay extra for Apple but who will pick it if it looks cheaper than the top tier of Android phones.

    My guess is that the counterpoint to a market share increase is therefore that Apple have had to cut the price per unit on their currently available models.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

      If you think Samsung's phones are fashionable, I suspect you have issues. They are hi-tech gadgets for the masses. As a fashion statement they are right up there with a Chev (Vette excluded, natch)

      1. JDX Gold badge

        Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

        Maybe it's simply normal market fluctuation.

        1. RyokuMas Silver badge
          Facepalm

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          JDX - you don't happen to work for Microsoft Advertising do you? I only ask, because your comment is their normal copy-pasted email response for any enquiry a developer makes as to why their in-app ad revenue has dropped (again)... pretty much verbatim!

        2. Mark .

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          I agree. Also note how it's just two countries - even if one platform is overall doing far better, there are bound to be fluctuations in some countries where it doesn't always do better. It's typical that reporters handpick the ones that make Apple look best.

          There's also the problem that percentages are a poor comparison in a growing market - we need to look at absolute numbers. Android sales have likely still increased, and it can even be the case that the increase could be higher than iphone in absolute numbers, even if the market share has dropped (this did occur with Symbian at some points, e.g., around 2009).

          I was also confused by "Still, the iPhone growth is surprising, considering that iPhone sales have historically stalled in the period leading up to the release of a new Cupertinian handset " - given that this is year-on-year comparison, and therefore the same excuse would have applied to last year too. We have this same excuse every year, how the next iphone will be the one to dominate, honest. We're still waiting. Meanwhile, the likes of Samsung have solid high sales all year round.

        3. Adam T

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          Every now and then my wife will let one rip that puts my gastric movements to shame.

          It doesn't mean much, other than she decided to have beans last night while I went for pasta.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

        "Life in plastic, it's fantastic!"

        Samsung phones feel cheap, look ugly and do not feel like they should cost as much as they do. In fact they probably have higher profit margins on them than the iPhone. Apple certainly puts more internal memory in their phones.

        Look to HTC for how you make an Android phone. The HTC One has stereo speakers with good quality (about as good as you're going to get out of two tiny speakers), metal case, solidly made.

        1. zemerick
          FAIL

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          "Feel" is subjective.

          I prefer plastic because I know it's superior for a phone. As a GS3 owner, I can tell you it is very solidly made. Perhaps a bit too solid. Much like if you built a car to not get a dent in a 60mph crash is lethal to those inside, building a phone too solidly can be hard on the rest of it, namely the screen. I don't drop my phone, so it hasn't been an issue yet. I preferred the HTC Incredible which was a bit softer. I have a friend that has literally thrown his Incredible against walls several times and it just bounces off. He would have killed an iPhone/HTC One within the first month, and his new GS4 might not last...we'll see.

          Anyways, the real thing I wanted to reply to was the flat out lie:

          "Apple certainly puts more internal memory in their phones."

          The iPhone 5 had the exact same internal memory options as the older Galaxy S3, and less than the newer Galaxy S4. However, Apple charges twice as much for the increased memory options as Samsung does. They charge a full $100 for each of the upgrades. So, it's $200 for the 16GB model, $300 for 32GB, and an insane $400 for 64GB. Samsung had the exact same price for the 16GB Galaxy S3 of $200. Then from there it was $250 for 32GB, and $300 for 64GB.

          Then, of course, the Samsung phones have Micro SD card slots that accept up to 64GB micro SD cards, which cost less than $50.

          So, tell me again, who has less storage?

          1. Ted Treen
            Devil

            @Zemerick

            "...I have a friend that has literally thrown his Incredible against walls several times and it just bounces off..."

            Friend of Gordon Brown, are we?

        2. Darkimmortal

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          Making the casing from metal is not a very smart move in a device with one or two large panels of glass

          Samsung are right to use plastic. The galaxy s i9000 for example is ridiculously shatter resistant

      3. Luke 11
        FAIL

        Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

        'Chev' ? What is a fuking chev? I would get the dictionary out except I can't be arsed. Don't get me wrong, I like Apple products, having an iPAD 4 I think it's brilliant, but to start categorising people as 'chevs' because they have an Android phone is ridiculous. You sound like a real arsehole to me, you know one that's been sat in the car for a bit too long, on a hot sunny day, under a fat person.

        One could categorise Apple product owners as wire framed spectacled wearing Saab driving cunts shrink wrapped in a shitty looking turtle neck sweater with dandruff on the shoulders, but one wouldn't because one isn't a cock.

        1. Pete Spicer

          Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

          He's not calling you a Chev, he's referring to Chevy - Chevrolet - the car manufacturer. As in 'as a fashion statement they are right up there with Chevrolet', a brand not entirely known for its fashionability, except the Corvette (as noted by the poster)

          1. Zack Mollusc

            Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

            Thanks for that. I was confused because it got me thinking about the Chevette, which was an old british Vauxhall car. Chevettes were not quite as flashy as a Corvette, but they were easier to park. My mate Simon had one with flush (rather than recessed) headlights, this was the epitome of style and made my mk4 cortina (with large eagle sticker on bonnet) look tacky.

            1. tony
              Happy

              Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

              I would include Camaro along with the Corvette,

              But that maybe because my ideal car is a pickup?

              1. Anonymous Coward
                Anonymous Coward

                Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

                Yes, forgot the Camaro.

                I don't live in the US anymore. I had an IROC Z many years ago which while big and cumbersome, was ok. Far from a fashion statement though. The Vette (despite getting lost there for a while) has always been, well, a Vette. My favourite is the '57.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

        Self responding ...

        Can I conclude that 50% of the readers here at The Reg. think that Chevys are a fashionable car?

        Oh my, that really says something about the readership, and it's not pretty.

        Perhaps my conclusion needs a few more data points?

    2. ThomH Silver badge

      Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal (@JDX)

      Even if it is just a fluctuation, that's surely news because it destroys the overall narrative of Android doing now what Windows did a couple of decades ago?

      It all sounds healthy regardless. I like Bernard's free market interpretation: Apple is managing to respond to competition.

      1. SuccessCase

        Peak Register

        "My guess is that the counterpoint to a market share increase is therefore that Apple have had to cut the price per unit on their currently available models."

        "I like Bernard's free market interpretation: Apple is managing to respond to competition.”

        Nope and nope.

        Apple have never cut the price of the iPhone. What they have done *and have always done*, is kept older models available at lower cost.

        The second point, Apple haven’t changed their business model to compete - especially not on price. The model has always been competitive on the basis in which they are interested in competing (which excludes price). I have written a comment about this pattern as it has been evident from those who have checked the data for some time now. In fact, sales for both Apple and Android are slowing as the smartphone market reaches saturation.

        Android has made massive sales since smartphones have been available at price points only previously available to feature phone customers. When Android started doing fantastically well in comparison with the iPhone, iPhone sales weren’t slowing one bit, they were continuing to accelerate. But just not as fast as Android. This can be explained by the fact smartphones have until recently been the biggest growth market the world has ever seen.

        But many Android phones have been bought by users who have no interest in a smart-phone per se. They would have bought a feature phone, but found a smartphone was available at the same price as they were planning on paying. This is why Android per user usage figures are so much lower than for iOS.

        Additionally, it has always been the case a greater percentage of users of Android (and more users of Samsung Android devices) have wanted to switch to iOS than vice versa. There is plenty of data showing this.

        The result was that it was inevitable that once the “flash" in-filling of the cheap feature phone market with smartphones had completed, iOS would start to take users off Android. This won't happen in every market, but it is happening in the more wealthy markets.

        I have stated this very clearly, with full referencing to relevant reports, in past comments and have always a large number of down-votes for saying it!

        Here is one such comment with references to the data:

        http://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/1/2013/08/14/peak_apple_samsung_has_double_market_share_of_iphone/#c_1925461

        1. Mark .

          Re: Peak Register

          The same thing was true of Symbian - although the share was falling in the late 2000s, the numbers were still increasing, in fact at a faster rate than iphones in absolute numbers.

          And actually, I suspect that the same thing is all that's happening here with Android. Percentages are counter-intuitive - it could even be the case that Android has risen faster (in absolute numbers) than iphone, even if Apple's share increases whilst Android's falls!

          "But many Android phones have been bought by users who have no interest in a smart-phone per se. They would have bought a feature phone"

          But this is also true of people buying cheaper iphones - as you say yourself, Apple have already long been in the lower end of the market, by selling older models at lower price (I recently saw the ancient iphone 4 going for £15/month).

          But yes, the smartphone "growth" has really only been that phones that used to be called "feature" are now called "smart" (and the distinction is completely arbitrary anyway) - it's not clear there has been really that much growth, or change in spending patterns.

          1. SuccessCase

            Re: Peak Register

            "it could even be the case that Android has risen faster (in absolute numbers) than iphone, even if Apple's share increases whilst Android's falls!"

            Yes that could definitely have been the case earlier in the cycle and can happen in a rapidly expanding market. It's very unlikely to be the case now though, if not impossible, because the market has reached maturity. There is still some expansion but it is a low percentage. From now on the smartphone replacement/upgrade cycle for exiting users is becoming an ever more significant metric.

    3. Robert Forsyth

      Re: I wonder if it's straightforward role reversal

      I don't see how you can say Apple's phone is a fashion item, it has not changed much every six months.

  3. Big_Ted

    Windows phone in UK is fueled by cheap Lumia phones and nothing else.

    People are not suddenly switching to Windows they are getting Cheap Nokias or HTC 8's, like the 8X that was on ebay for £159.99 a month ago with £20 PAYG SIM and bluetooth speaker.....

    1. JDX Gold badge

      What exactly is your point? It's not like MS are the only one selling entry-level low-price smart-phones. You do realise most of Android's success is fueled by cheaper phones, not top-end iPhone competitors?

      1. Neil Lewis
        FAIL

        Pardon?

        'most of Android's success is fueled by cheaper phones, not top-end iPhone competitors'

        The biggest chunk of Android market share is surely the Samsung Galaxy series. Though a bit cheaper than an iPhone, these are pretty comparable in terms of cost. They're certainly not entry-level, low-price kit.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Pardon?

          Maybe. But if you add up all of the other brands together they sell more phones than Samsung?

        2. JDX Gold badge

          The biggest chunk of Android market share is surely the Samsung Galaxy series

          Surely it's not. That would imply most people own premium top-end phones and that seems massively unlikely when you consider how many low/mid-range models are on offer. Most people don't want to pay £35+/month.

        3. Russell Hancock

          Re: Pardon?

          You do know that you can get very cheap Samsung "Galaxy" phones - i.e. under £100 - try the Galaxy Y, or Galaxy Europa (not sure if they are still sold as i got one of each a couple of years back - one was £30 and one was £60)...

          I can tell you for a fact that they are cheap tat... so not just Nokia selling low end phones with the same branding as their top end phones...

          Facts - great aren't they...

        4. MattEvansC3

          Re: Pardon?

          But that includes the likes of the Samsung Galaxy Y. My wife had one of those on a cheapy contract (£15pm) as her first touch screen phone and went back to her Blackberry handset within two months.

    2. Nick Thompson

      Pretty much, I bought a Windws phone 7 (Lumia 710) because it was £130 on PAYG, which 18 months ago was a fantastic deal. Similarly priced androids were so underpowered to be practically unusable.

      All I want from a phone is calls, texts, web browsing and a nice responsive UI and low cost. The lumia 710 was my first smartphone because it was the first one that ticked all the boxes.

      I've always said that you'd have to be pretty nuts to buy an expensive windows phone while it's still lacking in features and app, it's really not a recent iphone or galaxy S III competitor, yet, but it's getting there.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "you'd have to be pretty nuts to buy an expensive windows phone while it's still lacking in features and app, it's really not a recent iphone or galaxy S III competitor!"

        Disagree - the 1020 is in many ways better than either the iphone or the galaxy range. And the 925 is a pretty close match for 90% of people.

        Nokia high end phones also have better microphones, cameras, screens, touch panels, maps and nav for a start...And they don't break easily when you drop them.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      And you think Android hasn't been aided by having about 30 cheapo handsets laid out in phone shops?

    4. Luke 11
      WTF?

      Big_Ted small on ideas?

      And what prey tell is the fucking wrong with buying a good phone cheaply and getting a good deal on a sim only contract. Please don't tell me you're a phone snob who publicly winces when someone gets a phone out other than an S4 or I5 ?

      because if you're one of those people you're dick.

      1. Big_Ted
        Facepalm

        Re: Big_Ted small on ideas?

        My god, get a grip, all I was saying was that people were buying the Nokias because they were at knock down prices.

        Where did you get the idea that I could possibly be a phone snob?

        I have had cheap phones and worked up to better quality and now have a Nexus 4 due to price drop and an HTC 8X again due to price drop, I wanted a value for money phone so bought one, previously my backup was a Nokia 520, again bought for same reason.

        At least unlike some here I have something to say about the article rather than about people posting opinions....

    5. Mark .

      Any? That's like saying people aren't switching to Android, they're switching to Samsung, or they aren't switching to IOS. How many average people even know what Android or IOS is?

      I don't see why low cost is seen as a negative - surely if one company delivers a product people want at a lower cost than the competition, that's success. There are plenty of cheap Android and iphone phones anyway.

  4. twilkins
    Stop

    Don't think those Lumias will be flying off the shelves without the Nokia name on them, as per today's announcement.

    1. JDX Gold badge

      It is a concern, but maybe they've worked out a deal on this to continue using the Nokia name. It's not like Nokia means much to the new generation of purchaser anyway, only their parents.

      1. Dave 126 Silver badge

        >It's not like Nokia means much to the new generation of purchaser anyway, only their parents.

        And of those parents, a fair few are yet to buy their first 'smartphone' because their trusty 3330 still works for them.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      We don't know what Microsoft will call the phones yet.

      Until Nov 19th they can't do anything since that is when the shareholders decide if they accept the offer.

      1. Frumious Bandersnatch Silver badge

        re: We don't know what Microsoft will call the phones yet.

        Probably something snappy like THFKAN (the handset formerly known as Nokia).

    3. returnmyjedi

      The Nokia branding will endure, just as Skype did before it. It's a too well established brand to be lost under the Microsoft umbrella.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    And wait and see what happens if we get a cheaper iPhone. Basically few people would buy Android if an iPhone were around the same price. The volume Android handsets are usually pretty poor and mostly used as simple phones with a touchscreen rather than as full smart phones.

    1. Schultz
      Stop

      "Basically few people would buy Android if an iPhone were around the same price."

      You must be joking. Many people w̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ buy Android ̶i̶f̶ even though an iPhone w̶e̶r̶e̶ is around the same price.

  6. JimmyPage Silver badge

    I *like* widows phone

    Nokia Lumia 620 - supplied by work.

    despite being a bit of a tech-head geek, I also have a family, and simply could not sell getting an iPhone to the budget committee ('er indoors). And since the iPhone has come out, nothing anyone I know who has one has made me go "I MUST have an iPhone".

    My (continued) grumble about WP8 is lack of apps (and for the poster above who said he wanted WP to have more apps *and* features, as far as I can see, it's the apps that provide the features).

    And to all the Android fanbois out there ... 'er indoors has an HTC Wildfire, and trying to get it's text-to-speech and speech-to-text working ... well after 18 months they still aren't[1]. And don't get me started about the bluetooth.

    [1]Most apps for TTS are really concerned about how many accents they can provide. Actually features - not so important.

    1. RyokuMas Silver badge
      Go

      Re: I *like* widows phone

      "My (continued) grumble about WP8 is lack of apps" - Then get developing!

      Microsoft is all too aware of the lack of apps for the WinPhone - which probably explains why the "summer break" rate of $19 for a year's developer subscription has been extended. The tools you need are all free, and I've found that if you go through local channels rather than their main forum, they are all too happy to help promote independently developed apps - since 2011, I've had nine game launches, at least two thirds of which have been given prime-spot promotion on the Marketplace.

      It's currently a developer's market - if there's an app you're after, get out there and make it!

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Pretty impressive considering how long it's been since we had a new iPhone - imagine the sales once a new iPhone (or iPhones) are announced next week.

    1. returnmyjedi

      They'll be magical.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Pretty impressive considering how long it's been since we had a new iPhone

      Alternatively people eventually realised after the iPhone5 launch that there's not actually all that much extra getting added with each generation to make it worth waiting a few months for the new version so these figures get a double boost of people who waited lsat time and bought an iP5 and people this time who don't see the point in waiting for the iP5S/6/champange

      1. chr0m4t1c

        Yes, I can see the comments following next week's announcement already:

        "This is just an incremental change from the iPhone 5, Apple aren't innovating any more."

        (New phone has new feature X)

        "Apple claim to have invented X, that my <whatever> had years ago! They're just copying <company>, who should now sue them into bankruptcy!!!"

        (Please ignore fact that X existed long before <whatever> had it or that <company> didn't invent it. Or that Apple licensed it from the actual inventor/patent holder.)

        "How much? My <whatever> does all of that and cost me half that!"

        "Meh. Loads of features I'm not interested in. I'll stick with my <whatever>."

        And, of course, some stuff about Fanboi's, crApple, idiots, fashonistas and the death of Apple.

        Same as the last few years, really.

        1. Maharg

          Yep, I know you were going for sarcasm but that pretty much summed it up.

          If it ani’t broke don’t fix it, fair enough, Apple have managed what every company dreams of doing, repackaging the same thing with slight additions over a number of years and charging a premium price for its name.

          I would be not be surprised if there is a list of iPhone releases planned with exactly what current technology they will implement in it.

          Or maybe I’m just cynical and it will surprise me and the new iPhone will have loads of new and great never been done before features and they will not bring out another pretty much exactly the same one next year.

          But I doubt it

      2. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

        As I recall a good chunk of the growth has been in sales of iPhones 4 & 4S. Which is likely to be less release-time-sensitive than sales of the latest model. Although I don't think Apple break down the figures, so it's all analyst guesswork.

        My suspicion is that quite a few customers who buy a cheapo Android as their first smartphone will have been a tad disappointed. My experience with sub-£200 'Droids has been pretty rubbish. Even a lot of the midrange ones haven't been that great, it's usually better to buy previous year's top-end ones on their way down the price list. Which might suggest people going cheaper iPhone as their second smartphone. Or it's the teens abandoning Blackberry?

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Given the choice I'd choose iPhone or Windows Phone. Android is such a moving target and if I was going to spend £400-500 on a handset I expect more than plastic that I would expect on a £99 PAYG handset. Think in the long run Apple being able to optimise iOS for their devices will win over with better battery life, security and reliability.

  9. GotThumbs
    Paris Hilton

    Weak "News story"

    Big whoop.

    It's nothing more than a market fluctuation IMO.

    This is a non-story IMO.

    Best wishes,

    1. Roger Greenwood

      Re: Weak "News story"

      In the last 12 months, every time I have had contact with a phone store or company, they have practically begged me to take an iPhone of one sort or another, with some very tempting (cheap) offers.

      I don't know why they were pushing them so hard, but don't underestimate the power of a bribe, or an arm twist.

  10. Don Jefe

    What's In a Name

    Next time I have to create a handle I'm definitely going with Kantar Worldpanel.

  11. Alan Denman

    Anyone know what the partial data says?

    Well,I'd like to add some points but the data is so select, obscure and limited I can't add anything up.

    Yet one small point though may be that unlike the rest off the world, the UK is still being led by the US.

  12. This post has been deleted by a moderator

    1. Don Jefe
      FAIL

      Re: Moderator

      No, you leaking cock wart, your comments weren't moderated because of the curse words, they were moderated because you curse poorly and without taste or class and have situational valuation criteria that are irrelevant and somewhat disturbing.

      1. Ted Treen
        Happy

        @Don Jefe

        "...you leaking cock wart..."

        Thanks awfully, old chap. Must say, I haven't come across that one before. Seems some of you rebel colonials can be dashed creative in a highly original way.

        Mind if I borrow your phrase when the need arises?

        1. Don Jefe
          Alert

          Re: @Don Jefe

          All my aphorisms, colloquialisms and distinctive phrases are published under the FEHE (Fuck 'Em, Have 'Em) License. This means you may use them anywhere for any purpose, with no attribution or compensation required, necessary or desired.

          Neither Don Jefe nor One Planet, One People, One Leader Inc. assume any liability or express any warranty for the use of any products released under the FEHE License. Use appropriately and with care. Pregnant women or women who may become pregnant should consult their doctor prior to using any of these products. You may be entitled to additional rights depending on your planet of origin.

  13. A Butler

    The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

    The Lumia's 620 & 520 are the big story here they are a brilliant phone, are the right price that are really easy to use and unlike crap Android phones like the Samsung Ace or Sony Xperia early models they always run fluid; load up a few apps on the low end Android devices and watch them crawl.

    Plus backed with Office and the excellent outlook.com ecosystem they are a serious 3rd option. Competition is hotting up.

    The message is getting out, no need to spend €600 on a smart phone (or a 2 year €50 a month contract) a prepay unit like the Lumia 520 will do 90% of the main smartphone tasks for 1/3 of the price its a no brainier.

    Apple need a low range phone model and Android needs to clean up the OS speed wise for entry level phones to compete with Nokia's Lumia 520 & 620.

    Until that time arrives the Lumia's 520 & 620 have the entry level smartphone market to themselves.

    1. Don Jefe

      Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

      Load up more than a few Windows Phone apps. Do it!

      Oh, right, there aren't more than a few apps to use.

      1. RyokuMas Silver badge
        Boffin

        Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

        2013 - approx 3 years after Windows Phone was launched: Approximately 170,000 apps available.

        2011 - approx 3 years after Android was launched: Approximately 135,000 apps available.

        It's remembering that Android started a) two years earlier than Windows Phone and b) had an empty market space (no real low-budget competition) that separates the impartial from the fandroids.

        Sources:

        http://www.phonearena.com/news/Windows-Phone-Store-hosts-170000-apps_id46335

        http://www.gsmarena.com/android_market_has_more_free_apps_than_apple_app_store-news-2572.php

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

          2013 - approx 3 years after Windows Phone was launched: Approximately 170,000 apps available.

          2011 - approx 3 years after Android was launched: Approximately 135,000 apps available.

          Remember also that back in ~2009 people were saying Android didn't have a chance against iPhone due to the vastly larger number of apps available for iPhone.

    2. Richard Plinston Silver badge

      Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

      > are the right price

      They may be the 'right price' to sell, but they are _not_ the right price to make a profit for the manufacturer. Nokia make a large loss on their smartphones in spite of getting a billion dollars a year from Microsoft.

      They have been sold at a loss to build market share, but this has driven other WP makers out of the market. When real prices are applied sales will drop. If MS continues with loss making pricing then not only will this annoy the OEMs but will result in the EEC looking into it.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill

      Then buy the RIGHT entry level Android phones, not the wrong ones.

      There are plenty of Jellybean Android phones that are fast and fluid, better and cheaper than the Lumias. Just because you couldn't look past what the salesman was trying to offload, doesn't mean everyone else is so stupid/lazy.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill@ A Butler

      Interesting looking at your previous posts - reading them all, with a couple of minor deviations, they praise Microsoft to the skies, Xbox is a winner, apparently, SkyDrive is a winner, WinPho is a winner, Win 8 was "not bad at all" but will be brillant when 8.1 oozes out of Redmond's sphincter, RT is a winner (let down only by those worthless scum in the channel), even guff that the PC market will pick up once again when tablets have Android and Apple tablets have crawled back under the stone they came out from. Apple products, in all guises are rubbish, as are Android, according to you. I invite other readers to click on your posting name and peruse your posts....

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill@ A Butler

        @AC might have been a worthwhile comment if you hadn't secreted your oeuvre up your own capacious juxy

      2. A Butler

        Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill@ A Butler

        Adding a bit of balance to an overwhelming anti-Microsoft bias from most posters on the site.

        My posting on this thread is based on using a variety of phones, transferring contacts, settings up email and general usage and problems over a period of time until the user is familiar with their functionality. The biggest headache devices are cheap Android ones. I rarely ever have any grief with iPhones (except users complaining about reception) or any of the Windows 8 Lumia's once setup. The high end Android devices are fine aswell: S4/S3, HTC One.

        The standout value for money smartphone currently is the Lumia 520 all it is missing to be unbeatable is a better camera and flash but that would probably drive up the price. Most smart phones are used as a phone, camera, with email and web access and a few apps, Nokia have hit the sweet spot on the entry level and deserve credit for it.

      3. Robert Grant
        FAIL

        Re: The lumia range sure beat Android landfill@ A Butler

        Specious reasoning aside (someone being consistent doesn't make them wrong), you don't get to hold people to account like that when you post as AC.

  14. Greg J Preece

    Doesn't surprise me in the least that Windows Phone is on the rise. It's pretty slick, and I think it's really good for people who are new to smartphones, or would use them as feature phones anyway. Wouldn't have one myself, but then as I've said before, I hate pretty much all the currently available glossy candybar crap.

    1. RyokuMas Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      +1 for not being blinded by OS/corporate tribalism

  15. Charles Manning

    Windows "performance"

    So when the two front runners are getting 30% or more of market share and the third gets 5%, that is now considered "performance" and a serious contender.

    Based on that metric, an unfit fat bastard like me is a serious contender for the 100m sprint at the next olympics because I can run 100m in less than 1 minute.

    I just need the right spin-doctor.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Windows "performance"

      "So when the two front runners are getting 30% or more of market share and the third gets 5%, that is now considered "performance" and a serious contender."

      When the third is still gaining market share at over 70% a year, and most analysts believe it will get to at least 2nd place, yes....

      1. Richard Plinston Silver badge

        Re: Windows "performance"

        > When the third is still gaining market share at over 70% a year,

        WP did grow by 77% in _unit_sales_ in Q2 over 2012 Q2 (probably due to dumping the remaining WP7 models into the bargain bin and selling some newer models at a loss). However the market increased by 51% so the effective _market_share_ gain was from 3.1% to 3.7%.

        Your statement is completely untrue, either you deliberately lie to boost MS or you don't understand anything about the market.

        > and most analysts believe it will get to at least 2nd place, yes..

        Many analysts _did_ claim that - a couple of years ago. The _current_ prediction is that WP will get to third and may get to 10% globally by 2016 or maybe later. Do try and keep up and read something more recent than 2011.

        But given the rate of change of their predictions the next prediction will maybe that WP will get to 5% by 2018.

    2. carljones

      Re: Windows "performance"

      You looked at the wrong column. Market share in GB is 9.2%

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

  16. Anonymous Coward
    WTF?

    No real numbers!

    I wonder why everyone is debating this as if Kantar had published real sales figures, when they are just the old, discredited panels (IBOPE, Nelson, etc.) under a single name! Check wikipedia - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kantar_Worldpanel - apparently they are extrapolating these numbers from a base of 3000 users worldwide.

    Strange how everyone new that Nelson (or IBOPE in Brasil) ratings were crap, but now some journalists are passing the same dross as if it were real sales numbers. Even when it contradicts almost everyone else.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Typo - Re: No real numbers!

      "[...]everyone Knew[...]"

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: No real numbers!

      Because it suits Microsoft's agenda to pretend that Windows Phone has traction, as without that illusion, even less people would be stupid enough to buy one.

  17. bigdish

    poking my head above the parapet...

    I had iPhones for 3 or 4 years, but this time (out of a sense of perversity probably) thought I'd give Nokia a try...Nokia mark you, not Windows - that kind of comes as a side effect of buying Nokia.

    I've got a Lumia 925, fantastic hardware, not plasticy, right amount of solidity and heft. Fantastic camera and Nokia smartcam software. Much better voice call quality than an iPhone.

    WP8 isn't bad either - there are some features missing, it's a bit like iOS3 or 4 in the sense that it feels a bit unfinished, but I haven't much suffered from a lack of apps, most of what I actually use (as opposed to all the iOS apps I downloaded and only used once) I've got. MS need to move the Bing button though (or let us turn it off) is currently in just the wrong place for single-handed phone use, gets hit by the pad of my thumb when I'm typing one-handed.

    Is the Lumia handset as good as an iPhone or Galaxy? Definitely

    Is WP8 as good as iOS or Android?...maybe not yet, but WP9 might get closer.

    All in all - I like it, I'll probably keep it....for a while

    1. Charles Manning

      Buy W8 because W9 might be better?

      So why not just buy what you want, then if or when W9 shows up, but a W9 phone if the crapness has been fixed.

      Buying anything hoping that the next version will be better is just pointless.... Perhaps you're the exact demographic they're targeting!

    2. Jess

      Re: maybe not yet, but WP9 might get closer.

      But precedent implies you will be certain to need a new handset to run it. (And it won't run the same software, though tied into only loading from a market, that may be much less relevant)

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    craptastic iPhone

    This just confirms the dumbing down that's occurring in anglo countries ...

  19. Captain Hogwash Silver badge

    WP in the UK

    A lot of people moving to smartphones for the first time will be buying Nokia due to:

    a) the excellent experience they have had with Nokia dumbphones.

    b) the appalling experience they have had with Samsung (and other) dumbphones.

    I know this to be true by the number of complaints I've heard for years among my mates and fellow pub goers about how they hate their new (dumb) phone and wish they'd got another Nokia. Samsung phones are particularly loathed. Explaining the difference between smartphones and dumbphones or different smartphone operating systems often falls on deaf ears. A case in point being a mate who bought a Sony Xperia because it had a camera with the most megapixels and was emphatically not a Samsung. Had Nokia Lumias been available at the time I'm sure he'd have gone for one of those.

    1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

      Re: WP in the UK

      I really liked my last Samsung, a £40 slider about 4 phones back now. My last non-smartphone. I abandoned Nokia when they refused to make slidey/clamshells. Sadly Motorola stopped making nice RAZRs too. Although I did go back to Nokia for a Lumia 710 which was excellent at £130. All other smarties have been work ones, except my Sony Ericsson P800 back in 2003.

      There's certainly an opportunity at the low-end though. Neither the phone shop salespeople, or the customers, seem to give a crap about what they sell/buy - so people end up with all sorts of inappropriate or just downright rubbish kit.

      I had a go at my friend about this the other day. Admitting you know nothing about phones/computers is fine. Laudable in fact. Admitting that you can't be arsed to learn, but still complain when they don't do what you want isn't quite so clever though...

      1. Captain Hogwash Silver badge

        Re: I really liked my last Samsung

        What people hated about Samsung dumbphones was the unintuitive UI which meant they could never find whatever function they were looking for. With Nokia phones this was never a problem. The reason they usually found themselves in such a bind is because they had been seduced by the sliding form factor. My only experience of this was whenever I was asked, being their tame techie, to figure out how to do something on someone else s phone. I have to agree they generally had a point. However, my first and only Samsung is the GT-I9000 I bought over three years ago and still use today albeit with Cyanogenmod installed. I'll be keeping it going until one of the niche players (Mozilla, Ubuntu, Jolla, etc.) makes their kit more widely available.

        1. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge

          Re: I really liked my last Samsung

          I agree, their UI was pretty rubbish. Although my one allowed you to select the most common functions and link to the 4-way navigation thingy, so I didn't often have to brave the menu. But then Nokia's original elegant simplicity was pretty crap by then. I had a work Nokia (in about 2008?), and by that point their menus were just as filled up and confusing as my old Motorola Razr, which also had crap software but a lovely form-factor.

          I've got a good memory and some IT skills, so unintuitive software is bearable but annoying. Except trying to set my Mum's Mini up with Bluetooth, which is almost impossible (particularly as the instruction manual appeared to be wrong and I had to guess).

  20. Ben Holmes

    I've had iPhones for the last 4, 5 years or so. My contract's up next month on my 4S, and I find myself seriously considering a Nokia Lumia 925. Why? Because it's a bit different, the majority of the apps I genuinely use (as opposed to downloading once and never touching again) are still present and I like the hardware.

    The only other option I'm thinking of is sacking off the whole upgrade process altogether and just moving down to a SIM-only contract, because I can't see Apple releasing anything in the near future that would be a worthwhile upgrade path from where I'm at now.

  21. TomMariner

    What surprise

    Microsoft gaining is no surprise. Yes we all love the iPhone, Android, et. al. for the interesting apps that come from where we are, letting us communicate on the go and keeping up to date. But the last I heard, there were this things call computers that let us conduct business, organize, etc. There are only two real reasons we still use these smaller, but still bigger than a phone beasts -- a) bigger screens and keyboards and b) run Windows programs (or their clones in the Linux world).

    As the Ubuntu Edge crowdsourcing $13 billion showed, there are folks who believe that in a year your phone will have enough power to run PC stuff. Yeah, Windows will gain here, that's why the guy who everybody love to hate, Ballmer helped his company develop a touchscreen OS. Laugh at Windows 8 when it comes from the tiny slab in your pocket to a convenient screen and keypad ... and runs Android and IOS.

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