Same old same old. Nokia need to get ahead of the curve and not just sit back with a poor update to an already poor handset. Oh and get rid of WM too!
Today, Nokia launched its best smartphone to date: the Lumia 925. I got some hands-on time with the Windows Phone 8-powered device - and a tour of the gadget by shoegaze icon Nokia senior veep of product management Kevin Shields, who explained some of the key design decisions. It's a covetable bit of kit - but with iPhones and …
This is getting ridiculous. Nokia either just don't get it or their design team need some sort of cathartic release. Yet again we see another sexy piece of hardware from Nokia that is handicapped with an OS that no one really wants.
Elop will be out on his ass by the end of the year. Taking his MSGR exclusivity agreement with him.
Grows 27% from where?
Android 149.8 (Q4 '12) --grows to---> 163.5 (Q1 '13) million units shipped
WiPho 5.1 (Q4 '12) --grows to---> 6.5 (Q1 '13) million units shipped
A drop in the bucket.
"No wants this OS??
"making Windows Phone the fastest growing OS sequentially.""
Talk about seeing what you want to. While I won't touch on the impartiality of wmpoweruser.com, Windows Phone may have the highest growth %, but based on that un-sourced table, Windows Phone sold 1.4 million more phones compared to the previous quarter, whereas Android sold 13.7 million more phones than the previous quarter.
So while Windows Phone may have 27% growth, they still sold 12.3 million less units than Android between Q4 and Q1.
2009 Nokia sold 100 million Symbian smartphones.
2010 Nokia sold 134 million Symbian smartphones.
So that was a net increase of 34 million and year over year growth of 34%. So for the past two years Nokia hasn't even been able to come close to that additional 34 million got all Lumia models combined. If Symbian was a burning platform, what is WP? Symbian had more of a future than WP ever will.
It's easy to grow the fastest when you come from a very low base.
WinPho with a 27% growth rate = increase of 1.4m quarter-on-quarter.
Android with a 9% growth rate = increase of 13.7m quarter-on-quarter.
Look at the Q12013 numbers Android was shipped on 163.5m phones, while WinPho was shipped on 6.5m phone. So for every person that bought a WinPho, 25 others bought an Android. Like I said, no-one is really that interested in WinPho and it's been that case for some time now.
Elop will be out by the end of the year and his MSFT exclusivity agreement will be thrown out with him.
You know that Microsoft own the wmpoweruser site? It's just a astroturfing site. Check the domain owners and spend a couple of minutes tracing the path back to Microsoft's viral marketing agencies...
I wouldn't trust too much you read there. Microsoft are pouring vast amounts of money into the media to convince users to buy Windows Phone, just like they did to convince the world they needed Xbox when Playstation when Playstation was the dominant player.
The Android FUD right now is coming from the same orrifice as the PS3 FUD a few years back. It's how Microsoft work, pay the media to post crap about the competition, convince everyone to take something "as competition is good for the consumer, so buy our crap" yadaydayada...
>Nokia that is handicapped with an OS that i haven't used and am not really qualified to talk about.
There, fixed that for you.
Indeed, I've managed perfectly fine with feature phones until a year ago, when I got an Android phone... I get on well with it, but I can't imagine it is the only way of skinning the cat. I've invested next to sod-all on apps... a couple I find very useful, but I've hardly scratched the surface of the thousands that are available for Android.
I imagine my next handset will be Android, but can't see anything wrong with some competition.
Windows Phone 8, has the same issue as Windows Phone 7 for me. Microsoft seem to like causing clipping atefacts. For example:
The screensaving clock can appear partially off screen and to indicate there is a scroll page to the left they show you the first character/part of the right hand page (but not the left). This drives me nuts, I love the different approach and every windows phone is as slick as butter but the fact puts me right off.
I have noticed a certain attitude which is good for Nokia/Microsoft, my little sisters has had problems with the wireless charging, bluetooth and the wifi (two replacement units). So far all her rage has been at O2 rather than the poorly working units. Where as the slightest problem on her Nexus S was always Googles fault. I've seen this was the 3 people I know with WP8 phones.
Another problem with Windows 8 phones is how identical they all are, MS need to let manufacturers have a little more flexibility with the form factor. I've seen people get disapointed that their new andriod phone still has the same user interface. Windows Phone 7/8 phones are really quite close in appearence which I think will put people off upgrading.
Actually its the other way around. A pretty decent piece of software running on a county, plasticky poorly build lump of hardware.
I was thinking of buying a 920 until I picked one up. Overweight and flimsy at the same time -- quite an achievement.
Some one needs to explain to Nokia that one really good phone is better than a range of 50 c*** phones.
So, same processor, memory, battery, software as the 920. No SD card or removable battery or Xenon flash like the 920...and they've removed wireless charging (except by buying an add on?)
No, not what I was waiting for to upgrade my N8, was hoping for the rumoured Lumia EOS with a proper Pureview lens, HDMI out and FM transmitter with expandable storage.
Sorry Nokia, I've waited a long time for something worth upgrading to but my patience may well have run out.
Me too - I was expecting a true Windows Pureview phone and naturally expected it to be superior to my current 808 Pureview. Prior to the 808 I had the N8.
Nokia pushed Symbian to be extremely usable (and I'd say - still - superior in many ways to Android and iOS) in its latter phones such as the N8 and 808.
I don't have an irrational "hatred" of MS, but based on the recent hype expected a true successor to the 808 from an OS that is still I think, a beta or incomplete (for a 2013 mobile OS) product.
I was extremely disappointed that I was unable to buy the Meego powered N9 in the UK (or anywhere other than Timbuktu or the dark side of the moon) and that Nokia abandoned what was a very promising platform.
I wonder where Nokia and its ecosystem would now be had Meego not been abandoned.
I'll 2nd that. The N8 is my first ever symbian phone and it just works - fantastic battery life, solid design, and has enough decent apps it can be used on the car console (sweet driving mode+maps).
My N9 is lovely too (from Malayasia apparently), but battery life is not even close to the N8. Screen is wonderful, and the linux is reassuring. You can hit an icon and broadcast the phone to your desktop, social media etc..
We'll all just have to see what the Jolla/Sailfish folks can bring out...
Windows Phone is not capable of the processing grunt required for the proper Pureview (not the 920 Pureview branding that put it on par with an Xperia Arc from 2012).
You have a long wait. if you want a REALLY good phone that's a REALLY good camera too, then the Xperia Z is really your only choice.
Can we get OS choices anytime soon, Nokia?
You're like a restaurant offering a single dish. These are modern times, people like choice and they don't like to downgrade their software options. There are no onsite CAD and measurement taking apps on windows, there are no Pro-level audio recording, sequencing, synthesis apps on Windows the list of not available stuff goes on and on. Some of the app types they do claim to have 'available' are so barebones, they don't deserve the name.
Some people say: "soon they will have the same quality apps as iOS and Android" That'll be great, but "soon" is certainly no reason to buy a device now, cause it'll be discontinued long before the great apps happen there.
No replaceable battery and no SD slot is also a downgrade. A terminal downgrade.
And while I don't like Samsung completely dominating the industry, they dominate because they actually read what people want and build their products accordingly, offering things like SD slots and replaceable batteries of high capacity and a variety of operating systems. Samsung is like a big bakery, any size or flavor of bread or cake you want, they probably have it.
Tend to disagree with that comment. The good just got more widely available is probably how I would describe it.
I think all the feature phones on all platforms are as good as each other it just comes down to personal preference (mine is wp8 currently) the 925 looks nice but 16gb storage and no built in wireless charging are not the best way to sell a device to potentially new customers who you want to convince to move from android.
This looks like a return to what Nokia used to be good at: world beating industrial design. Even the One looks cheap compared to this. Snide remarks about Microsoft and Windows aside (this is not the 90s, and there's evil enough to spread in the software business these days), I hope this is the phone that starts a real, actual reversal in Nokia's fortunes.
Once you have no SD card and a sealed battery, then WTF are they doing not making it waterproof?
Considering the times I have had to remove the battery to reset my HTC phone, and the rapid demise of an iPhone with water (as you can't get the battery out to give it a chance to dry our before electrolysis destroys it) this is a big deal.
Yes, I know Nokia is not the only one doing this, but if you are making the device effectively sealed, then do it properly!
>Once you have no SD card and a sealed battery, then WTF are they doing not making it waterproof?
Two of the three waterproof Sony phones (Xperia Go and ZR) have replaceable batteries - they just employ a rubbery seal around the battery compartment... the compromise tends to be on loudspeaker quality.
Sodcasting in a pub or bus is nasty, but for spoken-word radio or podcasts a built-in speaker is handy. YMMV.
I decided to check this.
I went to nokia.com - it referred me to my local version of it.
I clicked on the nokai 925 links (noting that the first picture on the main site was a 920 with winpho proudly displayed).
On the 925 page I got pictures, able to scroll through them, and the first didn't show winpho, but later in the series it was visible.
Going down I got some assorted pictures on the screen, and finally I got to (rougly translated): "Powered by Windows Phone 8 and Nokia Lumia 925 is filled with powerful smart-phone functionalities. [...]" Along with photos clearly showing the operating system.
Now granted, they aren't flaunting it on the very first image of the phone - but that might also relate to them trying to sell the phone on the camera, which was the topic of the first few sections.
Since no one seems to like Microsoft, I'd think there'd be enough stories to go around, without having to invent new ones?
More like that, as every bugger under the sun knows what a WinPho screenshot looks like, a screenshot is a waste of advertising space. There's only a point to a screenshot if you've skinned the OS yourself.
I know damned well what that screen loks like without a picture and more to the point, I'll bet you do too.
"HUGE STORY"? Yeah......right.........if you can find somewhere that also accepts copy on the exciting subject of how the sun came up this morning, you might get that published.
erm how sorry? considering the pure volume of companys ripping on win phone and the square tiles atm its pretty obvious that the deterant isnt the software or the ui, its actually fools like you who have probably not used a windows 8 phone in their life slating it to join the band wagon. Its sleek, quick, user friendly and probably the best experience on a phone i have used albeit still very young and limited...
Or perhaps the Reg was given a dirty great press pack with a load of photos in, and decided to show the readers the pictures of the 925 showing the new piece of hardware?
Honestly chap, you really need to use one of these things for a week. It won't kill you, it won't eat your children, and it won't do unspeakable things to your dog. It's a very slick OS on a phone, and works beautifully with social feeds and Outlook, Office, and so on.
Having spent over a month with a Win8 Pro slate, WP8 is miles ahead of that - don't base your opinion on your irrational hatred of Microsoft, or that you might have stabbed your fingers at a Win8 desktop.
With the self confessed mess of Android, and the steady stagnation of iOS, there's only WP8 and BB10 offering anything new in the phone space at the moment. Personally I prefer WP8 as it less convoluted than BB10, but there's merits to each.
Anyway, OS arguments aside - looks a nice bit of shiny, can't wait to get my hands on it.
Please catch up at the back there Eadon. The actual press release, while headlining with a video, has this image just below, clearly showing the W8 UI.
If you're going to rant on about the platform, at least make your complaints vaguely accurate. Remember the old saying of it's better for people to think you an idiot than to open your mouth and prove it.
You mean "What does WinPho not do that SYMBIAN can do" You know Symbian that OTHER fully matured real time OS that Nokia wants everybody to forget!!!
1) FULL 2-way call recording especially over BT headsets/carkits
2) proper multitasking
3) TAKE BETTER PHOTOS thanks to it's REAL pureview technology and 41MPIXEL sensor!!!
4) longer battery life even with a less mA-battery!
5) has a file manager with FULL bluetooth transfer capabilities
6) timed profiles
7) independant volume for calls and media playback
8) fully themable UI with folders and SVG iconsets!
9) BOTH cloud and local (USB/BT) syncing
In fact is there ANY reason at all why I should buy a WP8-device? As even a mediocre Android phone like the Xperia Z can do MORE then EVERY WP-device on the market.
FU Nokia. Give us an update for that 808 Pureview and we'll sit up. We are NOT interested in WP-devices!
"What does WinPho not do that Android, Blackberry or iOS does do? Fart apps?"
Even Nokia's "former" smartphone OS has these features!
1) FULL 2-way call recording
2) PROPER multitasking
3) FULL bluetooth transfer and syncing capabilities WITH e.g. included filemanager\
4) Take BETTER pictures (Nokia 808 Pureview) due to 41mpxls sensoer and REAL pureview-technoklogy (this is JUST a standard Sony BSI-senor with OIS)
5) timed profiles
6) independant volume for calls, mediaplayback and system
7) Local syncing (BT/USB)
8) better battery life
I can write a lot more ,but this is just for starters. AND this is just compared to Nokia's SYMBIAN.
As for Android.
1) full HD screen & media playback
2) multiple apps multiscreen (SGS3/4)
3) full USB/BT/WIFI sync with e.g. Outlook (e.g. through Phone Explorer)
4) full 2-way call recording (SGS3 when rooted and special apps like Total recall)
5) proper NFC through BT AND Wifi (wifi-direct)
WP8 as an OS just sucks! This model with Harmattan or Symbian would be better!
For different folks, I guess. I read so much about the Galaxy's "cheap plasticky construction" but I'm very happy with my S3's construction precisely for the reasons that seem to be dismissed as of less worth than "luxury engineering" - its replaceable battery and expandable storage. Give me a plastic shell that comes apart to allow swapping out a battery and a microSD slot over a shiny metal unibody ANY DAY. I hope that Samsung keeps bucking the trend for a while longer, so that when I replace my S3, I can do so with a phone that still offers both a replaceable battery and expandable storage.
I've got a luxurious iPhone 5, made out of premium materials such as aluminium and glass, and I spit on you peasants with your plastic phones!
Unfortunately due to the violent action of doing this, the stupid slippery piece of crap just slid out of my hand and smashed into a million pieces on the concrete floor. Although I suppose it's an improvement on the iPhones 4 and 4S with the even sillier glass back. Because putting a pointlessly easily fragile surface material where it's not needed to look good is apparently genius design...
As it happens, the problem is easily solved by putting a rubber bumper on it, or using a case. But I'm not a fan of the iPhone designs since the 3S, which was a much more 'hand friendly' shape.
I think my favourite was the HTC Desire (and other models for a while after) with the all metal construction for toughness, but that rubberised stuff on the back where your hand goes to make it non-slippy and also warmer when you're holding it in winter. I also agree with you on the SD card - although companies could get round that by giving you extra storage. 16GB as the only option is ridiculous.
Give me a plastic shell that comes apart to allow swapping out a battery and a microSD slot over a shiny metal unibody ANY DAY.
Agreed ... but those don't have to be alternatives. My old HTC Legend has a one-piece metal body and still manages to offer a removable battery and SD card. It's a great pity that HTC seem to have abandoned user-accessible batteries and user-expandable memory.
Mine's the one with the Samsung in the pocket -- one of the many, I should say.
Why? I know lots of people with Samsungs and they never swap the battery. Why? Because you have to:
1. pre-charging the spare battery
2. powering the phone down,
3. swapping the battery,
4. booting it up again and
5. relaunching the app you were using...
...which is far more hassle that carrying a wall charger or car charger. Unless you are going on an expedition to the dark ages, you will always find a power-socket.
The SD card slot - May be. But the battery? After a 2 year contract you get a new phone anyway.
It seems we have different definitions of "hassle". I always have a battery pre-charged, and swapping batteries takes me, with one hand's usability significantly impaired by CP-induced hemiparesis, less than ten seconds. That's less hassle for me than having to find a socket, especially since I don't drive and thus don't own a car (buying one just use as a charger would be too much hassle, I think).
...But you still have to pre-charge the other battery, which *is* hassle. Just saying that "I always have a battery pre-charged" kind of hides the extra hassle of managing more that one battery, I think.
Also I'm guessing that it's actually more that 10 second to change a phone battery if you include power-down/power-up/relaunch. More like 30 seconds on a good day.
You don't have to pre-charge a charger.
....just what I've felt with Lumia (granted, 820).
Upgraded to 4-year-old HTC with Android after a month or so with Lumia. Great hardware, lovely camera, bright screen.... but everything software is backwards:
- can't get a good free ebook reader
- no file browser
- you must use skydrive to store your stuff
- if yiou get multiple apps for the same thing, each app downloads a separate copy of the file (if it manages to be compatible with it in the first place)
So it's back to Android and Aldiko, thankyouverymuch
Depends whether you want to sell any or not. I might have bought one, but for that.
Now, I wonder how much of that omission was down to design considerations and how much was due to commercial considerations? Put it this way; I doubt Vodafone would have kicked in quite so much for an exclusive deal on the 32Gb version, if the punters could just buy the 16 anywhere and whack in as much additional storage as they wanted.
Also Apple should sue. I'm sure that removing any expansion capabilities, so you can fleece punters by charging an eye-watering price for every additional gigabyte, is their IP.
I hope this isn't a direction nokia is taking... I have found the ease of charging my phone really rather pleasing... yes, its not hard to poke a micro usb cable in, but at night or at my desk, if I want to pick up the phone I just do... there isn't a mess of lead to snag, or deal with...
and the wireless jacket, Christ on a bike! way to murder a lovely design!
add an SD card slot, load it with stock Android 4.2 and then bundle Nokia's own goodies like public transport info and off-line satnav etc and I suspect Nokia wouldn't be able to make them fast enough. The problem is WP8 - good or bad Joe Public really doesn't seem to give a toss about it.
Add 3/4G, include tethering, upgrade the bluetooth and switch the damned MMC slot for micro SD. You'd have a phone with a half-life of probably at least two centuries which is small enough to carry everywhere and you don't have to worry about dropping or benchmarking it's O/S.
I'll get my coat.....
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