back to article Second Higgs possibility pops up in CERN data

Isn’t that just typical? Science waits half a century for a Higgs boson, and when it arrives, just like a bus, a second one is right behind. That’s the tantalising prospect raised by the most recent release of data from the Large Hadron Collider scientists, who had barely finished celebrating after confirming that they’d …

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  1. J. R. Hartley Silver badge

    Goddam!!

    1. James Micallef Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      Goddam!!

      CERN has identified a zombie Higgs Boson!!

      1. Evil Auditor Silver badge
        Thumb Up

        Re: Goddam!!

        @James Micallef: Exactly my thought! But don't worry, not much of Higgs Boson's brain is left. Now it's just an animal.

  2. Philipsz
    Joke

    Amazing!

    So CERN finally grew a pair.

    1. Zaphod.Beeblebrox
      Joke

      Re: Amazing!

      Erm, wrong gender, they are twin peaks after all...

  3. Bill Posters

    Nearly there

    Only 40 more to find.

    1. stizzleswick
      Facepalm

      Re: Nearly there

      Yes, but what was the question?

      1. Isendel Steel

        Re: Nearly there

        The only problem being that if we find the answer, it will be replaced by something even more inexplicable....or given that potentially 2 particles have been "found", maybe that is already the case.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Mushroom

      Re: Nearly there

      Might be the case.

      I personaly don't elieve we will fully know the higgs boson until we can properly define gravity and by that explain why it is weaker than it is.

      For all we know there are many more, some could be created into another universe(s), we just don't know and with that you may well get your 40 or 42, I'm going to pick 13 as this is becomming a lottery :).

      1. Zaphod.Beeblebrox
        Trollface

        Re: explain why [gravity] is weaker than it is

        I think you need to explain why your comment is less understandable than it is.

  4. Pondule

    El Reg's comment section has gone down hill.

    1. J. R. Hartley Silver badge

      Goddam right it has :/

    2. Lars Silver badge
      Pint

      "El Reg's comment section has gone down hill."

      After midnight, may explain it all.

      1. The First Dave Silver badge
        Headmaster

        Technically, it is _always_ after midnight...

        1. andy k O'Croydon
          Angel

          "Technically, it is _always_ after midnight"

          If it's always after midnight, when can i feed these gremlins?

    3. imanidiot Silver badge
      Joke

      And this is new how?

      I doubt we've ever been ON the hill to begin with!

    4. chris 233
      Coat

      uphill?

      I'd have said comment section was up something, but not a hill!

    5. TheRealRoland
      Happy

      In my time...

      It was always uphill, both ways!

  5. stucs201
    Joke

    So we're dealing with a pantheon then.

    It seems its not just a one true 'god' particle after all.

    (Yes, yes, I know its not a god particle really).

    1. Notas Badoff

      Funny you should mention 'pantheon'

      LHC : a temple dedicated to an unknown god (or two or however many show up)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Devil

        Re: Funny you should mention 'pantheon'

        Ooooo there is the heavenly host, in the Old Testament's book of Genius's - so that means there is a lot of gods there.

        There are the 5000 semi, demi and gods in the bardo states.

        Everyone one of use that the word of god has been given too, is a god, so about 3 billion people have a giddymans bible (or Mao's little red book will do - thus making it about 4 billion people).

        Mmmmmmmmmmmmm

        Ooooooo that is an awful lot of god particles.

        1. bobbles31

          Re: Funny you should mention 'pantheon'

          They are all small gods waiting for people to believe in them.

          1. Michael H.F. Wilkinson Silver badge
            Happy

            Re: Funny you should mention 'pantheon'

            In the beginning was the word, and the word was "Hey, ... you!!"

    2. Norman Hartnell

      Re: So we're dealing with a pantheon then.

      There are lots of gods, they are just rolled up too small to see.

    3. Zaphod.Beeblebrox
      Big Brother

      Re: So we're dealing with a pantheon then.

      Seems like we must be waiting on the third one - Father, So,n and Holy Ghost, etc.

      Where's the priest icon or other icon with religious over/undertones? Guess big brother will have to do...

  6. Marketing Hack Silver badge
    Go

    Pretty soon bosons are going to be like toasters.....

    Man declares particle God, man builds huge temple to find God, man finds God, Man complains that there is to much God!

    We need a "deep thought" icon!

    1. kyza

      Re: Pretty soon bosons are going to be like toasters.....

      Marketing geek at publisher calls particle 'god'. Scientists spend next 30 years trying to loose the name.

      1. Martin
        Headmaster

        Scientists spend next 30 years trying to LOSE the name.

        Sigh.

        1. TheRealRoland
          Happy

          Re: Scientists spend next 30 years trying to LOSE the name.

          But, to his credit - if it's loose, it'll fall off any moment...

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    It is just statistical error

    CMS does not see a difference between the masses. This peak is a single Higgs.

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Boffin

      KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON INCREASING STANDARD DEVIATIONS (away from the null hypothesis)

      > This peak is a single Higgs.

      Most quite likely on a likelihood scale of 0..1

      After discussion plots, Tommaso Dorigo of the CMS collaboration has this to say:

      So, to answer the question one idea is of course that some miscalibration systematics are affecting either or both mass measurements in ATLAS. However, I am sure this has been beaten down to death by the experimenters before making public the present results.

      Another idea is that the gamma-gamma signal contains some unexpected background which somehow shifts the best-fit mass to higher values, also contributing to the anomalously high signal rate. However, this also does not hold much water - if you look at the various mass histograms produced by ATLAS (there is a bunch here) you do not see anything striking as suspicious in the background distributions.

      Then there is the possibility of a statistical fluctuation. I think this is the most likely explanation, and I am willing to bet $100 with as many as five takers that the two measurements will be reconciled with each other once more statistics is added, and that no observation of a double state will be made. This however might take three years to sort out, given the impending shutdown of the LHC.

      Finally, you might instead want to believe that we are indeed looking at the first hint of new physics -Supersymmetry or some other model producing multiple Higgs-like particles. Very exciting, but I just do not buy that.

      Time will tell! So if you have some extra cash to throw away consider taking the bet...

      1. Derek Jones

        Re: KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON INCREASING STANDARD DEVIATIONS (away from the null hypothesis)

        A detailed discussion of why there is really only one Higgs boson here:

        http://profmattstrassler.com/2012/12/17/two-higgs-bosons-no-evidence-for-that/

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It is just statistical error

      Atlas needs to stop showing off. It's only there to verify CMS data.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The failed god hypothesis takes another whack

    That's gotta hurt.

  9. Neil Barnes Silver badge
    Coat

    Twin peaks?

    Damn fine cherry pie!

    1. Crisp Silver badge
      Coat

      Re: Twin peaks?

      Bob did it.

      1. hplasm Silver badge
        Angel

        Re: Twin peaks?

        For the slack?

  10. Thomas 4
    Boffin

    Time out a second...

    Did they just say a particle that gives *mass* to substances decays into massless photons? I'm not a scientist and my understanding of stuff like this is hazy at best but shouldn't this be impossible? oO

    1. SJB

      Re: Time out a second...

      I think you've answered your own question there...

      1. Richard Wharram

        Re: Time out a second...

        Gives mass != has mass

    2. Schultz
      Boffin

      Re: Time out a second...

      E=mc^2.

      You need two photons to make sure that energy and impulse conservation are observed at all times (one photon cannot freely choose both).

    3. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Big Brother

      Re: Time out a second...

      The particle has rest mass, yes. 140 GeV/c², was it?

      In this universe, any operation conserves the quantity mass energy, not the quantity rest mass. Transformations between energy and rest mass are scaled according E=mc²

      So you can have the rest mass of 140 GeV/c² going away as long as the 0-rest-mass-photons coming out of your operations have a total energy of 140 GeV/c²

      This is how matter/antimatter annihilation can happen.

      Big Brother because Big Mass.

  11. Richard Wharram

    It's Mrs Higgs Boson.

    Look out at double the mass for the Higgs Boson's mother in law.

  12. Crisp Silver badge

    As exciting as this is for supporters of the standard model.

    Am I the only just a little disappointed that the LHC didn't open a portal to the underworld?

    1. Omgwtfbbqtime Silver badge
      Coat

      Re: As exciting as this is for supporters of the standard model.

      Nope, just that we haven't got a portal to Xen.

      Or so they'd have us believe.....

      Mine's the one with the HEV suit batteries in it.

    2. kyza
      Happy

      Re: As exciting as this is for supporters of the standard model.

      Don't be too down, they've only cranked the thing up to halfway.

      There will be plenty of 'MAXIMUM POWER IGOR!' opportunities next year after the strip-down & refurb.

    3. Soruk
      Go

      Re: As exciting as this is for supporters of the standard model.

      No, it just turned a bunch of maintenance engineers into cannibalistic zombies.

    4. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge
      Mushroom

      Re: As exciting as this is for supporters of the standard model.

      They have until friday to destroy the world

      21-12-12 .......

  13. This post has been deleted by a moderator

  14. Michael H.F. Wilkinson Silver badge
    Joke

    Has the LHC developed a squint?

  15. Fading Silver badge
    Pint

    Quantum duality effect?

    Surely it merely exists at both energies?

  16. Wombling_Free
    Coat

    Is it the anti-higgs?

    If the Higgs Bosun gives other particles mass.... would an anti-higgs eat all the pi?

    Ok, I'm going, I'm going, you can stop hurling relativistic gold nuclei at me!

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: Is it the anti-higgs?

      >I'm going, you can stop hurling relativistic gold nuclei at me!

      Hmmm, the LHC gives a relativistic mass boost of about 5000x

      So if you did put some gold in there it would be worth 5000x as much - assuming you sold it while it was still in the beam. I think this could be an opportunity for some relativistic, high speed trading.

  17. Vladimir Plouzhnikov

    This is so simple

    Bosuns are splitting in twos because of all those mutated newtrinos. As them bosuns particles multiply in the Earth's core it will freewheel and all the mountains will start to move! Only those who got tickets to 3 Chinese boats will survive. I saw that all happen in a movie so that must be true (it had the right date on it).

  18. envmod

    The one that decays into the Z boson is obviously the dreaded

    Zod Particle.

    KNEEL BEFORE ZOD!

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Also for the friends of the earth

    We havent created the black hole yet either, that'll be on friday......

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