back to article Microsoft sets October date for Windows 8 release

Microsoft has set the date for the release of Windows 8: the operating system will be released to manufacturers in August ahead of a general release at the end of October. "The wait is almost over," said Tami Reller, chief marketing officer of Microsoft's Windows division. "Windows 8 is on track to be released to manufacturing …

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  1. JDX Gold badge

    Aside from the inevitable "it's dross" comments which I'll leave to others, A couple of neat things:

    >>Anyone buying a PC from today will be able to upgrade to Windows 8 for $14.95, she said, and for the rest of us the $39.99 price tag looks set in stone

    >>All customers will get access to SkyDrive cloud storage with a Windows 8 purchase

    SkyDrive for free especially seems quite cool, depending how much you get. I do wonder though what happens if you already have a Windows Phone... can you combine your included storage?

    1. jonathanb Silver badge

      Anyone with a hotmail account already gets free Skydrive. Do you get more storage if you have Windows 8?

    2. LarsG
      Trollface

      AND HOT ON THE HEELS OF WIN 8

      Will be the release of the Surface from Fantasy Island sometime in the near future, guaranteed before 2015.

      De surface! De surface! Mr Roarke, De surface is here!

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      US only deal and not OEM copies.

      Only retail copies are actually upgradeable for that headline price..

      Not any anyone with even half a brain would actually want to pay to downgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: US only deal and not OEM copies.

        "Not any anyone with even half a brain would actually want to pay to downgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8."

        Yeah, who needs faster boot times, performance and stability improvements, native USB 3.0, Drobo-esque storage virtualisation, a factory reset feature negating the need for reinstalls, etc. etc. After all it does have that nasty Metro UI that forces you to leave your comfort zone (assuming you've actually bothered using it for any length of time),

  2. ukgnome Silver badge
    Trollface

    Why wait until October? Isn't it ready yet?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Of course not. It won't be "ready" in October, either, but that won't stop them selling it.

    2. Mikel

      "Thriller" launch theme

      Like the Windows Phone launch.

  3. Dan Paul
    Joke

    How long will Windows 7 be supported and for sale?

    How long have I got to buy a couple of copies of Windows 7 so I won't be subjected to Windows 8?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: How long will Windows 7 be supported and for sale?

      I'd imagine it will disappear from sale as soon as stocks are exhausted.

      As for support, if XP is anything go to by, Win7 will probably be supported till around 2100!

      1. Anonymous Custard Silver badge
        Meh

        Re: How long will Windows 7 be supported and for sale?

        Between this and Surface (aka oem backstabbing), you think M$ are going to be around in 2100?

        Or 2014 for that matter?

        1. Phil O'Sophical Silver badge
          Trollface

          Re: How long will Windows 7 be supported and for sale?

          They'll likely make it past 2038, which is more than some OSes will...

  4. LinkOfHyrule
    Joke

    Is it just me or are they releasing new versions of this thing more regularly thee days? Seems like only yesterday 7 came out. Bloody windows salespeople always trying to flog you cheap crap that dosnt last! Give me a good old quality sash any day!

    1. That Steve Guy

      Frequent releases

      I do not think you are alone here, doesn't seem like yesterday we had 7's release following on so sharply on the heels of the vista flop.

      My home rig still runs XP, looks like I need to get my act together to buy a Win 7 license before the Metro is forced down my throat.

    2. This post has been deleted by its author

      1. Giles Jones Gold badge

        There's the problem, 57 months from XP to Win7 was a long time. 6 years between operating systems? some people only keep their car three years.

        1. This post has been deleted by its author

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Well, up to a point

          True about consumers. But sad when you think about OSes in general. I am faintly embarrassed to admit I had SunOS 4 apps running on Solaris 10 nearly twenty years later, and I only went to sol 10 to watch it flame out under Linux ^H^H^H^H... because 2.5 was the last release that ran on the ancient intel box I had.

          Next time you order a pizza, look closely at the little server running in the corner. It might just be one of mine.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "Whether that justifies the rapid turnover is a totally different matter - I don't think it does, and I think 7 should be around for a hell of a lot longer than they're letting it be."

        Eh? Why? It's still going to be supported until 2020, and no-one is being forced to upgrade. Why should development be slowed for no reason when no other OS (or software in general) is released in such long intervals?

        1. This post has been deleted by its author

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Well that sounds more like a "I don't like Windows 8" issue than an problem with Microsoft moving between releases too quickly. Presumably if you thought Windows 8 was better than Windows 7 then you wouldn't have an issue with not being able to purchase Windows 7.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          '...and no-one is being forced to upgrade.'

          There's plenty of material around the web for you to look at which describes how Microsoft makes its money. Sorry if I can't be bothered to link to it here.

      3. Tom 13

        @HolyFreakinGhost: If you're going to be fair,

        You need to recognize that 98ME was a stop-gap marketing attempt to juice the cash flow because 2000 didn't. And although XP was sold to consumers, it was a combined platform for Enterprise as it was built on the 2000 kernel. I think Enterprises adopted XP much more quickly than consumers did.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Emulating Apple who do a release every year or so. Smaller releases, cheaper upgrades.

      Customers don't like to wait five years and then have a big massive upgrade looming where everything has moved and has been renamed.

      The leap from XP to Vista was quite significant.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        No they wait a couple of years and have an OS where everything has moved and has been renamed..

        Windows 8 is a disaster-zone and best avoided.

      2. Simon B
        FAIL

        The leap from XP to Vista was quite significant. - Yep, namely it was shite!

        Win8 is the next Vista.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Annual upgrades

      Microsoft have stated they plan to move to annual upgrades for windows and office in the future. They are moving away from the big bang approach to more incremental builds - this will help keep the corporations from doing anything too stupid like seeking alternate platforms.

    5. John Bailey

      It's not just you.

      XP was around an unusually long time, which is what is throwing everybody. Vista was shoved behind the sofa as quick as possible, and 7 was released a few years ago I think. They were supposed to be using a 3 year release cycle from Vista on I think..

      No big deal though, No real need for anybody to use every release. Business will quite likely only use every second release at most, and home users will use what ever comes with the new PC.

    6. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Windows 1.0 - 1985

      Windows 2.0 - 1987

      Windows 2.1 - 1988

      Windows 3.0 - 1990

      Windows 3.1 - 1992

      Windows 95 - 1995 (big surprise)

      Windows 98 - 1998 (and again)

      Windows Me - 2000

      Windows XP - 2001

      The due to the well documented issues with developing Longhorn we had to wait five years until Windows Vista, before returning to a more normal release schedule. That was the exception to the rule but due to everyone's chronically short memory span (and because everyone on the Internet is something like twelve years old it seems) it seemed to have been set as the benchmark for what the norm is.

      1. Tom 13

        @everyone's chronically short memory span

        I don't think it has anything to do with short memory spans, and everything to do with the fact that until they fracked up on the XP release schedule, nobody knew how nice it could be to have a stable OS for a 5 or 6 year period. Five or six years to recover the cost of a capital investment in your company is a lot easier to swallow than every 2-3 years.

        Also, in the early years there was real, usable growth in what computers could do. But we've now entered the era when improvements in computing power don't actually affect the real productivity of your typical computer user. Page layout and cad work (both things I did professionally back in the day) were slow and tedious even on the expensive rigs. These days my home system would produce acceptable performance.

  5. Eponymous Cowherd
    Thumb Down

    The wait is almost over?

    "The wait is almost over," said Tami Reller, chief marketing officer of Microsoft's Windows division.

    Was I supposed to be waiting for something?

    1. dotdavid
      Thumb Up

      Re: The wait is almost over?

      "Was I supposed to be waiting for something?"

      I think the general consensus is "Windows 9" ;-)

  6. the-it-slayer
    Mushroom

    Techies...

    Press your panic button now to prepare for an amass of technical support for the next 24 months!

  7. Wensleydale Cheese Silver badge

    I wonder what those prices will be in my country

    "Anyone buying a PC from today will be able to upgrade to Windows 8 for $14.95, she said, and for the rest of us the $39.99 price tag looks set in stone. "

    Any guesses from non-US readers on what that will translate to in your currency?

    1. Steve Davies 3 Silver badge
      FAIL

      Re: I wonder what those prices will be in my country

      My guess is 19.99 GBP and 49.99GBP including VAT.

      then there is this

      Resellers can make up to 23 points of margin, which Ballmer claimed was 11 points more than the competition.

      Who is the competition exactly?

      Finally, the non arrival of fondleslabs that run Windows 8 unti 2013 is an outright failure. We'll be expecting the next iPad next March (probably) and this delay gives the Android boys another chance to get their act together. Could their all signing all dancing device be running on hardware that is close to two generations out of date?

      Please Mr Balmer, why should I wait this long when I can buy a number of devices that will do me perfectly well today?

    2. Al Jones

      Re: I wonder what those prices will be in my country

      https://windowsupgradeoffer.com/en/Home/Faq

      What is the local pricing for the offer, in the 23 currencies?

      The price displayed is an estimated retail price at the time these FAQs were published. The actual price of the offer will vary by region since it is dependent on a variety of specific factors including exchange rate, local taxes, duties, fees, local market conditions and other pricing considerations, and may vary by each independent reseller. The actual price you pay may be more than the advertised price, due to these additional factors.

      AUD - Australian Dollar $14.99

      BRL - Brazilian Real R$29

      CAD - Canadian Dollar $14.99

      CHF - Swiss Franc Fr. 17.95

      CNY - Chinese Yuan ¥98

      DKK - Danish Krone kr. 119

      EUR - Euro € 14.99

      GBP - British Pounds £14.99

      HKD - Hong Kong Dollar HK$119

      INR - Indian Rupee INR 699

      ISK - Icelandic Krona 2,499 kr

      JPY - Japanese Yen ¥1,200

      KRW - South Korean Won ₩16,300

      MXN - Mexican Peso $199

      NOK - Norwegian Krone kr 119

      NZD - New Zealand Dollar $19.99

      PLN - Polish Zloty 69 zl

      RUB - Russian Rubles RUB 469

      SEK - Swedish Kronor 139 kr

      SGD - Singapore Dollar $17.99

      TRY - Turkish Lira TRY 29

      TWD - Taiwan Dollar NT$439

      USD - US Dollar $14.99

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I wonder what those prices will be in my country

        Hmmm. AUD - Australian Dollar $14.99; GBP - British Pounds £14.99.

        Exchange rate: 1 British pound = 1.52187132 Australian dollars.

    3. DigiGato
      Meh

      Re: I wonder what those prices will be in my country

      In my case (México)

      $14.95 = $206.31 MXP

      $39.99 = $551.87 MXP

      To be honest, it is quite cheaper compared to Windows 7 current prices:

      Windows 7 Ultimate: $4050 MXP = $312.74 USD

      Anyway, I'll wait and see if it'll be ready to download in my country or if this "release" will be US only.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Will have to buy a copy.

    Stupidly used my own tablet to try it out, instead of a work one.

    It's not a complete abortion for tablets anyway, so it's not that bad.

    Alas Metro sucks arse for desktops, so I'm just going to wait until there's a start button.

    I don't think microsoft actually cares it's shit for desktops, they just want to bring out something that will force Apple to drop prices.

    1. h4rm0ny

      Re: Will have to buy a copy.

      "Alas Metro sucks arse for desktops, so I'm just going to wait until there's a start button. I don't think microsoft actually cares it's shit for desktops, they just want to bring out something that will force Apple to drop prices."

      I think you'll have a long wait for a Start button on Windows 8. You certainly wont get one from Microsoft, though a passably reasonable kludge will probably appear from someone. But I've been trying it out on my Desktop and I actually prefer it by this point. It's better for multiple-monitors than Win7 and Metro is quicker in practice than the Start menu for most of my tasks. I'd consider myself a power user - use twenty-plus programs regularly and that number fits easily on the main Metro page. Though to launch something I typically just hit the Windows key and type the first couple of letters of what I want. I can get something launched with Metro this way in around the time it would take to reach for the mouse and move the cursor to the bottom left. No hyperbole - I actually do.

      1. Tim Bates

        Re: Kludge

        "though a passably reasonable kludge will probably appear from someone."

        Already available..... http://lee-soft.com/news/windows-8-start-menu/

      2. jonathanb Silver badge

        Re: Will have to buy a copy.

        I tried Windows 8 on a Parallels VM on my Macbook. It is certainly faster than Windows 7 on the same hardware, and only slightly slower than XP, which is what I use most of the time.

        However, two problems with Metro. First, you have to hunt through all the non-important stuff (eg. Canon Utilities which you run once to set up the printer, then never look at again) to find the progs you actually want to run. Second, if you run your VM in window mode, useful if you regularly switch between Mac and Windows progs, finding the exact pixel on the screen that activates the Metro UI isn't that easy.

  9. Ken Hagan Gold badge

    Now with 11% more than nothing

    "[Ballmer] sweetened the pot further for partners with the promise of increased margins on the Office platform. Resellers can make up to 23 points of margin, which Ballmer claimed was 11 points more than the competition."

    The competition for Office?

    Is there anyone still out there charging money for an alternative to Office?

    Even if there is, are there any resellers out there actually offering it with a new machine?

  10. Kebablog

    I'm sure some people will love it, but after initial testing it's not ready for a corporate deployment.

  11. jason 7
    Facepalm

    Your over confidence astounds me!

    "Her boss Steve Ballmer claimed that Windows 8 would be the biggest deal for Microsoft in 17 years, since the launch of Windows 95."

    Oh dear, someone's going to be a bit disappointed come October.

    1. That Steve Guy

      Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

      Replace the word "deal" with "gamble" and you have what he's really saying.

    2. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. Heimdallr

      Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

      Sorry but can someone tell me why everyone is so negative about Windows 8 when it hasn't even been released yet. If it builds on Windows 7 then I predict it will be a very good OS.

      The incessant anti microsoft mantra is almost as tedious as the unconditional Apple lovein.

      1. Steve Davies 3 Silver badge
        Alien

        Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

        So you haven't tried the two previews have you?

        Lots of us here have and given it a solid thumbs down.

        As for the Apple Love-Ins... The recent stories about Apple have hardly been a 'Love-In'.

        Hmmm .Do you work for Microsoft then?

      2. Blitterbug
        Unhappy

        Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

        You utter moron. Many of us Win8 haters are devoted MS fans who feel let down by the steaming turd Microsoft have just crimped off. Read some tech news. Better yet, install the Win8 preview.

        1. Wade Burchette
          Unhappy

          Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

          Blitterbug: "Many of us Win8 haters are devoted MS fans who feel let down by the steaming turd Microsoft have just crimped off."

          I feel like Microsoft is trying to blur the line between tablets and desktops/laptops but forgetting that the two have different purposes and should be designed as such. Personally, I am not touching Windows 8 with a 2,500 ft pole.

          1. Blitterbug
            Unhappy

            Re: Personally, I am not touching Windows 8 with a 2,500 ft pole

            Me neither. I'm pretty galled, too, at the number of so-called MS 'fans' who think all the negative comments are from fruity fanbois. Bah, humbug! It all started so well, too. Installed both previews on two different lappys, one a 4-year old dual core and the other a core i7 jobbie with touch screen and nVidia graphics, to find:

            1. Win8 installer refused to proceed on either laptop 'cos it detected Alcohol 120%. Uninstalled Alcohol. Installer said it was still there. Ripped every Alcohol entry from the registry. Installer said it was still there. In the end opted for 'Install and destroy all existing apps' option as the only way to try Win8.

            2. Windows refused to run widescreen on the older machine. It defaulted to 1024x768 and would not recognise the 1280x800 screen.

            3. Tried some cool-sounding Metro apps only to find my Core i7 + nVidia lappy creaked and grumbled over pinball and other games. The older machine gave a frame rate of about 1fps.

            4. Was very, very, very impressed by 20 seconds boot time.

            5. Was impressed by the Metro mail app. Until I found it lacked half the basic functions.

            6. Very much liked the Win8 desktop fishy goodness. An Up button on the explorer toolbar - yay!

            I was going to keep the later preview on my newer machine, until I found serious problems - can't recall the exact details now, but it felt really beta-like and I couldn't understand how real people were getting real work done on the previews. For me, the bugginess was too problematic.

            The reason I'm so pissed now is that my experience turned me into a raging hater, from a position of excited anticipation. Now I'm just sad and angry at the whole thing...

      3. Mikel

        Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

        The browser decides for you which websites are allowed to use flash.

    4. Richard Plinston Silver badge

      Re: Your over confidence astounds me!

      > the biggest deal ... since the launch of Windows 95.

      For Windows 95 they paid $10million for a 14 year old song that included the line: "you make a grown man cry". The also bought up the whole issue of The Times to give away (and probably wrote the 'reviews' in it).

      What are they doing this time ?

  12. Michael Habel Silver badge
    WTF?

    So let's get this straight

    Windows 8 (no matter how ugly and useless it is), will only cost ~ca $40.00(USD), when it releases?

    Me thinks you might have missed a "2" that came just before those other Numbers.

    Or did Microsoft suddenly realize the best way to kill off Piracy was not to lock down our PCs (not like that's gonna stop 'em anyway), but to offer there Warez for a reasonable price for Once.

    Or does this $40.00(USD), just get you the Basic "N" Version?

    1. Tom 35 Silver badge

      Re: So let's get this straight

      The $40 is a fee to downgrade your current Windows version to 8.

      I don't think they have announced what a new licence will cost.

      1. Wensleydale Cheese Silver badge

        Re: So let's get this straight

        "The $40 is a fee to downgrade your current Windows version to 8."

        That's how I understand it, and that gets you the full version, multiple languages and all. If you find Metro acceptable it could be a good way to turn those XP Home or Windows 7 Home Premium systems into Pro versions.

    2. CaptainHook

      Re: So let's get this straight

      Me thinks you might have missed a "2" that came just before those other Numbers.

      ***

      No, MS know this is going to be a really hard sell which is vital to their future, they are pricing it according to their need to make sure people start using it.

    3. Malcolm 1

      Re: So let's get this straight

      It's an early adopter offer (although the end date is currently undefined). You get Windows 8 Pro for $39.99 and you can also download the Windows Media Center for free too.

      http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b/bloggingwindows/archive/2012/07/02/upgrade-to-windows-8-pro-for-39-99.aspx

      1. Wensleydale Cheese Silver badge

        Re: So let's get this straight

        @Malcolm 1

        "It's an early adopter offer (although the end date is currently undefined)"

        From the url you gave:

        "If you prefer to shop at a local store, a packaged DVD version of the upgrade to Windows 8 Pro will be available for $69.99 during this promotion.

        This upgrade promotion for Windows 8 Pro both online and at retail runs through January 31st, 2013."

        The DVD version is good news for those without decent broadband (or those who don't have the right flavour of credit card for that matter). Apple's "download only" policy for Mountain Lion has upset quite a few folks who live out in the sticks.

  13. Killraven

    I'm ready for Metro! ! !

    Just ordered a new laptop over the weekend. *Without* the Metro upgrade coupon.

    After some experimenting with Metro, I will freely admit, that if I considered a tablet to be anything more than a toy (to ME, that's all it would be, your mileage may vary) I'd find Metro to be as acceptable as an iPad or an Android-based tablet. It's fine for that.

  14. Ian Ferguson
    Windows

    is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

    Major consumer releases:

    Windows 3.1 = good

    Windows 95 = shit

    Windows 98 = good

    Windows Me = shit

    Windows XP = good

    Windows Vista = shit

    Windows 7 = good

    Windows 8 = ...

    I think I'll follow the pattern and wait for Windows 9.

    1. Bugs R Us

      Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

      Correction:

      Windows 3.1 = good

      >> Windows 3.11 Better

      Windows 95 = shit

      >> Windows 95 OSR Better

      Windows 98 = good

      >> Windows 98 SE Better

      Windows Me = shit

      Windows XP = good

      Windows Vista = shit

      >> Windows Vista SP1 Better

      Windows 7 = good

      Windows 8 = Really Windows 7 with touch support, Better

      1. Zombie Womble

        Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

        Sorry, lost me at 'touch support'.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

          Me, I'm looking forward to watching all those corporates get their touch support and proceed to swipe their monitors right off the desk.

      2. Tom 35 Silver badge

        Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

        Windows 8 = Really Windows 7 crippled to look like a phone. Steaming pool of diarrhoea

        1. JDX Gold badge

          Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

          >>Windows 8 = Really Windows 7 crippled to look like a phone. Steaming pool of diarrhoea

          Don't let the facts get in the way of all those funny jokes Tom, they're hilarious.

    2. mittfh

      Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

      Interestingly, if you look at the internal version numbers:

      3

      3.1 / 3.11

      NT 3.51

      4 (aka Windows 95)

      NT 4

      4.1 (aka Windows 98)

      4.9 (aka Windows ME)

      NT 5 (aka Win 2k)

      5.1 (aka XP - as MS had merged the consumer and business ends, they ditched the NT prefix)

      6 (aka Vista)

      6.1 (until the marketing department told them to up it to 7 to match the box number)

      8

      I guess 9 will be called 9 internally, although it wouldn't surprise me if early versions are 8.1.

      I expect what happens is that deadlines are set by the marketing department, who also like as many new features (and bloat!) as possible; consequently MS don't allocate enough time for testing / ironing out bugs (IIRC they once released a statement saying that 2k on release had 36,000 "unresolved issues" - a mixture of bugs and unimplemented feature requests).

      It'll be interesting to see how many businesses snap up 8 on release, or whether they'll adopt the usual strategy of waiting for SP 1. Although having said that, there was a joke (based on truth?) in NT 4 days that a significant portion of each service pack was fixing bugs introduced in the previous service pack.

      1. DJV Silver badge

        @mittfh

        If you look at the version number that Windows 8 puts in the IE10 User Agent string then you will find that it's 6.2, not 7 or 8! I have never come across Windows 7 with an internal version number of 7 - where did you find that? I suspect Windows 9 will have an internal number of 6.3 - looks like MS are adding the digits together to get the 'public' number!

        1. mittfh
          Facepalm

          Re: @mittfh

          /me runs Help -> About from Control Panel on his work computer (Win 7 Enterprise)... ooh, so it is 6.1 internally!

          Sorry, mea culpa.

          I run Linux at home and thought (from evidently badly remembered reviews of Win 7 when it first came out) that MS Marketing gurus had persuaded their engineers to change the internal version number to 7.

      2. squilookle
        Windows

        Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

        "6.1 (until the marketing department told them to up it to 7 to match the box number)"

        Was Windows 7 not numbered 6.1 rather than 7 because it was thought changing the major version number would break compatibility with some third party software, and that MS did not want people to have problems like that after the issues that were reported with Vista?

    3. Fuh Quit
      Pint

      Windows 2000

      Shit, your scheme has been blown away.

      I also remember the hate for XP and the Teletubbies references. Still, the love came and stayed ;-)

      1. Paul Crawford Silver badge

        Re: hate for XP and the Teletubbies references

        I hated the XP teletubbies appearance, but at least they let you change back to 'classic' look.

        With win8 they have gone out of their way to stop you, the useless bar stewards!

        Mind you, Ubuntu's Unity is well on its way as the Linux moment of pulling defeat from the jaws of victory, think of all those XP users who would find Gnome 2 quite usable? Ooops, we screwed that one.

        1. Goat Jam

          Re: hate for XP and the Teletubbies references

          A few points;

          Gnome 3 (Shell) is primarily responsible for the snatching of defeat from the jaws of victory, Unity is just an unsatisfactory response to Gnome 3.

          If you or your floundering gang XP refugees want Gnome 2 then go straight to Linux Mint MATE edition.

          If you want the underlying Gnome 3 framework without the Gnome Shell idiocy then Linux Mint Cinnamon edition is made for you.

          1. mittfh
            Linux

            Alternatively...

            If your favourite distro supports it, try Xfce. You can still install and use Gedit and Nautilus if you want to (although it'll look better if you choose a Gtk3 theme, otherwise Gtk3 apps such as Gedit and Nautilus will look naff). Some distros even make it relatively painless to disable Pulse and go back to plain old ALSA.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Windows 2000

        Doesn't count since it's pre business/consumer merge. The versions listed is actually correct as far as chronological order of consumer versions goes. It's still wrong in the simplistic judgements it makes though, obviously.

        1. Wensleydale Cheese Silver badge

          Re: Windows 2000

          "[WIndows 2000] Doesn't count since it's pre business/consumer merge. The versions listed is actually correct as far as chronological order of consumer versions goes."

          From a business user point off view it does count.

          Many of us managed to avoid the 98/SE/ME hassles by going straight from Win3.11/Win95 to NT 4.0.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Windows 2000

            I think you need to re-read what I said, specifically the part about how he listed the consumer versions and therefore omitted 2000 (as well as all the rest of the NT lineage prior to XP). In any case the alternating good/bad theory is nonsense, but if you're going to insist on going on about it then you should at least stick to either the consumer or business line rather than trying to sandwich in both somehow.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

      Oh god not this tired, old "good version, bad version" horseshit again. I doubt any of the people parroting this rubbish even used the versions they're talking about. 3.1 and earlier is basically just a GUI for DOS; 95, 98 and Me were all more or less all as shit as each other; XP was utter shit when it first came out for the same reasons as Vista (buggy as fuck, incompatible software/hardware, bad drivers), possibly even moreso, except everyone forgot this since it was around forever; and Windows 7 is just a polished Vista.

      1. JDX Gold badge

        Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

        " I doubt any of the people parroting this rubbish even used the versions they're talking about. 3.1 and earlier is basically just a GUI for DOS; 95, 98 and Me were all more or less all as shit as each other"

        As someone who has been using since DOS3.3, you're talking junk. 95/98/ME have big differences and ME is definitely inferior. Wasn't 98 crap until SE came out, at which point it was the best pre-XP version?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: is it shit or is it good? is it shit or is it good?

          Sigh. My point is that the good/bad thing needs to die already. Yes, 98 SE was the better of the 9x line, and Me was slightly worse, etc. but overall they were all basically the same compared to the difference between 98 SE and XP, or XP and Vista. In the same way 7 is basically the same as Vista, except no-one really takes that onboard because they compared the experience of Vista with hardware and drivers not really ready for it, along with an overhauled kernel compared to Windows 7 coming out years later when drivers and hardware had caught up and the bugs ironed out. If you compared Vista SP2 onwards with 7, then there's not a huge deal between them. Similarly XP started out shit and ended up good, but everyone awful memories means they actually mean XP SP2 onwards when comparing it to other versions of Windows.

  15. jason 7
    Megaphone

    MS can afford to sell this OS cheap.

    And no not because most of us here think its a bit lacking in a few areas.

    But because they aim to make 30% on all the apps they are hoping folks will buy through Metro land.

    This is the first OS that MS can make money from the customer all the way through the life of the OS.

    I'm wondering what their projected revenue per Windows 8 user is? Probably a bit more then the usual £70 OEM copy gypsy like myself.

    1. Bugs R Us

      Re: MS can afford to sell this OS cheap.

      "Lacking a bit"? Do explain. Seriously, I'd like to know because I'm confused as to how the majority of the planet is running businesses using Windows with more than an acceptable track record for simply getting the job done.

      1. jason 7

        Re: MS can afford to sell this OS cheap.

        Because like you and most others have totally missed the point about what Windows 8 is all about.

        Its not about getting rid of the Start button. Its not about all the UI changes.

        Its all about pushing folks to buy Metro Apps. The changes are just to push folks into Metro land. There they will buy all the fart apps they so desire, cos if Android and Apple App Stores are anything to go by, people love to buy crap. MS wants in on that big time.

        MS knows full well that Windows 8 is not going to be the corporate OS of choice. It's mainly going to be domestic. So they get the Metro infrastructure incorporated into employees homes and media devices and that then gains acceptance into the corporate field through familiarity and ubiquity for Windows 9 (basically Windows 8 Corporate edition).

        Windows 9 may not even have a 'desktop'.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: MS can afford to sell this OS cheap.

          > Windows 9 may not even have a 'desktop'.

          I see what you did there.

        2. LinkOfHyrule
          Coat

          I hope as well as apps...

          ...they sell porn too - they could call it - Metro-Sexual - boom boom!

          I'll get me coat, I can hear booing or is it groans...

        3. JDX Gold badge

          Its all about pushing folks to buy Metro Apps.

          No it really isn't. That is a fringe benefit.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    From the horses mouth, we're overcharging by 11% on office, so we can pay big margins to resellers to force it down our throats. Thanks I'll stick with Libre, how many new bells & whistles does an office suite need? Office 15 just an excuse for a file format change?

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Well it sounds like v15 is the first version to get some major new features for years... lots of swanky online collaboration stuff mainly. Which might actually be useful, with remote working getting more prevalent.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Trollface

    sadomasochists only need apply

    That Japanese video was right. It seems some american businessmen will pay to be kicked in the bollocks

  18. Jonathan 29

    Surface apps

    This seems like a fair price for the OS and is after all what they should have charged for Windows 7 upgrades from vista, but I am more interested in how they will price office and other applications from now on.

    Apple and Google have set many peoples expectations when it comes to app pricing on tablets - free, 69p or 4.99 for something very special. How much will Office for Surface Pro cost (not the RT version) ? What about other developers - Are they going to charge a tablet price or a desktop price - given their programs can be installed on both?

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Re: Surface apps

      Loads of professional apps cost £10+, in fact cost is basically proportional to app-complexity / size-of-userbase.

      1. Jonathan 29

        Re: Surface apps

        There are some that are over £20 sure, but that is far from the average. Take Winzip ( I know there are free alternatives) as an example. The base price is £25. You couldn't get away with that in any app store, but if they released a cheaper version for a Windows 8 pro tablet, they would not be able to prevent that being installed on the Desktop and totally undercut themselves. Yet how can any developer realistically offer a Windows 8 RT version at one price and another Windows 8 version at another price? I will watch with interest.

  19. This post has been deleted by its author

  20. A. Lewis
    Meh

    The end of October?

    I guess it's going to be as Ghoulish as my first thoughts, then.

  21. OrsonX
    FAIL

    JAN 2013

    so, Apple will be selling another bazillion iPads Xmas 2012 with no competition...

    utter

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Windows 8 - what is it?

    Writing as someone with an intimate knowledge of operating systems (not just windows), I have 1 pertinent question with respect to Windows8

    Are there ANY enhancements/changes to the ACTUAL OS, or is this entire Win8 exercise simply a total WOT over a new interface being thrown into the market?

    This is not a troll. I haven't seen one article or comment about the OS itself. The media coverage is ONLY about the UI and UI != OS.

    Feel free to direct me to where I should look.

    Dweeb

    1. Paul Crawford Silver badge

      Re: Windows 8 - what is it?

      I don't think there is much change the the underlying OS that is major, but it has has some minor improvements. Had there been a no-Metro option I think most commentards here would be less hateful in their comments, probably looking forward to it in fact as an improvement over 7. But sadly they have already tried the preview...

      Maybe on a tablet/phone it has a purpose, but on a desktop it sucks. But don't trust me, I don't own a fez.

    2. Tom 35 Silver badge

      Re: Windows 8 - what is it?

      - They say faster boot time. They don't say if that's on the same hardware.

      - Windows to Go. Put windows on a USB key. But it seems that the host computer has to have windows 8 installed so it's more like your profile on a USB key.

      - Secure boot. Yes it's for your own good.

      See this for a list.

      http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/explore-windows-8.aspx

      Most of it is UI stuff, or stuff that already in Win7 but tarted up a bit.

      1. Big-nosed Pengie
        Facepalm

        Re: Windows 8 - what is it?

        "- Windows to Go. Put windows on a USB key. But it seems that the host computer has to have windows 8 installed so it's more like your profile on a USB key."

        Oh, Lordy!!!

  23. Katie Saucey
    Devil

    Halloween release then...

    Figures that the skull-f'ing commences in October.

  24. JaitcH
    Meh

    Oh, wonderful ... more StartUp Repair on it's way

    It would be nice if they had done a better job on Win 7. Weekly updates means week StartUp Repairs for many machines.

    How I love my good, old, reliable Win XP, as do many others.

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