So scumbags being scumbags again...
I really hope a load of the Apple Faithful give them a really hard time.
Members of the Westboro Baptist Church (WBC) have announced their intention to protest at the funeral of Steve Jobs, in a Twitter message sent via an iPhone. The group, best known for their rainbow "God hates fags" signs and web page, are claiming the action is in response to Jobs not using his wealth to promote their …
By tutting loudly in their vicinity?
By getting annoyed and posting some nasty words on teh intaweb?
One presumes the church has run out of money (or is about to), so they'll crash the funeral (if they can find out where it is) and hold up some offensive signs in the hope that someone will tell them to clear off, leading to them suing for restriction of free speech.
Of all the people in need of a serious thrashing, it's the Westboro people. Their abuse of scripture is nauseating in the extreme. Only in America...
Google them, the counter protesters often outnumber them by several hundred percent. They ridicule them, and they LOVE it.
The WB church is fishing for lawsuits and media attention and LOVE controversy and attention. Most of them are lawyers, they are hoping that Apple will in some way interfere so they can sue them for many millions of dollars. And given ANY excuse they will.
A person's free-speech rights are only violated if a government body, say the police, force them to stop protesting on public land. Private security are absolutely allowed to physically remove protesters from private property. The problem with soldier's funerals is that they are indeed often buried on public/government owned land, which presents a problem for those soldier's families.
Presumably Steve Jobs will be buried at a cemetery owned by a private organisation and that means the company that owns the property can use hired security personnel to protect the dignity of families. In the US cemeteries are usually owned by private companies and as long as that is the case, it is perfectly legal for them to protect their private property from trespassers.
The common theme all the way through the Bible is "God loves the sinner but hates his sin".
So when these retards hold up signs saying "God hates fags", He doesn't. The Westboro people are just provocative idiots with no humility, no love for their fellowman, total disobedience to what scipture instructs Christians to be like and a good working knowledge of the American legal system.
One might venture to say "God hates the Westboro Church" because they trash His Name left, right and center.
'The common theme all the way through the Bible is "God loves the sinner but hates his sin"'?
Clearly you've been reading a very different version of the Bible to the one I've been reading. In mine, God *really* hates the sinner, and visits his retribution unto the seventh generation. He's all for slaughter, rape, pillage and general mayhem - the more the better. He thinks nothing of slaughtering (presumably) innocent babes and children.
As far as "God hates fags" is concerned, I'd say they're absolutely right. He commands us to kill any man who lies with a man as you would like with a woman, just as He commands us to kill any woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night.
If you call yourself a Christian, you'd better get a-stonin' fast before He returns or you'll be in deep shit.
"Interesting how this group "knows what god hates"
If he "hates" a group of people then why did he create them??
All knowing, all powerful, all made up??"
But how could any putative god hate any part of its creation? Would that not be tantamount to hating itself, or at least the fruits of its labour?
Below are examples of Leviticus 18:22 in "the bible" where most christian nutjobs get their authority to oppress others. The source text is the same for all versions of the bible but the variety of wording shows that it can be retranslated to better suit a particular point of view. Christ never said anything about homosexuality but he was a busy man and can't be expected to remember everything.
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."
"It is disgusting for a man to have sex with another man."
"No man is to have sexual relations with another man; God hates that."
"Do not practice homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin."
I think the best way to deal with these trolls is to ignore them or laugh at them.
The first of your translations is pretty much the accurate one; I've seen it commented before that the only things referred to as abominations in the Bible are homosexuality and the Anti-Christ. I'm not sure if that's true, but I think it shows that some people take things a teensy bit far.
Personally I think the late author David Eddings had it right when one of his characters commented, "Isn't it convenient that the prejudices of God always so closely match those of His prophets?" And if there's one thing God indubitably does hate, it's people who presume to speak for Him.
Seems to me that its gone through so many hundreds, or even thousands of years of translation and interpretation, that much like a horoscope you can conveniently read into it whatever you like.
And besides, there's an awful lot else in Leviticus that is generally ignored by modern Christians. Have a quick peek at the sort of dietary rules that Jews are supposed to follow, for example. But I guess picketing restaurants with GOD HATES SHELLFISH plackards isn't quite as likely to be taken seriously.
(incidentally, one interpretation of the various bits of biblical controversy would suggest that only the act of bumsex with men is bad, but everything else is just fine. knock yourselves out.)
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law... When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination... End of debate.
I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.
1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is, my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
4. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2. clearly states he should be put death, should I do it or should I ask the police to do it?
5. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Aren't there 'degrees' of abomination?
6. Lev.21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20 or is there a little wiggle room there?
7. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?
8. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
9. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I am confident you can help.
Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.
The only reason we know about this tiny insignificant bunch of mindless haters is that media types have wet dreams about them and punt them to the front page: a symbiotic relationship between two groups of people who share a similarly slender grip on reality.
WBC is shameful, but what you have to remember about them is that it's really nothing more than a business. They use tactics designed to inflame and incite, then sue when somebody snaps and becomes physically violent. It's their source of income.
These people aren't representative of even the right-wing fringe. They're simply a group of scam artists.
>>"kill them all...with fire"
Well, technically, by what they claim to believe, that would be perfectly OK, since /anyone/ who dies shows that God hates them - there's no such thing as a wrongful death.
It'd be interesting (and possibly entertaining) to see if they *still* claimed to believe that when someone stepped forward to light the woodpile under them
I understand they've been having a lot of car trouble, lately.
They drive to the site of their protest in a couple of vehicles, which they park some distance from the protest site.
When they complete their protest, they return to their vehicles, only to find all the tires flattened.
Even worse, there seem to be no tow services able to assist.
The only requirement being being considered "Christian" is belief in Jesus.
The bottom line has very little to do with morality, but salvation through grace... the good deeds are very much optional and denomination dependent.
Who's to say that they don't sincerely think that they're doing "good works", after all, some religious leaders thinks they're doing Africans a favor with awful advice on family planning and STDs.
Let's not kid ourselves; even the mildest protoylser who takes john 3:16 seriously is passing on a veiled threat; compliance or damnation. The westboro mob are just taking it one step further by stating the perceived terms of compliance, and the consequences of disobedience. It's plenty godly in an old testament way; although not very jesus-like and not good PR.
"whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life"
Threat: statement of an intention to inflict pain, injury, damage, or other hostile action on someone in retribution for something done or not.
In this case the tacit implication is that you will perish if you don't believe.
The threat is expanded upon by Jesus himself with comments about "wailing and gnashing of teeth", along with of course, the colorful language and imagery conjured up by various different churches re: the devil, hell, purgatory.
As Eddie Izzard said about the CoE: "cake or death?"
Put in other words: “salvation is an attempt to solve a problem of its own making — sin is just a concept from the teaching, like a doctor running around cutting people with a knife in order to sell them a Band Aid.”
What you're logically suggesting is the the opposite of Pascal's wager. "Devils" and the odd satanist must be just about the only ones who both know that Jesus offering salvation is real, yet choose to damn themselves by not following him.
Claiming that the westboro mob aren't Christians, either requires psychic powers to be able to say they're not being sincere... or divine knowledge of the will of God to able to say that they aren't following him correctly.
"Claiming that the westboro mob aren't Christians, either requires psychic powers to be able to say they're not being sincere... or divine knowledge of the will of God to able to say that they aren't following him correctly."
Or, you know, the ability to read. What you say is only correct if we take the position that nothing in the NT's reporting of Jesus' words is reliable. But at that point we have to then question whether the claim of his existence is reliable.
IF Jesus existed AND the NT reports are reasonably accurate, THEN we can say that he laid down some requirements which can be used as tests as to whether someone is following his teachings or not.
In that light, I think it's pretty reasonable to say that WBC are not Christians, although they probably could qualify as some sort of extreme jewish sect as they're very big on the OT. But the whole point of Jesus is supposed to be that the OT is not the only requirement and, in fact, is out of date in several important areas (mostly involving revenge). If you don't accept that this is a fundamental point that divides Christians from other groups then what you're really saying is that there is no such thing as a Christian at all (which brings us back to the first schism in the religion, but that's another story).
I am not even sure that is correct to be honest. A hatred of others [other religions, other life styles, other sexual preferences et al ] , a hatred of those with the ability to think freely and rationally very often seem to rank higher than some possibly imaginary and possibly beardy chap in dress.
The American conservative, right wing bible belters are not unique , but are a prime example of the levels of intolerance required to be a true christian.
And before anybody complains, I am a Chris Hitchens style Anti-theist. Without the intellect of Hitch of course. But then again, who has...... ?
"a prime example of the levels of intolerance required to be a true christian."
Sorry, doesn't match my experience. As a kid my dad taught me all people and religions should be respected, he's a minister and missionary no less. The main message of christianity is that god loves all people, regardless of what they believe or do.
I find it ironic and amusing that you need to push forward your false, caricatured and prejudiced image of christians and christianity. Very tolerant of you.
Yup. Three words: The Holy Inquisition. Definately "Christian" with a big "C" that.
I suppose I could also mention the Crusades, the Maleus Maleficorum and the Witch Hunts, the "English Martyrs" and other stuff in that vein.
I suppose that by the OPs standards, Christianity has a long and chequered record of not being, er, Christian.
Let's not get into a debate about what Christians are...there are plenty of people who will tear you to pieces (verbally). Suffice to say that, technically, these people can declare themselves to be Christians.
These people may be ar*ehats, but there is no difference in them declaring what your deity hates and you declaring them as 'ungodly'.
As a God-botherer myself, I can't find one person in any of the churches I frequent who can begin to support any of the actions taken by these. Every time I see a sign saying "God Hates Fags", I get so frustrated. Really? Does He? Really?????
There was a documentary on UK TV some months ago (Louis Theroux if my memory serves me) and watching it with the missus, we just couldn't understand how they can believe in the Biblical Jesus while doing the things they do.
Jesus doesn't hate homosexuals, but I dare say that He hates compassionless aggravation, humiliation and taunting of the sick, the infirm, the dead, families of the dead or any group of people, whether they be a minority or a majority.
Interestingly, Proverbs 16:16 lists what God does hate and that list is interesting;
An arrogant attitude
Killing of innocent people
Hearts that are always looking for ways to aggravate others
Always looking for ways to help make someone else's bad situation worse
A false witness
Someone who sows dischord among friends
I'm counting at least six there (assuming they haven't actually killed anyone)
"The group, best known for their rainbow ‘God hates fags’ signs and web page, are claiming the action is in response to Jobs not using his wealth to promote their interpretation of the bible [...]"
Well, shit, if that's all it takes to warrant their petty wrath, I guess they will need to rack up some frequent flier miles and start protesting every funeral in America, as nobody (save perhaps...PERHAPS..their 100-weak members) is going to use their wealth to promote this outfit's whackadoodle interpretation of the Bible.
that people have the sense to ignore these moneygrubbing trolls.
This guy and his family/congregation are all lawyers. They don't believe any of the crap they spew.
All they do is get in the faces of emotional people (such as mourners) and try to bait them in to retaliating, hopefully violently.
When somebody does so, they instantly sue them for damages.
It is nothing but a profit seeking scam.
....or how The French deliberatley corrupted and ruined a Great British Invention....
We, or rather the Earl of Sandwich, invent the eponymous article of heavenly fodder.
Les crapauds, furious that the world can now see how ridiculous their Haute Cuisine really is, come up with the vile, hideous weasel-vomit that is mayonnaise purely as a way to corrupt and demean the joy-that-is-a-sarnie.
I mean to say, if you need something like weasel puke to make yer food taste less horrible, then you are a nation in need of serious gastronomic aid.
Honestly, I don't know why the media doesn't just ignore these obnoxious trolls. Instead of providing coverage for these publicity whores, you'd think it'd make sense to reduce their presence at an even to: "The members of 'Westboro Baptist Church' were also present to wave signs; they were generally ignored or derided by others attending." No close-up photos, no interviews, no sputtering rage by the victims of their bigotry, etc.
It wouldn't stop them, but it would certainly piss them off.
let every male mourner embrace, and perhaps even kiss a male protester (I realize this requires setting aside your natural revulsion, but be strong!!).
For a nice touch add: "I forgive you."
I think this might freak these guys out, and they could hardly sue you for it, you are merely following the example set by by Christ, showing love to thy neighbours.
Brilliant though he was Steve Jobs wasn't a veteran. The PGR is all about honoring veterans and shutting down the WBC fools is just a fun past time for us. No, really. It started as a 'shut down the WBC people' movement, but these days we do maybe one of those for every 10 rides we go on. And that's in Kansas, where WBC is most active. Usually it's welcome home rides and sendoffs. Occasionally it's a funeral where we act as a second honor guard, but very rarely does WBC show up anymore. It's gotten to where the family just tells Phelps we're gonna be there when he calls to harass them and he doesn't even bother showing up.
Anyway, long story short, you can get a bunch of guys to rev bikes (it shouldn't be hard), but I doubt the PGR themselves would show. It'd be up to that state captain though.
Since Jobs wasn't gay, Muslim, a priest that sodomizes boys, or any of the other things this bunch of loonies claim to be upset about, what exactly is their beef?
Or is it the case that a true nutter doesn't really need any logical reason other than "it's there".
Jobs's birth father was Syrian-born Abdulfattah Jandali -- I'm guessing that's close enough for these morons -- or they just want some more publicity.
Please consider these people the worst that our poor country has to offer, and don't judge the rest of us by their stupidity. And Please, PLEASE, waste no more column space or bits on them.
They don't protest at people they hate. For example, when they protest at soldiers' funerals it isn't because they have anything in particular against the soldier. They claim to believe that God is punishing America for 'allowing gayness' and any funeral can just be seen as part of God's punishment. The logic is always tenuous.
Anyway, that's the purported logic, the real reason of course is to offend people and get publicity.
Did you bother to read the article? Apple has been voted the most gay friendly employer in the US. I think that pretty much fits right into their firing line.
God must REALLY love WBC, otherwise America being America (fuck yeah!) I'd have expected some good old boy to have taken them out by now.
When Fred Phelps die, I wonder how many LGBT will protest at his funeral. I can just se the placards now :)
Just dePort(al) them there.
In fact that should be the standard punishment in hate crimes.
If you commit a hate crime you should be convicted to serve your sentence (with no right for parole) in the most hostile possible form of environment you hate.
Hate muslims - fine, removing land mines in Iraq sounds like the right occupation for you. Hate "coloured" people - well, in that case how does working the next 10 years on famine relief sound to you? Wanna hate something else?
If people beat people up, that's bad: agreed, it's just the level of badness that is at stake.
In my book at least, it is worse if someone beats you up because he hates the group you belong to, rather than, e.g., what you said about him or his mother, or because you took a swing at him. There is even a sort of "bad sense" in mugging: people do it for profit. It is definitely bad, but not as bad as an unprovoked attack based on a person's religion, race, or sexual orientation.
Motive. If you were to beat up another man because he screwed your wife/kicked your dog/has something in his wallet that you want, then regardless of his race you're getting something out of the act - revenge, expiation of anger, money. If you were to beat up a black guy just because he was black, though, it's worse because he hasn't done anything to even remotely deserve it.
Hmm. yeah - Interesting idea.
I See two problems.
Firstly, knowing the kind of guy Steve is, I suspect no-one outside of his close friends and family will know when and where the funeral will be until it's over.
Secondly, yes, what they're doing may be legal under free speech, but with the number of apple fans running higher-than-usual emotions, I wouldn't bet against mob justice kicking in before the law enforcement shows up.
Now, as we remind everyone on the forums; don't feed the trolls. Westbro feed on media, and without it, they're just rebels without a cause.
Considering that they've now publicly announced their intent to picket Steve Jobs' funeral, there WILL be armies of fanbois and armies of gays and lesbians watching for their cars. Don't be surprised if their cars and anything in them disappear from the face of the earth, maybe to be found at the bottom of Devil's Slide or someplace similar. Any car in the Bay Area with a Kansas (?) license plate will be suspect for the next ten days or so... there was an incident last year where they returned from their picketing and found all four tires slashed on their car, and none of the local tire shops or towing companies was open for them. They finally had to drive on four flat tires to an out of town Wal-Mart (maybe 3-5 miles) to get new tires. Of course, the police saw no one approach their car.
Somebody will eventually try to torch their "church" again...
Someone needs to come up with legally safe nickname for them, and then EVERYONE agrees to use it. I am sooooo sick of seeing "Westboro Baptist Church" everywhere, and I'm guessing that the only reason they are still around doing what they're doing is the publicity. So why don't we just stop using their name, and take away what they want. Maybe then they will go away.
"They, who's name we don't use."
"Full of Santorum"
"Fundamentalists Against Gay Society"
"These'ums" Some kind of red-neck reference
Anything, just stop using their damn name. I don't care where "These'ums" are protesting this week.
Whilst a well-swung iPad would no doubt sting, i don't think that they have a lot to worry about from tech geeks.
Fortunately (for the rest of the world) these guys have pissed off a lot of people as a result of their war funeral pickets. A quick YouTube search leads to some promising hits such as "Westboro Baptist vs. Angry Nevadan Bikers" (parts I, II and III). Full credit for the bikers form of protest - basically "we have big flags and lots of people and we're just gonna stand in front of you" - as opposed to the highly tempting but not very legal line of "lets just have a fight"
They won't go away even if the press DOES ignore them. Protesting is their family business and denial of their civil right to protest is what makes them the cash, that's why they all study law. Sadly other than using a shotgun there is very little that you can do to stop them and they are here for the long haul, so people will just have to ignore them and accept they are a price of free speech that has to be paid
To be fair, they are just pointing out what it says in the Bible.
Like the BNP, let's expose people of all religious faiths for the irrational bonkers nonsense they all believe in.
Just because some Christians believe in the nice, fluffy, English-village-church-with-innocent-bicycle-rideing-vicars version of Christianity, completely ignoring what a c**t god is in the Old testament, doesn't mean their beliefs are more credible than the Phelps.
If these people were truly Bible practicing Christians, they would not be doing this. They need to go back and read the Bible and then practice what it really says... especially in the New Testament about loving your fellow man. You do not have to support the sin, but you are still NOT to do things like WBC is doing.
It is people like these members of Westboro Baptist Church which give those who do not know what Christianity is really about a bad name.
If they do this in "God's Name" the Bible clearly states that they will be held accountable for those who turn their backs on Christianity as a result of their action. They will not like what God has in store for people misleading others in His name.
Jesus NEVER said to do anything in hate, and that God loves even those who sin even though he holds final judgment on them for their actions.
Jesus says in the 4 apostles of new testament that his words do not undo the jewish law, and says several times that people must still follow the old laws. Problem is he also says contrary stuff in other books of the apostles. This is because the books of new testament, like the old testament were written at different times, by different people with different agendas. Check out "misquoting Jesus" and "Jesus, Interrupted" two great books that very clearly spell out the falseness and inaccuracies of the new testament, and it give great back ground on the real history behind these human made books.
"like working on a Sunday"
Actually, the Sabbath is Saturday. Always has been, always will be. I could write a book to prove it historically and scripturally, but it'd be easier if you just go ask your priest/pastor/minister (assuming you have one). They all know it and admit to it, but there's a wide variety of arguments as to why most Christians observe Sunday instead (none of which scripturally valid, but whatever).
As for the Old Testament being 'just history', Christ himself said otherwise.
"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." -Matthew 5:18
Which in no way backs up WBC because...
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
"Judge not, that ye be not judged." -Matthew 7:1
(again, I could write a whole book on the passages that back up the 'love for the sinner' perspective)
So even if homosexuality is sinful, God still loves homosexuals. Furthermore, those laws are not the ones that God felt was so important that he had to write them in stone with his own finger, unlike 'Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy'. Given that 99% of Christianity has forgotten the Sabbath I would say that it is probably closer to accurate (though still horribly inaccurate) to say God hates WBC.
See, that's why knowing the Bible is useful. When dealing with folks like the WBC people you can outmanuver them pretty easily using thier own book without having to result to weak (and false) arguments like 'the Old Testament is just history'.
God alone holds the ability to judge.
Calling themselves Christians, they need to use the New Testament as well as the Old. It is written very clearly in the New Testament that the Old Testament "rules" about tit-for-tat are no longer valid with the coming of Christ.
They are simply using whatever parts of the Bible they wish to further their "cause" and get in the news, not caring that they are giving those who are not Christian the wrong idea of what Christianity is about.
I have been busy and away from the computer for several days so this is my first chance to respond.
As much as I have voiced my hatred of Apple in the past I cant wait to see what comes of this.
These idiots need to do this I think if only for the rabid Apple faithful to beat them to death with iProducts.
Whos bring the beer?
Edited: I dont quite get why I was referred to the page on why this was rejected. It weasnt a snipe at Apple fans it was directed 100% at the idiots from this "church". As for the iProducts comment it was easier then typing them all out.
the funny fact that they used an iPhone to make the announcement exposes them to the clauses in the agreements that they signed.
since they signed and agreed to the Apple iPhone terms of service, Apple has the right to permanently disable & brick their iPhones at any time thanks to this bit in the iPhone contract:
(the iPhone contract for older iPhones has similar language in it)
7.4 Apple does not warrant against interference with your enjoyment of the iPhone software and services, that the functions contained in or services performed by the iPhone software will meet your requirements, that the operation of the iPhone software and services will be uninterrupted or error-free, that any service will continue to be made available, that defects in the iPhone software or services will be corrected, or that the iPhone software will be compatible or work with any third party software, applications or third party services.
i expect that Apple will do so if WBC continues to interfere in this case and i look forward to their "WTF happened" confused looks.
and about the WBC being a scam:
Why the Westboro Baptist Church is a Scam
"This is a scam.
It's a business. They travel the country, set up websites telling you exactly when they'll be there, and using the most inflammatory statements all over the place, just to get someone to violate their rights for profit. Then they sue the military, the police force that was to protect them, and everyone that is around them for money. This is a sham, and it is a trap to get people sued. Every member of his family is an attorney. Phelps does not break the law. What he does is try to make you break the law by trying to punch your sensibilities about everything you hold dear, and then sue you and everyone municipality around him to the max.
This is a scam.
Whether he believes his posters or not is irrelevant.
He's using this as a moneymaking scheme.
Lay one finger on him, do one thing that violates him, and he will sue you, and more importantly, the city, the police department, the US Military, and any private property owner he happens to be standing on to make money off of it."
(explanation continues on those pages, full with details)
It's morons like this that erode any remaining credibility for legitimate churches. Not that anybody agrees with me or even cares, I happen to be a devout christian and I'm positively convinced that God probably wants to bitch slap these people, for a wide number of reasons.
I hope, albeit highly improbable, that this church gets its collective head out of its ass and gets a clue.
As Dan Brown has it, the Bible, the Koran and all other religious books were written by men. They contain the word of men not of God. So far as I know God has never actually said anything to anyone. Some of the writing say that God spoke, but is this true? At his distance of time and with the vested interests of the intervening tellers, I think not.
If you like I can prove on a scientific logical basis that God exists. However I do not believe in Religion. Religion is falsehood.
Very simple, as far as I am concerned. They seek violent reactions and sue as a result, so we should deny them that reaction. Instead, we should show them love and understanding, and here's what I have in mind.
If you see these people protesting anything, don't shout, don't jeer, go up to them, pick a member of their organisation the same sex as yourself, and come on to them. I mean REALLY come on to them, and don't stop until they give the kind of reaction they want from others.
Even if it doesn't work, it'd be a laugh.
Where's the big-wet-sloppy-kiss icon?
There are times when I fantasise about ways of making life hell for this group. Are there ways, for instance, of making their travel to a protest difficult? How do they travel? Are there lists they might get on? And I can't really see any legal ways of setting them up for grief.
The mental image of a broken-down micro-bus full of Westboro Baptists, as the rain keeps on falling and the creek rises is still sorta amusing.
I don't wish to suggest that their words and actions are somehow more hateful or repulsive just because on this occasion they happen to be concerned with Steve Jobs. They're not. Their obscene and vile actions towards members of the military and gay community (to name but two) are just as repellent.
But I hope they really do try and show up at SJ's funeral, and I really hope they finally get to feel some serious consequences for their evil.
I don't get it, God isn't reality, it's just belief. Gay's are reality.
Clearly Gays > God. (probably why this fictional character of a bed time story 2000 years ago isn't quite happy with peeps over at gay central)
Or in other words, quit trolling and respect the man (and his family) who pushed the realms of todays technology to the limit, advancing us into the smartphone era.
+1 for iPhoning them to death.
“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”
― Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion
They're not so much a cult as a group of lawyers who provoke people into trying to ban protests and then taking them to court under constitutional law.
It's a scam and sadly it's worked well enough for them to make a living out of it.
The only good news is that they promise to picket all sorts of places (such as the funerals of the murdered kids in Norway) and rarely turn up.
HA HA HAH AHAHA HA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Very much to their faces.
What a bunch of complete losers.
As an aside, I don't care what their God wants; even if she exists, if she's that feckin' petty she ain't getting my "vote". I'd rather rot in hell for all eternity than worship at the feet of a cretinous bigot.
"Fags are great! (I smoke 20/day, I should know)"
been there, done that, got the lung function test results to prove it.
in the doctors own words "if you don't stop smoking and start exercising, BAD THINGS ARE GOING TO HAPPEN TO YOU"
i put the caps in myself, he actually said it in a very matter of fact tone, and being an ex-army doctor didn't really look like he gave a shit what happens.
if taking issue with smoking is trolling, then yes i am a troll.
there are a million ways i can reply to your post, but nah, it's only smoking and what it does that i have an issue with.
i do apologize however seeing how i seem to have hurt your feelings. for the record i only called the OP a dick because he claimed fags are great. and your post just justified my stance that there are a lot of impressionable young minds who just might get the wrong idea.
happy face icon to make you feel better.
Given they number in the 100 range, let's be thankful this intolerant and misguided line of thinking is extremely rare in the grand scheme of things.
It's just hugely disrespectful that they choose someone's funeral to make a point of it. Jobs retired and handed the reins to Tim Cook in August, that was the time to do it, if at all.
find comfort in the fact that they damn themselves with their own rhetoric. If they bothered to read past the bits in the bible that they like to use to condemn their fellow man they might have stumbled on this bit..
"Judge not, that ye be not judged.
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."
I find it baffling that some people can base their ideology on a book written over 2000 years ago. I very much feel that anyone who chooses to ignore the social progress made over the course of the last two thousand years doesn't deserve to benefit from it; i.e. no cars, no running hot/cold water, no central heating, no aeroplanes, no vaccinations or hospital surgery treatment. In many respects these WBCs share similar traits with the minority of Islamic crazies who want to impose sharia law. The sooner we can pack these lot onto the 'B' Ark the better off we will be.
Hate is a human concept. In fact, most of the traits attributed to God are human ones. Even the 'He' part. How can God have a gender? Why would an omnipotent super-being feel the need to be worshiped or praised. Surely that is only for egotists - humans.
The fact is that God was created by man in his own image - not the other way around!
When people don't understand something, they make up explanations, and then stand around nodding in agreement. I wonder if earthworms have theories about motor cars?
These guys deserve the thanks of all atheists and freethinkers, and sensible people generally, including myself, for their incredible work - vocally and hilariously illustrating the folly of literal belief in the writings of any self-appointed diety, or representatives thereof.
Hopefully nobody will tell them that their absurd, ill-disguised malice does no good to their cause.
Their rustic stupidity reveals the essence of all irrational beliefs, which beneath their saccharine-sweet veneer lies falsehood, oppression and corruption.
Because they aren't. They have more in common with the Pharisees of Jesus time than with Jesus himself. If I had seen the first TV programme about them I would have told Louis Therouix (when I had the chance to speak to him at the BBC's offices) exactly the same. _RCH_ has it right the church should be spreading good news not attacking people. The Old Testament also specifies it to be a sin to wear clothing of two materials, so where's the protest group against the wearing of poly-cotton shirts and blouses?
The gospel is Good News, and what WBC promote isn't the gospel.
it's in the interest of the pseudo-intellectual left leaning sections of the media to tar all Christians with the same brush, especially when you get a bunch of crazies like these.
having said that, these inbred dodos have done a good job of distancing themselves from other Christian denominations.
If Osama bin Laden can (could) claim to be a Muslim despite all he's done, then these nutjobs can claim to be Christians despite their behaviour. Once people suspend their logic in order to believe in a sky-fairy, then its only a little jump to suspending all other logic as well.
(Hello to the NSA people who are reading this because of the trigger words!)
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