back to article Amazon accepts Kindle Fire will be rooted

Amazon has confirmed that its Kindle Fire 7in Android tablet can be rooted - and that it expects it will be soon enough. The retailer will apparently do nothing to prevent hardware hackers getting into the gadget's software innards, Jon Jenkins, director of Amazon's Silk browser project, suggested to PC Mag. "It's going to …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Linux

    No, that sound is

    Apple's lawyers deciding which Pacific islands they're going to buy with the fees they'll charge for suing yet another of these copycat "flat with rounded corners™" machines into non-existance.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Stop

      Rounded corners

      Can we cut down on posting this nonsense in every story even remotely related to Apple?

      It's easy to see Samsung didn't only copy the rounded corners, that's not the main issue, have a look at http://cdn.tipb.com/images/stories//2011/09/TmUj2.jpg for real examples.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Rounded corners

        > Can we cut down on posting this nonsense in every story even remotely related to Apple?

        Nope

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Flame

        Well bugger me

        But don't Boeing and Airbus planes look similar as well? They have tails fuselages and wings!

        Oh and cars - wow they look the same as well!

        Its frakking ridiculous that Apple can sue over the shape of a product.

        1. DZ-Jay

          Re: Jim Booth

          Actually, you may not be aware, but high end car manufacturers will sue others if the design of the cars seem too close as theirs. And yes, it comes down to curves, fins, shapes of the front grille or headlights, the colour combination of the interior, etc.

          But go on, ignorance is bliss and all that.

          -dZ.

          1. HipposRule

            I don't actually believe that..

            ... as Daimler didn't sue the Chinese manufacturer of a car that was in essence a dupicate of a Smart Fortwo

      3. Chris Miller
        Facepalm

        Metavisor really nailed that one

        Not only has it got rounded corners, but it comes in a cuboid cardboard box, just like Apple!! And the USB adaptors are almost identical (to every other USB adaptor in the world)!!!!

        Case closed, I think ...

      4. Anonymous Coward
        FAIL

        I liked the "what you see when you open the box" one: the product! I'm not sure quite what you thought a person might have seen - Krakatoa erupting, perhaps?

        1. KjetilS
          Coffee/keyboard

          @Robert Long 1

          Thank you for that one... I just about managed to stifle a loud snigger when I read that. My work colleagues would have started to wonder what's so funny about spreadsheets and error messages :)

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Pandora

      5. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Why stop when we're having fun?

        It might not have the longevity of the picture of a certain former newspaper editor and an "Asian babe" but I think there's mileage in it yet.

      6. mittfh
        Holmes

        Copying

        Let's see...

        Store: has icons for Apple products among many others. If the device can use those programs, what's the issue?

        Adaptors: Apple's is more rounded, is white, is assembled in a different manner. As for overall shape, I'd assume that's probably the most convenient one to house the components.

        Box: most product boxes show an image of the product contained within. Samsung's occupies less space and includes the name of the product, whereas Apple's doesn't. The open box shows that the Samsung is a different aspect ratio, besides which what do you expect to find when you open the box other than the product itself? How could they have done that differently?

        Connectors: almost certainly a standard design.

        Voice recording app: sure, they both show a microphone - but the designs of microphone pictured are completely different, and the rest of the screen is set up differently.

        -oOo-

        I'm sure there are plenty of other products that share at least some of those alleged similarities.

      7. Peter 48
        Stop

        debunked

        this, and many other collages of it's ilk have laready been debunked as fabricated nonsense. The charger and cable for example are mostlikely sourced from a generic plant - the ones that came with my asus transformer look exactly the same too. Sure, some things do look similar, but then they are also a pretty obvious way of designing them.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Feel free to post what other companies were using these same designs *before* Apple.

          Peter48 the Asus Transformer came out after the iPad, so not sure how it makes it fabricated nonsense.

          Anyway this is off topic for the Amazon device, as at least Amazon tried to be creative. You don't see the Kindle reader app being a clone of Apple's iBooks (or vice versa), while the same can't be said of Samsung's book reader app...

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      but

      Like the play book it doesn't have a button

  2. Dan 55 Silver badge

    Interesting decision

    What about the DRM? Will regret that decision when someone inevitably comes up with a freetard Kindle book reader app?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      But the Kindle reader software is completely free. You can run it on a PC (Mac or Windows - or Linux with Wine) or on an iPhone, or on an iPad, or on an Android phone or tablet.

      (Hint - the Kindle Fire is an Android tablet).

      And any DRM-breaking that might or might not have already happened has nothing to do with rooting the Kindle Fire. I'm reading Kindle books on my Sony Reader.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        The kindle reader is free, but this tablet isn't only a Kindle like the other dedicated, e-ink based, ones. This is Amazon's media device, so there will be movies, music and apps to be bought too.

        It's those that need further protection and where Amazon has a financial interest in stopping DRM breaking

        1. CmdrX3
          Coffee/keyboard

          Well just checked out those comparison pictures and you've certainly confirmed it for me, they both look like completely different and individual products. Perhaps Apple need to sue Asus, because when I open the box, there was the product sitting right on top in all it's glory and the USB cable is very similar. As for the box, how dare a company put a picture of their product right there on the front of it. Samsung even had the blatant cheek to write Samsung Galaxy Tab in big letters right on the front of the box in a totally deliberate attempt to fool people into thinking it's actually an iPad. As for using a completely different looking voice recording app, they should be ashamed of themselves.

          Oh did I happen to mention you were an idiot, it appears not... you are an idiot, there you go...sorted!!

    2. lurker

      "freetard Kindle book reader"

      Ignoring the weak 'freetard' label which seems to imply that wanting to have access to epub formats on a kindle is socially irresponsible..

      http://calibre-ebook.com/

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    bootloader

    I'd think if the head of the Silk project (one main part of the tablet) "doesn't know" if it's locked, then is quite likely that the boot loader IS locked and probably very much so.

  4. LuMan
    Go

    Hoo-bloody-ray!

    At last, a pad manufacturer/supplier/whatever with a sensible attitude to what folk might actually want. Simply make your choice - root it and void your warranty, or don't and keep it. Most of us are adult enough to make our own decisions. Not to mention that, at that price, you could buy one to hack and one for keeps.

    It's also worth noting that not all hacks are bad. Some even enhance the operation of the original firmware and OS.

    Good going, Amazon. Let's hope others follow suit.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Ermm

      Care to explain how is this any different from the other tablet makers?

      We don't even know if the boot loader is unlocked or not, and from his silence on the matter I'm guessing it is locked.

      1. Anonymous John

        Re Care to explain how is this any different from the other tablet makers?

        It's very cheap.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          At AC 1606

          Not sure the OP was think of cost...

  5. James 51 Silver badge

    Good Lord, exec actually talking sense!

  6. GottaBeKidding

    Currency conversion again!

    $199 (£199)

    Please! :)

    1. phuzz Silver badge
      WTF?

      You're a bit out there, look at the price of the new cheapo kindle: $79 in the states becomes £89 over here.

      So apparently the extra shipping and taxes make up 40% of the price (based on today's conversion rate of $79~£50).

      1. Jon Green
        FAIL

        Not quite

        As I understand it, the US$79 model is advertising-supported. The non-adverts model is $109 = ~£84 inc. VAT. So in fact, we're getting a bargain - and the US price won't have included state sales tax, whereas the VAT price does of course.

      2. Jim_aka_Jim
        Mushroom

        Will people stop comparing the price in America!!! Do your research before complaining. It's so much cheaper in America because it's add supported: every time you switch the thing off an add will show on the display until you swtich is back on again.

        It was still going to be about £79 in the UK, but there's no adds on the UK one, so it's £89 instead. And a good thing too: adds for the entire time you own a product? No thanks.

      3. Rob Moir
        Thumb Down

        Actually you're comparing the cost of the ad supported model in the states to the non-add supported model we're getting here.

        But do carry on, why let facts get in the way of your opinion?

    2. Anonymous Bosch

      Currency conversion again! + VAT + cost of recycling +...

      Amazing that you Brits are that clueless.

  7. Joseph Lord
    Big Brother

    Given its built in man in the middle attack...

    ...being rootable is the only way I would even consider buying such a device or recommending it to anyone.

    1. moiety

      There's a man-in-the-middle attack (Silk) and a man-at-the-other-end attack (Amazon withdrawing books...even if they've promised not to do it, the ability is still there).

      Rooted is the only way I'd use or recommend the device too. Have an upvote, Mr. Lord.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Title Not Needed Or Wanted

    ... Just waiting for the tablet-ards to come out whining about the fact that if only it was ~50 cheaper - quadcore - with 256GB SSD + Direct Link to Skynet then they might be interested in parting with some cash to pick one up etc. etc.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Nope

      the biggest fail is no 3g, so a mobile consumption device with a small storage area, and no expansions, but you can pull everything from the cloud, except when you are mobile, which is when you really want a 7 inch device?

      1. fandom Silver badge
        Angel

        3g?

        Why would I want to pay another monthly fee for a 3G subscription when my smartphone, which is always with me, already has one?

      2. Anonymous John

        I've got a Three MIFI thingie, so a WiFi only tablet is fine. Ditto a Kindle ereader if I ever buy one. When my smartphone contract runs out, I can downgrade it. Quite a saving all round.

        The E585 also takes an SDHC card up to 32GB, but I don't know if a tablet can see it by WiFi.

    2. Ralthor

      Re: AC 13:45 GMT

      So you're getting in with some pre-emptive whining about the whiners? LOL

      If it gets release this side of the pond with anywhere near the price point it's at in the states, not at 1 dollar = 1 pound then I will be grabbing one of these. I need something to replace my aging book reader and after consideration reckon that a seven incher is the perfoect form factor for me. Large enough to \llow a comfortable font size and small enough to fit in a pocket.

  9. nichobe
    Gimp

    No front facing VGA camera

    FAIL - or iPad one clone...... might wait for the second coming.....might create Amazon fanboi's

    As for the hacking of the tablet, maybe the fact Amazon have spent $0 in trying to secure it has something to do with the cost of the final product.......

    1. Northern Fop

      Haters gotta hate

      VGA camera? Yeah, I think you've nailed it's Achilles' heel there.

      *rolls eyes*

    2. Andy Fletcher

      Why are you worried?

      Your IPad presumably has got one

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Not many books have those either.

  10. Northern Fop

    Cool

    Why waste millions on securing and re-secring your device when you can spend all that moolah on making the user experience better, or providing top-drawer content. Especially as only a tiny fraction of people will bother anyway...

    You listening, Stevo? Are you?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      totally agree..

      ..I only bought an iPod touch (i know, i know....i'm sorry) 'cos I could jailbreak it and make it more useful (it's still a toy though). But this....I'll be watching developments on this keenly ...

      Does it have and SD card slot too? I can only wish.

  11. Arctic fox
    Happy

    Locked bootloader or no locked bootloader.........

    ..............it will be rooted in no time flat and if the custom ROM boys are not already cooking something up I'll eat my hat *and* yours. Amazon can after all afford to have a very relaxed attitude to this (if they are sensible). When it comes down to it how many of their customers are likely to do this, percentage-wise? It will simply generate even more "buzz" round this iteration of their Kindle line.

    1. James Hughes 1

      Quite

      And for some reason you (and previous post) got a downvote? Who are these people?

      Anyway, it's pretty simple. Don't bother protected the device - it's takes ages and lots of cash, and gets rooted immediately anyway. The only people who root anyway are people who probably wouldn't have bought the device unless they could. So unless you are selling each item at a loss, it's a no brainer. Make money, or don't.

      1. Arctic fox
        Happy

        @James Hughes 1 RE "Quite" Indeed, I am somewhat at a loss to..........

        ..........understand why my post was apparently so "controversial" for a couple of people. I recall that HTC recently decided that locking the bootloader was more trouble that it was worth. Well, anyway it is up to Amazon to decide whether they want the grief or not but whatever happens it will be rooted and custom ROMs installed by very happy enthusiasts. After all at that price you would be smiling, wouldn't you!

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Not sure why you say Amazon can have a very relaxed attitude to this, when even Google (which usually has a very relaxed attitude to copyright) locked Video rentals out of rooted devices.

      According to most media Amazon is also partly subsidising the cost of the device, so it seems even more important for them to contain any rooting (and avoid piracy)

      I think Amazon will be just as good as the others. Sure they won't take anyone who roots their devices to court - mainly because it's been proven they can't - but you can bet they won't make custom rom users lives any easier.

      1. Charles 9 Silver badge

        To which some of us reply...

        "Who ______ cares?" If Amazon is a bit cavalier about the attitude of rooting the Fire, there's a fair hint that Amazon isn't too concerned about hardware losses, meaning it's probably selling very close to cost either way, meaning at best they make a little bit with each sale and at worst they take a slight hit that's easily recovered with e-book sales that can still be made on rooted Fires (since Android already has the Kindle Reader in its marketplace). Meanwhile, a potent $200 7-inch WiFi tablet at least piques my interest. Perhaps not now, but a little later on after a little hands-on time I may get one and root it myself so I can put in additional readers such as for PDFs. Amazon, you have my attention...

      2. Arctic fox

        +++ath0@ RE "Not sure why you say Amazon can have a very relaxed attitude to this, "

        Well, I did include in brackets "if they are sensible". Furthermore I made the point that only a small percentage of their customers are going to do this and so (as others have pointed out) it would be a waste of effort and money locking it down. I also made it pretty clear that IMO it will be rooted *however* hard they try to prevent it - the temptation will be way too much, with the result that Amazon will achieve nothing. The people who have the knowledge/inclination to do this will do it, end of.

  12. sisk Silver badge

    Good decision

    Motorola, are you paying attention? Locking (or, rather, attempting to lock) an Android device is a pointless waste of your time. It WILL be rooted whether the manufacturer likes it or not, so go spend your time on features to improve the hardware instead.

    Apple, you may want to pay attention to. People who really want a rooted iOS device will have one to. They're just far outnumbered by the people who root their Androids.

  13. Jad
    Meh

    Great, I've Rooted it ...

    Now what ...

    I guess I could install Android ... oh wait!

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    who cares

    99% of people who buy these things don't know what rooted means. It's just all the sad bastards who loiter around tech websites who give a shit if they can SSH into their tablet.

    Do yourselves a favour and go and get laid.

    1. Arctic fox
      Trollface

      @AC RE "who cares" Well, actually old chap I am pretty certain that.......

      ............quite a lot of us manage to be both interested in tech *and* get laid regularly. What your problems may be however..............?

    2. Paul Crawford Silver badge

      @who cares

      "the sad bastards who loiter around tech websites"

      Said the AC who posted on a tech website...

  15. Bill Cumming
    Thumb Up

    cheapest Kindle for us outside the USA...

    will be $109 (the $79 is for an add supported kindle which currently is US only).

    If you're ordering from Europe with a non-US address you'll be directed to the non-add version.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Geez

    How many times? The abbreviation of advert is ad, i.e. there is only one 'd'.

    I can only assume the illiterates among you want the Kindle Fire for Angry Birds and not the books.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      The abbreviation of advert is ad...

      ...where advert is an abbreviation of advertisement :o)

      1. Field Marshal Von Krakenfart
        Coat

        I've often wondered....

        ...why is "abbreviation" such a big word?

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        I was taking baby steps for the benefit of the children.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    You tell em metavisor

    How about finishing off with a Charlton Hestonesque cry of "Votedown you all to hell!"

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