There were police, it seems...
The SFPD now says officers "assisted" the Apple people, but didn't go into the house to search it.
Update: This story has been updated to reflect that the SFPD has apparently changed its story about the iPhone 5 search. The San Francisco Police Department has told a local paper that plainclothes police accompanied two Apple security officials to the home of a local man in search of a lost iPhone 5 prototype. According to …
The people from Apple who spoke to the perp claimed to be SFPD but were not SFPD.
Can I, as a regular Joe here in London, walk around claiming to be Met Police because there's some wooden top standing behind me? No.
So still looks like Apple are going around claiming to be SFPD, which is apparently a crime. I won't hold my breath waiting for the charges to be brought against the fruit company, however.
If the witness can't confirm that the Apple employees unambiguously identified themselves as police, it's going to be a tough case to make.
Not to worry, though; the PC Magazine article says there are plenty of other things they can be charged with. Unlawful entry, extortion, and fraud, for a start.
They could have easily said they were "with the SFPD" implying they were officers but in court they can easily say they meant that the SFPD came with them and were outside enjoying a donut. Why wait in the car? That way they can't run afoul of the Constitution since it was an unlawful search and all. What Apple might not realize that the Fourth Amendment is not limited in the same manner as the First Amendment is and therefore even Apple would need a warrant to conduct a search. That said, it will, as always, come down to a "he said, she said" situation. My advice is to always keep a video camera handy and use the words that will undoubtedly be used on you; "it shouldn't be a problem if you've got nothing to hide, right?"
Never, under any circumstances get an iPhone. They are fashion accessories, not primarily pieces of technology. Yes, they do smartphone things, but that is not what they are for. The great thing about Android is that it is sold as a (hopefully) reasonably priced smartphone the first purpose of which is to be a smartphone that can do stuff.
So my smartphone can't run iTunes? It can run Android marketplace and Amazons too if I want.
I can't run FaceTime? I can run Skype which has a bigger audience of phones and computers.
It hasn't got the iPhone slick interface? That is nothing special, just very well hyped.
I have never felt the need to hack my Android - I might when I get my new contract in a couple of months. I may fiddle with the old one to see what I have been missing but I have been able to do all that I wanted with it until now. I even managed to duplicate the Iphone connectivity experience by going into a lift while talking on the phone. Once the metal doors closed and we went down, it dropped the call - just like an Apple phone!
I'm "into technology" if you mean working and developing in it. Lots of colleagues do buy Apple kit, just because they know and understand technology.
But I suspect you mean just "interested as a hobby", so just following the usual, uninformed, "popular = bad" fashion.
Take a risk, learn UNIX and get an Apple computer. The risk is, you would have to eat your words.
I am not slagging off Linux, Windows, Free BSD or whatever fetish takes your fantasy.
Why would I want to spend 2 times more than the computer is actually worth (not what Apple says it is worth) just to run UNIX? I can do that on a much more powerful but cheaper system.
Wher do I get my 2 times figure? I just built a Core i7 gaming rig for £900 including a full copy (not OEM) of Windows 7. No cheap parts were used. Out of curiosity I configured an iMac as well as I could ( it didn't come close - it still didn't have things the custom rig does like bluetooth, USB 3 and a bluray player) on the Apple store. Total price? just under £2000. Now I didn't include a monitor with my new rig but having just saved £1100 and got a better machine than any Apple offering I could buy any IPS LED backlit monitor I choose and still have enough change to buy another computer, or a cheap second hand car. I didn't even bother seeing how much a specced up Mac Pro would be.
You clearly didn't spend much time researching Macs. They have all come standard with Bluetooth for years. Also, a monitor that's comparable to the 27" iMac's costs at least $1000 and that's in the US, where electronics are typically cheaper. So the price difference between your "gaming rig" and the iMac might not be as big as you expected.
Ultimately though people pay Apple's profit margins to use OS X which is very nice, but I'm sure you want to justify your recent purchase of a PC to yourself and will argue that Windows 7 can do everything OS X does, etc. etc.
"Also, a monitor that's comparable to the 27" iMac's costs at least $1000 and that's in the US, where electronics are typically cheaper."
Do more Googling. They're about £490 from Hazro (IPS too!). Shows how much of a rip off Apple are who charge about twice that for something no better.
Buy a copy of OSX if you want it that badly, hackintosh it and still save shedloads of cash.
You obviously don't research prices much as I can get a 27" IPS monitor for around £500
And I don't have to justify anything as I paid the best prices possible and got exactly what I wanted. What needs justifying is spending more to get less and that is the category Apple fans fall into.
And yes, Windows 7 does do everything that OSX does and more besides.
Maybe I have a fetish for those, My laptop triple boots Apple OS 10.5, Linux Mint 11, And windows 7.
I enjoy using all of them. Oh and " Take a risk, learn UNIX and get an Apple computer. The risk is, you would have to eat your words ", FreeBSD is Unix and is at the core of Apple OS, Linux is a UNIX Like system and Windows is Windows, we all need a change sometime.
Look at the first Android prototypes and the original beta SDKs. Google was originally trying to make something similar to a circa-2007 Blackberry or Motorola Q. So next time you're using your Android's nice touch interface on its nice big touchscreen, you can thank Apple for making the fashion accessory that inspired it.
You are kidding, right? Have you ever used an iPhone? I'm not here to bag Android (I quite like it) but I've been in IT for 12 years and I can remote manage Windows servers on my iPhone. That's just one example of what makes it a primary piece of technology. The hardware is superior to *anything else*, and the OS is on par with Android in most respects (I think iOS has some catching up to do) but iOS also doesnt suffer the horrible horrible bugs that Android does, AND there are A1 class apps available on the iphone, but you wouldn't know that since you don't use one. I just cant stand ignorant statements such as 'they are not a primary piece of technology'. 'They are a fashion accessory'. You are a fool intent on spreading your foolishness to others. Shame on you.
Er, aren't you missing the point? Surely even in the good ol' US of A it is illegal to impersonate a police officer? And doing so to gain illegal entry to someone's home and threaten the residence is surely an agrevating factor?
What on earth were the SFPD officers thinking when they agreed to go along with this? With the Apple guys handing out a phone number this was always going to come out.
And it doesn't say much for whatever GPS tracking is in the phone if Apple went to the wrong house.
"The six searched his home for the unnamed device and offered him $300 for it, but he told them he did not have it."
I would have asked for a search warrant and until they had one, there will be no search.
As soon as they offered him money, it was quite evident that they were not police officers.
All they need is reasonable suspicion that the device is there. It used to be probable cause but the Supremes have even watered that down. So if you say that the police can't come in without a warrant you now you are interfering with a Peace officer in the performance of their duty. The Police are also know to kill peoples dogs and cats because they were " a threat to the officer".
Sadly standing up for you civil rights in the U.S. is dangerous to your health and freedom. And don't even think about filming them to protect yourself.
AC to protect myself.
Legally the police in the US need a warrant to search your home or your person AGAINST YOUR WILL. Sometimes they go ahead and search anyway but can be contested in court. What often happens is that police take advantage of people's ignorance of the legal technicalities, and persuade people to cooperate using snake-oil salesmen techniques. For example "Do you mind if I come in & have a look around" - many people will say "sue no problem" because they think they are being polite, while in reality that response can be legally taken as consent to search.
This guy might not have known that he had the option of refusing the search.
We don't need this media theatre to be beaten into a frenzy.
I'll buy the silly thing Apple, I'm more than happy to, my 3GS is getting old.
But save us the drama, PLEASE! I don't need fuzzy pics of stolen phones, or the accompanying media frenzy. Once I could believe, but twice in a row just comes off staged.
While you are willing to keep giving them your cash Apple will carry on with business as normal.
This includes stealing the work of others and passing it off as your own.
Filing multiple frivolous lawsuits just to delay a competitors product getting to market.
Blame other companies for their fuckups (blaming Microsoft when They shipped ipods containing a worm as just one example)
Ignoring European laws about the length of a warranty (3 years) and refusing to fix a faulty product as you didn't buy Applecare.
Ignoring EU law again by releasing battery powered devices which you cannot change the battery yourself. (why they haven't been battered in the courts I don't know, if it was any other company they would have been dragged over the coals by now)
Deliberatly restricting what a device can do, just to introduce a 'feature' in the next release so idiots like yourself rush out to buy it instead of asking why it wasn't there from day one.
Lying to their customers when a fault is found with a product and spending more on PR for damaged limitation rather than fixing the problem.
Attempt to sneak software onto peoples computers in order to make it look like market share had grown. (Itunes installing safari without asking)
Not allowing apps that directly compete with Apples own offerings because they 'duplicate functionality'. So what? If I want to have different apps that do the same or similar things that should be up to me. Apples stance is just blatently anti-competitive.
The attempt to impose American bible-belt 'morality' on everyone.
Terrorising journalists and threatening their career because they dared release information about a product before the marketing department (look up Jason O'Grady).
Terrify employees with a personal police force with regard to any leak to such an extent that they have even committed suicide. This started in China and it looks to have spread to the SFPD. No corporation should have a police force in its pocket. Be afraid, very afraid.
I could go on but point made. While Apple have such blind willing fans such as yourself they will never change. I don't buy Apple so you could say it doesn't affect me and you would be wrong. If a newspaper for example wants to sell through the App store they have to give Apple 30% fair enough apple can charge what they like. But they go one step further and ban that newspaper from selling a subscription cheaper elsewhere so they raise their prices. Even if I buy a subscription through the newspapers website I am paying a higher rate than I needed to as they are forbidden from selling it any cheaper by Apple. The more Apple get away with it, the more other companies look and think if they can get away with it, so can we. As a result expect technology to move backwards as individual companies use underhand tactics to lock you into their products and keep you there making it incredibly difficult to move to another supplier. As technology moves forward everything should be becoming more compatible with everything else, not less. We are heading back to the 80's were you had to pick a platform and stick with it as it was incompatible with everything else. IBM PC vs Amstrad, Amiga vs Atari ST etc. This is a huge step backwards and is a very bad thing.
The PR machine at Apple is at it again by "misplacing" another prototype shortly before its launch. Someone finds it, plasters the specs over the web to get the Appletinis drooling and camping out at the stores to get it as soon as the Immaculate Conception is delivered for the 5th time.
Wasn't the last guy who "found" the IP4 recently hired by Apple...at least that was the public statement.
Have we slid so far down the slippery slope that the police will now sanction a Corporate search of personal property? The LOSS of your PERSONAL property does not confer your right to search someone else's personal property. Did Steve Jobs sanction that action? Is that his last earthly attempt to hold on to power? Well I can tell you Apple can suck it (to the core) for that.
Apple is silent about even the existence future products. It's mainly about delaying any competitor response as long as possible, and protecting sales of the Apple product it will replace. Those are worth billions to Apple. Hype is worth only millions, and requires disclosing the existence of the product. And dirty hype, that Barry Shitpeas says Apple is deliberately manufacturing here, is seriously damaging to Apple. Why would they do that?
I'm not claiming that this wasn't Apple, or wasn't incompetent or perhaps immoral. Just that it isn't hype initiated by senior management.
Dude apparently didn't know his rights. Tell me what California law allows an APPLE EMPLOYEE to search ANY private citizen's home while POLICE OFFERS STAND OUTSIDE, ALL without any form of warrant?? BS. Apple's people are not law enforcement and do not have any legal right to enter or search any private citizens' home, whether they think they have reason to believe so or not. In fact, Calderon can Sue and win a tidy sum from either APPLE, SF PD, or both.
And you are ignoring the effects of "apparent authority" that routinely make innocent people go so far as to admit they committed serious crimes.
"We're with the police, may we come in" a request, not a demand when spoken by a police officer, and a phrase easily usurped by someone who has hired police to accompany them.
And the Apple employee was an ex-cop. As someone with cops and ex-cops in his family I can tell you that tricking people into giving up their rights and how to get away with crimes is a common topic.
You can say it wouldn't happen to you, but when the day comes, likely you'll be intimidated into the wrong actions too.
The difference is, I know my rights and I can tell you for a fact that some private company with an ex cop or not, does not have any LEGAL RIGHT to search My home, whether accompanied by police, or not. APPLE IS NOT LAW ENFORCEMENT and they have NO LEGAL RIGHT THEREFORE, TO SEARCH ANY PRIVATE CITIZEN'S HOME. I have cops and a JUDGE in my family sir, so I KNOW what I'm talking about. NO ONE is going to trick me into entering my home illegally. Show me a badge and Identify yourself. Try to mince words, I will ask if they are police officers. They aren't? Sorry, not coming in> Here's the thing. THE COPS STAYED OUTSIDE. WHY? THEY KNOW They can't enter without a warrant. Why else would THEY remain outside while Apple employees entered with the owner's consent? There you have it. NO ONE FROM APPLE can legal enter ANYONE'S HOME unless invited and I sure as hell would not invite them. They passed themselves off as police officers, tricked the bloke into allowing them entry, and committed an illegal search, period. They were not law enforcement and therefore had NO RIGHT to search the man's home, irregardless of what they believed they might find there. Some may be easily tricked. I am not. ASK FOR A BADGE AND ASK IF THEY ARE POLICE OFFICERS. They say NO, then no entry. They say yes, they are lying and illegally searching. With officers present who have knowledge of this, they are braking the law too. Can you say - "LAW SUIT AND BIG SETTLEMENT"?
"The six searched his home for the unnamed device and offered him $300 for it, but he told them he did not have it."
Apple cops: "We're looking for a thing, do you have it?"
Home Owner: "What thing?"
AC: "You know, a thingy..."
HO: "What you talking about? What do you think I have?"
AC: "Don't play dumb sonny, hand over the doodah"
HO: "I have no idea what you're talking about"
AC: "Okay, look, hand it over and we'll give you $300"
HO: "Hand over what?!"
I find it disgusting that the home was searched without a warrant and by civilians when the police looked on from outside? So many people should be fired over this, the police involved, their officers in charge . There should be an immediate investigation into this with an email freeze and mobile phone record tracking and then apple should be fined massively for home invasion,.invasion of privacy, etc..
It's a lost phone ford chrissake not enriched uranium.
At least the fanbois will be happy when the specs are released for what they are searching for.
Maybe their version works about as well as the one in my Motorola DEFY? Switched on everything (GPS, WiFi, mobile, bluetooth...) and tied the damn phone to a tree in the driveway. Could the Motoblur site locate my phone? Could it hell...
I'd have more luck if I wrote an app to request a webpage off my site at regular intervals giving the location as parameters in the fetch.
If my phone didn't duplicate the relevant functions, I would like an iPod touch. One day, when I am rich, I may get an Apple laptop. The first computer network I have ever used a computer on was an Apple one in the University computer labs. I have persuaded several people who are getting new computers to get Apples. I don't think I qualify as an anti-fanboi, mouth-frothing or not.
One of my objections to iPhones arise from the reason that a lot of people get them - namely fashion. Fashion is no reason to do anything with technology. Technology is do do things with. Fashion is for visual and social effect.
You want a SmartPhone? Get the one that best does the things you want - phone, SMS applications, development or whatever. You want to appear visually cool - get a new shirt, dress, pair of shoes or get your teeth whitened.
Your object to iPhones because they are popular, and the only possible explanation for them being popular is 'fashion'.
Would you consider for a moment that iPhones might be popular because people actually like them and the way they work?
Moreover, teens -- who usually go for 'most fashionable' things -- don't have iPhones, their fashionable phone is Blackberry, and the reason for that is Blackberry Messenger and their ability to 'text' each other for free and not uses SMS credits on their PaYG.
"Moreover, teens -- who usually go for 'most fashionable' things -- don't have iPhones..."
You mean the teens without well off and overly generous parents don't have iPhones. A quick check with @&T shows that the most expensive BB (Torch 9810) is the same price ($49) as the cheapest iPhone (3GS). Sure, refurbs are cheaper but even then the iPhone 4 is two to four times the cost of the 9810. Sometimes wallets actually trump fashion and that the texts are free it kinda proves the point, especially on PaYG, no?
No one else find the account of this 'illegal search' a bit... contradictory?
Calderón told SF Weekly that in July, he was visited by six people – four men and two women – who wore badges and said they were San Francisco police officers. The six searched his home
Calderon told SF Weekly that four of the visitors did indeed stay outside his home. But he maintained the no one identified themselves as an Apple employee.
Nowhere does anyone suggest they forced their way in.
"We have tracked a stolen device by GPS and it may be on these premises, can we come in and look for it?"
If yes - search
if no - leave
I don't see that as being all that sinister to be honest.
"While you are willing to keep giving them your cash Apple will carry on with business as normal. This includes stealing the work of others and passing it off as your own", Anonymous Coward, Sep 03 2011 14:55 GMT
OK, I'll byte, where are all the exmples of Apple stealing other peoples work.
it's a long one but here are some highlights:
Here is a short list of features Apple stole from Windows
Firewire - actually called P1394 and made in colaboration with a number of companies but call it firewire and suddenly Apple invented it
They lay claim to the modern laptop format but were beaten to it 2 years earlier by Compaq
The iPhone - a direct copy of the LG Prada
They claim to have invented the scroll wheel - actually Eric Michelman at Microsoft in 1993
Multi touch - Done by Fingerworks who Apple then bought to get their hands on the technology. Buying the inventor does not make you the inventor
The iPod - was not the first mp3 player no matter what Apple tell you
The iPod interface - directly lifted from Creative who succesfully sued and got a lot of money
Facetime - video calling existed long before Apple thought it was a good thing and then started claiming that video calling was ONLY available on iphone
The OSX dock - first seen on RISC OS even before NeXT so you can't claim St Jobs was involved
Augmented reality maps - already done a few times but Apple think they can patent it
The iPad - Apple did not invent the tablet
Pico projectors in phones - they haven't released an iphone with it in yet but have patented it even though it has already been done. Samsung have one as just one example
Ripping off their own developers
Dynamic cell memory patent - as demo'd by Samsung a year earlier
Location based ads - beaten to it by Google
And don't forget the daddy, the GUI they stole from Xerox (yes they licensed it at a later date but they stole it first)
There are loads (and I mean LOADS) of other examples but point made I think. I know that other companies quite happily lift features from competitors but that doesn't make it right. Not only that most other companies are well aware they are taking from other places but don't then have the cheek to sue and pretend that they did it first.
AC 11:36 Apple is hugely successful now; I am sorry for your loss. Your post contains so many errors, it's not really worth discussing. But let's tackle the first three.
1. Yes, Apple was so comprehensively defeated in the market that Mac OS was gradually revised to work more like Microsoft Windows, as a matter of survival. But they were hardly "innovations"; simply Microsoft's way of doing things. Existing Mac users didn't like the changes.
2. Firewire most certainly was invented by Apple. After it was submitted for standardisation, other companies also worked on the committee. It combined the benefits of Apple Desktop Bus and SCSI: High speed, peer to peer, substantial power distribution, thin, symmetrical cables (only one kind of cable as conceived), isochronous transfers, hot plug/unplug.
3. The modern laptop format? I don't know what 's meant by that, but Apple have a reasonable claim to the first designed for GUI use. I'd say "firsts" went like this: Osborne 1 and Epson HX20 1981; Toshiba T1100 1985. Apple Powerbook 1991: the first laptops with palm rest and trackball at the front, keyboard behind. At that time PC laptops were designed for DOS; Windows 3 had only just been released, and on laptops had to be used with a separate mouse or clip-on trackball. (However, the Powerbook 100 was actually designed by Sony for Apple.) I don't think Compaq did anything first - their claim to fame was copying the PC in an Osborne form factor legally.
Modern laptop format meaning something that you look at and see something similar to what you see today and not just a desktop in a luggable case. the Tosh T1100 had the right kind of design but the equivalent of a calculator LCD screen and no hard disk. The Compaq SLT/286 was the first that could be compared to todays modern laptops with a VGA LCD screen and hard disk.
As to your other points:
Firewire was never submitted for standardisation by Apple. That would be the p1394 working group which is why every member of that group gets royalties from every firewire port made. They approached a group of companies with an idea and it went from there. Apple merely own the trademark 'Firewire'. Apple did not, and could not do it on their own but as usual don't let the facts get in the way of Apple history
Have a look at the date on the article I linked to. We are talking about things since OSX and not the transition from OS9 to OSX which from the wording of your reply you seem to think it means. Although it is interesting that in your eyes when Apple steal something it is either 'innovating' or 'surviving'. Would you feel the same way if the word Apple was replaced with Microsoft?
So thanks very much for your 'fantasy post', anything else you would like correcting on?
BTW, wikipedia is not the source of all knowledge so you might need to look a little harder next time.
Apple leave phone in bar hoping for a repeat of last time, instead nothing happens and panic ensues that iphone 5 will be on the next flight to samsung hq rather than gracing articles for salivating fanbois.
Nice touch with the deportation threats as well, cute the release of the iCasualracism in an apple store near you soon.
The head of 'compliance' of a global bank once told me that not only did this financial services giant have its own security division populated by ex-FBI and other ex-security agency and law enforcement staff but also has it's own private military unit complete with black helicopters.
The security people often work with local law enforcement when their organisation has been attacked in some way, be it virtual or physical methods of gaining their funds, and they often take the lead role rather than the local plod; their military division has been used in cases of kidnaped employees in South America and other places where that kind of thing is likely to occur.
Although I wonder if in these days of austerity they have subcontracted out the military work to Blackwater or other professional mercenary outfit.
Got to hand it to Apple.. This is one brilliant way to get free advertising for an upcoming product. They pulled the same "trick" with the iPhone 4 remember. Leave the device somewhere public, claim it was "stolen" media goes wild covering the hunt.
To the SF police department. If Apple isn't picking up %100 of the costs in looking for the thing, STOP WASTING YOUR TAXPAYER'S MONEY LOOKING FOR IT! Your officers have MUCH better things to do than hunt for something that should have never left Apple HQ in the fist place.
To whoever has this thing. A suggestion.. Have some fun... FedEX that b**ch to Samsung.
Or.. Answer this question.... Will it blend?
so....prototype new iPhone goes missing again. gets hunted down and found again.
got lots of free publicity and hype last time....maybe not so much this time - but its all
if Apple cared so much they would NOT let these devices leave their HQ premises full stop - they WANT these leaks and free pages of hype.
i think the 'we tracked it to a house' is one reason NOT to buy one.
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