back to article Pirate Party wins seat in European Parliament

The pro-internet file sharing Pirate Party yesterday scored a big win by securing a seat in the European parliament. It pulled in 7.1 per cent of votes in Sweden, which handed the party one of the country’s 18 seats in the European parliament. "Privacy issues and civil liberties are important to people and they demonstrated …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Stop

    Results...

    "...took 6.5 per cent of the UK vote. The Pirate Party beat this, with its 7.1 per cent share. We think this tells us something significant, but we're not sure what..."

    That 6.5 % of the UK voting public are arseholes, Whereas 7.1% of Swedes are a bunch of freeloaders?

  2. Andy
    Thumb Down

    BNP - how dare they...

    I'm not a leftie, but the BNP getting a result like this on the commemoration of D-Day is utterly outrageous.

    Shame on all of you who couldn't be arsed to vote.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    BNP

    I'm an accidental immigrant but always vote for the far right in my adopted country and it seems my reasoning for doing so is justified. Said reasoning being that it will give a kick up the backsides of the smug arses of the members of the main political parties. Myabe now they will start to look more seriously at why people didn't vote for them and listen to what the people want.

  4. Lionel Baden

    can you lend us a hand

    only got another 40 barrels to shift

    yup down there in the cellar please

  5. EvilGav

    @ Andy

    The BNP getting a result is terrible, but UKIP even more results is fine ?

    Both want to distance us from Europe, one is more overt in their aims than the other.

    But only one of them is terrible.

    How about the SNP ? They got the same number of seats as the BNP and have been qutie clear in wanting to break up the union that is Great Britain. Any comment on them ?

  6. David Webb

    Ahem

    Being a proud Welshman (apparently Celt isn't the race, its the language) I can say, without a shadow of doubt, that the BNP does not represent me, nor will they ever represent me. Luckily, neither do the Lib Dems!

  7. Karim Bourouba
    Paris Hilton

    @Chris W

    Does this mean you voted for the racist BNP then, only to prove a point against the main political parties? If you did, dont you think that it was a tad silly?

    I understand the need to suffer groups like the BNP, after all we live in a democracy, but I dont see the need to throw away a vote for them. That is, of course, unless you fit their idea of what a British person looks like. After listening to the chap who leads that rabble on Sky news last night it would appear he will figure out who can stay and who can go just by looking at them.

    I am not telling you that a protest vote is wrong, it isnt, but it is a great shame that it goes to muppets like the BNP instead of actual political parties like the Green Party, or UKIP, who actually want to try and make a positive difference.

    Paris, because even she isnt stupid enough to waste a vote on the BNP...

  8. Paul
    Joke

    Will they get their expenses paid

    ... in pieces of eight.

    A-haaaarr

  9. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    Racist

    People who vote for BNP are racists, no matter what excuse they come up with.

  10. Dave Ross
    Heart

    Mortifying.

    I am horrified that the British Nazi Party managed to get two seats in Europe. A sad day indeed.

    While I don't mind idiots like this kicking up a fuss, I am stunned that enough British citizens would actually take a bunch of buffons like this seriously enough to vote for them.

    The continued degradation of this country that was started by the Thatcher government and gleefully continued by the Blair one is one of the most mortifying things I have the extreme displeasure to witness.

    Oh, and go Pirate party! :)

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Pirate

    Pirates 7.1%, BNP 6.5%

    Arr! That be cos BNP is limited to those from a certain racial background with very limited views, whilst piracy knows no such boundaries, ye scurvy knaves! Avast behind! Splice the mainbrace, and prepare for boarders!

    Oh and Chris W? It's because of this attitude that we get people elected who have one "policy" ('keep our post office open', or "no telephone mast next to our school", forex) but who don't have a sodding clue how a council is supposed to run, and then fsck everything else up by being unable to make a sensible decision on anything else. Or even worse, too many people could waste their ballot as a protest vote thinking "oh, I'll just vote for the so-and-so to give the 'big three' a butt-kick" and we end up with a bunch of racist thugs running things. Last time something like that happened was, I believe, somewhere in central Europe around 1936/37...

  12. h4rm0ny
    Paris Hilton

    Lesser evil?

    Well if people are disgusted with the main parties (fair enough) then I suppose I'd rather they vote for a bunch of people wanting people to give them their work for free than for a bunch of racist xenophobes. So Sweden comes out ahead there.

    But yeah, yesterday's results make me ashamed of this country. If you add the UKIP and the BNP results together into a single "rude xenophobes incapable of running anything" category, then their success dwarfs the Lib Dems and the Greens (the latter usually do quite well in Europe, and our Green MEPs are very well respected in Brussels). and comes close to threatening the Conservatives.

    The behaviour of the UKIP MEPs has been disgusting. They've done no work, been disruptive (including standing up and singing the Dad's Army song in a meeting) and generally making the British look like arses.

    Though I disagree with the freeloading ideology of the Pirate Party, at least the people voting for them appear to have been voting /for/ something, not just trying to be disruptive, awkward and racist. And at least the Pirate Party has (I have been told) some more sensible views on government intrusion and police powers.

    Shame on this country. Real shame.

    Paris, because I need /someone/ to put a smile on my face.

  13. jon
    Pirate

    something about pirates pwn vikings?

    shame there were no ninjas

  14. Pat

    what it tells us

    is that the BNP are really a minority party. It doesn't surprise me that 6% of Brits are racists, I'd have thought more. It doesn't surprise me that 7% of Swedes care more about their moviez than the rest of public policy. But these are all pretty small numbers. Trolls, the lot of them.

  15. Winkypop Silver badge
    Pirate

    Pirate Politicians?

    Avast me hearties, just you be waiting until THEY start rorting the old expenses treasure chest!

  16. NB
    Paris Hilton

    @Chris W

    I admire your optimism but the chances of our incumbent labour overlords giving a flying fuck about what we, the people, think are still so low as to be negligible. Despite the massive electoral kick to the gonads that labour have received in the last week and the fact that it is obvious to the entire country that Brown must go, that one-eyed scottish idiot refuses to budge.

    We need a general election now.

    Paris, cos even she'd make a better PM than that fucking clown Brown.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Wait, how thick are the BNP?

    "The BNP, which styles itself as the representative of the "Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Danes, Norse and closely related kindred peoples" it says constitute the indigenous peoples of the UK"

    I assume they don't realise that none of those are "indigenous peoples of the UK" :/

  18. Mark Fenton

    BNP not far right...

    ..their agenda is actually far left, but with added racism.

    They want centralised / nationalised pretty much everything - which makes them far left. It is just their racism that folks equate with the right...

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    @ChrisW

    Chris, you may want to look at the history of the Nazi party. It may sound a little familiar.

    http://www.schoolhistory.co.uk/year9links/riseofhitler/Hitlertopower.pdf

    Note: It's from a Year Nine publication, so should be ok for you get get the general idea, but you may struggle lifting your knuckles of the floor.

  20. Stuart Henderson
    Stop

    Chris W and all other racists

    Dear Chris W and all other backward racist simpletons,

    Voting for the BNP isn't a protest vote. It simply shows you're a racist and too cowardly to admit it.

    If you want to protest, turn up and spoil your vote or get involved in the bloody process.

    Regards,

    Stu

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Alert

    Not sure which is more worrying...

    900K BNP voters or 230K Christian Party voters.

    Always remember the Christian Right is rarely Christian and never right.

    AC as I don't want to be nailed to anything.

  22. zedee

    @Dave Ross - use of 'buffon'

    Boris Johnson is an example of a 'buffon'.

    The BNP are actually a bunch of 'cnuts'.

  23. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    30% (ish) turnout

    Can we conclude that over 2 thirds of the populace just want the politicians to FOAD ?

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Re : Andy

    "Shame on all of you who couldn't be arsed to vote"

    With the disenfranchisement that had taken place over the last 12 years, and now hearing Browns speach on how he must 'stay on for the good of the party' (what about the good of the people?) I am not surprised that huge numbers didn't vote. It could well be that their apathy prevented an even greater defeat for Labour and more seats for the BNP.

    When we see the distance between Government and governed increasing daily, the feeling that your single vote won't matter, and would probably be ignored anyway, will increase.

    And I didn't vote. I was working. Left home at 06:15 and got back at 21:30.

  25. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    @Andy - Vote for who exactly?

    "Shame on all of you who couldn't be arsed to vote."

    Not really. There's nobody to vote for.

    • Labour - doing a useless job under Brown, yet he's too stubborn to go.

    • Tory - would never ever vote for the Tories and toffs Cameron and Osbourne.

    • Lib Dem - used to be good under Charles Kennedy. Completely lost their way now though. Too many green policies.

    • Green - eco lefties who have fallen for global warming propaganda. No thanks

    • UKIP - too right wing. Nothing against being in Europe.

    • BNP - bunch of racists

    and then you have the tiny parties that aren't worth bothering with.

    Now Andy, who was I supposed to vote for in that bunch?

  26. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Re: BNP

    Chris W: "I'm an accidental immigrant but always vote for the far right in my adopted country and it seems my reasoning for doing so is justified. Said reasoning being that it will give a kick up the backsides of the smug arses of the members of the main political parties. Myabe now they will start to look more seriously at why people didn't vote for them and listen to what the people want."

    Given that immigrants of whatever nature are generally the unrepresented in any country, unless they've acquired citizenship and can actually vote to change the policies of the nation, it's hard to see how supporting parties that are hostile to immigrants is in any way a smart idea. If you can get a chance to influence immigration policy and make it somewhat more humane - many non-immigrants have no real idea about such matters, since they only know what they read in the papers or see on the television - voting for bigots is like taking a bullet in the foot, not only for those who have to suffer the inept, unaccountable and often degrading immigration and employment bureaucracy, but also for everyone else in society who, after all, have to live together with their new co-residents without one party or the other feeling like they're being mistreated, marginalised or victimised.

    Although one might wish that Labour and friends might consider the election of high-profile racists as a "wake-up call" or "a kick up the backsides", one should bear in mind that swathes of the political establishment (as well as many of the Britards) still regard a vote for the Liberal Democrats as a "protest vote", so the most you'll get from the ruling elite is what you've already been hearing: the Cage of the Britards has been shaken and stupid has voted for stupid. And they'd be right because even though their contempt for democracy has been demonstrated repeatedly, voting for a party merely to spite some other parties, without actually bothering to choose a party (or person) who might make a constructive difference, shows an even greater contempt for democracy than simply spoiling the ballot paper with a doodle of a penis.

    Given that a couple of Britard xenophobes will now be off to Brussels to vote away on all sorts of stuff on behalf of people following your supposedly "justified" reasoning, we can see votes on such reasoning for what they are: the Tactical Vote of the Britards. It's like a genie offering three wishes, but instead of being grateful, the average Britard, displeased at the supposedly meagre offer, takes a crap in the magic lamp with a stupid grin on his/her face, only to see the offer withdrawn. Remember that when your racist representatives are riding roughshod over your actual wishes and ideals.

  27. DutchOven

    Am I missing something?

    The BNP are big fans of "Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Danes, Norse and closely related kindred peoples". (They didn't mention picts, though did they?)

    ...but let's get this straight. If you violently invade a country and hang around for 1000 or more years then the BNP think you're a "nice" foreigner. If on the other hand, you have something positive to give to society but your parents were invited here 40 years ago, they want you out?

    ...and the fact that we all started out in Africa and share the majority of genes with every other human being on the planet counts as nothing. We are all humans, regardless of everything else. Race, colour, creed, parentage, religion, the place you happen to have been born; they're all artificial subdivisions. It's idiots like the BNP that make me ashamed to be British - they actually make me feel like leaving these islands - and I will if they ever manage to gain any serious power.

    I wonder how the BNP stand on emmigration? I mean they're a little bit down on foreigners coming here, do they feel just as strongly on behalf of foreign nations when British workers go overseas? I doubt it very much (which speaks volumes about double-standards and nimbyism, doesn't it?)

  28. Matt D

    Buffon?

    I think you mean 'buffoon', zedee. Buffon is the Italian national goalkeeper, a task for which I feel Mr. Johnson would not be ideally suited.

  29. DJ
    Joke

    FSM

    Now that there are more pirates, does this mean the end to global warming?

    http://www.seanbonner.com/blog/archives/piratesarecool.jpg

  30. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Well...

    ...if we choose to see a silver lining it's that whilst labour lost 7% of vote share the tories only increased their share by 1% so perhaps we could just view this 7% as protest votes (unfortunately resulting in loony MEPs), rather than a genuine Labour-Tory swing.

    Now all labour needs to do is get their arses in gear and remember who they work for and who their core supporters are!

  31. Simon Painter
    Stop

    calm down, it's only an EU election

    The BNP are a fringe party and serve no purpose other than to help guage the complex political barometer of UK politics. They had fewer votes than last time they stood in the EU elections and only got in because people now know that they can use these insignificant polls to register their protest vote or abstention. We are not being over run by facists and the next five years of EU politics will be very similar to the last five so let's all just calm down a little.

    The mainstream parties could do with looking at the coherent parts of the BNP manifesto though, the lucid parts actually appeal to many of middle england and a party could gain a lot of votes if it could address the fears of middle england without dipping too far into abject racism (the Daily Mail reader, for example).

    That aside, to put it in perspective the Monster Raving Looney have held more seats than the BNP ever have.

  32. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Who the BNP represent

    "Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Danes, Norse and closely related kindred peoples" - basically white people. Racist fuckwit BNP scum

  33. Ash
    Pirate

    @AC (30%)

    No, we can conclude that 2/3 were watching re-runs of the Britain's Got Talent final.

    I've said it once, I'll say it again, we live in the United Kingdom of Great Apathy.

  34. Matt
    Alert

    Should be interesting.

    With so many independants winning seats in brussels it should be an interesting few years ahead.

    And yes I did vote. Though unfortunately the BNP still didn't win in my area. Maybe next time.

    Interesting to see that people seem to think that saying Britain for the british makes you racist.... So all the illegals and criminals that come are free to stay? They can rob you blind and you don't care? Around my way it is always racist crimes against white people, yet nothing is ever done.

    Hopefully the BNP will do better in the general election, if labour will dare call it before the last possible moment that is.

    NOT AC, as I'm not afraid of the false accusations and insults

  35. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    huzzah

    30% (ish) turnout

    By Anonymous Coward Posted Monday 8th June 2009 11:09 GMT

    Can we conclude that over 2 thirds of the populace just want the politicians to FOAD ?

    ------------------------------------------

    Bingo! If you turn up and write "none of the lying, cheating, self-interested sacks of shite" on the ballot paper they don't count it.

    Ballot papers need a "protest vote" or "vote of no confidence" checkbox that basically states that none of these feckers represent your position and you think they'd be better put to use as organ donors or glue.

  36. Karim Bourouba
    Paris Hilton

    @Pat

    No, it tells us that 6% of the 34%(ish) who bothered to turn out for the elections thought that voting for the BNP was a good idea at the time.

    It's funny to listen to the news from this morning and last night. Apparently Labour got the blame for this as well. Now, personally I dont see how someone who has been voting for the Labour party for the last n amount of years starts voting for a far right racist party. Dont see how the swing from left to right can take place unless the BNP is actively going out and lying to people.

    Which they probably are.

    Last night the goon in charge of them commented that the BNP MEP's will be donating 10% of their wages to community causes and to a traditional christian christmas. Of course, I would imagine that the community causes will be things like marches, shaving heads, burning books, fearing other religions, fearing immigrants, making the public fear other things (like Europe, the single currency etc) and getting angry with anyone who appears to disagree with them.

    I still maintain that people should be able to vote for who they want, but I think those who voted BNP as a protest should feel ashamed for wasting their vote. Especially when they could have voted for the Pirate Party ( or the Roman Party, Ave).

    Paris, because she cant spell BNP.

  37. Simon Painter

    @Mark Fenton

    That's not far left, that's facism.

    I hear that wikipedia is quite good for looking up complicated things that you don't understand.

  38. This post has been deleted by its author

  39. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Karim Bourouba and others

    >If you did, dont you think that it was a tad silly?

    No, and I’ll explain why. Most people will blindly vote for the party of their fathers, note I said most. Hence we have safe seats, seats which could be won by the flower pot men if they were selected by the party members. Because of these voters a minority party will never gain overnight popularity. There was a reference by an AC to 1936/37. Hitler became leader of the NSDAP in 1921, between then and when he became chancellor in 1933 they were numerous elections. The incumbents had 12 years to take notice of the way things were going and take action, obviously they didn’t but that’s democracy for you.

    Let’s take a look at the modern day incuments and see what they have been saying about the BNP wins. “Beyond the pale”, horrific, dismayed, “a disgrace” amongst other things. What are they really saying? Democracy is a disgrace. Democracy should be voting for us. Or perhaps, their real thoughts, it’s a disgrace that we’ve been shown up to be the sponging bastards that we are and people are displeased with us. See the diference here between the disgrace that is them being sponging bastards and the one that is them being found out. They have no shame and like the sociopaths they are they truly believe that to be on the gravy train they are now riding is their God given right and we the voters shouldn’t have the nerve to question them, examine what they or doing or heaven forbid vote for someone else.

    A seat or two for the greens or lib-dems wouldn't evoke such emotions and a protest vote for them wouldn't be worth the trip to the polls.

    So if it makes them sit up and think or even realise that they may just well have to sit up and beg then for now I feel a protest vote for the far right is not wasted.

    It seems that since my starting this missive and finishing it there have been a few other comments.

    NB: 10:58 – We can only live in hope

    AC 11:00 and Stuart Henderson, thankyou for your comment I’m sure everyone was impressed by your thought provoking contributions.

    Finally, based on past historic events, even though only one, the politicians have a tad over ten years to improve their act.

  40. Joe Montana
    Flame

    The AC got it right...

    As someone else stated, there wasn't really much choice as to who to vote for in the UK... All of the parties are either corrupt and self serving (labour, conservatives, libdems), or too extreme in one way or another (bnp, ukip, green, christian)...

    Is it any surprise that only 20% of those eligible to vote actually bothered to do so?

    Those who support parties like the bnp will go out and vote at every chance, and they will also gain a lot of votes from people who are casting a protest vote due to being disgruntled with the other parties... The percentage of die hard supporters of the minority parties goes up significantly when there is such a low voter turnout.

    If we had a pirate party i would have considered voting for them, copyright laws are ridiculous these days, they are constantly being extended while modern technological advancements should make them shorter (software becomes obsolete quickly for instance, by the time copyright expires it will be completely useless, and audio/video technologies are constantly improving)...

    As for the UKIP MEPs being disrupting, that's exactly what they were supposed to do... They are an anti europe party sitting in the european parliament, their entire philosophy is anti europe and the people voting for them know that. Are you really surprised that an anti europe party would seek to disrupt the european parliament? If you truly believe in democracy, then you have to respect that a percentage of the population voted for this behaviour.

  41. Shakje

    @Chris W

    And while we wait for the next European election we can watch the BNP spend your money on racist propaganda and Nazi youth camps? Good job Chris! Highfive!

  42. Anonymous Coward
    Alert

    BNP and Politics..

    I might not like what they say but I will defend thier right to say it..

    IT is corrcet that the BNP are in the political arena rather than the terror arena like the IRA used to be and the Animal rights people still do.

    If you dont like democracy move!

    I support having the BNP on the ballot (although I would not vote for them!)

  43. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Racist thugs...

    I had no idea that Reg reading geeks were such a bunch of wet, whiny, vegetarian hand ringers. I'm genuinely surprised.

    I like many others voted BNP not because I'd like to see racist thugs in control, but because I see no better way to let our ruling elite know that I've had enough of their PC, H&S, Equal Opportunities, multi-cultural nonsense.

    Oh and the Pirate Party campaigned predominantly on civil liberties issues, not just rights for freetards.

  44. Andrew Norton
    Pirate

    oh dear

    It's amazing, the people that go 'oh the Pirate Party is just a bunch of freeloaders' - shows they've not bothered to read the platform.

    Why did the Pirate Party get such support from the Pirate Bay decision? Might have something to do with judge corruption (biased judge), police corruption (chief cop also worked for Warner while he was suppoed to be investigating TPB), and that such a harsh sentence (a year in jail is a lot in Sweden) was passed for running a website with NO proven damage (and as yet, they've only ever claimed, with no proof, that p2p damages sales - every study says otherwise), and lets not forget where this started - A raid pushed for by a foreign government, after illegal intervention by the justice minister.

    In short, the PirateBay case gave them massive support, because it symbolised the corruption in the current government, just like the expenses scandal. Essentially, that the government does what business wants, regardless of the facts, or the people, and IPRED and ACTA only make it clearer.

    There are 3 main areas of policy for the Pirate Parties.

    1) Government accountability and transparancy.

    2) Increase in Personal Privacy

    3) reform of the Copyright, Patent and Trademark systems.

    You'd be surprised just how much those 3 basic points cover, including through secondary effects. Making the government accountable, means less waste, which means a smaller budget. Ditto with things like ID cards, or databases (and cut down on the surveillance society as well).

    Just remember, take 30 years off the filesharing debate, and you'd have the same arguments about VCRs, and we have seen how that 'killed' the movie industry as they claimed it would. Cable TV didn't kill the networks, again it was claimed it would, and radio didn't kill the music companies. There's a pattern, and if you think all of a sudden the film/music industry execs are telling the truth, why have they YET to provide any proof of their claims?

    Andrew Norton

    Pirate Party International

  45. Anonymous Coward
    Pirate

    Got arr vote..

    shame they weren't on my ballot.

  46. fajensen Silver badge
    Flame

    Boycott the UK ??

    So, when will the "Boycott Britain" campaign be running - like they did with Austria?

  47. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    RAGE!!!

    People should vote how they choose, but people who don't vote shouldn't bitch about their leaders or the results of elections. That said I hate the BNP, they are racist scum, anyone who claims they are not should probably answer the question "Why can't black or asian people join the party?".

    As for the Pirate Party, if they are formed out of the Pirate Bay (as I understand they are) they also have links to the far right (Karl Lundstrom). And they have almost no policies other than "everyone should get everything, like, for free, man." There are far mor important issues to be addressed at a European level than they or the BNP can hope to address.

    I'm livid.

  48. Anonymous Coward
    Go

    What's wrong with Tories?

    An AC above says he won't vote for them because of inverted snobbery, well that's creditable and rational isn't it? Sound like a disenfranchised Labour supporter.

    Average state salary higher than average private sector salary, more than 30% of people employed by the state, state pensions guaranteed but private sector pensions decimated ... unsustainable policy at the best of times, complete madness in these times.

    The Tories will prolly get in again like the did in 1979 and have to clear up mess of a profligate Labour government, again. "Cuts cuts cuts" cry the socialist bleeding hearts, but isn't that how one balances a budget? Like a spendaholic with maxed out credit cards this country spends more than it can afford, and if we're not going to go completely down the pan we need to reduce government spending.

    But the people who have the backbone to actually do this are labelled 'nasty'. Whoever cuts the most gets my vote, Im fed up of paying for it all.

  49. Juillen
    Flame

    The elasticity of society.

    Everyone seems to forget that most people don't actually really like 'issues'. They want a peaceful life.

    Over here in sunny Bristol we had two 'issues' in rapid succession. One was a Radio presenter that asked a taxi company not to send someone round in a turban as it unnerved her daughter (but why it unnerved her daughter was not gone into).

    The second was a council member that said "in her culture there was a word for the behaviour" of another council member. A 'Coconut'. Black on the outside, white on the inside; a traitor to roots.

    One of these lost her job. The other, nobody batted an eyelid about. Guess which one?

    Well, it was the Radio presenter that lost her job to the mob. The blatant racism by a member of the council was ignored, because in her own words "she can't be racist, because she's black".

    If both had lost their jobs over it, there would be no issue (upholding the same standard). If neither had lost their jobs, again, no real issue.

    However, there's a big 'positive discrimination' thing going on. However, there is no such thing as positive discrimination. All you're doing by 'positively discriminating' for a minority is to discriminate against the majority.

    This is the crux of the matter, methinks. What isn't really an issue (not many consider anyone of any creed or colour less able than any other; social integration is largely there) is made one by political pressure groups. These keep saying that minority groupls need special concessions (why? They're equal, and I know a good many 'ethnic' people who resent these concessions, as it makes people think they can only do their job because of quotas when they're perfectly capable of competing on a level playing field).

    This environment (along with the almost witch hunt fervour that people keep screaming 'racism' over anything that may possibly be shoehorned into that catefoty.. Though sometimes even shoehorning doesn't make it that way when viewed rationally) creates a very high profile 'issue' that is blasted out to the general public, whether it's relevant or not. The premise is that "you're racist unless you try very hard to prove that you're not".

    Honestly, I think people are just fed up, and are just voting to say "Enough. This is now an issue that we think you've taken too far."

    Me, I'm middle of the road, and wish that people would just treat people as people without labelling them to make it easy to brush them off and put them in a category of "less than me, and therefore irrelevant what they say". Every time you scream 'racist' at someone, you're pulling the elastic a little further on someone, which makes their reaction that much stronger when they express it. Most people aren't racist.

    Oh, and the radio presenter that was fired? Her close circle of friends numbered the top people in the local race relations groups who were of all races. All of them testified that she was not racist. However, she's still branded racist by the mob. What does that tell you about the mob?

  50. michael
    Pirate

    @Joe Montana

    we do

    http://www.pirateparty.org.uk/

    they are just not yet setup for thses elections at the next they will be getting my vote

  51. Shakje

    Re: Racist thugs...

    "I like many others voted BNP not because I'd like to see racist thugs in control, but because I see no better way to let our ruling elite know that I've had enough of their PC, H&S, Equal Opportunities, multi-cultural nonsense."

    So you're one of the idiots that believes the Mail as well as a racist. Good show old chap!

    Just to be clear for Matt's sake, if you voted BNP you voted for a party whose leader believes that rape isn't a serious crime, in his eyes women enjoy sex and "rape is simply sex". If you voted for the BNP you also voted for a party that's curently being investigated for misappropriation of funds and for not declaring donations. If you voted for the BNP you voted for a party that only allows the membership of whites. If you really believe that immigration is the cause of all your problems, other than being misguided, you believe what you read too much. If you voted BNP, you voted for a fascist racist party, who will now be spending YOUR money on their right-wing propaganda. Nice one.

  52. Dr. Mouse Silver badge

    Anonymous Coward 11:24 GMT

    I quite agree. There is noone running for govt who even comes close to being who I want in power. If it was possible to tick the "Vote of No Confidence" box, and it was taken into account (i.e. if enough of these are cast, noone wins) I would. But the protest vote options are limited:

    a) vote for a party you dont agree with, but who is unlikely to win (e.g. Greens/BNP etc). This is idiotic in my view as it suggests you support them, and you are screwed if they actually get into power.

    b) Spoil your ballot. Problem with this is it still doesnt actually count.*

    c) Dont turn up. Although this tends to suggest you don't care... which I do.

    I can also see a (d) of running yourself, but I would make a terrible politician. I am not a leader and wont pretend to be.

    So, what can I do. a, b, and d are useless, so that leaves c: I dont turn up.

    *Interestingly enough, a friend was 'used' by the Lib Dems as a 'token' candidate. He said the candidates have to all look at a spoiled ballot and agree it's spoiled. That led him to (when he lost) praise those in his speach who wrote such things (and this was a mild one) as "You can all f**k off and die for all I care".

  53. Anonymous Coward
    Alert

    @AC - Sounds all too familiar

    "you may want to look at the history of the Nazi party. It may sound a little familiar." - AC

    Totalitarian - CHECK

    Getting neighbours to inform upon other neighbours - CHECK

    Tries to ban opposition parties raising funds. - CHECK

    Constantly passes regulations curtailing individual rights - CHECK

    Destroying democracy - CHECK

    Sounds like our current government alright...

  54. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    Voting should be mandatory

    30% turn out in a working democracy is appalling. Those who are too lazy to vote should be punished.

    Even if you think there is no one to vote for, do one of two things

    1) Go down and spoil you ballot to show your disenfranchisement; or

    2) Get in the political game yourself rather than moaning about how no one speaks for you.

    There is no excuse for not voting. None. Other than being a worthless piece of humanity not fit to live here, of course.

  55. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Ummm...

    I'm sure the racial scientists at the BNP know more about this than the likes of me*, but surely one thing that is certain about the 'Celts, Anglo-Saxons, Danes and Norse' is that they're NOT the indigenous people of the UK.

    * When they're not otherwise busy trying to find Atlantis and the Lost Ark of the Covenant. Who wouldn't pay good money to see Nick Griffin re-enact the last few minutes of 'Raiders of the Lost Ark'???

  56. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Shame on all of you who couldn't be arsed to vote.

    How do you know that they wouldn't have voted BNP?

    It's normally suggested that its the working and non-working classes that tend to abstain, a group which also forms the demographic of the BNP's support.

  57. Adrian Challinor
    Coat

    re: Boycott the UK ??

    There was a boycott Austria campaign? When? I must have slept through that.

    On the other hand, I guess that's why there are so few Vienese Waltzes these days. Well, there you go, that made them think didn't it.

    </irony>

  58. Mike Richards

    @ Anonymous Coward

    'Whereas 7.1% of Swedes are a bunch of freeloaders?'

    Careful, now they've remembered their pirate ancestry they'll be stocking up on surströmming, ABBA compilations and pointing their IKEA flatpack long boats towards Britain's East Coast in the hope of going back to Göteborg with a pile of danegeld and some lovely English girls.

    What the Swedes don't realise is that they will be facing the only people on earth more blonde, more tanned and with a greater capacity for alcohol than themselves.

    Essex Girls.

    The poor bastards won't stand a chance.

  59. Karim Bourouba
    Paris Hilton

    @Chris w

    What did I say about the BNP and the NAZI party? I didnt draw any links.

    Oh no, I did actually, I mentioned that the BNP are racist and as we all know from history, so were the NAZI's. Both parties seem to have a similar ideaology and the BNP seems to be intent on playing on the worst fears of a minority to get what they want.

    You may also notice I didnt have a problem with protest votes in general, but there are other far more worthy parties to vote for in this manner - even UKIP rate better than the BNP.

    And now I am wondering why you singled out my name for the title of your post....

    Paris, because she isnt wondering...

  60. Anonymous Coward
    Coat

    Whats wrong with UKIP?

    There seem to be a lot of comments here that equate UKIP with the BNP. I just don't understand why.

    I did vote UKIP because although I am a gress roots Tory, the chances of a Tory getting elected in my area are the same as a snow ball in hell. But a protest vote for UKIP registers the fact that we were promised a referendum on the European Consitution but because the exact same docment was renamed "The Lisbon Treaty" the Great Gordo says no.

    Well, Gordon, Did you notice that the party that campaigned on this single issue managed to beat you in to third? Does that tell you something?

    Mine's the one with the copy of "Bombing Parliament for Dummies" in the pocket.

  61. Richard

    membership bnp

    Just checked the BNP website they are perfectly happy to accept anyone as a member irrespective of skin colour, race or even species so long as you have a spare 30 quid a year to pay them.

  62. Ian

    "My vote doesn't matter"

    To be fair, the my vote doesn't matter excuse is fair enough in local elections and general elections but not European elections.

    Because we have the anti-democratic first past the post system we have this stupid situation where a party with only say 38% public support can have 100% of the power leaving 62% of the population's vote not matter, so the chances are in the UK when someone says they can't be arsed to vote because their vote doesn't matter they're more likely to be right, than wrong.

    Until we get rid of first past the post and switch to proportional representation expect voter apathy to continue, because for most people, their vote really doesn't count. Of course, it wont change soon, Cameron knows he's got a free ride to the next general election and he supports first past the post, I mean why wouldn't he push for 100% of power even though he only deserves 38% of it based on public opinion.

    Our country is fucked, and people don't even understand why. First past the post is at the core of everything that's wrong with politics in our country. At least in the European elections proportional representation means there's a fair share of representation of people's views so the likes of The Pirate Party get to have their say.

  63. Ed Blackshaw Silver badge
    Thumb Up

    @Andrew Norton

    So tell me, why you didn't have any candidates standing in this country? I'm pretty sure I would have voted for your agenda. Government accountability and transparency being pretty much the biggest thing our political system is missing in this country. FFS, even the US has better oversight of their politicians than us.

    Seriously, get your act together in time for the next general election (within the next few months?) and you'll probably get some seats in the Uk parliament.

  64. Anonymous Coward
    Paris Hilton

    Well...

    I would have voted Pirate Party if we had one. I voted UKIP.

    @Andy - yes, the anniversary of our defending ourselves from an invasion of foreigners, you might say.

    You should see some of Churchill's quotes on immigration and muslims, he would definitely not be welcome in the modern day conservative party.

    I didn't vote for the BNP but I don't have a much of a problem with them as most people, because I actually took the time to find out what they were for, not what the BBC and Grauniad tell people.

  65. Anonymous Coward
    Stop

    @ Andy - BNP - how dare they...

    "Shame on all of you who couldn't be arsed to vote."

    Just remember that Hitler was elected by a free and democratic election...

  66. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    BNP got less votes

    I just saw this on the BBC. The BNP got less votes than last time, they only got two seats because non-BNP voters were scattered between other parties.

  67. Anonymous Coward
    Heart

    Chris W

    Don't know what you guys are arguing about. Chris W is a racist which he himself admitted. He is the worse form of humans.

    Pretty sad to find plenty of racist members on El Reg.

  68. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Re: Karim Bourouba

    >And now I am wondering why you singled out my name for the title of your post....

    Don't flatter yourself and learn to read. The title said quite clearly "and others" you were merely the first to reply to my post and it's my custom to address a person correctly. Also, if you bothered to read the post you would have noticed that the comments about the nazi party were in reply to an ac who brought up the subject of 1936/37.

    Just so you are in no doubt this is a direct response to you, hope it clears things up for you, any more doubts just keep them to yourself.

  69. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Re: calm down, it's only an EU election

    Simon Painter: "The BNP are a fringe party and serve no purpose other than to help guage the complex political barometer of UK politics. They had fewer votes than last time they stood in the EU elections and only got in because people now know that they can use these insignificant polls to register their protest vote or abstention. We are not being over run by facists and the next five years of EU politics will be very similar to the last five so let's all just calm down a little."

    So it's "only an EU election" is it? If the massed Britards who like to show the finger to the EU (but hidden behind their other hand, in a "not voting - British!" sulking sort of way) took a few moments to understand the obligations of the country towards the EU, they'd take the whole damn thing a lot more seriously. The European Parliament is the only thing standing between the nepotism and vision politics of the top tier of the EU (masterminded by various failed and scandal-ridden career-politicians - where do you think Mandelson was all that time?) and the Parliament of the Britards being asked to sign on the dotted line, no questions asked.

    "The mainstream parties could do with looking at the coherent parts of the BNP manifesto though, the lucid parts actually appeal to many of middle england and a party could gain a lot of votes if it could address the fears of middle england without dipping too far into abject racism (the Daily Mail reader, for example)."

    Address the fears, or play on them? And where do the fears of Middle England come from, anyway, and why should we pander to such small-minded Mail-reading dimwits? That's the whole problem with British politics (and politics in many countries): instead of thinking through issues like immigration and migration and considering how one might treat people decently, it's a see-saw flipping between a laissez-faire integration policy ("just come and do the work we don't care to do") and then demonising all the people who did exactly what the Britards (and -tards of all nations) wanted them to do.

  70. Eddy Ito Silver badge
    Happy

    Interesting

    I expected at least a few derisive comments to be aimed at we 'mericans. Surely one of you can find a way to blame this all on the U.S. Hey, at least that wouldn't appear xenophobic... or would it?

    Actually you folks are lucky. You have viable alternative parties that you can vote for. We only get to pick from two condiments for our shit sandwich. We have too many who pull the big D or R lever at the top because they are too lazy to figure out who is who and make real choices. Sure we have other parties but they can't get elected dog catcher since the D-R Cartel have special rules just for them. For instance, the two major parties can pretty much put whoever the want on the ballot but opposition parties usually have much higher hurdles such as getting a ridiculous number of signatures in every town. And let's not forget the occasional fees, which can reach into the thousands of dollars, one must pay to play after all. It would be nice to have a Pirate Party here or even just a level playing field. So much for a free society.

    Now then, go ahead and eat your shit sandwich just as we are force fed ours. You can wash it down with em-pee tea or pol-piss ale. See, cheer up, choices abound.

  71. Mike Richards

    @ Anonymous Coward

    'Just remember that Hitler was elected by a free and democratic election...'

    And people then said they voted Nazi, not because they agreed with its anti-semitism, but because they agreed with its economic policies, promise of stability and excellent local organisation. Weimar voters may not have voted for the extermination of Jews and other minorities, but by turning a blind eye to the Nazis racism they made it possible.

    People may have voted BNP because they promised to make sure the bins were emptied, or like in my area, were the only ones who put leaflets through the door, but they can't possibly claim to be ignorant of the BNP's deeper motives. People who voted BNP actively support racism - let's not make excuses for them.

  72. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Re: The AC got it right...

    Joe Montana: "As someone else stated, there wasn't really much choice as to who to vote for in the UK... All of the parties are either corrupt and self serving (labour, conservatives, libdems), or too extreme in one way or another (bnp, ukip, green, christian)..."

    I'm astonished that anyone with any insight would consider the Green Party too extreme, and I'm shocked that any right-minded person would put them in a list with racists and bigots, but I guess it's the usual prejudice at work: green must somehow equate to radical eco-protesters, Tom and Barbara from The Good Life, and some kind of secret agenda to make Britain a pre-industrial society. Mix in, if you will, the spoilt child attitude of the average Britard: "I want my shiny gadgets for next to nothing! What's that gurgling sound? The oil running out? How dare you suggest such a thing - it's a conspiracy!"

    In short, the AC produced a list of reasons for his/her apathy, demonstrating a complete lack of aptitude in dealing with a sub-optimal situation in any kind of constructive fashion.

    "As for the UKIP MEPs being disrupting, that's exactly what they were supposed to do... They are an anti europe party sitting in the european parliament, their entire philosophy is anti europe and the people voting for them know that. Are you really surprised that an anti europe party would seek to disrupt the european parliament? If you truly believe in democracy, then you have to respect that a percentage of the population voted for this behaviour."

    And it's exactly the childish behaviour that you'd expect from the average, propaganda-indoctinated Britard whose parents were brought up in the 1950s or 1960s thinking bad things about German people and who now thinks xenophobia (and presumably the number of days clocked wearing an England shirt) is a measure of patriotism and doing what's best for the nation. As a result, the buffoons in the UKIP, rejects from the Tory party because they're mostly too racist even for the seedier "old guard" factions in that party, will happily put their snouts in the trough and do as little work as possible, letting all those foreigners make the decisions for the next few years.

    Well done, UKIP-voting Britards: your "stick it to Johnny Foreigner" attitude will see you getting the shaft from, well, Mr Foreigner himself, courtesy of your chosen representatives. Yes, you voted stupid, too.

  73. Anonymous Coward
    Alert

    Re: Am I missing something?

    DutchOven: "I wonder how the BNP stand on emmigration? I mean they're a little bit down on foreigners coming here, do they feel just as strongly on behalf of foreign nations when British workers go overseas? I doubt it very much (which speaks volumes about double-standards and nimbyism, doesn't it?)"

    Judging by the positions of less extreme parties in other countries, the stance is usually something to do with it being their God-given right to have schools and bureaucracy in their own language in, say, Spain - where the middle class go to retire - but how dare Mr Foreigner want to speak his language in our country!

    No, you're not missing anything.

  74. Anonymous Coward
    Happy

    @Eddy Ito

    If it makes you feel better, the BNP are the same as a Replican American, anything with slightly darker complexion or is not "Christian" is the root of all evil and must be destroyed. The main difference the BNP don't have a multibillion pound milatary budget to kill people with.

    There, hope that helps elivate the imbalance....

  75. Maty

    Just asking ...

    One of the largest minorities in England is the Polish (i.e. mainly Slavonic) community. Lots arrived at around the same time as the Pakistani and West Indian communities (and more have come over in recent years). Not being Celtic, Nordic, or Anglo-Saxon, I'd be interested if the BNP is planning to send us 'back to where we came from' as well. This would help to show whether the BNP is racist and xenophobic, or merely xenophobic.

    I guess we could all go to Sweden and vote for the Pirate party. Up anchors, me hearties!

  76. John70

    Voting

    Why are people so obsessed by BNP getting 2 seats? The BNP is seen as a protest vote.

    After all we live in a society where we are free to vote who we want.

    If the other 70% couldnt be bothered to vote then they have no say after the result.

    Best thing they can do is to vote next time round to make sure they don't get in again.

    What the main political parties need to do is listen to the voters and keep their manifesto promises, like a vote on the EU Treaty which Labour didn't give.

    Come the next General Election we will get the same bull about Crime, Education, NHS and Immigration. And most likely nothing will be done, again...

  77. This post has been deleted by its author

  78. James
    Flame

    A few points....

    Read the comments and decided to chip in...

    Left and Right are economic stand points, Left for centralised control, nationalisation and socialism (proven not to work by communist countries and the UK), Right for decentralisation, capitalism and market control. Capitalism can go wrong when morons who don't understand it try to control it and simply distort markets (Brown, that is you, the FSA and the banking crisis) but it is the ONLY system that generates money instead of consuming it. Is it "socially fair"? No it isn't but why should we reward the indolent, lazy, criminal and/or incompetent? I'm sick of paying for the free handouts to them. Socialism's problem is that eventually it runs out of other people's money rewarding those who generate no wealth of their own...

    Should we support those genuinely in need and unable to support themselves? Yes, we should. Society is not a good place to be if strictly Darwinian. Those who are genuinely in need are in a tiny minority of those currently living on state handouts. Those who can work, should.

    The BNP are far left, not far right. Look at their policies. Racism isn't an economic standpoint. That's somewhere on the orthogonal axis of Authoritarian/Liberal. Totally unrelated, for those who don't know what orthogonal means :P

    What the mainstream parties need to do is ask themselves why the BNP are gaining support. What policies of the mainstream parties are failing to address the desires of the majority white native voters? No that isn't racist, it is a simple reflection of the demographics of the nation. Simple numbers. I work in a culturally varied environment and all of the folks I work with are committed, talented and productive people. Great :) Are they immigrants? Yes, some are. Do they contribute to the country? Hell yes. Do they want to pay taxes so that those who don't work because they can't be bothered (native Brits included, they're hardly immune from being useless, lazy twats) can be paid "benefits"? No they don't. Do they think it is reasonable to do so? Hell no.

    Not wanting to pay for people who have contributed and continue to contribute nothing to society is not quintessentially British or white, it is simply the resentment of those who work hard for their income when they see hard work rewarded by taxes and non-work rewarded by generous handouts. Capitalism is the one true meritocracy.

    For the record, I didn't vote BNP as they are totally unfit to govern and are a bunch of economically illiterate, racist fucktards. I voted for Daniel Hannan, possibly the most sensible politician in history. DH for PM....

  79. Shakje

    @Chris W

    Well done, you structured a completely stupid argument. None of the parties are saying that there is anything wrong with democracy, which is why none of them are calling for the banning of the BNP. They're saying that it's wrong that in a modern multicultural society a party like the BNP can gain ground, and that the views that the BNP share are disgusting, which they are. They're thoroughly abhorrent. Talking of "sponging bastards", did you miss my comment about Nick Griffin being investigated for misappropriating funds? Or that the BNP are being investigated for failing to declare donations? Why would a party fail to declare donations? Think about it.

    Just as an aside, the person who said that the BNP does not exclude non-whites, Nick Griffin was quite vocal in explaining why they only allow white members, he did not deny it for a moment, and his main reason was so that they could claim racial discrimination if their members are targetted. Of course, anyone with an ounce of sense would realise that it's because they're deeply racist. Brons (their other MEP) was the National Front leader for a while, and said, while a member that he would rather go to prison than let a black person in the National Front. He was also a member of the National Socialist party as a kid.

    UKIP seem to have escaped corruption scandals relatively unscathed because it's MEPs that are reported on, and people don't take as much notice. Have a look at some of the news stories about their members, it's a party of criminals, and if you voted for them, you're almost as stupid as BNP supporters (you could almost understand not knowing this, but you can't really not know about the BNP being racist cnuts, anyone who honestly thinks the BNP is not inherently racist is gravely deluded).

  80. Karim Bourouba
    Paris Hilton

    @ Chris W

    Sadly, you seem to be adopting the same attitude as many other supporters of largely racist and ignorant far right political movements, you know groups like the BNP etc.

    As soon as someone says "I dont like that way of thinking", they tend to get a bit wound up. Last night on Sky News, the goon in charge of the BNP commented that the UK was a slum and that the BNP were a direct response to the peoples needs. I completely disagree, the BNP is a product of peoples worse fears and ignorance, a little like the qualities you seem to have displayed on this thread.

    While there is a need to diverese political attitudes in order for democracy to work, we can rest assured that evil, racist, criminal thugs like the BNP will never gain any great power in the UK. thank god.

    Paris, as she has about as much a clue as yourself.

  81. Stuart Elliott
    Pirate

    I didn't vote

    Not because I'm lazy (although I am,but that's an aside), not because I thought my vote wouldn't count in the grand scheme of things, but because there wasn't a tick box stating "None of the above".

  82. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    @AC 14:38

    Oh, surely you can do a lot better than that, you obviously know me very well.

    >Pretty sad to find plenty of racist members on El Reg.

    What's worse is seeing that the level of comprehension of basic English has fallen so dramatically since I left the UK over 25 years ago that you can't have an intelligent debate on a .co.uk forum.

  83. b166er

    No shame on you Andy

    for voting at all. After all, which bunch of corrupt incompetent self-aggrandizing tossers did you vote for?

    If no-one voted, there would be a hung parliament (not literally unfortunately) and we might have some chance of getting a more 'democratic' democracy.

  84. John Fallon
    Coat

    What's this....

    .... pirates in the European Parrrrrghlament?

  85. Bod

    UKIP

    "The behaviour of the UKIP MEPs has been disgusting. They've done no work, been disruptive (including standing up and singing the Dad's Army song in a meeting)"

    Fantastic! That's what I like to see. There's little point to the rubbish that goes on in Brussels other than to waste £40m a day* of UK tax payers money and impose ridiculous directives on us, which the rest of the EU ignores and the UK bends over and takes it up the arse.

    Anyway, as for those not seeing the point of UKIP. Apart from the £40m a day* waste, are you actually aware that we are signing up to the EU Constitution that's been shoved through by calling it a "treaty" so the UK public cannot have a referendum on it as was promised by Labour?

    * - okay UKIP exaggerated figure that may be more like £12m *a day* in real money, but that's still one hell of a lot!

    Remember also, UKIP isn't like the BNP and other fascist organisations, and nor do they want no part of Europe. Trade with Europe - yes. Valid useful migrant workers from Europe - yes. Complete governance by Europe affecting taxes, jobs, spending, pensions, immigration (which becomes open border, so long as immigrants don't stay in France), defence, housing, development, etc, etc, etc - no.

  86. Nebulo
    Pirate

    Funny ...

    Not nearly as many clearly pirate-oriented posts here as I was expecting. Seems to be about something called something like the Bogus Nautical Pirates, to judge by their initials.

    So, well done, me 'earties, an' see you 'ere next time round. Arrr.

  87. Karim Bourouba
    Paris Hilton

    This is daft

    Maybe, just maybe, illegal immigrants are not the source of all woe in the UK.

    I for one would be interested to hear what the BNP have to say about tacking the problem of crime, drug use and social housing in the UK, should the (for some reason) win an election.

    So far, all I have heard them say is that they will kick all the illegal immigrants out, not let any immigrants in and spend lots of money on promoting St Georges Day and a traditional Christian Christmas. I think I also heard the muppet in charge of them saying he will ignite industry in the UK again. From looking at their website, it would seem that this will all be paid for by 'eliminating multiculturalism in the UK'.

    At the same time as doing this, the BNP also want to withdraw from the EU - and then set up new trading and travel agreements with the EU (?). Isnt that just going to cost more money, or am I being thick? There is a whole bunch of other stuff, like enlarging the army, reintroducing the death penalty, using chaingangs - the normal guff from muppets like the BNP as well as messages that all the other political parties are putting forward, you know the stuff about doctors and nurses as well as green fuels blah blah blah.

    I have never really viewed the EU elections in the same way I look at a general election, to me the EU elections are sort of like a supra council election - it doesnt really if one party has overall control as long as the parliament has a decent share of representation from all corners of the politcal world.

    So, getting the Pirate Party in is good, it means discussion will take place on a very big topic. Getting the BNP in wont really do much good at all, they want out of the EU. The only good to come of it is that people will hopefully wake up and turn out to vote for the next election, putting these rascist (and potentially criminal?) thugs out of the picture.

    Again with Paris, she really wants to download the next series of Lost without fear of her ISP sending a strongly worded letter.

  88. Poopie McStinklestein
    Alert

    Non-racist would-be BNP voter here.

    I didn't vote because I was away from home, but I too, like Chris W, would have voted for the BNP.

    My best friend is Indian, and I have other good friends who are Indian, and African.

    There's no way that I want the BNP to get in though.

    If I thought that the BNP had the slightest chance of getting in and causing them any problems, I'd never vote for them, and I'd be one of the ones in rallies against them.

    So - why?

    It is, honestly, a protest vote. They're the party that "scare" the main 3 the most.

    I want to warn the main 3 parties though that they need to buck up their ideas, and sort things out.

    You can call me racist if you like, but I'm not.

  89. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    OK, So Tell Me This

    I was waiting for this, so let me guess a day in Parlament with the Pirate Party at the podium...

    PP: We want free downloads for movies that cost industry millions of dollars! We have a right to this!!!

    Parlament: Later, let us first address how to keep the East Side Poor Kitchen open with a limited budget. How do you propose to do this?

    PP: With free downloads for movies! It is the only way! Freedom to the people! We deserve freedom to view other people's hard work and dedication, they want us to have it!

    P: But the poor? How will they eat?

    PP: Free popcorn for the free downloads!

    P: And the jobless?

    PP: They can run internet cafes for the free downloads!

    P: Arent they jobless because the company they worked for didnt get the royalties due for the films they published because of free downloads?

    PP: YES YES...ITS PROOF OF GREEDY CAPITALIST PIGS! SEE! SEE! IF EVERYTHING WERE FREE WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING THIS CONVERSATION!

    Because some twit is upset that the government stepped in and said you gotta pay for what you get is not the basis for a political party. What's the answer to peace? Free downloads! What's the answer to poverty? Free downloads!

    I sort of wish I were the prosecutor at the Pirate trial, my attack would have been short and sweet:

    Me: Sooooo, everyone has a right to everyone else's intellectual property is what you are saying?

    Them: Everyone has a right to enjoy and use intellectual property without the feeding of glutenous pigs who make millions off the poor and unsuspecting...

    Me: Well put...say, you have quite a web site there.

    Them: (smiling) ...we did put alot of work into it.

    Me: (smiling back) ...very nice, well structured, no troubles on the technical side?

    Them: None, we are the thing these days...

    Me: Nice, give me your code and your database structures, I want to open a site like it.

    Them: (astonished then brash)...do your own, it took us a long time to get it that way...

    Me: (astonished back)...oh, alot of work, long hours, time and money spent?

    Them: Yes?

    Me: but according to you, that doesn't matter, it's intellectual property and should be shared amongst the masses....FREE OF COST....CODE AND ALL....

    CASE CLOSED...

    jeez

  90. Frumious Bandersnatch Silver badge

    Perhaps a BNP supporter could tell us ...

    whether they're for or against people of Visigoth, Vandal or Pict descent?

  91. Greg Trocchia
    Pirate

    @Eddy Ito

    I have yet to see an election for national office where there are only two candidates running, maybe for local or county office, but never for Congress, Senate, and certainly not for President. Now there may be only two candidates with a chance of winning (one candidate, in some circumstances), but that doesn't matter. The purpose of voting in an election is not to guess who will win the election, it is to record your own preferences.

    A protest vote for a non-major party candidate is a way of showing disaffection with the offerings of the major parties. When I have been dissatisfied with what was on offer, I happily entered such a vote, something I heartily recommend to anyone else similarly displeased. I have always been able to find a third party that I could stomach voting for (no need to vote for folks as distasteful as the BNP) and if there was ever a situation where there wasn't one... well, there is always the write-in route. If enough people start registering their disapproval of major party candidates in this fashion I am sure that this fact would not go unnoticed. The Jolly Roger because the Pirate Party sounds like one I could vote for when casting a protest vote.

  92. Anonymous Coward
    Unhappy

    Okay, tell me this...

    1 - what does a Euro MP earn?

    2 - what are the remits of a Euro MP?

    3 - how does one contact a Euro MP?

    4 - what are the running (eg office) expenses of a Euro MP?

    5 - what were your Euro MP's personal expenses since the last election?

    6 - what were your Euro MP's additional unexpected expenses since the last election?

    Now perhaps one might empathise with the vaster majority of people who chose not to vote?

  93. Anonymous Coward
    Boffin

    The System is Falling Apart

    The basic problem is that the Labour party have imploded through corruption and self worship. Look at all the policies they have that are targeted against people and in favour of corporations, again people and in favour of globalisation, against people and in favour of removal of personal freedom.

    The system of government that we have in this country was supposed to be 'for the good of the people'.... not any more.

    Now, have a look at the BNP manifesto - I did yesterday because I needed to understand why people were voting for them. For one second put aside racism (yes I know but try). 70% of the policies make perfect sense because they are in place to support the people. Exactly the opposite of what the Labour party are doing.

    For your average not too bothered about racism person, the policies are a bunch of simple themes which resonate with simple people. They put the people first and attempt to dismantle a lot of the crap which the main parties throw down peoples throats but the people can do nothing about... like jobs going abroad, like growing restrictions on freedom of speech, like erosion of workers rights to create a more 'fluid' workforce.

    Now granted most of this is just talk, but its certainly attractive enough to pull in 6.5% of the vote.

    Now I'm certainly no supporter of the BNP, my mother's English and my father's from the West Indies, and I couldn't be bothered to get off my fat arse and vote anyway, but if I had, I would have voted BNP before Labour ...

  94. This post has been deleted by a moderator

  95. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Re: UKIP

    Bod quotes another: "The behaviour of the UKIP MEPs has been disgusting. They've done no work, been disruptive (including standing up and singing the Dad's Army song in a meeting)"

    Then writes: "Fantastic! That's what I like to see. There's little point to the rubbish that goes on in Brussels other than to waste £40m a day* of UK tax payers money and impose ridiculous directives on us, which the rest of the EU ignores and the UK bends over and takes it up the arse."

    So the solution is to communicate to the other members of the EU that the Britards are a bunch of inbred bigots who trot out the Second World War at every turn? If Brussels is wasting £40m, erm £12m, a day, wouldn't any sensible group of people at least try and do some work and earn their pay - noting that the UKIP representatives seem to have a reputation for lining their pockets - rather than boast about their ineptitude?

    "Remember also, UKIP isn't like the BNP and other fascist organisations, and nor do they want no part of Europe. Trade with Europe - yes. Valid useful migrant workers from Europe - yes. Complete governance by Europe affecting taxes, jobs, spending, pensions, immigration (which becomes open border, so long as immigrants don't stay in France), defence, housing, development, etc, etc, etc - no."

    This "trade with Europe" stuff is very interesting. Usually, the nationalists trot out the Nordic countries as examples of being able to pull this off, but in fact none of those countries have been able to escape the economic power of the EU. Combine it with "useful migrant workers" - presumably those willing to work on the cheap to fix up the leader's house - and already you're on the slippery slope to the level of the racists, particularly when a lot of UKIP people seem to have a bit of history with the BNP and their accomplices.

    I'm not a big fan of the state of European democracy, but the combination of too-rabid-to-be-Tory Eurosceptics, bigots and closet racists that the UKIP appears to comprise, together with their hastily assembled right-of-Tory programme, doesn't deserve my vote.

  96. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Re: This is daft

    "At the same time as doing this, the BNP also want to withdraw from the EU - and then set up new trading and travel agreements with the EU (?). Isnt that just going to cost more money, or am I being thick?"

    Nope. This is the classic National Front rhetoric toned down - it's presumably acceptable to go to Spain on holiday without abandoning one's own nationalist sentiments, and trading with the US, Canada and Australia only gets you so far. Like it or not, if Britain wanted to renegotiate trading agreements with the EU, the country would get the shaft: Norway alone has to pay over €1 billion in grants just to get to play along with the EU, and Britain isn't likely to get more favourable treatment.

    In addition, on the outside of the EU, Britain would become a competitor to the EU for natural resources (and in lots of other areas), and this wouldn't necessarily make anything cheaper. "Please Mr Putin, erm, Medvedev, would you pretty please sell us some cheap oil/gas/uranium!" That's what it might end up being like.

    "There is a whole bunch of other stuff, like enlarging the army, reintroducing the death penalty, using chaingangs - the normal guff from muppets like the BNP"

    Yes, society under the BNP would be a like a red US state with progress rewound one hundred years or more. Daft indeed, but some Britards love their re-imagined nostalgia for a way of life that never was, papered over a way of life that no-one should have to endure.

  97. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    got to love it

    Democracy in action

    you didn't vote for who I wanted to win so I will call you names

    Brill

    -Non Voter

  98. Bod

    One more thing on the BNP

    Okay, the same is true of any other MEP, but if you're not a racist/fascist but voted BNP just as a protest vote over expenses, consider this...

    Nick Griffin will now earn aprox £80k and get expenses on top that likely eclipse the expenses farce we've had in the UK parliament.

    Now really, was it a sensible thing to vote BNP? !!!

  99. Daisy O'Byrne

    Pirates

    Are these pirates the followers of the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

  100. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    UK has never had a democracy

    I wonder when the UK will stop deluding itself. It does not remotely have a democracy.

    If I vote in a general election for a particular prospective MP and that prospective MP does not get elected, I have ZERO representation in parliament. Full stop. The winning MP, by definition, does not represent me - I made that clear when I didn't vote for him/her. Would you be happy to have a BNP MP represent you if you did not vote for them? ZERO representation in parliament does not sound like any system I would use the label 'democracy' for.

    Some may argue that you should use the system to beat the system. Unfortunately this can not work. There is no use in voting for a candidate who supports electoral reform because if they don't get elected to parliament, there voice will never be heard. ZERO representation.

    Consider these plain cold facts - the only people who have representation in parliament are those who voted for a winning MP. The rest who voted for a loser, spoiled their paper or didn't vote all get ZERO representation. In the 2001 general election, Labour gained approx. 43% of the vote. There was approx. 60% turnout. This means that approx. 26% of the electorate voted for the winning party. One in four. Next incredible fact. That 26% of the electorate had 64% of all elected MPs. Two out of three. And to top it all, ZERO% of the electorate get any vote whatsoever in who becomes Prime Minister.

    The system is ridiculous and until this 'elephant in the room' is fixed then you are evidently wasting your time voting.

  101. Dick Emery

    Re: UK has never had a democracy

    Thank goodness someone else gets it!

  102. Mostor Astrakan

    Oh for FSM's sake...

    Thre Pirate Party's manifesto does NOT include the assertion that you should be able do download everything under the sun the day it comes out. The main issue is to counter the foolish notion held by high-income companies, government organisations and others that they somehow have an intrinsic right to steam open all your letters and inspect everything that you are doing on the Internet on the grounds that some of the bits in your traffic may belong to them and you are doing something untoward with them.

    The bastards want to rummage through your Internet traffic, The Piratpartiet is against that. For a Single Issue, it is a pretty big one.

  103. Watashi

    You votes for what you wants

    The real idiots are the ones who voted New Labour.

    "I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Democracy Just doesn't work."

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