back to article Nokia confirms 'iPhone killer' handset in pipeline

Nokia has confirmed that it’s developing a touchscreen-equipped handset to take on the Apple iPhone, and has shown off pictures of the upcoming phone to drooling onlookers. The Finnish giant’s handset is codenamed 'Tube', and Tom Libretto, VP of Forum Nokia, said the device will be the company’s “first touch device”. Libretto …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Jobs Horns

    Ya Tube

    That's funny, because in Scotland the moniker "Tube" could equally be applied to someone who owns an iPhone...

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    Not another "Killer"

    Wasn't Zune the I-pod "Killer" and I'm sure we've have other iphone "killer" statements on here in the past.. its all getting rather tedious.

  3. Matthew Banwell
    Happy

    Ringtone?

    A tube in a pipeline? Will it make a sound like a swannee-whistle?

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Coat

    First touch screen device

    I supose the 7700 and 7710 didn't exist

  5. oxo
    Thumb Down

    S60 ? Oh dear

    "Unconfirmed reports suggest Nokia's would-be iPhone killer will run on the Symbian S60 platform."

    That'll mean that bluetooth connection and contact sync to cars will be broken then, just like the N95.

  6. Ash

    @First touch screen device

    Hardly stylish devices; they look like mis-shapen Sega Game Gears.

  7. Chad H.
    Thumb Down

    I could have sworn

    I could have sworn nokia once called touch a gimmick.

    How many dozen software revisions will it take for them to get this right?

  8. jai
    Coat

    so...

    will you be calling this one the Pontius Pilot phone then?

    or the Judas phone?

    :)

  9. alphaxion

    @first touch screen device

    if you read, it says "first touch device" not "touch screen", which suggests to me that it is a pure touch/gesture interface rather than a phone that sports a touchpad but with a keypad somewhere as your prominant interface.

    But then, that is just interpretation.

  10. Phil Wray

    re: Not another "Killer"

    Yes but microsofts track record with mp3 player isn't exactly great, lets see we have the zune, and oh yes the zune.

    Where as Nokia make phones its what they do, and they have quite alot of experiance in doing it.

    Argubly some of the latter Nseries phones(n95/n96, n82) are better products than the jesus phone as it stands now

  11. Jared Earle

    If you have to ...

    If you have to describe your device as a ${DEVICE}-Killer, you've already lost.

  12. Chris Gibson

    @ David Corbett

    That's an insightful and worthwhile comment, David. Why do you think that someone who owns an iPhone is a "tube"?

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Alien

    But why

    I can't understand why anyone would need to compete with a piece of technology that won't even work on a 3G system?

  14. Richard Large

    I can see a home button...

    Look under the left thumb. There is a white mark that looks regular enough to be a home button, in the right place.

  15. Chris Hembrow
    Linux

    re: First touch screen device

    Or the 770, n800, n810 or recently announced N810-we (wiMax)

  16. Richard Austin

    N95 with a facelift - Here's hoping

    If this is what I'm hoping for, we could finally be getting a winner.

    I would love the iphone if it had a decent camera, connectivity and didn't tie you to one operator for 2 years.

    I love my N95 and if this can expand on that to include a touch screen. I for one will be one very happy geek.

  17. Chris Hembrow
    Stop

    First touch device

    ignoring the other touch "screen" devices Nokia sell, I'm fairly sure you touch the N95 to make it work. Unless I got an early version without psychic interface

  18. TranceMist

    Simplicity

    I want my 6310i back, life was simple then.

  19. El G

    RE: First touch screen device

    Nor the N770, N800 or N810 internet tablets...

  20. Maliciously Crafted Packet

    Isn't this a bit late...

    they should have been working on this in 2005 - 2006.

    Judging by the photo it looks like another "me too" product. If you want to challenge Apple you need to lead not follow.

    Lets hope Nokia have something unique and special up there sleeve otherwise they will go the way of Creative and the Zune.

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Yeah right

    It's Symbian, that says it all - it will be slow, unresponsive and require frequent resetting.

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    iPhone killer

    So about a year later Nokia come up with an iPhone killer! Surely a massive handset manufacturer should have been at the forefront of handset design and come up with a design like this before apple. Nokia have been churning out handsets every year. It wouldn't have taken much risk for them to develop their iPhone. Its not just nokia either...Every year all the manufacturers have been bringing the same thing year in year out but with bigger cameras, more complicated UI etc.

    Apple spent the time and money to come up with a beautiful design, slick UI and a pretty decent handset on their first go. That took a lot of guts if you ask me.

    Fair enough they still don't have MMS and 3G and a few other features that most modern phones have but the iPhone 1 is just the beginnings and now apple have seen how the iPhone was recieved and what people really want with the handset given the option I believe the iPhone 2 will truly blow the competition out of the water when it arrives.

    I hope nokia realise that when their iPhone (1) killer comes out the iPhone 2 won't be far behind to show them yet again what they should have thought of.

  23. jai

    keyboard

    i seem to remember everyone has been saying for the last year that a key failing of the iPhone is the lack of a proper keyboard.

    so would i be wrong in expect all those same people to level the same criticism at the Nokia Tube?

    or are Nokia fanbois suddenly coming around to the idea of a completely touch interface device?

  24. Seanie Ryan
    Alert

    killer

    its so funny to see a company that has been around for years in the mobile business trying to tout their latest one as the iphone killer... a device that hasnt even been around for 1 year and is the first offering from apple.

    Conceding defeat from the start, no?

    surely they could have spun it better?

  25. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Mobile video platform

    Why? Mobile video is mostly rubbish. Tiny, tiny market except for Keeping Up With Jones.

  26. Steve

    Isn't this a bit late...

    "Lets hope Nokia have something unique and special up there sleeve otherwise they will go the way of Creative and the Zune."

    No they won't - having the iPhone outsell this particular model will do eff all to Nokia.

    Unlike Apple, Nokia have a secret weapon in their arsenal known as "other models" - they also have realistic sales expectations.

  27. Anonymous Coward
    Paris Hilton

    @ Chris Gibson

    "Why do you think that someone who owns an iPhone is a "tube"?"

    Because they paid silly money for a piece of 2.5G landfill.

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Jobs Halo

    If Nokia want's to avoid the Tube becoming a Hole....

    Having owned 2 Nokia Symbian S60 devices, the N70 and N73 respectively, I'm assuming that Nokia will have completely removed the current collection of Symbian bugs and glitches before releasing this supposed iPhone killer (lost the N70, chanced it with the N73, not 100% satisfied).

    I hope Nokia equip the Tube with a decent enough processor (600mhz plus), the N73 takes up to 5-10 seconds to access SMS, Gallery, Camera (longer) at times, and this device doesn't do any swish, sliding-multi-touch type stuff like a iPhone does. I'd suggest that the elegant UI of the iPhone is one of it main selling points, simply out of the 'Wow!' factor, so unless Nokia are going to release something akin to this, I can't see the current S60 UI being that much of an iPhone killer, can you?

    In Nokia's defense, I do hear good things about the memory management, speed and battery life improvements provided by the inclusion of on-demand-paging to the Symbian stack but this is only available on certain handsets at present (namely N95).

  29. Rolf Harris
    Paris Hilton

    @ iPhone killer (AC)

    [puts on flame-proof suit]

    Awooga awooga! Apple Fanboi Alert!

    [note: I neither own an Apple nor Nokia device - I am an HTC-fan]

    Get over it dude - Nokia's been consistently "king of the UI" for years if not decades. Sure, some people don't like some of their phones, but there's no other manufacturer out there that comes close in the long run. The iPhone's sexy no doubt, but it's not Divine, and if any manufacturer can make a phone with a nice UI, it's Nokia. Couple a nice UI with the functionality that Nokia phones have been offering for years that the iPhone is lacking, and to be honest I think that you will have a serious contender. Time will tell of course, but the "iPhone2" isn't the Holy Grail, and the longer iPhone/iPhone2 is tethered to it's large price tag and the ongoing costs of the exorbitant contract on limited providers (at least where I am, the UK) it's leaving itself wide open to competition.

    Cheapest iPhone = £269 for 8GB version + £35/mnth for at least 18 months = £899 (approx $1,858).

    Expensive iPhone = £329 for 16GB version + £75/mnth for at least 18 months = £1,679 (approx $3,470).

    And these prices are for a brand new contract with O2...

    Paris because all of this fighting is just making her cry. Won't SOMEBODY think of the children?!?

  30. Chris Gibson

    @ David Corbett

    Ah, thanks for the clarification. What was it about the iPhone that you didn't like when you used one, though? Did you find that the 2.5G connection was far too slow? Personally, I don't find it too bad, but I'd be interested to hear your thoughts...?

    Hang on. You have used one, right? No -- wait -- you just hate it because it's not 3G. When the 3G model is released, you'll hate it because it's not got MMS. When MMS is added in a future firmware update, you'll hate it because... er... it's too expensive. Oh, and because it's made by Apple. I hate Apple! Waah!

    Personal bickering aside, I'm really interested to see what Nokia come up with, but there's more to a decent UI than the physical interface. I've thought that the Nokia interface has been getting steadily worse since the 8210, and they're going to have to do more than bolt on a large touch-screen to make this a great handset, iPhone "killer" or not.

  31. Michael

    wait there

    the N95 was an iphone killer before the iphone came out, hell even the n80 has more features than the stupid iphone.

    I have not had any issues with my n95 at all.

    So this new phone cant be an iphone killer as it was dead before it was born..

  32. Alex McKenna

    Judas phone?

    More like Mary Magdalene phone

  33. Ze Stuart
    Thumb Down

    Bollocks

    Sorry guys but this news is so old it's stale: I seem to remeber a jolly Nokia-sponsored night out in London last year, just after they'd made the big announcement about this (with free food, drink and bluetooth handsfrees).

    In case anyone cares, the phone is running S60, and there are plenty of videos of the OS in action.

    And killer? Yawn. Yawn.

  34. Anonymous Coward
    Go

    you anti-nokia wise guys out there; greetings from finland

    nokia didnt call it blabla-killer, that was register or someone else who thought he would gain attantion that way.

    nokia does not require this kind of attantion seeking. they just press it through their already established distribution channels when theyre ready to release it.

    i run a s60 phone , and the speed is ok. It plays mp3/radio/navigates/mails/flashplays/podcast-receives /turns screen by 90° automagically,flashphotographs with almost 3megabit

    and doesnt care about "touch" - but its smaller than iwhatever

    has USB, external hotswappable sd card slot and standard earphonesockets...

    and the bluetooth stack and interaction with my car

    works perfect.

    Whoever buys an iphone would also buy a hummer to drive it in the city. Good design, no survival abilties in the daily use.

    i also own a s80 phone (9300i) slightly slower but that is no problem in day to day use.

    go and pay a months salary for the iphone from that charity organisation: apple; and let the other >53% marketshare stick with what they like.

  35. philip jeffery

    Pathetic

    Nokia should have produced this phone a long time ago, personally I don't like the Iphone as it is lacking some features that I like on a phone. But you cannot deny that the Iphone is an evolutional leap from previous phones and congrats to Apple for taking the gamble.

    I firmly believe that the development of mobile phones has been slowed down intentionally by the mobile phone manufacturers. To keep customers purchasing new phones each year they had to ensure that the next new phone was better than their previous one, they could create a phone with all the new features available at that time but then they'd need to add some new cutting edge technology the following year or they could take their time, add a camera one year, MP3 player the next year, add video the year after that.

  36. Andrew Orlowski (Written by Reg staff)

    Nokia, King of the UIs?

    "but there's no other manufacturer out there that comes close in the long run."

    You should have stuck a Joke Alert icon on that, Rolfie.

    Nokia were once the King of the UIs - they made phones usable.

    http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/12/20/nokia_breakthrough_phone/

    But that reputation has not survived the albatross called S60 - a UI disaster. Too many clicks to do anything.

    The iPhone really deserves its success, IMHO.

  37. Anonymous Coward
    Happy

    @ Chris Gibson

    I guess you own an iPhone then? Good for you. Now, given the effort you've put into your commenting I think we can officially promote you from "Tube" to "Flange".

    No thanks necessary.

  38. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    What about HTC?!

    They've been making almost-iPhone quality handsets for years. The only thing the iPhone has over them is a MultiTouch touchpanel (and attendant software). In every other way they're superior- easier to sync with (unless you use a Mac), 3G- HSDPA/HSUPA in some cases, just about purely-touch-panel driven (though a few hard buttons), QVGA and VGA resolutions, and a vast amount more software. And a full QWERTY keyboard, and a cool tilty screen. Plus GPS. Oh, and it makes phone calls/sends txts/has MMS/I can unlock it/ I could go on...

    Any phone without multitouch, however- Nokia's new beast included- will never have a nice slidey interface like the iPhone unless it's got multitouch and the attendant software. Does the Nokia have multitouch?

  39. Red Bren
    Happy

    I want it NOW!

    The last phone I was truly happy with was the SE P910i. Every smartphone since then has been a disappointment because manufacturers insist on sacrificing valuable screen space to put buttons on the front. Now if Nokia will just add a slide-out keyboard, like the N95 or the SE X1, I'll bite their hand off to get one.

  40. Greg

    @Chris Gibson

    Now that you've quit ranting, I can get a word in edgeways and say that I *have* used an iPhone, and not just once. And I'm with David - it's rubbish.

  41. Martin Usher

    They already have the technology

    Though I can't figure out why they'd want to use Symbian when they already have a great Linux based platform with the N800/N810. Maybe its the old problem of needing a locked down system?

    I think the N8xx works better in tandem with a regular phone myself. I'd rather have a small phone with Bluetooth interface to a data device than carry around a iPhone or Blackberry -- its like those Leatherman multitools (or Swiss Army knives), its a great idea in theory, very ingenious, but it really doesn't do any particular job well.

  42. Anonymous Coward
    Pirate

    Let's take iPhone success with a pinch of salt

    Lord Jobs and his motley crew designed the iPhone to take on the US mobile market which, lets be fair, consists of crap phones with dreadful service at an already too expensive price (from someone who has just moved from the UK to the US). Its a sorry state of affairs when the top mobile phone service providers make the main point of their adverts that they drop less calls than their opposition. I'm not going into the why - just the fact that US mobile services suck. IMHO they are at about the same level Europe was at 8-10 years ago - and I'm serious with that. I used to get better mobile service in 98 or 99 than I get now in the US - for less money. The phones are lower standard and have less features, everything just isn't as good. In that market, Lord Jobs has managed to come up with a popular phone - selling a lot of units to a market that was starved for quality.

    In Europe the iPhone has bombed. I know the fan-bois will come up with some argument why it hasn't bombed, but just look at the sales figures; the empty stores on release day; the lack of meaningful marketing follow up. The reason for that is simple, the iPhone is poor quality and poor value against what Europe offer. Nokia don't have to bring out iPhone killers - in the most mature markets in the world they are already better. This is a marketing stunt from Nokia. They definitely want a touch phone to compete with iPhone, but they don't need it to maintain their already dominant market share. And next time Lord Jobs wants to release a product that is genuinely best in class, he needs to look in the most developed markets first (which with mobiles is either Europe or Japan - most definitely not the remarkably backward USA).

  43. Jason The Saj
    Jobs Horns

    All these so-called "iPhone Killers"

    Seem to come out, and look more like 'suicide bombers' than anything else.

  44. Filippo

    S60

    It must be because I don't keep up with cellphone technology much, but I don't get the hatred at S60. I have a 6630 and all the functions I use frequently can be started with one or two clicks, the interface responds quickly, and it crashed twice in 3 years. I must be using it wrong.

  45. Reid Malenfant
    Flame

    Perhaps its just me

    but once again I’m struggling to comprehend what everyone’s blathering on about. This is like all that pointless drivel endlessly churned out in the oh-so-tedious OS Flame Wars. What’s wrong with you people?

    You’re talking about bloody mobile phones …… TELEPHONES for Christ’s sake!

    I’ve been using one for years, don’t care about the network, who makes it or what it looks like just so long as IT MAKES CALLS. Yeah texting is useful, but other than that most everything else is just confetti; an endless succession of marketing ploys aimed directly at gullible morons.

    Nokia, Motorola, Sony Ericsson et al have been playing you shamelessly for years so why get so excited about Apple joining in the game? Can you not see that EVERY mobile phone has been turned into gizmo laden, colour coded fashion accessory?

    Doesn’t matter how ‘awesome’ your current phone is because, this time next year, there’ll be a nearly identical replacement model that somehow renders your old one both redundant and embarrassing; one more kitchen drawer dust magnet. Phew, good job those contracts only last 12 months eh?

    Hmm, what a coincidence?

    It the most blatant built-in obsolescence scam the world has ever seen – and all this vociferous N*** this v the i*** that graphically illustrates how you’ve all fallen for it.

  46. Grego

    Compatible with existing S60 apps?

    I wonder if this baby will be compatible with the existing base of S60 apps? Speaking as an app developer ( http://mpaja.com ) I don't see how it would be possible without a slide-out keyboard...

  47. Ben Bufton
    Heart

    <uh-huh>

    Hey - I liked the SE P910i as well... before it got all slow when they replaced it with the 990 - oh dear.

    Anyway, whatever you may think of the iPhone, you have to concede that Nokia think it's amazing - so amazing they're going to try and make a handset just like it.

    What's sad here is that Sony, Nokia and the rest had to be shown that a touch screen could work before they had the balls to make one themselves (and Sony were sooo close too).

    Love 'em or hate 'em Apple have come up with a product that will only do us all good - and that's why they get a heart from me.

    On a side note: It's funny when I read my posts back they always sound so balanced and reasonable - it always makes me wonder why half the posters here at Reg make themselves sound like such angry jerks...

  48. Gilbo
    Stop

    @ Reid Malenfant

    That's strange. I see people every single day using their phones to talk to people, send messages, take photos, listen to MP3s, check the football scores on the internet and maybe even play a little game whilst waiting for the bus.

    But pah! Who needs all that bollocks when we could still be using a nice monochrome Ericsson T28 that could only fit 2 lines text on the screen.

    There's a reason we don't still live in the DARK AGES mate. That said, I'm still not bloody touching an iPhone.

  49. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Designs driven by network operators??

    The Nokias and others usually have their designs driven by the network operators (AT&T and Verizon here in the USA). The iPhone was the first that WASN'T driven by the network operators (but yes, tied into one). Until the other phone providers take the "consumer" (the one paying for the service) into account, they will all lose out in the end.

    The "success" of the iphone is due to its "ground up" design, not being hampered by previous (mis)conceptions of network operators wanting us to upgrade devices every year or so.

  50. Anonymous Coward
    Linux

    iPhone killer?

    sure;y Nokia doesn't care about being seen as an iPhone killer, maybe they wanted to make a nice looking good quality handset (ah I remember my old nokia's with joy,9300i, 6600 and 6210 3310 and 3210 if you care, moved to HTC now)

    but remember the things nokias have subtly used to detroy the rest of the market

    mine were all FREE!!!

    so surely that does nasty things completely to the iPhone bonfire

    oh and they're network free (I'm not going to bother with functionality as that arguement never wins with fan boys) but an instant savong of a couple of hundred quid which I can go and spend on a decent MP4 player (got my heart on this one http://www.sony.co.uk/view/ShowProduct.action?product=NWZ-A828K&site=odw_en_GB&imageType=Main&category=NWS+A+Series as it come's with kick ass headphone which will work on phone and player-something the iPhone won't do without a £50 adaptor!!!!!!)

  51. Diogenies
    Flame

    @ perhaps its me

    Well said sir !

    My sediments exactly. - I have visted many phone shops looking for a mobile phone that just makes calls and sends texts and a calendar - no camera, no games, no silly ringtones and was laughed at by the sales people...

    I used my nokia 5110 for 5 years, and would probably still be using it but I was forced to give it up when I moved to the bush (needed cdma) and now that I have moved back to the big smoke now use a samsung Esomething (as cdma reception here is awful) .

    I suspect many reg readers are bowerbirds (ohhhh shiny must have)

  52. Tigre Marino
    Jobs Horns

    Running the slowest S60 phone...

    The S60V3 interface is okay, and running a N75 in my pocket is a great experience, can watch YouTube videos via MobiTubia, can play 3D Games, etc. on the slowest, least-featured, POS S60V3 device Nokia has put on the market, yet it has a great picture editor, a fantastic camera with video support, and is not as slow as people say... yet the other day I installed an unsigned app that was a virus but a flash later my N75 is running quick and smooth and is a pleasure to have.

    Mobile phones nowadays aren't "just Phones" anymore, you use them as MP3 player, video player, camera/video, game players, map devices, alarm clock, notepad, Office document editor, MMS/SMS paging, audio recorder, picture gallery, they are a great convergence device including internet access, sky-is-the-limit-while-you-have-battery...

    As for the Nokia iPhone, I'm still wanting a N81 with 8 GB or a N96 as my next phone :)

  53. Anonymous Coward
    Stop

    @ Chris Gibson

    Calm down dear, it's only a telephone.

  54. Steve J. Rapaport
    Jobs Halo

    Bjarne Stroustrup on telephone UI

    "I have always wished for my computer to be as easy to use as my telephone; my wish has come true because I can no longer figure out how to use my telephone."

    Until this is no longer funny, the iPhone will have a market.

  55. Andy Worth

    So hands up who read the story....

    All of the people slating Nokia for referring to their phone as an iPhone killer.....read again and this time do it with your eyes open. The author of the story was the only one referring to it in that way, although it does seem pretty obvious that it is aiming at the iPhone directly.

    Now I'm not a fan of Apple because of their exorbitant prices (rather than disliking the technology itself), and I really don't get on well with the Nokia phone UI's in general. However, I'll still be interested to see what they come up with, purely from a technogeek perspective.

  56. Anonymous Coward
    Dead Vulture

    Ranting and raving about phones

    I have silently read all these comments in perpetuum; I can take it no more.

    Surely the idea of having a phone or any mobile device is to use it for purpose.

    It is not a fashion accessory, it is not what type it is or how much it cost but to be used to contact friends, work etc.

    You people seem to be obsessed with how you will look with your toys and who might see you with it,

    Shallow shameful individuals.

    How are the youth of today expected to have any sense of a moralistic life when so many morons are impressed by the type of phone you own and, more importantly, how much it costs.

    It would be so much easier for everyone to buy and own the same type of phone, to be purchased from one company, on one type of contract, all the same, for ever, the end.

    This would then force the other companies to sit up and take note, forcing them to re consider the pricing and style of devices being offered.

    If we all had the same items, on the same contracts then the kids would not be arguing about who has the best and who cannot afford this and that, there would not be any in fighting in classrooms and homes. Families would be able to return to old fashioned, clean living morals and begin to live a life without thinking about how they look and how much everything costs.

    It is so easy, just get on with your own lives and stop worrying about other people.

    Get a dining table and sit round it as a family and talk without using a computer or a bloody mobile phone !

  57. Glenn Evans

    It's the interface, stupid!

    Ape the form factor all you want, Nokia, but if you think that's the driving force behind the iPod Touch/iPhone's desirability you're crazy. It's the OS and interface that make it work so well.

    I've had an Nokie S60 3rd phone for a year and it's a hateful, slow piece of sh*t. Since I've bought an iPod touch, I have stopped using my phone for anything except texting and phonecalls - the Apple interface and apps are utterly beautiful to use.

    I'm going to be downgrading my phone to a simple handset until such times as I get a 3G iPhone now, or someone brings out a competing devide with an equally effective front end. I find it impossible to believe that an S60 or WM based device can truely become an iPhone killer in the near future.

  58. Nikolaus Heger

    a long road...

    the iPhone is only limited by the sim/provider locking. however, with ziphone there is a true 1-click way around that, it just unlocks any iphone out of the box in about 5 minutes. recently tried. 5 minutes later you have an iphone you can use on any network. and install some really cool apps on it to boot.

    if there is S60 on this supposed iPhone killer i wish Nokia good luck. I don't think that S60 is up to the task, or can be improved to a point where it can compete with the iPhone's OS.

    Nokia did know how to make good phones once, but that was before it ventured into smart-phone territory. It's been downhill ever since. The 6600 was still acceptable, the N73 already garbage, as was the first rev of the N95, the latter having been revved to an acceptable performance level by now.

    Nokia is still unrivaled in the low cost phone market of course. These are incredible in terms of value, battery life, build quality.

    I am hoping the iPhone was the much needed kick in the proverbial to get Nokia innovating again.. because as much as i love my iPhone, competition is good.

    One thing, however, I venture to predict right now: The "tube" is not an iPhone killer. It will not work well and Nokia will have to go back to the drawing board with touch controls and kinda be reminded of the reason they didn't do it a long time ago: Because it's HARD.

  59. This post has been deleted by its author

  60. Shonko Kid
    Jobs Horns

    Oh dear...

    @"avoid the Tube becoming a Hole"

    >I hope Nokia equip the Tube with a decent enough processor (600mhz plus)

    Why should they sacrifice battery power or build costs because of bloaty code? Only OS providers from desktopland care about more MHz, using it as a crutch to support their poor software engineering practices.

    @philip jeffery

    >But you cannot deny that the Iphone is an evolutional leap from previous phones...

    Care to elaborate? the iPhone does nothing substantially different or better than the 5 year old SEMC P800, which even had MMS and Handwriting!!!ZOMG!!!1! Nothing better, except perhaps making fanbois soil themselves.

    >To keep customers purchasing new phones each year...[snip]

    Wow. What a really profound insight you have on the industry, you must be a big player.

    @Martin Usher

    >Though I can't figure out why they'd want to use Symbian when they already have a great Linux based platform with the N800/N810

    Two words. Real Time. Don't get me wrong, I love the Maemo devices, and you're right, when coupled with a nice, small, elegant 3G handset (you got that Steve?) they're great. But the platform isn't upto the job of running a handset. Yet.

    @Chad H.

    >I could have sworn nokia once called touch a gimmick.

    I think they said the same thing about clamshells ;-)

    @jai

    >so would i be wrong in expect all those same people to level the same criticism at the Nokia Tube?

    You could expect them to criticise it, but then Nokia do dozens of form factors, so if you wanted Tube + keyboard, chances are you could just get that model instead. Completely different proposition to Apple's 'Model T' design philosophy. When Apple have a range of iPhones in different form factors, then Nokia might just begin to worry.

    @AC "iPhone killer"

    >Apple spent the time and money to come up with a beautiful design, slick UI and a pretty decent handset on their first go. That took a lot of guts if you ask me.

    Not really. it was something they had to do, and had to do very well first time. Mobile phones are eating into the iPod market, it was a simple case of adapt or die. No guts required.

    What should have Apple worried about this, is that this will appeal to the iPhone market, yet will come at a much better deal for the consumer (it'll be free with an 18month contract within 6 months of launch, if the N95 is anything to go by). Jobs better have something much more than bringing the iPhone up to 3G spec up his sleeve, if he wants to meet those targets.

  61. Steve Evans

    @AC

    "Wasn't Zune the I-pod "Killer" and I'm sure we've have other iphone "killer" statements on here in the past.. its all getting rather tedious."

    There's a difference... Microsoft weren't an mp3 player manufacturer.

    Nokia *ARE* a phone manufacturer.

    So they know a thing or two about the global communications game.

    In contrast Apple were a computer/mp3 player manufacturer who tried to make a phone, and although they made a lovely user interface (which they know all about), they kinda missed the target on the phone side of things (especially compared to what non-US customers are used to). Price too steap, Camera too cheap, MMS functionality missing etc etc. You only have to look at the sales figures to see that.

  62. Andy Tyzack
    Go

    why oh why

    why do people always compare new phones to the iphone, oh yes, because its simply a better handset, people moan about 3g when most people dont even know what 3g is,

    countless people I know go and upgrade to a 2.5g phone, why? they ycudnt give a f**k about 3g.

    what happens if the next iphone has hsdpa up to 7mbps, all the pathetic apple bashers will still find fault with it.

    "well its only got a 16bit screen" my nokia has 70 billion (get a grip)

    the fact all the new handsets are called iphone killers leads me to believe that they percieve the handset to be superior.

    nokia isnt showing one ounce of innovation here because this type of handset is already out there. They are copying the design because the iphone is a highly desirable peice of electronics.

    /rant

  63. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    @you anti-nokia wise guys out there; greetings from finland

    A month's salary for an iPhone? Cripes, wages in Finland a bit low?

    I'm not bothered about the whole debate myself, but as a mobile developer I can say that I wouldn't take home an S60 device through choice (and we have nearly every handset for the picking and choosing).

  64. Jacob Reid
    Thumb Down

    Gimmick

    Touch screens are still a gimmick for the kind of idiotic person who would buy an iphone based on the fact it has a picture of an apple on it, ignoring cheaper, better phones.

    the truth is, touch screens will never work as long as they are still unreliable, inaccurate, expensive and easily broken.

  65. Big_Boomer
    Coat

    iPoop

    I don't care who releases what so long as they shoot anyone in marketing who dares to suggest prefixing it with an "i" or an "e".

    Perhaps Nokia can upset a certain website by calling it the uTube?

    The bike jacket and my lid & gloves please.

  66. Kenny Millar

    @Ya Tube

    Yip indeed!

    I totally agree, any one who thinks £700 costs in the first year before any call or texts is a good deal, must be a tube.

    Tube, as david says, is a derogatory term in scotland, meaning the same as Ya Dick.

    As for the nokia, shouldn't it be called the 'Nokia ME2' ?

  67. Dave
    Coat

    Underground

    I thought mobile phones didn't generally work that well on the tube?

    Mine's the one with the buttons, not a zip.

  68. Fluffykins Silver badge

    Does anyone know?

    I can waggle my ears?

  69. Rob

    mmmmm

    S60, so the browser will be pants then

    for a bunch of people who hate the iphone, people on here read a damn lot of stories and spend an awful lot of time posting about the thing. I hate the sugababes but I don't go to pop music websites and post comments on every article regarding aforementioned tripe expressing my disdain for how many little kids buy their nonsense,

    I have an iphone because I like being able to have a quick look at the net on the train and buses etc and when doing so I like being able to see the pages how they're meant to be, and not the sluggish mess that any other phone i've had would somehow spew out in response to the pages I pointed it at.

    I don't use mms as emails are free, higher res and less hassle the other end as whoever receives it doesn't have to bother moving it onto a pc just so they can see it properly. Yeah no 3g but as I said before I prefer having everything displayed properly and **I** am prepared to pay a time premium of a few seconds for that, ever so sorry, but if you dont want to, dont buy an iphone, if you buy one and you dont like, then you can moan about it, but I read very very few negative comments from people who actually have any experience of actually USING the thing, or who disregard every aspect of its clearly awesome design simply because theres no 3g, they OBVIOUSLY have never used an iphone for anything other than a quick fiddle about in a shop or they would be aware of how much 3g would suck the battery, it'd run out in less than a day easily, as has previously been said, over and over again because at the time it was made 3g chips were a lot less efficient than they are now, and you have a big display and load of other stuff running, the difference seems to be the phone companies continue to make phones with other bits shoddily stuck on, whereas the iphone seems to be more of a little computer designed around its central functions, one of which happens to be taking and making telephone calls

  70. Rolf Howarth
    Thumb Up

    Nothing better?

    "the iPhone does nothing substantially different or better than the 5 year old SEMC P800, which even had MMS and Handwriting!!!ZOMG!!!1! "

    This is so laughable I don't even know where to begin.

    I upgrade my phones reasonably frequently and over the last 5 years probably had at least 3 phones all of which supposedly "supported" MMS, email and web browsing. In all that entire time I sent precisely one MMS message, received two, visited one web site, and sent and received not a single email! (Not counting the half dozen or so times I visited my operator's home page trying to sell me games and ringtones I didn't want and lumbering me with data charges because I accidentally hit the one touch internet button they oh so helpfully insist on adding to the keypad). Handwriting recognition is even more of a joke. It's years since I last had a device with a stylus and that claimed to do handwriting. I've had a few of those in my time too, sounds like a great idea in theory but completely pointless in practice. If I used the device at all I usually lost the stylus, but that's ok 'cos it didn't work even when I had it.

    By contrast, I use email and web on my iPhone *constantly*, because it actually works and is usable, and is useful to me. What do I care if other devices have had superficially the same features on paper years before if they don't bloody work??

    And have you noticed that when the iPhone commercials are on TV, all they do is show you the device actually being used? The user interface really does speak for itself. Can you imagine any other consumer electronics device doing that, never mind any other mobile phone?

  71. Rob

    price

    "I totally agree, any one who thinks £700 costs in the first year before any call or texts is a good deal, must be a tube."

    I agree, who on earth would sign any contract which doesnt include minutes or texts, the iphone contract is actually fairly reasonable, in fact, spread over the full term, the price of the handset with the monthly bills is cheaper than my old phone was,

  72. Anonymous Coward
    Stop

    @ Rob & Rolf, the iFans

    @ Rob "I agree, who on earth would sign any contract which doesnt include minutes or texts, the iphone contract is actually fairly reasonable, in fact, spread over the full term, the price of the handset with the monthly bills is cheaper than my old phone was,"

    What? Did your old phone come with a steam driven charger that you had to run by burning £5 notes?

    @ Rolf "And have you noticed that when the iPhone commercials are on TV, all they do is show you the device actually being used? The user interface really does speak for itself. Can you imagine any other consumer electronics device doing that, never mind any other mobile phone?"

    Well, duhhh! What else are they gonna do with something that's 'all fur coat and no knickers'? They certainly can't market the iPhone on it's advanced capabilities...

  73. Ted
    Heart

    Nokia is Totally Screwed --------------------

    Hate to let everyone know, but Nokia simply doesn't have the resources to go up against Apple in the handset market. As most know, the Cell Industry is hugely uncompetitive, practically no innovation has occurred there in 15 years and Steve Jobs sees this quite clearly.

    The iPhone is by far the most advanced, easiest to use phone on the market, and sure it's still kinda expensive but so was the iPod way back in 2001. Now the iPod has roughly 70% of the market and it's easy to see Apple's iPhone will have a similar amount of the handset market in 7 years.

    Nokia is running very scared now... they simply don't have the computer skills to build products as robust as the iPhone. Sure, they can build a touch screen, but they can't build a "multitouch" screen like the iPhone has. Nokia has no experience with Graphics, Gestures or high resolution screens. So when you use a Nokia it's like going back in time compared to where the iPhone is at on their very first "try". Apple has far more experience in building popular consumer products and the iPhone has been a huge success even surprising Apple by hitting their sales goals nearly 6 months early. Nokia is totally screwed, you read it first here.

    The iPhone has 60% of internet web traffic already, where is Nokia? less than 8%. The reason Nokia is so worried is that Apple now controls the entire high end of the Cell Market. Apple always does this, then releases smaller, cheaper, less feature rich products to take away the rest of the market. An iPhone nano? Nokia would go bankrupt if that were to happen!

    The solution? - Nokia has to give up on Symbian and get over to Unix based phones in a hurry. They need to learn about computer development, high res graphics, they need to get a PC OS up and running before they stand a chance against Apple. The iPhone SDK comes out in June and has $100 million of "iFund" backing. That's 4 times more money than what Google took to create! Nokia simply doesn't have that kind of computing interest. They still see it as a "phone", when Apple has changed all the rules and now it's a full blown "computer" you carry around in your pocket.

    Those are the facts and so I feel sorry for Nokia going forward. Steve Jobs is going to steamroll them, they are way out of their element now that phones are becoming "internet communicators"... and there isn't much Nokia can do about it.

  74. Rob

    my old phone

    was an n93, what a load of crap it was too, I certainly wouldn't subject myself to S60, not even for free, hence why I ended up just buying an iphone since I knew it would do what it says it does, and not claim every feature under the sun and deliver barely any of them

  75. Shonko Kid
    Jobs Horns

    @Rolf

    >supposedly "supported" MMS, email and web browsing.

    Well, you must have picked the duffers. I've had working email on all my phones for the past 8 years, similar for Web, and MMS for the last 5. OK, so sometimes the configuration was a bit of a dark art, but that has certainly improved over the years. But it worked.

    Most new phones come with the correct settings for most of the big operators. Getting the configuration right is trivial if you are targeting just one operator every couple of months. Trying to get it correct for 50, in 20 different countries, first time. That's a challenge.

    >In all that entire time I sent precisely one MMS message, received two, visited one web site, and sent and received not a single email!

    And? All previous phones were rubbish because you never used the features they had?

    >(Not counting the half dozen or so times I visited my operator's home page trying to sell me games and ringtones I didn't want and lumbering me with data charges because I accidentally hit the one touch internet button they oh so helpfully insist on adding to the keypad)

    So... Nokia sux because your operator is rubbish? Here's a hint; change operator. Better still, buy unsubsidised handsets that don't have any operator config added on. Better still, buy a handset that allows you to tailor the entire SW stack to suit your needs.

    >And have you noticed that when the iPhone commercials are on TV, all they do is show you the device actually being used? The user interface really does speak for itself.

    Hmm, that's because it's looks are it's only selling point. It's a shiny video iPod, that does some stuff phones have been doing for years. Meh.

    >Handwriting recognition is even more of a joke. It's years since I last had a device with a stylus and that claimed to do handwriting. I've had a few of those in my time too, sounds like a great idea in theory but completely pointless in practice. If I used the device at all I usually lost the stylus, but that's ok 'cos it didn't work even when I had it.

    Well, I found that the handwriting on the SEMC P series was pretty good, it took a while to learn the correct glyphs, but with a bit of practice soon became second nature. They used to say the same thing about Palm's handwriting.

    As for handwriting being pointless, it was certainly much quicker and more comfortable to write emails with handwriting than with either T9, multi-tap, virtual keyboard, or those cramped little keyboards on the crackberries and clones. Of course, Jobs will be able to invent something revolutionary, perhaps a slide-out keyboard?

    @Ted

    ROFLMAO

  76. Anonymous Coward
    Alien

    iPhone has not sold any better than other hi-end mobiles

    >Apple now controls the entire high end of the Cell Market.

    That is bollocks. I don't know where people get the idea that iPhone dominates the market. It's just peanuts compared to many other hi-end mobiles, and yes I do mean individual product sales. Maybe people in the US just look at their market and not the global figures.

  77. Ted
    Heart

    iPhone is second largest Hi-End Phone

    Only Blackberry had more marketshare in Q3 of 2007, now the iPhone is number one of all Hi-End Phones.

    http://www.intomobile.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/iphone-market-share.jpg

    That's pretty impressive considering it had 0% share this time last year, now it has 27% of the High-End market. It's the biggest peanut because it sells the best and has the most functionality.

    You'll get one soon, don't worry!

  78. Ted
    Heart

    The iPhone has Broke all Sales Records...

    Anonymous Coward, you are neglecting the fact that the iPhone has become the most popular Smartphone of all time, garnering over 18% of the entire Smartphone market in less than 9 months.

    When you get your first iPhone you'll understand why everyone is so excited, but until then, please learn about the cell phone market.

    Thanks!

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