Meet the Frenchman masterminding a Google-free Android Open source had a moral purpose when it was fighting "The Borg", Microsoft, in the 1990s, but then it fell from view. You could say it has found its mojo again, only this time it is about loosening the grip of companies built on ever more intrusive personal data processing: Google and Facebook. One of the biggest but most …
"try living with out...Google Maps"
Google maps is, as far as I'm concerned, not the first choice for mapping. Their actual maps, even at small scale, are just street maps. Ironically it's streetmap.co.uk that has the real Ordnance Survey maps. Oh, and Bing has them too. No Google is not the sole provider of good stuff; in fact it can be the provider of somewhat less good stuff.
Maybe I can help with your questions, as I already avoid most google services.
Google docs: Use another program. Microsoft has this one they've made in a bunch of different ways. They don't have to track you, because you pay for it. It's called office. Apple has one too. There are also open source ones, which you can have for free. That's my choice, personally.
Google search: Use another engine. Duckduckgo works OK. So do various others. Google is rather well-liked, and for good reason, but making it out as if google is the only one that works at all is at best misleading.
Google drive: Use another storage system. There are so many cloud services that can be used that I can't even list a representative sample. I quite like dropbox, if you want true cloud, but there are a lot of options. Also, you could use your own systems using a variety of protocols.
Google maps: Use another GPS. Google maps is nice, but you don't have to use this. Evidence? I don't. I've used various GPS applications, usually with maps that were made by companies that make the GPS writers pay for them, which means I pay for them. I paid for the set of maps I have, and it really wasn't that much. The applications work rather well. However, there are free GPS apps that don't rely on google to do everything for them. Also, apple and microsoft both have maps applications of their own. Whether they work for you is a different story, but they exist.
There is nothing that google has that I can't replace with something else. If I don't like google, I can replace their services. So please don't act as if I need to thank google for their selfless creation of this wonderful code. They are asking a price for it, just a price paid using different units, and some of us don't want to pay that price. We pay different prices for some things, go open source for some things, and make our own replacements for other things.
"Google docs: Use another program. Microsoft has this one they've made in a bunch of different ways. They don't have to track you, because you pay for it. It's called office."
Actually if a web crapp will do then the Microsoft cutdown versions are free!
https://products.office.com/en-US/office-online/documents-spreadsheets-presentations-office-online
What I foresee occurring is that the EU will force Google to allow the OEMs to sell phones with Android OS without Gapps installed, but then the OEMs will replace Gapps with a load of their own unremovable apps that take you to their wall garden, give you trial versions you have to pay extra to unlock and app stores with hardly any apps worth downloading but there won't be any reduction in price of handsets. Just look how PCs come with loads of bloatware because the manufactures get paid to pre-install it on the PC
A large percentage of Android users are probably happy with Gapps on their Android phone, even if the EU thinks otherwise. They had the option to buy other phones then didn't send their data to Google: Windows, Blackberrry, Ubuntu, Meego, FirefoxOS, Amazon etc but these options have all died as people preferred either iOS or Android.
So good luck with your Google free Android, I hope they do succeed but I fear they will go the same way as many others have.
After all, he seems to be having trouble with a couple of points.
""I'm not happy because Google has become too big and is tracking us by catching a lot of information about what we do."
Everything Google does is already entirely optional. You press cancel on your Android phone on the initial startup (or just factory wipe it)., Job done. Don't expect to use Google services however.
So he clearly has trouble understanding the difference between Android and Google service.
He also wants to create a "Google-free Android" using source-code written by, hmmm, Google.....
I, along with a great deal of other people so it seems, would welcome the return to more simplistic days of Nokia type phones with limited OS capability.
If I'm brutally honest, I use the following on my android device:
1. Email
2. WhatsApp
3. The phone, to actually make calls. Yes I know, quite radical and all that, but it is a feature I use.
4. SMS/Text
I occasionally use:
1. Banking App
2. Stock broker App
3. Google Maps when I have no idea where things are
All the rest of the pre-bundled/installed shite I can't delete, such as the offerings from Google et al. I never use them and disable the app in settings.
Maybe I'm just getting old and turning into a Neo Victor Meldrew, but I don't want the entire planet observing my comings and goings via my phone and then selling it onwards. It's about time we had some decent controls on phones.
I did look at the Granite phones at one stage, but I'm not that paranoid......?
Personalised ads, tracking of everything … that’s the details. What we’re talking about is Big Data, all the stuff all the apps collect about us. Here in Europe we’re much more safe compared with the US, where all kinds of data and databases are common merchandising.
But anyway, I have already supported https://eelo.io in Kickstarter. Now they have a Foundation set up.
By the way, as an European alternative, try Qwant.com as your search engine. Qwant is made in France, and I have it as default search engine since a year already.
Qwant Music was announced recently, and Qwant Maps is coming soon …
Not a single mention of Replicant in this article? Replicant is based on Android, minus the non-free components. And that's hardly new, though I never did anything with it other than know it exists (I've the feeling I'm not the only one!).
The main problem facing its use? Proprietary drivers, what else?! Phones and all SoC devices are very unlike the generic PC x86 boxes, with just about every necessary drivers for the latter already built in the Linux kernel.
Oh but wait even with Android, drivers are a massive problem. If there's a new version of Android, it seems the drivers need to be ported to it if the phone is to receive an upgrade (How hard is it to recompile sh*t? Is it all written in assembly for specific micro-architectures!?!?). On my computer, I don't need to get new drivers in order to receive... a new version of KDE or whatever I fancy. Conclusion: Android is a pitiful design.
.....which I really don't understand. A user DOES NOT NEED A GOOGLE ACCOUNT to use Google Maps.....just a browser and an internet connection. Same logic for email...a browser and an internet connection can get you to most (all?) email providers.
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So...if Gäel Duval is successful in creating a fork of the basic Android OS, supplying IP support and supplying a decent GUI shell and a decent browser....won't the BASIC needs of many (most?) smartphone users be met?
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I simply don't understand most of the comments here about "Google lock in"....can someone explain?
"A user DOES NOT NEED A GOOGLE ACCOUNT to use Google Maps"
But to make it work for navigation on your phone you do and it's worth every bit of information Google collect. It's better than any sat-nav, better than any system supplied in any car. No contest whatsoever.
It even keeps a very accurate record of all your journeys, great if you want to remember what you did six months ago for your business mileage claim, not so good if you're a travelling rapist or serial killer.
Look, stop acting like a 5 year old on daddy's phone and think about what you are saying for 5 minutes.
You say it doesn't matter if people know your name, address and DOB.
So why not give us all here that information? Because that would be stupid dumb and irresponsible right?
Once you grow up, you will realise why even with just your real name and address, someone can get you in enormous trouble with the law, get your DOB, and well, your entire life can be destroyed.
If you are so ignorant you do not think there is any need to keep your data private, then there is no help for you, and you probably won't make it to your 6th birthday.
Look, stop acting like a 5 year old on daddy's phone and think about what you are saying for 5 minutes.
Posting you private information here for everyone to read is very different to entrusting that information bro one company (Google) to allow them to use the to send directed advertising your way. They obviously don't give your details to anyone else, it's written in back and white in their privacy policy...
"Once you grow up, you will realise why even with just your real name and address, someone can get you in enormous trouble with the law, get your DOB, and well, your entire life can be destroyed."
Thing is, they can do that ALREADY. Everything someone needs to ruin your life is a matter of public record. Why do you think there are so many paranoiac monologues about fearing the people at the DMV, who necessarily know your vital statistics since you MUST fill them out to get a driver's license or even ID card. Against that, how worse could a Hall of Records (which keeps things like birth certificates) be?
it's written in back and white in their privacy policy...
Absolutely!
If you’ve nothing to hide, you’ve nothing to fear.
No, seriously: just ignore the rapist who, having hacked in, is using the CCTV cameras to follow your movements around town for months on end—getting to know your routines, where you go, when and when you’re alone, in preparation for when they leave work for that fateful evening.
Nor do you need to give a moment’s thought to the corrupt cop using them to keep an eye on your home so his criminal friends can break in when you’re away.
In fact, you probably shouldn’t be worried about the guy with the gambling debts, alimony payments or college fees who works at the company that promised to keep your details secure and not pass them on to third parties either.
There’s no cause for concern—none at all. You really can believe the platitudes and empty promises, I guarantee it—the fact that 25% of all data breaches are down to insiders is nothing to worry about—what's a 1 in 4 chance of all your data being sold to the highest bidding criminal after all?
Pffft, it's all a fuss about nothing: criminals don't have day jobs working for legitimate organisations, they all work at night, dressed in black-and-white striped jerseys and carry a sack with the word 'swag' stamped on it.
And, clearly, only people who are unnecessarily anxious would be at all troubled by the prospect of someone making a mistake (like at Yahoo or Equifax) and all their data being accidentally exposed—after all, what harm could such a huge trove of information on them do if it did fall into the wrong hands anyway?
Now, repeat after me: only the paranoid and people with something to hide are alarmed by the prospect of spending every second of their life under surveillance by unaccountable individuals with their own agendas and no scruples.
"won't the BASIC needs of many (most?) smartphone users be met?"
Well no because you have to root the phone to do that and many apps like banking and Samsung pay will then no longer work. For most users to be happy there should be a requirement that all crapware can be uninstalled not just Google's.
Unfortunately that's not the focus here and Google will likely be forced to allow OEMs to install what they like, and make Google apps optional. What this will almost certainly mean is instead of just Google's crapware, you will get a whole selection of crud from anyone that will pay for it. Rather like a Dell PC!
There isn't a problem with your setup. The problem is that I can't get it. I have had a few android devices, and I'd have loved for all of them to be google free. That didn't happen.
First, many devices never get support from a third-party ROM. Unless you buy the flagships, you probably only have a fifty-fifty chance of getting something. I don't want to buy the flagships because they cost a ridiculous amount for features I don't need (if my camera has five megapixels, that's enough for the one photo I take in a year) and lack others I'd like (I have a few applications I've written that like the extra storage of an SD card). I can get what I want in a much cheaper android device, but that device probably won't get a non-google ROM customized for it. It definitely wouldn't have been running ubuntu touch or firefox OS when those were still things, explaining why, as much as I wanted to try them, I never got the chance. Some of them can't even be rooted by things available online, or can be rooted by something that only looks extremely dodgy and I'm not sure whether to trust it or not.
Then, even if there is such a ROM, the process for installing it always looks like 1. Root device (no instructions, try to find the least dodgy thing) 2. Log into a shell with ADB 3. Push all of these files to some system directory 4. Run this installation script with these fifteen parameters and wait. And yet, those scripts don't seem to be very reliable. When a shell error happens in the middle of a script, but not one that got handled with an error message, I have to wonder whether I should bother to try to fix the script and/or whatever it has been calling, or give it a miss altogether. Oh, and by the way, I am also wondering whether the half-completed script may have bricked my phone or not.
I'm all for more non-google experiments, but I don't get the idea that these people have considered these problems. They just seem to say that they'd like something, so they're going to go code for a bit. I've said that before, but without actually thinking it through, the results were never good. You have to plan, design, and poke holes in things before you can write a good system. I'm hoping that this group has done that. I doubt they have.
@ doublelayer
The Moto G range are the best bang for the buck you'll get if you don't want to spend shedloads of money but want a decent device:
90% of the functionality/performance of a flagship device.
Come with all but stock Android (Docs/Sheets/Outlook + some genuinely useful optional extra features).
Have unlockable bootloaders.
And as long as you get the 'Plus' model there are ROMs for them.
I'm not saying that they suffer from none of the problems you outline when the time comes to consider an alternative ROM but you can get LineageOS as long as you get a 'Plus' and so eke out a bit more life from your phone before it's a security colander or simply breaks down completely.
from the picture, Mssr. Duval could easily pass for a third Sklar brother
I guess if you don't like it you shouldn't use it, but Android without Google will just be a useless OS with no market share and poor functionality. I imagine the same people post on Windows PC stories suggesting people adopt Linux on their PC's - a sure way to make a PC almost useless.
Frankly I see these 'we're being tracked' stories all the time and it comes down to the same thing, basement dwelling, tin-foil-hat wearing nobodys imagining their lives are of interest to others. But you're not that interesting (nor am I) the idea that anyone is looking at you as an individual is a fantasy and frankly it's pathetic.
I still think most people dripping about the issue are worried about their habits being recorded because they're illegal.
I still think most people dripping about the issue are worried about their habits being recorded because they're illegal.
So you think that people who live in countries where homosexuality is illegal should just stop being gay then - after all, only bad people have anything to hide, right?
And, naturally, in places (like Northern Ireland) where abortion is illegal, rape victims are criminals if they get an abortion - so they should just drop out of education and have the unwanted baby rather than keep their communications with the abortionist secret, right?
In fact, since only criminals and perverts are concerned about privacy, why don't we just get our governments to develop a mobile version of Red Star Linux for all our phones? Then nobody would be able to hide anything and the problem would go away, wouldn't it?
"...useless OS with no market share..."
It'll still be Android and should run all Android apps. The fault lies at the app-developers. They should build their apps less google-services dependent.
"I still think most people dripping about the issue are worried about their habits being recorded because they're illegal."
It's my belief, as a paranoiac, that everybody has something to hide. No matter how insignificant.
Some people always have to fight something. Even if the problem does not exist. In your case you want to fight Android because there is too much Google in it. But this is why Abdroid is so great. Beacause there is so much Google in it. I love Android and love Google serveces. To the point i cant leave without them. Google spying on me to sell me ads? So what??? Im not even 1% worried. They deserve it. The give me wonderful products built by thousands developers just for the price of collecting my ads preferences. Not a big price. So your fight is rediculous and your OS will be non existent or very marginal at best. This is my opinion. Because your are solving non exixtent problem and fighting the non existent enemy.
While H2G2 is a good source for a name, I rather suggest a name from a Heinlein source instead. Also 2 syllables, how about the "Holmes Five". This would make it the successor of Mike, the Holmes Four, from The Moon is a Harsh Mistress. Just be careful using it to make automated payments to janitors, that can lead to all sorts of funny business.
1) An alternative for Google Drive is made available, which allows users to use it as excess cloud storage, and back up the phone. It must be widely supported within most of the more popular apps e.g. Whatsapp.
2) App developers make their apks available on the official sites for sideloading, and/or an alternative to the Google Play Store redirects users to those sites. Those app developers need to be financially incentivised to do that. Xiaomi (and maybe Samsung) are doing something like that, but this alternative 'store' or 'app repository' must not be exclusive to any particular phone manufacturer.
3) Users who had done microtransactions e.g. purchasing stickers on a chat app, or an upgraded feature in a game, need to be able to carry over their transaction/subscription history outside of the Google Play Store.
4) Some more useful Google apps e.g. Maps and Hangouts need to be officially available outside the Google Play Store... not sure if Google will even allow this. The most you can do is to sideload the apks from a warez site, but that has inherent risks.
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Otherwise it'll be nothing more than a quaint project but never gaining traction.
"We are using compatibility as a club to make [OEMs] do things we want," one Google executive famously wrote.
Just as with Microsoft memos, and Mrs. Clinton, I really have no idea why a certain sort of people carefully put on record things they really don't want on record, just like bloody Bond villains.
Probably with their tongues sticking out sideways as they carefully pen out the letters.
while their Fire Phone was pretty much DOA, people forget that Amazon have a pretty solid, Google free fork of Android already. The Fire Phone, tablets and FireTV platforms are all ASOP based but largely replaced the GMS pieces with their own store and services (with APIs that over the years have got a lot closer to their Google equivalents).
the challenge will be getting OEMs and chipmakers to work on delivering/integrating with their BSP so the OS layer can be dropped onto devices (perhaps the work Google is doing with "P" to decouple the OS from the firmware where possible might help speed this up...)
now, not saying Amazon are a better path to tread than working with Google, but it would be interesting to see if these projects could play nice and get further together than bifurcating all over the place.
The great unwashed simply don’t care about their privacy, in fact they are self-obsessed narcissists who WANT everyone to know what they are doing, with whom, in intimate details. Privacy is a concept they simply cannot undertstand, until someone empties their bank account or steal their identity.
Selling privacy to them is like pissing into the wind. Even Apple will sooner or later cave into the commercial pressures of releasing all that user data, sadly.
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