back to article Microsoft has developed its own Linux. Repeat. Microsoft has developed its own Linux

Sitting down? Nothing in your mouth? Microsoft has developed its own Linux distribution. And Azure runs it to do networking. Redmond's revealed that it's built something called Azure Cloud Switch (ACS), describing it as “a cross-platform modular operating system for data center networking built on Linux” and “our foray into …

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        1. Richard Plinston

          Re: Does no-one remember Minix?

          > In 1996, Bill Gates said that for a long time Microsoft had the highest volume AT&T license!

          Right up to 1990 MS used Xenix for all their accounting and for developing: MS-DOS, OS/2, Office, and much else were developed using vi. Excel started as Multiplan on Xenix.

          At one point, when MS-DOS 2 was released, MS talked about a 'family' of operating systems, which is why MS-DOS 2 had some poorly implemented features copied from Xenix (such as sub-directories).

    1. jake Silver badge

      Re: Does no-one remember Minix?

      Bite your tongue. Prof. Tanenbaum never had anything to do with microsoft.

  1. thames

    They didn't have much choice.

    Having read the original Microsoft announcement, it sounds like they needed to work with a lot of existing hardware, open source and other third party software, SDKs, etc. Since all or nearly all of those were Linux only, Microsoft was faced with the choices of either using Linux, redeveloping everything themselves from scratch based on reverse engineering the Linux software, or else give up any hope of being the market at all. It's kind of like the choice that desktop software developers face in business markets, except the shoe is on the other foot in this case.

    Linux dominates the mobile and tablet market (Android), high performance computing, 32 and 64 bit embedded systems, cloud, and now apparently SDN. Microsoft has their niche in the PC market, but it doesn't look like they will ever expand Windows very much outside of that. That doesn't mean that Windows is about to go away, but it does probably mean that it will become more like the traditional (non-Linux) mainframe market - supporting legacy systems in a stagnant or slowly declining market segment.

    1. Anonymous Blowhard

      Re: They didn't have much choice.

      "Microsoft has their niche in the PC market, but it doesn't look like they will ever expand Windows very much outside of that."

      Because no-one is using Exchange Server, SharePoint or SQL Server running on Windows Servers?

      1. oldcoder

        Re: They didn't have much choice.

        As he said - "declining market".

        After all the security failures - organizations do learn, even if it costs them millions of dollars for the lessons.

      2. GrahamsTenPenneth

        Re: They didn't have much choice.

        "Because no-one is using Exchange Server, SharePoint or SQL Server running on Windows Servers?"

        There's always one.

        ..sucker !

    2. nematoad
      Facepalm

      Re: They didn't have much choice.

      "... redeveloping everything themselves from scratch based on reverse engineering the Linux software..."

      You must be new here.

      MS have no need to reverse engineer anything, see with FLOSS the source code is freely available and all the MS devs need to do is read it to find out how it does stuff.

      That's one of the reasons it's called "free software".

      1. Dazed and Confused

        Re: They didn't have much choice.

        > That's one of the reasons it's called "free software".

        Except it isn't really free, it has a license and the license doesn't allow you to just borrow the interesting bits of code, see http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/03/05/vmware_sued_for_gpl_violation_by_linux_kernel_developer/ . Sure they can reverse engineer from the source code, which makes it much easier but they'd still need to work out how it all worked and then code their own design while being careful to ensure that what they wrote didn't fall foul of the license. Microsoft are very keen on SW licenses.

        1. nematoad

          Re: They didn't have much choice.

          "... it has a license and the license doesn't allow you to just borrow the interesting bits of code..."

          Yes it does. The GPL is only applicable if you take something under the license and then re-distribute anything that you develop incorporating GPL'd components. As far as I can tell MS is proposing to use this internally so the GPL does not come in to play. How do you think that the like of Google and Facebook manage?

          Redistribute and you play by the GPL. Internal use only, you're good to go.

          1. Dazed and Confused

            Re: They didn't have much choice.

            > Redistribute and you play by the GPL. Internal use only, you're good to go.

            But they'll be intending to sell this, it won't just be an internal use thing.

            1. Richard Plinston

              Re: They didn't have much choice.

              > But they'll be intending to sell this, it won't just be an internal use thing.

              That is merely speculation on your part - unsupported by any evidence.

        2. GrahamsTenPenneth
          Facepalm

          Re: They didn't have much choice.

          "..Sure they can reverse engineer from the source code.."

          Seriously!

    3. Roland6 Silver badge

      Re: They didn't have much choice. @thames

      Agree, it seems many here have missed the key phrase: "built on Linux", ie. ACS is a package that goes on top of Linux (and hence it is not subject to the Linux license agreement). The only real question isn't what Linux distributions are supported but which open source SDN projects did they raid...

  2. Joe Harrison

    It's everywhere

    They will even SELL you Linux

    https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/virtual-machines/#Linux

    1. Hans 1
      Boffin

      Re: It's everywhere

      They have been selling Linux for years, remember, Suse^H^H^H^HNovell signing the deal with Microsoft iow their demise and that of Suse.

      Novell head-shot of the finest!

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novell#Agreement_with_Microsoft

    2. sysconfig
      Facepalm

      Re: It's everywhere

      "They will even SELL you Linux"

      Interesting though, that all instance types in Azure (except A0) are cheaper with Linux than they are with Windows... You'd think they could get licences cheaper... (The icon is for this fact, not for what you said.)

      As to why they offer Linux: The big clouds are after big customers. And they want them to move everything to the cloud - ideally. You'd struggle to find any enterprise size customer who runs a Windows-only server landscape these days. If Azure didn't offer Linux, they'd make themselves even less attractive for large scale customers than they already are.

      1. Hans 1

        Re: It's everywhere

        >Interesting though, that all instance types in Azure (except A0) are cheaper with Linux than they are with Windows... You'd think they could get licences cheaper... (The icon is for this fact, not for what you said.)

        Two sides to this:

        1. TCO of Linux is way lower than Windows, even when administered for MS admins, who cannot even manage certificates in a timely manner

        2. An account that currently runs Linux outside of Azure is not making MS anything, getting them to run Linux on Azure means they get a least something

    3. Richard Plinston

      Re: It's everywhere

      > They will even SELL you Linux

      No. They are _not_ selling Linux. They are selling Azure, which happens to be able to run Linux as distributed by others (who thus fulfil the GPL by distributing the code).

  3. Naselus

    COMMUNISM!!!!!!

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    ASIC v FPGA

    "[...] that offers an API to program ASICs inside network devices."

    Do the devices have ASICs - or the more flexible FPGAs?

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    So, what happens to SCO?

    Just curious, of course, but I would have expected El Reg to ask that question.

    I'd be rather interested in seeing just how they squirm out of that one.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Clearly...

    Queeg is in charge of Microsoft.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Lindows coming to you'

    What they will do with the desktop is give you the Linux OS, but still charge a license for a flakey Windows like GUI addon, that still phones home. They make too much money selling data about us.

    1. dogged
      Stop

      Re: Lindows coming to you'

      According to their published accounts, they make a loss on data and advertising services (and sold that bit to AOL of all people earlier in the year).

      Paranoia is all very well but accuracy is important.

      I suppose you must be thinking of Google.

  8. 080
    Linux

    New Dawn

    So that's why there will not be another release of Windows after 10, it will a much better product called Winux

    1. Peter Simpson 1
      Happy

      Re: New Dawn

      Is thewe somthing humowous about my pwoduct's name?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: New Dawn

      So that's why there will not be another release of Windows after 10, it will a much better product called Winux

      If it would finally work properly and not mirror every byte in storage to some black box at the NSA I wouldn't mind. The only problem I can see is there will be loud wailing from the whole ecosystem that has grown up around managing those deficiencies - they won't go quietly.

  9. kmac499

    Engineering vs Sales & Marketing

    Could be a sign of engineers ruling the roost rather than the S&M gurus..

    Which in my eyes is always a plus.

  10. John Sanders
    Holmes

    This being Microsoft

    This being Microsoft it will require a Windows server with some very expensive and proprietary software just to manage it, and the server will require AD, and so on.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Big Brother

    They know all Cisco kit has been back-doored by the PLA

    1. Hans 1
      Pint

      >They know all Cisco kit has been back-doored by the PLA

      They know all proprietary kit has been back-doored by the PLA

      Fixed that for you, may I have a pint ?

  12. 5wat53ll

    What...We're a Tech. Company?

    Microsoft didn't realize the had become an "also ran" sort of company. When you're in tech. You can't just sit on your arse and think you've got a product nobody else can touch. MSFT stock made a nice leap in price just by announcing their CEO was leaving the company to "pursue other interests". Since Nadella took over, there have actually been real teams put together to work on new tech. It was sad seeing a company with the resources they have doing absolutely nothing. I'm happy MSFT is willing to do what it takes to try and take a leading role in tech.

  13. Howard Hanek
    Happy

    Cloudy With More Than A Chance Of Meatballs

    I wonder if they included all the old exploits as well for backward compatibility?

  14. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Anyone remembers SCO?

    Will Darl McBride sue Microsoft for not paying him $1500 "license" per CPU?

  15. James Loughner
    Linux

    Fork it

    Where is the source code they must provide to be in compliance with the license. I want to fork it :)

    1. John Savard

      Re: Fork it

      That's only true if they distribute their version of Linux to others. If it's strictly for their own in-house use, the GPL no longer makes that demand of them.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Linux

    They've debauched something that was beautiful.

    Poor Linus will be spending the weekend poring over the 4.3 kernel source code, seeing who has booked in an delta update for 'telemetry services'.

  17. JustNiz

    "what the cloud and enterprise networks find challenging is integrating the radically different software running on each different type of switch into a cloud-wide network management platform."

    Translation: Instead of just staying standards compliant and making good itneroperable products, Microsoft keeps inventing their own (usually technically worse) secret versions of existing industry protocols just so they can lock their customers into paying through the nose for licences and crappy Microsoft apps. That has caused so many customers to switch away from using Microsoft infrastructure that even Microsoft finally can't keep sticking its head in the sand any more.

  18. Fitz_

    Not a distro, but sounds like they have used Linux for a software switch. Probably because Linux is frankly amazingly solid at networking and Windows has a tendency to crumble under real pressure like a rich tea biscuit under a bicycle wheel.

    Back in 2003 I observed a Blaster/Nachi infection; the ISA servers just went unresponsive where the Linux iptables based firewalls just suffered a slight slowdown under unending ICMP type 8.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Albeit based on Linux instead of UNIX.

    Is Microsoft taking the first steps in working towards introducing a complete system version upgrade based on the iOS and OSX method for future versions?

    Endorsed advertising written within the OS code to bombard the end user..who knows?

    Wouldn't this remove the need for service packs with only critical patches pushed to the users?

    Next thing you'll know is, Microsoft will be giving away their OS..oh, they already have.

  20. Richard Altmann

    Are we

    talking about this certain company that bought Skype and then announced that it will no longer support third party hardware? AverComm had this fantastic Skype Bridge video conferencing box that enabled the Boss to partake on conferences while being chauffeured to whereever. Open source my ass, Microsoft. And 1k€ of my money right into the bin.

    http://de.aver.com/press-release/VCBridge%20Termination

    1. Richard Plinston

      Re: Are we

      > this certain company that bought Skype

      It has been alleged that the first thing MS did was replace the 'supernode' servers with 10,000 Linux boxes to run Skype so that they could keep it all in-house.

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Val

    Microsoft, if you really care about linux, do something about Skype.

    The screen-sharing is awful since the last upgrade two years ago.

  22. Henry Wertz 1 Gold badge

    What they said

    What Jack of Shadows and Frank Rysanek said.... it would have been a good show that Microsoft's serious about their "Windows IoT" or whatever if they'd used it as a base for this. But Linux (as well as a few BSD variants and QNX to name a few) ALREADY run on all sorts of CPUs (x86, ARM, MIPS, PowerPC... Linux even supports MMUless variants in case any of these switches have one.) Linux and BSD at least already support some switch ASICs (and since you'll have source, if you're ASIC isn't supported you'll have a driver to reference when writing your driver.) Linux and BSD also have all sorts of networking functionality (QoS, throttling, switching, bridging, all types of packet filtering and mangling.. all hardware accelerated if possible.)

    I'm surprised and duly impressed that Microsoft has gotten over NIH ("Not Invented Here") syndrome enough to admit to doing this. (Actually doing it is one thing, they've probably had the odd Linux system there for 10 years... but publicizing it is quite another.)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: What they said

      Indeed but I would have picked one of the *BSD (such as nanoBSD).

  23. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Spousal issues?

    And yet another multi-billion dollar company makes money off of Linux while the developers won't see a dime from them for it.

    I wonder if Linus' wife ever chides him, "..and how come you can't charge for this?".

    Maybe that's why he's so salty.

    1. diodesign (Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

      Re: Spousal issues?

      "Maybe that's why he's so salty."

      Linus is a multimillionaire - he was given shares worth $20m when Red Hat and VA Linux went public and gets paid a lot by the Linux Foundation.

      C.

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Overlooking the obvious....

    Apple famously painted themselves into a corner with the unmaintainable spaghetti code that was OS9. They went - cap in hand - to Berkeley University and asked if they could use BSD as the underpinning of OSX.....

    MS have finally realised that they don't have a viable OS product (and never really have) and are going to build their next generation of rubbish on Linux foundations.......

    1. John Savard

      Re: Overlooking the obvious....

      Isn't BSD distributed under the BSD license? If so, why did Apple have to beg Berkeley to be able to use it inside of their proprietary operating system?

  25. Henry Wertz 1 Gold badge

    "Apple famously painted themselves into a corner with the unmaintainable spaghetti code that was OS9. They went - cap in hand - to Berkeley University and asked if they could use BSD as the underpinning of OSX....."

    "Classic" MacOS was awful. I won't defend it. I thought the worst "feature" was their insistence on claiming cooperative task switching was "multitasking". (Multitasking, the OS gives each program a timeslice, when it's done it's done... cooperative task switching, which is NOT multitasking, it's up to the app to yield it's time, making a call saying "OK I'm done"... if it never yields, the ENTIRE system locks solid. Which, along with having no memory protection, is why these systems locked up so damned often.)

    What actually happened here was... Apple "deposed" Steve Jobs. Jobs went and started Next computers (NeXT always seemed to be capitolized differently every single time, even on the NeXt computers and literature themselves.) *They* took Mach microkernel + BSD and developed Objective C programming language, as well as a very modern (for 1985) object-oriented GUI. Jobs was convinced if the OS and computer were nice enough, people would pay like $10,000 for them. So, fast forward a few years -- next was on the ropes, but so was Apple due to the crapulence of OS9. Apple actually went cap in hand to buy up NExt and reinstall Jobs as CEO of Apple, OSX is a direct decendent of NextStep. This is why so many functions on it start with "NS".

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