back to article Awkward... Revealed Facebook emails show plans for data slurping, selling access to addicts' info, crafty PR spinning

Emails released today reveal Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg discussing how to squeeze more cash from companies hoping to tap into the platform's goldmine of personal data on a billion-plus people. And the memos show staff deliberately hid the amount of data the Facebook Android app was slurping, and Zuck personally giving the OK …

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They will no doubt find any means of extracting additional cash from their paymasters.....

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@ASAC - I suspect there was more of a 'nod, nod, wink, wink' to this whole affair. The documents were conveniently with a C-suite who could claim he needed to review them while on the road in a foreign country. Said foreign country issued a warrant to get those documents as they wanted them to. Said person coughs up the documents rather willingly. The only issue is how did said foreign country know the documents were in the country unless someone made sure they knew.

Anonymous Coward

The real fun has n't even started yet..

Just wait until it comes out that Facebook have been doing "data swap" deals with the big financial institutions and retailers, (at least in the US), so that they have extremely detailed financial records of not only what their registered user earn and spend, but friends, family and acquaintances who are not even register users. We are not talking consolidated data, but individual transaction data.

This is very very illegal stuff under US law. Which is notoriously lax on data consolidators. The only question now is not whether Zuckerberg is charged for multiple criminal conspiracies (plus RICO) but if he will avoid jail. This sort of stuff plays out over years so dont expect anything to happen in the short term but within the next decade Zuckerberg and FB will be toast.

If you dont think it can happen then look up the case of Michael Milken. From highest paid guy in the US to prison inmate in 5 years.

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Re: The real fun has n't even started yet..

Credit card companies and Loyalty card schemes, not just in USA but in EU and UK are selling data to Google.

That probably wasn't legal in EU even before GDPR.

Eircom in Ireland (who are not Irish) have moved legal HQ from Dublin to Jersey. When you sign up you are offered chance to opt out of phone, SMS, email and other marketing. Last year those were pre-opted in. What they DON'T tell you is that by default, hidden in your online page if you register, is two sets of nasty settings: Your WiFi is shared to other Eir customers (managed remote on modem/router they supply, no visible user setting) and you are pre-opted into every sort of marketing when you stop being a customer. I only found the two pages on the website (when you log in) because I was looking a few weeks ago how to cancel the contract after a year and was their year 13 months? I didn't find answer to either question. I guess I'll cancel DD after 12th payment and write / email to them.

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Re: The real fun has n't even started yet..

"Just wait until it comes out that Facebook have been doing "data swap" deals with the big financial institutions and retailers, (at least in the US)"

I wonder if there would be an outcry over this, given that Google publicly stated that they do this sort of thing and nobody blinked.

Anonymous Coward

Re: The real fun has n't even started yet..

> "Just wait until it comes out that Facebook have been doing "data swap" deals with the big financial institutions and retailers, (at least in the US)"

I wonder if there would be an outcry over this, given that Google publicly stated that they do this sort of thing and nobody blinked

>

Actually what Goggle did was quite different. Someone, some underling, had the bright idea of "let get some real world metrics" for ad effectiveness using real world transaction. After sometime someone high up in legal heard about, and the wider world. A large amount of shit hit the fan. End of metrics collection experiment.

Part of the story here..

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-08-30/google-and-mastercard-cut-a-secret-ad-deal-to-track-retail-sales

What FB does is straight up info harvesting of individual financial transactions, as mentioned in the article. When combined with their other Stasi level of intrusive surveillance you got a lot of laws broken.

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Re: The real fun has n't even started yet..

"End of metrics collection experiment."

First, you're using "metrics" in an overly broad sense here. Google purchases this data in order to match up online activity with physical purchase activity. That's a whole lot more than what people tend to think of when they think "metrics".

Second, I don't see anywhere that this effort has ended. I may have missed it, but even the article you linked to doesn't say they've stopped.

Third, it's not just credit card information. Google also has deal to collect Wifi & Bluetooth pings that stores increasingly use to track you. Google has expanded their already overly invasive spying activities into the physical world on several fronts.

I'm not seeing how their behavior is better than Facebook's.

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FB on my Android devices?

Zuck on man... I have no FB crap on any of my Droids, and prefer to keep them Zuckerborg-free, kthanxbai.

Anonymous Coward

.....you missed this report, didn't you?

@Anonymous_South_African_Coward

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/05/22/facebook_data_leak_no_account/

Anonymous Coward

Re: .....you missed this report, didn't you?

www.theregister.co.uk/2018/05/22/facebook_data_leak_no_account/

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FB on my Android devices?

Zuck on man... I have no FB crap on any of my Droids, and prefer to keep them Zuckerborg-free, kthanxbai.

I can one-up that, I'm Android free as well.

Even less slurp - It's bad enough on the (I was going to write regular desktop internet access, but it's probably less so these days) without letting it follow you as you carry it around in your pocket tracking you.

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Devil

"I can one-up that, I'm Android free as well."

I can two-up that with my fiendish two-layer defence. Against direct snooping I'm protected by simply not having any Facebook or Twitter accounts. Second, against posts from friends and family betraying the Ferrari and the mansion I cannot possibly afford I'm protected by the fact that, uh, I cannot possibly afford any*.

* Yes, I also make my life dull and uninteresting on purpose for the same reason - to starve them of anything they might foolishly post about me. At least that's my story and I'm sticking to it...!

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FAIL

I'm on faceborg

And signed to be a mindless drone.

Actually its to stay in touch with old friends who've scattered to the four winds. and the USA.

Having a fairly decent mobile, I thought "how about the FB app for android"

So I looked at the download page, and clicked 'permissions needed'

Zuckenburg.... you can f... right off. (for those who've never looked, the permissions are for EVERYTHING on your phone to be accessible to FB.... )

Oh and the targeted ads on FB are laughable... ranging from washing machines just after posting "I've got a new washing machine".... dur.. I've just spent 400 quid on a new one why the hell do I want another? to age based ads for the sort of problems faced by elderly people (and no I'm not ready for a stairlift/tena pants/equity release/care home yet!)

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Re: I'm on faceborg

Use email.

Maybe Viber for real time text and chat, or perhaps Telegram or Signal?

I tried QQ for a while after Skype got broken on XP (as I'm not Chinese), then I moved to Linux. Only Chinese QQ for Linux.

Note that several popular systems are owned and borged by Facebook.

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Re: I'm on faceborg

"Actually its to stay in touch with old friends who've scattered to the four winds. and the USA."

You don't need Facebook for that. There are numerous other non-awful ways to do the same thing.

Childcatcher

Gota catch them all

This smacks of the cartoon series Pokémon or in my day the child catcher (Chitty Chitty Bang Bang)' Even if you did not have an account you could still end up on their database through your friends though loosing control of their phone contact list and even worse their dialling logs. I under stand there is little or no human intervention, the machines do all the selection. I was thinking what if you denied them every thing and see what the machines make of that. They did not give up. The advertising stared fairly mundane when I did not go click happy the images became darker until a child appeared in make up and not in the face paint usually associated with children. At which point I stopped the experiment. Machines have no moral compass as Google found out. Catcher later (On some database or another).

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Facepalm

Baffled

Hasn't this always been the model?

That's hardly news or a surprise! They make money by claiming their adverts are better than TV, radio, paper & billboards because they are targeted using illegally gathered personal information. Even people browsing websites with [F] button who are not members.

Advertisers believe it, though the whole concept that targeting adverts make much difference might be fake snake-oil. I've bought a Laser printer or a toilet seat. Why would I want another?

There is a simple remedy which will not stop sites making money from advertising. Ban collection of user behaviour and data (actually in many ways illegal in EU 12 years ago, not just GDPR) AND ban targeted ads, ban 3rd party scripts and adverts with scripts. An image that is the same for EVERYONE with a link. Anything else is abuse.

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Stop

Why Facebook will never charge ...

... because it would render them liable to provide the service paid for on a contractual basis.

And one thing the legals systems of the world have been honed to do over the years, is regulate contract law.

It's one thing to offer a "premium" service which a few mugs will cough for (LinkedIn - if anyone does ???). But *every* *single* *user* ????? Imagine the sueballs then ?

"Would you like to login using Facebook", that question that pops up on many non-Facebook sites, is so obvioualy a bad idea that most rational adults will click "no" 10,000 times, even without stories like the above. You really have no idea what Facebook is doing behind the scenes, but you sure don't want it to involve your authentication credentials for any other sites, or any other personal secrets for that matter.

Some will do it though, eg. children, perhaps young people or just the less cynical among us. Therein lies the problem.

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