back to article HMS Queen Lizzie impugned by cheeky Scot's drone landing

An amateur photographer has reportedly landed his £475 drone aboard the largest warship ever built for the Royal Navy – without permission and completely unchallenged. The unnamed photographer gave an interview to local paper the Inverness Courier, detailing how he landed his drone aboard HMS Queen Elizabeth in spite of “ …

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Re: "to defend against this"

"or if you just INSIST on something techy: directional RF jammer and/or MASER"

What frequencies do these things work on?

This appeals to the latent BOFH in me.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: "to defend against this"

something that fires a big net? skywall, etc ...?

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Re: "to defend against this"

>trained eagle ?

It's an aircraft carrier, perhaps the military need to start training seagulls...

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Re: "to defend against this"

It's an aircraft carrier, perhaps the military need to start training seagulls...

Albatrosses (Albatri?).

(they're bloody seabird flavour)

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Re: "to defend against this"

I see your 12 bore shotgun and raise you the 4 bore

And I'll raise you a "punt gun" - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2NUCJOYRE8 -2 or even 1 bore monsters - 50+ ducks in a go.

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Re: "to defend against this"

Albatroi, I think.

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"I find it hard to believe that the vessel was unequipped with this type of anti-drone weapon"

I'm sure BAe will soon be quoting for a hardened version in carbon fibre and Kevlar.

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trained eagle

Eagle? How about crows? I have pics of crows doing fighter attacks on an eagle bomber.

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Re: "to defend against this"

How about the Trophy active-countermeasure system? The drone is likely to be slower than an RPG...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trophy_(countermeasure)

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Re: "to defend against this"

They can be preprogrammed to run a route using GPS. But if you also yam the GPS they will probably get lost.

Best high tech solution is lasers ofcourse.

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Headmaster

Re: "to defend against this"

But if you also yam the GPS they will probably get lost.

Would that be the Dioscorea rotundata, the Dioscorea cayenensis, the Dioscorea alata, the Dioscorea polystachya, the bulbifera, esculenta, dumetorum or the trifida? And would other tubers (like the common potato, radish, rutabaga or turnip) work as well?

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There was a report (sadly probably apocryphal) of a member of The Expeditionary Forces' Institute hefting a NAAFI pork pie at an Argy jet over San Carlos Water.

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Re: "to defend against this"

It's an aircraft carrier, perhaps the military need to start training seagulls...

Sea Eagles.

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Coat

Re: "to defend against this"

Is it "Sea Eagles all the way up" ?

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Re: "to defend against this"

Albatrosses

With the extra fringe benefit that anyone who kills it will be condemned to wander the seas forever.

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Re: "to defend against this"

Albatroi, I think

But only if you are Greek. To we English speakers, the plural of albatross is albatross..

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Unhappy

Re: "to defend against this"

Most of these jammers transmit a 30° cone pattern to jam the control and GPS navigation frequencies. The control frequencies are all commercial drone licensed telemetry bands.

Obviously, using alternative frequencies will defeat these latest military toys. Sad!

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Common sense to not take it very seriously

When you have your huge armoured ship sitting in the shipyards still being built, it's probably best to just ignore hobbyists flying little drones around.

Just about 0 chance of them causing any damage and it's not like the pictures they will take are of any real use (after all anybody that matters probably already hacked into the design servers & downloaded the blueprints a long time ago).

That's not to say you couldn't use them as free test targets to improve EM jamming and hijacking techniques. Just oops your drone went into the sea... shame...

In actual hostile environments your battleships and aircraft carriers are going to be way out of the reach of small drones, so anything big enough to get to them is probably big enough to be a threat and those would warrant getting dispatched quickly which is not hard to do if you are Tier 1 or 2 and your enemies are Tier 8 and 9

What I could see being a lot more fun is the military using mini "fighter drones" doing drone combat duty for practice and a little sport. Nets, blocks, sticky stuff, ramming speed all fun and good. But probably just Hijack them or EM disrupt them. And of course.... Lasers....

Now that the Armed forces in the USA have the green light to take out any drones they like... fun and games for everyone.

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Re: Common sense to not take it very seriously

Spoilsport!

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Re: Common sense to not take it very seriously

"...it's not like the pictures they will take are of any real use..."

But the Russians! Won't somebody think of the Russians??

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On a visit once to HMS Illustrious they had a training rocket on display with four holes punctured in it in a neat row by Phalanx or Goalkeeper. Princess Anne walked pass me as well.

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Anonymous Coward

Princess Anne

She drove a Reliant Scimitar, you know?

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Re: She drove a Reliant Scimitar, you know?

One with London, Paris, New York, Peckham on the side?

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Re: She drove a Reliant Scimitar, you know?

@Jason Hindle

One with London, Paris, New York, Peckham on the side?

That was on a Reliant Regal van...

http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/whats-on/tv/del-boys-tamworth-made-reliant-regal-398230

which despite it's name, not really suitable for royalty.

HRH with one her Scimitars...

http://www.middlebridge-scimitar.co.uk/gallery_images.php?db_id=6&Middlebridge_id=5

see also

http://www.sporting-reliants.com/Middlebridge_20th.htm

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Anonymous Coward

Hilarious!

Shame he'll probably end up with a rather heavy book thrown at him (for endangering sea gulls or something) - which would've also done for the drone.

Happy friday ya'll

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Odd.

You seem to go out of your way to not mention that these things can be bought on the High Street. Like Menkind or Maplin? Why is that?

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Can he now claim to have made the first flight from the deck of the aircraft carrier?

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No, no he can't. My friend can though.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/merlin-makes-first-landing-aboard-new-uk-aircraft-ca-439039/

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So, bragging rights for first UAV landing and takeoff, then?

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'So, bragging rights for first UAV landing and takeoff, then?'

Apparently not even those, there was a video put out by the RN of some of the ship's weapons engineers playing with their own on the flight deck while they were waiting to get under the bridges at Rosyth.

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Seriously - how hard would it be to put GSM control on these things? If they have a range in the distance of miles, you could plant them on top of roofs (a little solar panel should keep them topped up enough until they're needed), take off, all go to your destination under remote pilot, then do... whatever nasty you wanted.

And then either dump them there, or tell them to drop themselves in a nearby ocean or into the path of a lorry.

Just thinking from what I know of playing about with Ardunio and stuff, a GSM module and a GPS controller could push a drone to any destination you like on remote command, whenever you felt like it.

Is it really that hard to imagine these things being used for lots more nefarious purposes, everything from bombs, but down to papparazzi sneaking a shot through someone's bedroom window while leaving the perpetrator pretty anonymous even if the device is recovered?

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If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

There's also no crew on the ship to be killed if it carried a grenade or plastic explosive.

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Re: If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

Personally I take away from it that there was no crew so it was undefended, which seems a bit silly considering its the navys new toy.

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Re: If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

It's not finished or commissioned yet, so no navy gunners to man the non fitted guns to defend the unavailable planes.

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Re: If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

It was defended, by MoD Police. As mentioned in the article.

The Navy defends against attack from foreign countries, the Police from criminals. Because we are not a military dictatorship.

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Re: If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

More exactly, it's the politicians' and the admirals' new toy.

Any actual sailor - more especially anyone who runs any risk of having to sail in the bloody thing - will be very much aware that it's nothing but an immense floating target with "Sink Me!" written on it in big letters.

Just as the Navy saw through John Fisher's demented schemes to bombard the North Prussian coast with "Courageous" and "Glorious" - immediately christened "Outrageous" and "Uproarious". And just as all the matelots must have realised that sailing on HMS "Hood" was not a safe thing to do.

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Re: If there's no crew on the ship to see the drone

"....the Police from criminals."

I thought the function of the MoD police was to keep passers-by from noticing the poor state of repair of military sites?

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Blast! Chance missed.

The Liaoning visited Hong Kong recently.

Now tell me again how to drone-buzz a carrier without being traceable?

Borrow one from somebody I don't like?

On second thoughts, don't tell me. At least not publicly.

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A good thing too

It's quite lucky that the carrier wasn't yet armed. Just imagine - if it had been equipped with - or escorted by - a functioning Aegis system, they could have shot down several civilian airliners.

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Seeing someone has mentioned shotguns, how about using a few AA-12s?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atchisson_Assault_Shotgun

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Trollface

Pics or it didn't happen...

Never has the phrase been more appropriate.

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Anonymous Coward

I say raise it to

Rail guns. :-)

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The distant buzz of the swarm

Can you hear it? Drones are cheap, ever longer ranged, faster and capable of carrying ever more sophisticated electronics. They can be made extremely stealthy, assisted by their small size in the first place. The price of one ineffective POS like an F-35 will buy you thousands of drones—so many that individually they are expendable. The cost of a single ballistic missile sub (e.g. Trident) will get you tens of thousands of neutral-buoyancy surveillance drones capable of riding the currents for potentially years, listening and sending bursts of intel back to base—not to mention even nastier ones, sacrificial drones with active sonar and 50kg of PBX.

My point being that for those who think they know what asymmetrical warfare is: you ain't seen nothing yet.

Just as well our anon photog was an honest man, not a deep-cover GRU agent with a warehouse full of "Buster Crabbe"-class drones capable of dropping RF pickups, microphones, cameras and capsules of botulinus toxin down every vent, orifice and exhaust that HMS QE had to offer.

IMHO there was been a grotesque failure of the imagination in respect of the potential of military/espionage drones, especially their nascent ability to operate as semi-autonomous swarms. (Do you know just how fast a point-defence weapons system like Phalanx runs out of ammo? It's designed for last-ditch defence against the last few vampires getting through layered air pickets to a Nato ship: not to shoot down hosts of gnats. And don't get me started on the difficulty of hiding boomers in the ocean when sea drones, silently riding through the thermocline, can bang out active sonar pulses with impunity, and quickly relay their findings back to base.)

If you thought Windows for Warships was the gravest danger to our navy (well, after Her Majesty's ministers, and our insane defence procurement processes, that is), you were wrong: drone war is going to make some of our big steel investments into big steel targets.

There is, in short, a desperately urgent need for a high level of intelliegence, imagination, competence and leadership in the Uk defence ministry.

Unfortunately, the current incumbent is Michael Fallon (loose-lipped, arrogant luodmouth, no relevant experience or knowledge of defence), who was preceded by Philip Hammond (tight-lipped, moderately intelligent, no relevant experience or knowledge of defence), preceded by Liam Fox (astoundingly stupid, for a trained doctor, no relevant experience or knowledge of defence unless you count a stint as a Civilian Army MO), preceded by Bob Ainsworth, John Hutton, John Reid, Geoff "Buff" Hoon ...not a single one of whom had any knowledge or experience qualifying them to oversee the armed forces defence of the United Kingdom.

That is, of course, the nature of cabinet government, and explains why it isn't just defence that these second-rate mouths-on-sticks manage to fuck up with such dreary predictability.

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AS she is sailing alongside the USS something or other, there is a NOTAM out banning flight, any flight, in the vicinity as she enters port ... not for the UK ship, but for the American vessel ... which may (in theory) launch it's aircraft at any time, hence the no fly zone. Check the NOTAMs for more details, there was one promulagted as she anchored off Portsmouth recently, I suspect there will be another as she heads south again.

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Anonymous Coward

It is rather heartwarming, in a way, to know that The Register is one of the media which has been invited by the MoD to the carrier's arrival in Portsmouth. I don't know whether you should be pleased, or somewhat alarmed, that you are, as it were, on their radar. Hopefully it's just that they are aware you are fellow technology buffs, but I suspect they are watching you anyway (keep up the good work)...

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Black Helicopters

PCSO with a Taser

Landlubbers get accosted now and then for lawfully taking photographs, usually by over-eager officers unfamiliar with the law. Some are also trigger happy with their tasers - A lethal combination to deploy against unwelcome drones! The MOD Police should recruit a few of them.

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Assuming it was armed...

This should bring down a drone. Accurate home made machine gun. Twenty million hits! No wait a minute...

http://goo.gl/2b2UPg

I'd plump for employing one of our world class clay pigeon shots. Short range but likely a bit less collateral damage than say the million shot a minute Metal Storm,

https://youtu.be/wKlnMwuCZso

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Flechettes!

Massed flechette strike.

See John Birmingham's book "Weapons of Choice (Axis of Time)" series.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birmingham#Axis_of_Time

Highly recommended.

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Quick, to the PeterCopter

Drones are really hard to shoot down, but they are really easy to take control over or bring down using technology if you know where to find it, which the military does.

Also the QE has no defensive systems fitted at present so a big stick or battered Mars bar would do the trick.

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