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back to article US patent office prepares to kill off Apple's bounce-back patent

The US Patent Office (USPTO) appears to have provisionally invalidated one of the major patents that Apple was using against Samsung... And it's possible that large parts of the case will go “kablooie” as a result. Given that it's not Friday afternoon yet, everyone will remember that the Cupertinians were most insistent that …

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        1. Dazed and Confused
          Reply Icon

          Re: Of course...

          When I first started writing X code (back at X10.4) I wrote a toy to just make users windows bounce around all over their screens, xbounce was a little boring after a while, the windows only bounced when they got to the bottom of the screen, I wanted windows to bounce off other windows too :-)

          Incidentally xbounce (and my toy) would also both bounce drop down and pop up menus, since they are both implemented as discreet windows.

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  2. Tom 35

    Now

    How about slide to unlock...

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    1. Interested Party
      Reply Icon
      Holmes

      Re: Now

      Slide to unlock prior art: http://www.efanlock.com/files/Door_Bolt.jpg

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  3. Big_Ted
    Devil

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business/market_data/shares/4/106520/one_month.stm

    Apple stock has dropped 2.57% since the announcement of the ipad mini etc.

    Looks like news of this plus that is not enough for the shareholders to be happy.....

    That's 9% down in the pat month........

    Is this the end for Apple ? ? ? ?

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    1. Geoff Campbell Silver badge
      Reply Icon
      Linux

      No, not the end, or at least not necessarily.

      But certainly the start of a new phase. One in which they are facing a lot more, and better organised, competition. How they respond will decide the future of the company.

      I'm not sure I'd be investing in Apple shares any time soon. I did have a small chortle at a friend who recently exclaimed "Apple down to $632! Time to buy!". Fortunately for him, he didn't have the courage of his convictions.

      GJC

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  4. Al Jones

    Who says you can't patent the wheel?

    It's been done!

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn965-wheel-patented-in-australia.html

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    1. Will Godfrey Silver badge
      Reply Icon
      Happy

      Yes but...

      That was in Australia.

      Also the patentee had his fingers crossed.

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      1. Tim Worstal
        Reply Icon

        Re: Yes but...

        It's also a good way of showing what really happens. Many patents aren't really examined for the inventive or new steps. It's only when someone tries to challenge them that they are.

        With the wheel, everyone knows that the guy's not going to try to enforce the patent because it's so damn obvious that it will fail both tests. So let him keep it and ignore it: don't bother to spend the money to test it.

        Unfortunately, some (unknown) number of these tens of thousands of tech patents will also fail such a test. But who has the money to go fight the court case to test them?

        As it happens, in this one particular case, Samsung. But what about the other tens of thousands of them?

        The reason the testing isn't done in the first place is because it costs lots of money. And the majority of patents are never referred to after they've been filed anyway.

        This might not be the best way to run the system but it is the way it really works. Very loose grants of patents then rely on people challenging them to weed out the bad ones.

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  5. Martin 50
    Joke

    This is the first time somebody has explained the patent system to me in these terms, I can now see why it's a mess but also why it's not fixable. And I think a point above about getting the Patent Office to make a ruling before a high court judge uses it to base a multi-billion dollar case on, sounds sensible.

    So I'm picturing a patent, in a box, being neither a valid patent nor an invalid patent, until said box is opened... Wasn't Einstein a Patent clerk?...

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    1. Rob Carriere
      Reply Icon

      Yes, he was. And he didn't much fancy quantum uncertainty...

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  6. Malcolm Weir Silver badge

    Claiming Samsung wouldn't have thought up the bounce back behavior...

    ... ignores the fact that:

    a) Most of the software on the Samsung devices comes from a company called Google, who most people recognize as being _capable_ of great innovation (even if views differ as to whether they have actually been innovative in any particular situation), and

    b) the Apple products run "iOS" which is heavily based on BSD Unix which is a (perfectly legal) copy of Bell Lab's Unix.

    Copying is the norm, and this is the basis of innovation, not some cockeyed problem. Either Apple accepts that everything about their products is fundamentally based on copied work, or Apple needs to quit whining when other people do what they have always done!

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  7. Mark .

    Agree with the article, though a small point as an off-topic aside

    "as we arguably are with the move from featurephones to smartphones."

    There is no meaninful difference between "feature" and "smart" phones. The difference is just one of marketing. Once upon a time, a smartphone (as opposed to a "dumb" one) was one that did apps, Internet and ran an OS - basically a computer that was a phone. Around 2004, even bog standard phones did this, but instead the term "feature" phone was introduced for the lower end phones, I guess to differentiate the more expensive phones. Apple further confuse things by introducing a dumb phone that couldn't even run apps, and marketing it as a smartphone.

    It's not that we're really now moving to smartphones, rather companies are just using "smartphone" more often as a marketing label, as that's where the hype is.

    A small point - but it amazes me how commonly people seem to think a feature phone is objectively different to a smartphone, when it's entirely a matter of marketing terms.

    (Now that there smart TVs, in a few years, are we going to have nonsense like "feature TVs"?)

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  8. JaitcH
    Thumb Up

    Why the pregnant silence from ...

    the Cupertinians?

    You would have thought the PR department would have been working overtime.

    Possibly Judge Koh had a premonition, or a tip, that things might change and she protected proceedings by adjourning until December. Guess Samsung has deservedly been given two big Christmas presents - the delayed trial proceedings allowing them to score the Christmas market and this patent determination.

    New trial anyone?

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  9. Dazed and Confused
    FAIL

    Re: cannot gain a patent on a wheel

    I wonder how long it will be before Apple sue BL for making a rectangular wheel with rounded corners?

    Innovate like an Allegro :-)

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    1. Anonymous Coward
      Reply Icon
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: cannot gain a patent on a wheel

      Oh please. Did you really have to remind me of the existence of the Allegro?

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      1. Callam McMillan
        Reply Icon
        FAIL

        Re: cannot gain a patent on a wheel

        Could be worse... There's always the Morris Marina ;)

        <<Fail... Because that's what the Allegro and Marina were!

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  10. Will Godfrey Silver badge
    Happy

    What about the Vauxhall Nova - translates to 'Doesn't Go' in some countries

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