back to article UK's solar 'leccy cash slash ruled unlawful

Campaigning organisations and the solar industry have won their legal challenge to the Government's decision to reduce subsidies to businesses and homes which use solar panels to generate their own energy. Environmental pressure group Friends of the Earth, which had sought judicial review of the Government's timescale for …

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        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          And who eats the food? How did you get access to the internet? How do you reach your fields without using the infrastucture provided and maintained by the society you affect to despise? Where does the clean water you use originate? How did you acquire the land I assume you occupy, the clothes you wear?

          Did you make it all with your big, manly hands?

          You are silly.

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            1. Stu_The_Jock
              Facepalm

              Ah, NOW I realise who you are

              You're that bloke driving a "JCB for hire"

            2. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              helped build an awful lot of major infrastructure

              So you dug a few ditches on a lot of building sites did you?

              Get a life you stupid twat.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          rich moron - ted leaf

          Ok, glad to see you are just making stuff up now.

          Your lack of understanding of how economic systems work, and your apparent disdain and disgust for your "customer base" is enough to convince me that if your attitude was real, you would have long since starved.

          If everyone took your approach to life, which you seem to think is morally sound (it isnt), then you would quickly cease to have a source of income. The people you deride provide you with the ability to access the internet and show the world what a dick you are.

          Fortunately I suspect that this is a kind of lame attempt at a Poe.

          If, however, you are real and what you say is even a close approximation of reality, we will read about you in the papers pretty soon. I hope the police are gentle with you.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            @ted leaf

            "I hope the police are gentle with you."

            To Ted Leafforabrain, Actually, I hope they aren't in the least bit gentle. Never more has a Reg commentard deserved the insertion of a truncheon into orifices not previously there.

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    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      ?

      What's a gas gun? What's your address? I think the police may be interested.

      What a bigotted twat! Sounds as if you are a red-neck from one of the more deprived parts of the Southern United States. Please return there.

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      2. 404 Silver badge
        Stop

        @AC 12:51 -> Whoa there, big man!

        This isn't about us "red-neck(s) from one of the more deprived parts of the Southern United States", this is about Ted Leaf!

        I live exactly where you describe (and had my face rubbed in it recently, to my surprise), drink PG Tips daily, have a robust home network, android tablets, family, and lots of guns - and I think Ted Leaf is a damn fool too. Don't put us in the same category, please.

        Just Saying..

        :;)

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        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          @404

          Yeah. At this point, much of the cool high tech stuff and software is being developed in the Southern United States. That's where businesses can setup shop, hire a bunch of folks, and not get taxed to oblivion. Hence we have a lot of refugees from California, Michigan and other areas streaming here in droves. Job market here is BOOMING, while the rest of the US is in a recession (some parts in a depression) due to bad economic policy at the State, County and City levels. You can't just tax tax tax, and expect a company to stay, when it can easily "outsource" to a business friendly State in the same country and bring with it the employees that want to move. They're standard of living goes up with less taxes, and the Business's profits go up, and they can hire more employees. All of which start paying more taxes in the end.

          BTW - Ted Leaf is from the English Isles. So not sure why someone decided to start insulting foreign lands where they've probably never been...

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        1. Stoneshop Silver badge
          FAIL

          Your name visible

          Ah yes. The guy posting as ted leaf says he's ted leaf.

          Where have I seen such circular references before?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      @Ted leaf

      I really hope you're a troll, if not, I pity you. Breaking other people's stuff because you can't see a reason not to suggests a level of narcissism and lack of empathy with others that probably requires professional help. I wouldn't expect that sort of behaviour from my four year old niece.

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    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      @ted

      So you wouldn't mind telling us exactly where you live in order for us to come round and throw flaming bricks through all your windows? Seems fair enough to me if you don't consider causing criminal damage to someone else's property to be a problem.

      As an aside I have to add that the people I know who have had solar panels installed on their bog standard mid terrace homes have scrimped and saved for several years and have had it done mostly on the grounds of principle rather than having thousands of pounds to splurge on whatever takes their fancy. But I guess you wouldn't comprehend possessing principles judging by your posts on this thread.

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    4. gotes

      Whilst I'm against going out and smashing up other peoples' stuff, I do agree that solar panel installations and the feed in tariff are essentially a savings scheme for "rich people", one that once you've paid off the cost of the panels is a nice little earner. This comes at the expense of everyone else who can't afford to put solar panels on their home, and/or don't own their own property with a roof.

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Solaaar

    "i cannot get any help to do anything on my home,why should these arseholes make money from the rest of us ?."

    Why cant you get any help to install solar panels when other people have?

    Or is it just that you cant get the help to do stuff *you* want to do?

    1. PC Paul

      " "i cannot get any help to do anything on my home,why should these arseholes make money from the rest of us ?."

      Why cant you get any help to install solar panels when other people have?

      Or is it just that you cant get the help to do stuff *you* want to do?"

      To be fair, I can't get help with solar panels either because my house points in the wrong direction.

      But in T.Leafs case, if he was real and not just trolling, I suspect he would get lots of help in the form of benefits which add up to far more than the solar panel subsidy, but in a lot of cases people have been getting those for so long that they have started to view them as a right and therefore not counting for anything...

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        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          re: er

          ted leaf, you are the living embodiment of the race to the bottom.

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      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        ted leaf poetrollery

        You are "stuck" in local authority housing, while growing & selling food, then using your spare time to destroy the things other people have.

        You are the Daily Mail's wet dream.

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  2. SmithySW
    Flame

    Money for nothing

    The problem as i see it was the "powers that be" underestimated the financial acumen of various bandwagon jumping companies under the "rent your roof" schemes. Any company that couldnt work out a (about) 8% annual return was far better than that available in the traditional markets needed serious advising. Mightily hacked off with the apologists for these companies bleating about how they're only helping poorer customers cut their bills. Absolute Crap!! Theyre in it to line their pockets substantially which is paid for by (my bill said 11%) a big chunk of everyones energy bill.

    1. gerryg

      @Money for nothing

      Any company that couldnt work out a (about) 8% annual return, inflation proofed and lasting for 25 years was far better than that available in the traditional markets needed serious advising.

      Fixed that for you

  3. peter_dtm
    Pirate

    Subsidies required

    IF solar panals produce electricity THEN no electricity drawn from grid

    IF no electricity drawn from grid THEN money is saved

    Why the need to have tax payers pay anything towards this ? The subsidy pays on CALCULATED output, and forces US , THE CONSUMER OF ELECTRICITY to buy electricty at a stupidly expensive and unsustainable price.

    The only payment made to solar panel owners should be at the same rate the supplier charges, and then ONLY for metered quantities RETURNNED to the grid. Even that isn't very fair to other consumers; but an attempt to make domestic solar producers bid to supply their excess generation would likely cost a fortune..

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      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "When we move into our own home, I will insist on installing a 5,000-litre insulated accumulator tank, heat-and-PV solar panels, and a heat pump to extract the heat energy from the roof and put it in the tank."

        And that's OK. But (if you were in the UK) why should your neighbours who don't have this extravagant energy infrastructure installation in their home be forced to pay you over the odds for trickle feeding almost useless energy back into the system?

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Seem to have upset a few people there.

    I don't work for friends of the earth. I'm in IT, and have three cars, and several foreign holidays a year. They wouldn't be happy with that.

    However, I think we'll find, that just like French Politicians were rumoured to have brought in a law in the 70's that said all foreign video recorders had to be tested by a frenchman (one frenchman that is, let's call him Pierre Marchant... taking 2 hours each, in a warehouse near Marseilles,) to stop their country being flooded by foreign imports before they got a chance to build their own industry...

    ...I think we will also find that once the government has given a chance to the solar industry to redirect their lobbying to pay coalition MPs rather than labour ones, and a few solar companies employ the wives and children of said MPs on boards, not to mention a few Tories setting up their own solar companies, we will find that it's all systems go on the Solar front again.

    Besides I think you'll also find that the government have slashed the funding because it was a licence to print money for companies with bilateral agreements with homeowners.

    From their website, Homesun's business model (and I suspect, all the others in this embryonic cottage industry,) is you have several options...

    1. You pay it all, and get the Feed in Tariff.

    2. We pay it all and you get the leccy, and we get the Feed in Tariff.

    Not withstanding no case law existing yet in the event of death, husbands forcing their "vulnerable, victim" wife to sign etc. I think this is a fairly good model.

    All the government is doing is stopping such companies printing money at the expense of the taxpayer, because the cost of installation has halved.

    As it happens, I'm sure if you've a big roof, and live somewhere south of the Humber, insolationwise, you could ring up any of the people involved and they'll still do it for you.

    The whole business truly is money for nothing for the average homeowner who can have it.

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    2. Bronek Kozicki Silver badge
      Thumb Up

      "I think we will also find that once the government has given a chance to the solar industry to redirect their lobbying to pay coalition MPs rather than labour ones, and a few solar companies employ the wives and children"

      I think said wifes and children are all already employed by wind turbines industry

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  5. Ru
    Facepalm

    "free themselves from expensive fossil fuels"

    This line is rather good. I assume the original source meant 'environmentally expensive' because I can't actually think of any fossil fuels which are more expensive than photovoltaic power in the UK. Come to think of it, they're all cheaper than wind, too

    Remember also that non-renewable companies must pay a tribute to those who provide 'clean' energy, so the price has already been artificially biased against fossil fuels!

  6. Oliver King

    Solar subsidy = Fuel Poverty and Job Losses

    The quicker these feed-in tariffs go the better. Who in their right mind thinks that making power more expensive is good for the economy?

    These tariffs are added to our electricity bills and it's us who've never been consulted as to whether we'd like to give our hard-earned to solar companies or our neighbours.

    Each household is being forced to pay more and more for this crackpot scheme.

    If you're poor and live in a council flat on a card meter you can't take advantage of solar, but you can bet that your fuel is getting more expensive due to the family down the road with a nice big detached house ,covered in panels, getting paid more for the power they add to the grid than that from a powerstation.

    It was recently calculated in Spain that for every job created by solar/wind subsidies cost 2.5 in the real economy, a report earlier in the UK showed that we could beat that with 3.7 jobs lost for every green job created.

    So effectively Friends of the Earth are for fuel poverty and unemployment.

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