back to article Experts rubbish iPhone for health use

Two NHS mobile equipment specialists have said that the short battery life of Apple's iPhone makes it unsuitable for use in health work Paul Curley, clinical director of IT and consultant surgeon for Mid-Yorkshire Hospitals NHS Trust, said that his organisation's tests had found that personal digital assistants were viable for …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Newton

    Apple's original tablet had a faithful following as a device for medical applications. It's amazing battery life was one of the reasons it was so successful even after Windows CE machines came along with colour screens.

    If only there was something like the Psion organisers around today that combined battery life, ergonomics and all-round loveliness.

    One question - why are they allowed network devices in a hospital when we're expected to switch all our electronic gizmos off?

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Joke

    Following

    "the trust has trailed Sony PSP mobile devices"

    they are indeed so mobile, that they have to be followed around to see what they get up to

  3. David Halko
    IT Angle

    Some hot-swappable batteries fo the iPhone

    If the Blackberry runs out of power, the swap of the battery is not hot...

    Hot-Swappable batteries fo the iPhone exist. Here are two:

    http://www.bestbuy.com/site/DLO+-+JumpStart+External+Battery+for+Apple%26%23174%3B+iPod%26%23174%3B+and+iPhone/9480233.p?skuId=9480233&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=9480233&ref=06&loc=01&id=1218112363245

    http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=iphone+external+battery&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=330057407863458230&ei=1PWHS_CPN4jgNdjapNQO&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CCMQ8wIwAQ#ps-sellers

    It seems the business problem is solved for the iPhone and not the Blackberry?

    1. Solomon Grundy

      Toys

      iPhones are consumer gadgets - toys if you will. They are in no way a business class device. They have no place in business and absolutely no place in the health care industry. The products you linked to fall under the toy category as well.

  4. The Other Steve
    Jobs Horns

    Duh!

    Well of course it's not fucking suitable for use as a medical device. There are a whole bloody host of things that it's not suitable for. Basically it's a pretty shite platform for most business apps due to e.g. lack of bluetooth, lack of multitasking (well, not lack, buy you know what I mean) and a whole host of other dumb ass restrictions piled on by Apple in an effort to a) maintain their premium branding, b) control the 'user experience', and c) well just generally be pack of four letter words beginning with C.

    And I say that as someone who has recently added 'iPhone' to his development platforms. It's a shite platform for anything other than being a shiny toy, and even as a shiny toy lack of basics like OBEX make it bloody annoying. The vast lack of biz apps that you simply can't build around an iPhone because Apple won't let you is staggering. The very fact that these idiots decided to try is proof that despite it's paucity of features and general unfitness for such tasks, it's overall shinyness makes it attractive enough to close down peoples critical reasoning functions. As with many of the iPhone based biz projects I've been watching fail recently, I suspect what we are seeing is a persuasive dev team who somehow managed to write a plausible sounding business case as to why their employer should buy them all iPhones and pay to enroll them in the dev program. Can't imagine why they'd want that, can you ?

    FWIW I hear that med profs actually do like Win 7 tablets, which let's face it are a far more suitable form factor to begin with. Why ? Because they like the handwriting recognition. Hate the fucker personally but then I'm not a medical professional informatics practitioner, or whatever they're called this week. Graffiti FTW, except that I can't sell it to you, cos bastard Xerox own a patent on it.

    Also, I should like to point out that even though am I now the owner of several macs, a jesus phone and soon a stupid bloody iPad, I still hate mac fanbois, creepy kool aid swilling bunch, so you are. Oh yeah, and Apple are WAY more evil than MS, can't even change the color of the menubars in snow leopard, fucking retards.

    Meh!

    1. dylan 4

      Tablets - too bulky to be portable, too portable to be practical

      I worked in an NHS trust IT projects department a couple of years ago, where we trialed a couple of different tablets (Panasonic prototype and MCA).

      Nobody bothered to use them.

      Largely it was the lack of suitable apps, which is really key for touchscreen devices - the windows menus are too fiddly, on-screen keyboard is too slow and takes up too much real estate, and handwriting recognition just didn't work well enough (not to mention the training and config required to get it working with a full medical dictionary for 20 different users). The panasonic tried to get around the shortcomings of stylus driven devices by implementing a resistive touchscreen as well, but it just wasn't accurate enough and we ended up turning it off as it was too frustrating (prototype device so maybe drivers got fixed for production).

      Another major factor was the lack of sufficient hands - who knew that nurses are still only available with two arms each? Once you're carrying the device, you only have on hand free, so no pushing a trolley, or doing anything clinical without putting the device down. And they really weren't all that usable handheld - fine for short stints, but too heavy to use for a whole ward round. No, you need to put them down to use them effectively, by which time you may as well have a laptop (with keyboard).

      Once the applications are available which are designed for touchscreen use, there will be a niche for tablets, but this isn't it. You will never get doctors using tablets because they just aren't portable enough. Docs need a device that can go in their pocket, or they just won't use it.

      Despite all the naysayers, the iPhone is a pretty good platform for deployment to non-geek users, who just want to use their simple app for a quick and dirty task. It may not be great for "power users", but caters well for the lowest common denominator - and surely we can agree here that delivering effective medicine is the point, not delivering the be-all of smartphone devices? Battery life is a factor, but once you get into the realm of pretty UIs, processor intensive apps like imaging, 3G and wireless connectivity, battery life will diminish, regardless of vendor. None of these devices are designed for constant intensive use, as that is not how most are used in the real world. Anyone spending 5 hours using their phone as a portable computing device through the course of a day could probably have got that work done in 3 hours sitting at a desk in front of full-size PC.

      "Medical grade" devices are IMO largely just an excuse for charging 1500 quid for a touchscreen PC with an Atom processor and 1Gb memory. Yes, it may be easier to clean, but that doesn't mean it will be cleaned while pens, hands, pagers, mobiles and shirtsleeves continue to spread bugs around.

      I will always remember overhearing a nurse on a GI ward, on hearing of a ward closure due to C. Diff, opining "Oh no, I bet I'll be off with the runs tomorrow, I'm always the first to come down with it" - while chewing the end of her pen, sandwich on the desk in front of her at the nurses' station.

    2. Goat Jam
      Thumb Up

      Magnificent rant

      That is all

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Up

    ipad anyone?

    Obviously it is patently ridiculous to use an iphone, with its small screen for serious visual work. The ipad, on the other hand.......

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    A lot of work to make these devices safe and legal

    The intended use for this device includes displaying high resolution scans used for diagnosis. This clearly makes the combination of the device and the software packages on it a medical device. There are rightly strict requirements to comply with the medical device directive whcih I doubt any of the mentioned devices comply with either from an electrical or software point of view.A hazard analysis for its intended us should be performed and it is usual although not a legal requirement that the appropriate safety standard ISO/IEC 60601-1 is applied. It must be registered with a notified body eg. MHRA.

    Some obvious hazards they should consider is:

    Cleaning/disinfection. An obvious route for infection.

    Software reliability/integrity. Asa platform for diagnosis they need to demonstrate that the sofwtare will be reliable and that the softeare version/configuration is controlled.

    Security

    Medical environment restrictions: near an MR, in an environment wth explosive gases, near diathermy equipment ...

    Whoever supplies the device will have a lot of work to do or the sale will be illegal and any injuries will make them liable.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Boffin

      Medical devices

      It's funny whenever you read electrical components datasheets. Without a exception they ban the usage in devices for medical, or anywhere where the failure of part might endanger life. Here's the National Semiconductor Incs version:

      "LIFE SUPPORT POLICY

      NATIONAL’S PRODUCTS ARE NOT AUTHORIZED FOR USE AS CRITICAL COMPONENTS IN LIFE SUPPORT DEVICES OR SYSTEMS

      WITHOUT THE EXPRESS WRITTEN APPROVAL OF THE PRESIDENT AND GENERAL COUNSEL OF NATIONAL SEMICONDUCTOR

      CORPORATION. As used herein:

      1. Life support devices or systems are devices or systems

      which, (a) are intended for surgical implant into the body, or

      (b) support or sustain life, and whose failure to perform when

      properly used in accordance with instructions for use

      provided in the labeling, can be reasonably expected to result

      in a significant injury to the user.

      2. A critical component is any component of a life support

      device or system whose failure to perform can be reasonably

      expected to cause the failure of the life support device or

      system, or to affect its safety or effectiveness."

      So the first hurdle would be getting the written permission to use parts in medical apparatuses. I doubt many, if any are given.

      I doubt any phone manufacturer will start to offer phones officially for doctors, for fear of litigation. Some display driver bug that flips picture, patient gets wrong leg amputeet, and lawyers get work....

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Paris Hilton

    Do the right thing

    Maybe it is a good idea for them to contact the Apple and provide feedback?

    If they don't know who to contact thy could merely do a search on Feedback on Apple's website.

    Similarly so for the 'berry?

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I have an iPhone

    It lasts all day on the same (if not slightly more) usage than on my last XDA without needing a charge. I charge it at night. No idea how long a charge needs, I is sleeping anyway.

    Given all the important patient info is written in a folder stuffed at the bottom of the bed, I am at a loss as to understand the point of this research.

    1. Bod

      Patient Data

      NHS has spent billions of tax payers money on a new IT system (that's broken, late and over budget, as with all public sector IT systems). All patient data gets put onto it, and then it will tie into the Gov ID database also so anyone can get access to patient data.

      There obviously needs to be a method of access to this ;)

  9. windywoo
    Jobs Horns

    The reason this is news

    Is because Apple has repeatedly tried to push the iPhone as a help to medical professionals. This flies in the face of Apple's own PR. I think it was during one of their keynote speeches that they played soft focus video of some Doctor telling us how great it was for seeing scans.

  10. Charles E

    Battery whine

    Yeah, I used to hear this sort of complaint quite often from one source, Guy Kawasaki. What a prat. He would constantly whine on his blog about how terrible the battery life was on his PowerBook and it wouldn't last through long airplane flights. I finally couldn't take it anymore, I told him directly, "STFU and buy a a second battery. You can afford it."

    I think it worked, he did STFU.

    1. Tom Samplonius

      Ironice

      @ Charles: The irony is that all new Apple laptops have integral batteries, so you can't swap them anymore.

    2. Alan Brown Silver badge

      How exactly.....

      does one fit a second battery to an iphone?

    3. Bod

      2nd battery

      Not possible to have a second battery with the iPhone, by commandment of God (sorry Jobs).

  11. WinHatter
    WTF?

    Rubbish

    phone for rubbish organisation I don't see any incompatibilities.

  12. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Happy

    External battery pack *doubles* iPhone life you say

    So that's 4 hours or so?

    The Medislate looks *very* impressive for this application. Bit heavy but *lots* of security (as befits a merkin product that could indirectly give you access to some excellent pharmacy grade drugs), multi-tasking and emphasises it is hot swappable in the battery department.

    Down side (as many specialist hardware types are) is that it will likely be premium priced and on a slower update cycle than more conventional designs.

    BTW regarding screen size. Is this not what scroll bars and a zoom function are for?

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Gloves?

    Surprising that this didn't come up, but... Ever try to use a capacitive touch screen while wearing gloves?

    I'd prefer my doctor to take care against cross infection rather than risk my health just to use a toy.

  14. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Big surprise

    So a device aimed at the consumer market is crap in a specialised industry with very particular requirements. Perhaps we should be clamouring for reports on how Rolex watches are totally useless for time sync between GPS satellites.

  15. Matt 13

    waste my taxes on that rubbish!

    Panasonic are another company that produce a medical tablet, can be disenfected, steamed, dropped and runs for ever on its battery, Windows based so all the software runs without needing recoding and with encryption and biometric logins, retively secure... it also looks like nothing you would really want to steal!!!

    the iphone is cool, but its a consumer fasion accesory get something thats fit for purpose!

    with the iphone, wouldnt all the NHS software have to be availiable to the public in the appstore???

  16. Andrew 19
    Welcome

    Opportunity for Palm

    Well, Epocrates, the killer mobile app for health, has come out on webOS just a few weeks after the iPhone version. It has a couple of major advantages over its iPhone sibling:

    1. Palm units have removable batteries - i.e. get an after-market "rump shaker" and you've got double the battery life. Just not an option with iPhone. Epocrates stores all its data locally so you dont have to worry about constant data traffic killing your battery either, just the screen and CPU

    2. Because webOS has true multitasking, you can switch to another app like email and not have to wait for Epocrates to re-load a humungous medical database when you switch back.

    Get in there, Palm!

  17. Argus Tuft
    Gates Horns

    but will the Apps

    have to be bought from iTunes?

  18. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Thumb Up

    @The Other Steve

    "Graffiti FTW, except that I can't sell it to you, cos bastard Xerox own a patent on it."

    Don't software patents only apply in the US? If not it might be worth checking how much longer it has to run, when it will be open season on this innovation.

  19. Bod

    Forget consumer devices

    They need to be looking at devices designed for the job to satisfy all their requirements. They'd also need to be more robust than anything Apple churns out too as almost certainly these are going to get dropped or thrown about a lot as they rush about. Charging all the time or carrying external battery packs isn't going to be practical. They need the applications they require with reliability and most likely plenty of on device storage to avoid issues with networks being down, and just imagine the NHS trying to get their apps approved by Jobs !

    No, they need to go to a medical IT supplier, but remember we will be paying for it, and being public sector it will go way over budget.

    Anyway, aren't there rules about the public sector affiliating themselves with a religious group? ;)

  20. Ascylto
    Big Brother

    PFI

    "The trust is currently building two new hospitals through the private finance initiative..."

    Enough said, really.

    Who employs these wankers, anyway? We need nurses and doctors, not these superficial administrative tossers. Their likes have already bolloxed the NHS with IT schemes.

  21. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Thumb Down

    Why PFI

    Simple. Government gets an asset built *without* it showing on their borrowing requirement.

    Something for nothing.

    Except the leasing costs will be a *lot* more than the cost to build them had the government borrowed the money directly. IIRC the figures int he UK are roughly £60bn in assets for £80-90bn in costs.

    And the companies concerned have worked various re-financing deals to lower the cost to *them* even further.

    The UK government has not sought *any* kind of rebate on these deals, despite the fact the re-financing deal has dropped the companies costs through the floor, as "It might frighten off any future prospective bidders."

    UK tax payers get better (in theory, unless the builders have dropped the quality to make *even* more money which has happened) built for free (at massively increased leasing charges with built in price escalator clauses) for 30 years.

    The classic no money for assets but lots for overhead routine for an electorate that wants it all and wants it *now*.

    NB The Labour term for it is a Public Private Partnership. That's where the public takes all the risk, the private takes all the cash. PFI is the original Conservative name for this.

  22. Giles Jones Gold badge

    What are they on about?

    Did they buy a set of kitchen knives from ASDA and found they were no good for slicing up patients compared to a scalpel??

    I suppose that 12v compressor bought from Halfords isn't going to be much use as a respirator either.

    Why don't they detail what they want in huge detail and get someone to build it for them. You don't see them using phones on the trains for ticketing, they have a custom made device (with a huge battery).

  23. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Happy

    BOFH CMA against NHS manager types

    "See, here is the evaluation report we wrote last *year* showing you it was s%&t. "

    Now your next question.

  24. James Katt
    Stop

    Doctors are already using the iPhone

    According to SDI's Mobile & Social Media Study: Physicians' Views of Emerging Technology, approximately 30% of physicians access medical information using a handheld device or smartphone. The most popular handheld device or smartphone is the Apple iPhone, with 31% of respondents owning one.

    Doctors are more likely to be using the iPhone than any other phone for providing health care to their patients.

    Thus, the pundits' arguments against the iPhone is moot.

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