back to article Trump’s immigration policies costing US tech jobs says LogMeIn CEO

President Trump’s immigration policies are costing the United States technology jobs, rather than their intended effect of growing them, according to Bill Wagner, the CEO of LogMeIn. Speaking to The Register in Sydney, Australia, today, Wagner said his company had hoped to bring in more workers, some on H-1B visas. He now …

  1. Steve Davies 3 Silver badge
    Facepalm

    Wow!

    Tech company boss admitting that the USofA is not the centre of the Universe...!

    What next?

    Trump admitting that he can be wrong?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Wow!

      Consistent and working regional support in O365?

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Up

      Re: Wow!

      Spammy spyware conglomerate is butthurt about Trump's policies? Carry on, sir!

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    That's certainly my experience

    We regularly get in my European office people who couldn't yet get a visa for the US. They apply until they get it, or they end up applying for an internal work transfer, once they've worked long enough.

    Sometimes, we convince them to stay here. The office has doubled since I joined.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: That's certainly my experience

      I will say. My latest office was wonderfully diverse, wonderfully young and the average wage was wonderfully low. The boss had to shamelessly embiggen the actual skills of the team though while charging for the usual going rate for "top notch engineers / business analysis with a collective experience of hundreds of years". It resulted in problems all across the board.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: That's certainly my experience

      Yup, You are eligible for an L1 visa after one year, or if you've worked for 1 in the previous 3 years, for an overseas division of that US company.

    3. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: That's certainly my experience

      "We regularly get in my European office people who couldn't yet get a visa for the US."

      I have a strong suspicion that the immigration reforms that Trump wants (i.e. end "the lottery" aka 'random pick' system and use a 'merit-based' system, along with ending 'chain migration' and of course building 'the wall') might actually make it EASIER for technologically savvy people to obtain visas and immigrate.

      But that viewpoint isn't very popular. It doesn't have 'Trump hate' in it.

      Once more qualified people CAN come into the USA more easily [instead of being randomly selected at the same rate as "unskilled" people and their 12th cousins] we'll see a LOT less of the *kinds* of complaints that are associated with H1-B visas, etc..

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: That's certainly my experience

        Once more qualified people CAN come into the USA more easily [instead of being randomly selected at the same rate as "unskilled" people and their 12th cousins] we'll see a LOT less of the *kinds* of complaints that are associated with H1-B visas, etc..

        Less complaints from who? Greedy tech company executives, or middle-age american tech workers trying to get a job? Any visa that allows companies to undercut the market rate for tech workers (which has not increased in decades) is bad for the american workers. As Trump particularly has it out for "liberal" silicon valley companies, I don't see why he'd want to make it easier for them.

  3. whitepines Bronze badge
    Facepalm

    So just add a tariff on overseas employment / contracting, proportional to how far below your country's standard of living the offshore country is. Problem fixed; it's not a ban but it does mean you don't get to hire slaves in the developing world to line your own pockets....

    1. Def Silver badge

      The standard of living in the US isn't exactly high compared to a lot of other countries these days. Highlighting that fact would probably just cause more companies to offshore their employees.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        > The standard of living in the US isn't exactly high compared to a lot of other countries these days.

        True, because we had corrupt fools in charge for 28 years. Please bear with us while we make it great again.

        1. Tom 38 Silver badge

          True, because we had corrupt fools in charge for 28 years. Please bear with us while we make it great again.

          Looks like America will start getting great again shortly after the coming midterms.

        2. bombastic bob Silver badge
          Pint

          "Please bear with us while we make it great again."

          Beer, sir!

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        "The standard of living in the US isn't exactly high compared to a lot of other countries these days"

        Horse manure. Try looking at house prices in any major U.S. city. Comparing prices in Chicago to ones in Berlin is disingenuous; try comparing them to ones in Delhi.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      So lets check "standard of living"

      250mbs Broadband. Check

      Paid cleaners and gardner - check

      Good working to home working hours ratio - check

      4 bed house with large garden - check

      Private Healthcare - check.

      Forced to have a full 1 hour lunch - check

      Good public transport.

      That's the offshore guys dealt with, now look at what we have....

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      So just add a tariff on overseas employment / contracting, proportional to how far below your country's standard of living the offshore country is.

      Ah do fuck off. The world isn't here to pander to America's needs.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Funny how the World think the opposite though.....especially those shithole countries with a lot of these HB1 visa types.

      2. AmyInNH

        Nor is the US here to pander to the world's needs.

      3. This post has been deleted by its author

  4. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
    Windows

    Pushing for low, low wages? Yes!

    This is the company that has bought LastPass then ratched up the subscription by 200%.

    Speaking to The Register in Sydney, Australia, today, Wagner said his company had hoped to bring in more workers, some on H-1B visas. He now believes that won’t be possible, that the company will instead need to establish bigger offices offshore and that the net outcome will be fewer employees in the USA.

    Which is of course a complex way of saying that they want to move all jobs abroad and just keep the shares and the swimming pool in the good old USA.

    Manufacturing is already not all that great. While politicians wonder-wish for the knowledge economy and go through all kind of stupid schemes to magically obtain in, what will be left is the McJobs economy.

    (Prolly not that important anyway, I wonder whether there were important "muh jobs" discussions in August 1914?)

  5. cyke1

    "Speaking to The Register in Sydney, Australia, today, Wagner said his company had hoped to bring in more workers, some on H-1B visas."

    Stop beating around the bush, you want pretty much ALL workers on H-1B so you can pay them next to nothing and get US tax breaks. How many Perfectly Able american's were replaced by H-1B workers not cause they couldn't do the job but cause they wanted someone to work for peanuts? On top of it they are forced to TRAIN THEM to do the job before getting fired.

    1. elip

      Bingo

      I've trained my replacements so many times now, that I'm thinking I may just turn it into a one-man business.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Outsource the biggest overheads first...

    ...surely the biggest cost savings would be gained by outsourcing the most expensive staff? You could hire 20 CEOs for his salary. A bonus would be that they would be in a good time zone for the main customers.

    “This is Microsoft, and we’ve detected a problem with your computer”

    1. tfewster Silver badge
      Facepalm

      Re: Outsource the biggest overheads first...

      it's interesting that generic roles like Manglement, Finance and HR can't be outsourced, but apparently IT can.

      Don't get me wrong, it makes sense to buy-in skills temporarily. But getting rid of staff because "we don't know what we're/they're doing" is an admission of failure in the company.

      1. nijam Silver badge

        Re: Outsource the biggest overheads first...

        > ...getting rid of staff because "we don't know what we're/they're doing" is an admission of failure in the company...

        Getting rid of staff because "we don't know what we're/they're doing" is an admission of failure in the management.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Outsource the biggest overheads first...

      > “This is Microsoft, and we’ve detected a problem with your computer”

      B-b-but they're cracking down! "Wagner said the company is aware that its remote access tools can be mis-used, so has shortened the free trial period from 60 days to under two weeks and no longer accepts registrations from generic email addresses."

      Prediction: the company's stock price will skyrocket on news of a fivefold increase in new accounts and massive profits in its domain registration and email hosting subsidiaries.

  7. HmmmYes Silver badge

    US immigration/import checks operate by the book.

    If your staff are not getting thru the airport then you are breaking one or more law.

    1. AmyInNH

      And yet, it persists. Posted today: "AK: Got approval(Visa Filed via sponsoring employer) and looking for jobs on contract.But its getting difficult for the job hunt"

      Should not have a visa if no job.

  8. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

    US immigration/import checks operate by the book.

    No they don't - they operate by the whim of the minimum wage / minimum education person in the booth.

    Even the law says things like "if in their opinion..."

    I have been refused entry because they thought the green carbon copy of the visa should be in the passport not the pink one. And I'm white, English and a professor.

    It makes it increasingly difficult to do business in the US, if any foreign employees (especially any that don't look like typical country and western audience) have to worry that they wont be let back in after a holiday or business trip.

    Of course this doesn't affect the slave labour Tata H1Bs who don't get to take holidays or business trips -

    1. HmmmYes Silver badge

      I disagree.

      You get off the plane. If you are told to stand in a line, you stand in a line.

      They only go off script when you start being a dick or not doing what you are told.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        You get off the plane. If you are told to stand in a line, you stand in a line.

        True if you are going to Florida for 2 weeks - less true on a business trip.

        As a Brit on a visa waiver you can go to America to:

        1, Install or maintain imported equipment - but not assemble it

        2, Observe and advise a US employee - but not supervise them

        3, Conduct training - but not receive training.

        4, Attend a conference or trade show, but not any educational sessions

        And these are the official rules to the "are you coming here to work" question.

        Not including the "you look a bit muslim" factor

      2. nijam Silver badge

        > They only go off script when you start being a dick

        They only go off script when they start being a dick

    2. Valheru

      Every country uses people for passport control and people make mistakes. Dealing with such situations gracefully is an important skill for expats that merits whole forums and books elsewhere.

  9. RobertLongshaft

    More anti-Trump tripe.

    Remember when Barry Solomon told you those jobs were never coming back?

    Lowest employment in decades, lowest minority unemployment in history.

    Making America Great Again!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Don't forget lowest annual job growth for 7 years!

      oh wait, I bet Fox forgot to mention that one didn't they.....

      1. Valheru

        Nonsense. Jobs market is tightening here in Phoenix over the last few years. Hired guns in IT are busy and businesss are raising wages and benefits.

    2. AmyInNH

      "Lowest unemployment " because Washington's redefined "unemployed". Quite noticeable by the time Obama was using it, and still continuing under Trump: only those 26 to 55 years old, and only those who've looked for work in the past 4 weeks.

      There is no good reason ANY US tech person should be out of work, but for the UN initiative to provide "foreign aid", by giving third world western jobs, in the west, for work and remittances, and for offshoring to third world. https://www.epi.org/blog/the-un-global-compact-and-labor-migration-what-can-we-expect/

  10. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

    "He now believes that won’t be possible, that the company will instead need to establish bigger offices offshore and that the net outcome will be fewer employees in the USA....He added his hope that the cost of running extra offshore offices is offset by lower labour costs, so that shareholders don’t see extra cost."

    Translation: Great. We now have the perfect excuse for off-shoring as much as possible to the cheapest possible country and blame the govt. for any public backlash.

    1. AmyInNH

      "Let me operate corruptly or I'll offshore" is hardly motive to accommodate.

    2. elip

      But would somebody please think of the SHAREHOLDERS!!!

  11. Carpet Deal 'em

    So the great job losses we were promised is just them keeping their H-1Bs home? I'm pretty sure the US comes ahead on this.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Foreign workers are not better than Americans, only cheaper

    What Bill Wagner meant to say is that foreign workers here via H-1B / L-1 visas are so much cheaper than Americans that CEOs and other corporate parasites will be able to receive far larger bonuses.

  13. J.Smith

    Lower labour costs by offshoring. The only thing these people care about is minimizing labour costs, anything to lower labour costs. And if anyone tries to limit their access to the cheapest labour, then they'll get around it. Protection for domestic workers, no way.

    And don't mention taxes, they don't believe in taxes either, it's for the shareholders of course, not ideological. They're a law unto themselves, and should be dealt with, rather than pandered to. Pigs might fly too.

  14. arthoss

    Might require that companies that do a certain turnover in the US have so many employees hired in the US. I can certainly see that coming.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Impose additional tariffs

    Importing lower cost labor under Visa is nothing more than a scam. New tariffs for imported products or labor will help level the playing field and encourage U.S. companies to create U.S. jobs instead of exporting them. If the company CEO only receives a $4 million annual bonus boo hoo.

    1. AmyInNH

      Re: Impose additional tariffs

      It needs to be SEVERELY restricted. "temporary", no more than 1 year. "prevailing wage rate" should be top of the local wage rate, being as their claiming they can't find local skill. NO GOOD REASON for long term leash but indenture.

      Percentage of green cards should be independently verified ACTUAL shortage and lottery for those who have that - cut the employer indenture, they can compete on labor free market.

  16. MedievalMalta

    Story of HyPEdra

    Erm did nobody notice this before? The nearshore/offshore is purely built off lower costs, nothing to do with expertise. It is more often than not related to Business tax incentives, so the workers COGs are not even in the equation...they remain at 0, gradually increase to 0*1%..then when the loophole is closed or something happens they move their business to another place. Being told that profit margins on IT support were 97%, doesn't motivate the outsourced...The just do it as a gig...no investment, no interest

  17. Cederic

    Good

    So he's complaining that his company now have to be more honest about the nationality of the people they hire?

    Good. If you want to employ cheap foreign labour then go for it, but don't go pretending you're a US company.

    If you want to employ Americans, hire Americans. Train them, treat them well, reward them well and they'll even stay working for you. It's not hard.

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