back to article Apple to automatically cram macOS Sierra into Macs – 'cos that worked well for Windows 10

Apple is taking a page from Microsoft's Windows 10 playbook and will push out its latest macOS (ex-OS X) update as an automatic download. The Cupertino maker of the Performa 275 has confirmed to El Reg that later this week it will begin to push macOS Sierra to Mac owners who have the "automatic update" function enabled on …

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  1. Vince

    Good to see at the end of the article you clarified that in fact this is nothing like Microsoft, because the user gets a choice.

    1. kain preacher Silver badge

      In the beginning window users had a choice.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        In the beginning window users had a choice.

        And Bill Gates, said, 'Let there be Windows, andLo!, there was no choice..

      2. Doc Ock

        @ Kain, you still do have a choice, you are free to install Linux*

        * Note this is current info and this can in no way be guaranteed in future should MS succeed in their plan to lock down new PCs.

    2. Salts

      Apple also control the hardware

      As Apple also control the hardware the experience tends to be a bit smoother, though do wait a couple of weeks before install just in case - but then even Apple waited a couple of weeks before it went in to nag mode :-)

  2. W Donelson

    Typical anti-Apple rant...

    ... by the otherwise great El Reg

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

      Typical rant by someone that didn't read the fcuking article.

      Nothing in that article is Anti-Apple, actually its a straight down the line compliment if anything.

      The only real problem (not mentioned) is the automatic updates pop-up is quite naggy on El Capitan and seem to get purposely activated by slipclicking.

      1. SuccessCase

        Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

        "Typical rant by someone that didn't read the fcuking article."

        Well here is the article.

        "Cupertino's customers are conditioned to be extremely loyal to the brand and take whatever Tim Cook and co hand out."

        AC, read it. think about it. Consider the deep and begrudging twisted of logic that produces reasoning like that. Stop being an El Reg sheep.

        1. MrDamage

          Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

          > "Cupertino's customers are conditioned to be extremely loyal to the brand and take whatever Tim Cook and co hand out."

          Since when is reporting the truth "anti-apple"n or "apple bashing"?

          Apple products aren't magical, innovative, or unique, they're just bog-stock items, often with less features than their competitors, packaged in a pretty she'll, and emblazoned with fruity logo. They appeal to hipsters who want to be seen having "something different", whilst ignoring the fact they're want for something different means they all end up with the same bloody thing.

          In the end, iTards will always bash any El Reg article about Apple, as El Reg tells it like it is, rather than slurping at the sphincter of Jobs just to get access to the next iShiney.

          1. rsole

            Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

            Please explain; how exactly are the users conditioned.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

              Please explain; how exactly are the users conditioned.

              Apple announcement: The iPiss will go on sale tomorrow!

              Apple drones: Must queue at nearest Apple store to buy one at 12:01 AM.

              1. rh587

                Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

                Apple announcement: The iPiss will go on sale tomorrow!

                Apple drones: Must queue at nearest Apple store to buy one at 12:01 AM

                I will report forthwith for reconditioning - mine seems to have worn off. I met news of the iPhone 7 with a "Meh, too big, just like the 6". Happy 5S user here. Steve would be disappointed in me (or possibly in Apple, who knows these days).

                1. Vic

                  Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

                  Steve would be disappointed in me (or possibly in Apple, who knows these days).

                  Steve would be frothing at the mouth with the way Apple is doing things these days...

                  Vic.

          2. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

            Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

            "they're want for something different means they all end up with the same bloody thing."

            Which applies to pretty well any fashion item.

        2. Annihilator
          Thumb Up

          Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

          In fairness, they also include gems such as these:

          "whereas Microsoft has spent decades expertly fostering resentment"

          The Register - biting the hand that feeds IT. If they could have crammed in an OS/2 dig, they would have done that too.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

            If they could have crammed in an OS/2 dig, they would have done that too

            Nah, OS/2 updates would still come on CDs. Even when that is becoming as usable as a 3.5" floppy due to lack of installed drives.

            1. DJSpuddyLizard

              Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

              Nah, OS/2 updates would still come on CDs. Even when that is becoming as usable as a 3.5" floppy due to lack of installed drives.

              But an OS/2 upgrade would require rebooting the machine, and there's nobody alive who remembers how to do that.

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

            >If they could have crammed in an OS/2 dig, they would have done that too.

            Mocking the afflicted has its limits - although some of us are actually looking forward to ArcaOS -perhaps the 17 year OS update cycle might actually catch on

            1. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

              Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

              "some of us are actually looking forward to ArcaOS"

              Now that gives me an idea: ArkB-OS.

              1. Chika

                Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

                Now that gives me an idea: ArkB-OS.

                Brought to you by Golgafrincham Enterprises.

            2. David 132 Silver badge

              Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

              some of us are actually looking forward to ArcaOS -perhaps the 17 year OS update cycle might actually catch on

              I would think that with a 17-year cycle, the name "Cicada OS" (CicaDOS?) would be more appropriate...

          3. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

            Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

            > If they could have crammed in an OS/2 dig, they would have done that too

            Don't diss the OS/2! OK, so it was slow, did everything in a pretty unintuitive way and in general was pretty user hostile but it *worked*.

      2. joed

        Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

        The upgrade nag is also annoying on iOS devices. Just as much as wasting 1.2GB of storage and clogging my Internet access while doing so. Soon everyone will miss good old time when upgrade happened when one intended (and had $ to pay for it).

        1. Randy Hudson

          Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

          @joed

          You can disable iOS system updates by following these instructions:

          https://writekay.github.io/Disable-OTA/

      3. rsole

        Re: anti-Microsoft rant more like...

        Yes, but it can be easily disabled at any time.

        Whether a normal user is capable is quite another thing.

    2. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Typical anti-Apple rant...

      I didn't think it was anti-Apple at all. A bit of a snark-tone, but that's normal.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Typical anti-Apple rant...

        > I didn't think it was anti-Apple at all. A bit of a snark-tone, but that's normal.

        I'd go further and say it was an accurate observation about Apple users :)

  3. Adam 1 Silver badge

    Wow!

    In case anyone missed the tech news of the year:

    > has confirmed to El Reg

    1. Captain DaFt

      Re: Wow!

      Probably worked along the lines of:

      "Hello Apple? I'm Shaun Nichols from the <cough cough Hack> news site and wonder if you could confirm..."

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Another major difference -

    Windows 10 includes a ton of changes nobody wants in exchange for a small number of security improvements and a few nifty things for admins (if you're using the Enterprise Edition, which is the only one not that's completely appalling). Sierra so far has no such downsides, and so far has been pretty nice (Tabs! Tabs everywhere!). Being able to copy/paste from a cell phone and unlock with an Apple Watch seem like minor features, but nicely simplify common tasks.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Another major difference -

      Certainly, the look and feel of Sierra is improved of El Capitan, but its marginal at best, can't say I've bothered to send/or received an iMessage that isn't just straight text either.

      1. razorfishsl

        Re: Another major difference -

        They also locked out a load of computers for upgrade, but offer nothing new

      2. Scroticus Canis Silver badge
        Meh

        Re: Another major difference - More meh IMHO

        Haven't found Sierra to be any improvement on El Crapitan.

        Tried Sirri for ten minutes and went "meh"; can't even close an application like iTunes so nothing useful like "Siri - close all apps and shut down mac". And why does Sirri have to download your address book to Apple to dial a number? My old Motorola Razr was doing this by itself 10 years ago!

        Also this version goes to sleep during a virus scan (left to run while I had lunch) which didn't happen previously.

        So meh.

    2. GiantKiwi

      Re: Another major difference -

      No downsides? I take it you aren't using it for software development then. Most IDE's inexplicably stopped being at all stable with Sierra. Which in a development environment is tantamount to worst nightmare, some of my compilers wouldn't even initialise, luckily i had the common sense to VM it before installing it on my main machine. 6 months is my usual time delay for upgrades, hell, I only started using EC 3 days before Sierra went live. Security updates never required installation of EC, so didn't bother. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

      1. Richard 12 Silver badge

        Re: Another major difference -

        They broke video playback this time, that one is confirmed!

        As of yet we do not know what else is broken.

        Anyone using a Mac for work always needs to hold off for a few months at least, as so far every significant update - and many of the "minor" ones - has broken something important.

        I am genuinely starting to think that there won't be any professional users of Macs in five years. Quite where new software will come from then is an open question.

        1. LDS Silver badge

          Re: Another major difference -

          Most Canon software doesn't work yet on Sierra. Canon reported that most of its printers, scanners and camera utilities have issues with Sierra, and recommend to delay the upgrade until a fix is available. See http://www.canon-europe.com/support/consumer_products/operating_system_information/?=j+e

          Hint for the CUPS fans: when you buy a €3000 printer, you expect to use it within its full capabilities, usually delivered through the specific driver and software.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Another major difference -

            Most Canon software doesn't work yet on Sierra

            Whereas my Epsons had no problem whatsoever. I've been running the beta for months and I haven't really come across any major problems other than with MplayerX, and that was easily countered by using VLC for a while (MplayerX has since been updated). Oh, and Onyx needed an update, but that's always been tied to the OS version because it goes rather deep.

            1. Stevie Silver badge

              Re: Whereas my Epsons had no problem whatsoever

              Another functionally useless piece of blither amounting to: stop complaining and just buy different hardware/software/whatever else the upgrade broke.

              Great Cthulhu's Aquatic Anus I'm so fucking tired of hearing that nonsense from fanboys of Linux/Apple/Windows who don't need a specific and usually expensive piece of kit to do their job.

              Broke is broke. Broke with no warning is pitiful for the "it just works" shop.

    3. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Another major difference -

      "Tabs! Tabs everywhere!"

      Sounds awful.

      Can we have a Marvin icon?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Another major difference -

        "Tabs! Tabs everywhere!"

        Sounds awful.

        YES. I hate tabs. They've always seemed to me to be a cop-out for designers who can't figure out how to get relevant information in a single window.

        Obviously, browser tabs are an exception to this, but applications with tabs are awful

    4. CrazyOldCatMan Silver badge

      Re: Another major difference -

      > Sierra so far has no such downsides, and so far has been pretty nice

      On my MBP 2013 the screen zoom feature has become pretty unusable.. (does nothing, then abruptly jumps).

      Maybe it's just Apple's way of saying "You need a new MBP". If only they still did a 17" version - I'd buy one tomorrow!

    5. Wibble
      Thumb Down

      Re: Another major difference -

      [i]Sierra so far has no such downsides, and so far has been pretty nice[/]

      There's *nothing* compelling about Sierra. There's never any use for Siri in an office - "Siri can you shut the fuck up"; nobody has an Apple watch toy; and a few minor tweaks here and there that are aimed completely at Millenials, children (messaging, photos) and fanbois. Then there's the constant all your datas are ours slurp...

      The only reason to update is to keep on the prime branch of updates and get it over for the next year.

      In all the years I've been using all computers, this is the most barren OS 'full update' ever - more along the lines of a service pack update TBH.

    6. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Another major difference -

      Windows 10 includes a ton of changes nobody wants in exchange for a small number of security improvements and a few nifty things for admins

      Don't forget being able to use Ctrl-V at the command line!

      I'm not sure the spyware and advertising counts as "security improvements"

    7. Scroticus Canis Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Another major difference -

      So your the bloke with two Apple Watches!

  5. Borg.King
    Facepalm

    "Microsoft has spent decades expertly fostering resentment"

    Microsoft has done something well? Say it isn't so.

    This is the cat with the buttered toast on it's back spinning over and over 6 inches above the floor.

  6. Andy Taylor

    Good.

    Now that the OS upgrades are no longer chargeable, it's about time Apple stopped discriminating between minor and major updates. Hopefully this will mean fewer people being blissfully ignorant of the new software because "it didn't show up on updates".

    1. JLV Silver badge
      Facepalm

      Re: Good.

      Yeah, because I love being on the bleeding of testing Chef/Postgres/Django etc support for Sierra on my work machine.

      Hint: on a serious machine it's not just your hardware and the quality of the OS (which is uncomfortably brand new here - did you see all the iOS10 gliches?). It's all the 3rd party stuff supporting the new shiny.

      With posts like this, I can see why more than a few people think Apple customers lack judgment.

      I'd rather keep my version of "blissful ignorance" and not risk installing Sierra until I am good and ready, txs.

      And before wise Linux folk shake their head at such lame practices, I also haven't switched to Ubuntu 16.04. Same reason.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Good.

        I'd rather keep my version of "blissful ignorance" and not risk installing Sierra until I am good and ready, txs.

        And before wise Linux folk shake their head at such lame practices, I also haven't switched to Ubuntu 16.04. Same reason.

        For us, it's never quite as black and white. We tend to look at what a new OS release provides, and if it contains features we see as indeed beneficial to work or to security in general we'll test it on a machine after making an extra backup (all machines are backed up via Time Machine as well as a daily Carbon Copy). If that works OK for a couple of months we'll switch all of the machines to keep management consistent.

        When it comes to security point updates, it depends on what it is how long we wait. In general, there haven't really been that many INSTALL NOW updates that we abandoned the usual wait-a-day approach with forum monitoring see if an update didn't do a Microsoft and nuke a platform on install.

        We follow the same process with iOS10 and Linux. For us, the only obligatory updates are security patches - the rest requires a balance between the cost of overhead and the benefits it brings (although you can't be TOO much out of date on either platform as stuff eventually starts to break).

      2. GeezaGaz

        Re: Good.

        Agreed.

        I was quite happy with mavericks and my workflow for dragging photos straight out of iphoto into screenflow. One upgrade to EC later and I have the joyous piece of shit now named 'Photos' just to keep it in line with iOS (like anyone cares). Now my workflow is drag from photos into finder and then drag from finder to screenflow.

        Photos only allows drag/drop with approved 3rd party apps (and finder), I can pay (again) for a major screenflow update for this feature.

        I like (well did) Apple but their constant OS revisions are just like M$ now; completely pointless rehashes of the UI, keep changing/removing useful features while adding more bulk to the OS and features that nobody even asked for!

        In other words dev teams working on these systems have completely lost their fucking minds.

    2. 45RPM Silver badge

      Re: Good.

      @Andy Taylor

      Agreed. Professionals who require an older OS, for whatever reason, will either not have Automatic Updates turned on, or will choose to decline the OS install when prompted. For everyone else this is a good way of ensuring that Macs have the latest patches - even for clueless users who wouldn't think to check the App Store, or understand the significance of a new OS if they did (Hi Mum!)

      My only proviso is that the update doesn't get pushed out to Macs which aren't able to use it.

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