back to article Windows 10: Happy with Anniversary Update?

One year after the launch of Windows 10, Microsoft has released the Anniversary Update, bringing new features as well as usability tweaks to the operating system. Windows 10 was always more than just another release. Notable innovations include the concept of Windows-as-a-service, with regular updates (free for consumer …

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Holmes

Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10.

Pity they are so few, if any.

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Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10.

I think there are plenty of good points in Windows 10. It's just that the flaws are critical ones. I.e. the Edge browser you cannot separate from your Windows log in if you're using an MS account. The closest you can get is to enter private mode every time you start it and then it can't remember anything between sessions. Basically MS saying: if you want normal browsing experience with this, you WILL tell us who you are so we can track which websites you visit. Other things are reversible but only against MS's wishes - e.g. the lowest you can switch the "diagnostic" feedback to is "Basic", but you can actually turn it off by hacking around with the registry and disabling standard services. But that's neither reliable nor suitable for most users, so I class it as a critical flaw. I have gone back to GNU/Linux after years of using Windows (switched to it part way through 7 when I found it had actually become a decent OS).

I think Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy. But for many of us, those are non-negotiable.

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Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

Spot on.

An Operating System used to be the layer that could launch applications and manage the hardware.

Today it is an excuse to push ads, monitor users and create salable statistics.

I'm checking out of all this nonsense.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10 @h4rm0ny

h4rm0ny You can use a different account in Edge from your MS account. Go to bing.com and sign in with another MS id. It's no different from Chrome where you go to google.com and sign in with another Google id. For that matter you can sign on and use your Google id in Edge and your MS id on Chrome. It's the sites you visit that are using the id made available to them by the browser.

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Holmes

Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10.

"Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy"

Spot on.

Ho and I'll add "and if you don't care having an ever mutating OS, wich will reset your privacy settings with each upgrades and confuse you with senseless changes".

Somewhat of a repetition, but Windows does it too : MS switch its model to running gag or perpetual update as they call it.

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Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10 @h4rm0ny

Thanks for the response. I didn't know that. But can I use Edge without being signed into Bing with any account? Because the issue is that I don't want Bing/MS building a running profile of me in my online activity and whether I am signed in with one account or another, that profile is still being built and is easily attachable to me as a real person at any point they feel the desire to do so, given the wealth of personal details, account settings, IP addresses, locations and times included in such a profile. The browser is only acceptable to me if I'm not signed into Bing / MS at all.

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Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

"An Operating System used to be the layer that could launch applications and manage the hardware."

I miss those days.

I would pay almost any price for a Windows OS that just sat there quietly, didn't move and did NOTHING while I worked on other things.

MicroDaft is aiming for children and retards who play games and buy sweeties.

It's fast becoming a thing of the past for proper computer users.

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Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10.

"I think Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy. But for many of us, those are non-negotiable."

^ This. I read much about Windows 10 that makes me think that under the hood there's some decent stuff going into it. However, those good things are seriously outweighed by the telemetry systems (including Cortana) and the forced updates. I said these were deal breakers back when Windows 10 was announced with these invasive things in place. My data and what I do with it do not belong in anyone else's cloud, and if I get used to the way an application works I don't want that way of working fucked around with by a forced update.

So I stay with Linux Mint for general use, and Windows 7 (even beyond support in 2020) for specific hardware and software that Linux can't handle.

My biggest worry is future custom build PCs: I might not be able to get a Win7 license for them, and future hardware might not have Windows 7 drivers.

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@h4rm0ny I've not created a Microsoft/Bing/hotmail account of any sort. I've poked around Edge's setting and there doesn't seem to be any account active and it still seems to work.

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Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10 @h4rm0ny

@h4rm0ny ..... yes you can. Just sign out. That said there a multitude of ways you are tracked and profiled on the web. Being signed into MS, Google or whatever doesn't really affect that massively.

BTW - It's actually quite hard for "them" to group together disparate activities with any degree of certainty though arguably they don't really care if you are one person or three.

I have observed they love you to enter "recovery" options to allow you to regain access to a lost or compromised account so perhaps they really do want to resolve you down to one pile of meat across browsers and devices.

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Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

> "I would pay almost any price for a Windows OS that just sat there quietly, didn't move and did NOTHING while I worked on other things."

Sounds like you want to install Wine on FreeBSD, which will literally do the square root of Jack, unless you are using it.

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Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10 @h4rm0ny

Do people sign in to Bing? Really? Brilliant.

I'd never sign in to Google on desktop as well. I've made exception (using some throw away account) on a tablet and only because one has no option (and I've used it for nothing of any importance).

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VBF

It does and if you happen to need an MS account, just create a "junk" one for the sole purpose of accessing MS (if you wish to use the Store for example). That account needn't have any personal information in it - just don't lose the password 'cos you won't be able to recover it - if that happens, create another one!

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Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

@TeacherMARK: the use of the expression "retard" in a derogatory way is ignorant and insensitive.

People with mental disabilities made no election to have such challenges in life, and yet they still manage to contribute greatly to their community. Please consider showing some respect.

That your handle includes "teacher" makes your choice of words doubly reprehensible.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Well done for trying to find the good points of Win10.

Exaggerated crap.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

Spoken like someone who hasn't used it.

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Re: Windows 10 is good if you don't care about controlling your own computer or your privacy

I think it's becoming easier to identify with those people who have stuck with XP.

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Windows

Web much?

After reading the article I can't help conclude that the whole environment relies very heavy on Internet access (cloud). Which makes me seriously worry about what will happen when you're disconnected.

Thing is: I've read too much "success" stories already about Office 365 users being completely unable to work (at one point this even lasted a whole day) while my old-fashioned-but-still-working Office 2010 just started without any hassle (and without any Internet).

It's not that I don't like connectivity, I do, but I don't want to end up becoming fully depending on it either.

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Re: Web much?

On a slow PC (or merely a slow connection) look forward to significant delays in start menu search if it's checking online as well as looking for some local program.

Used to get very long delays with this sort of functionality when Ubuntu Unity had it's web search activated (at least you could always turn this off on Ubuntu).

The public like always on connectivity where they can easily find out stuff with ease, but it's a convenience they are after, not a forced compulsion. This had ended up becoming a connected by default with no fall back should the connection not be there. Windows 10 is an internet addict.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Web much?

And this is why one of my first installs is LibreOffice alongside Agent Ransack

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Re: Web much?

>>"Thing is: I've read too much "success" stories already about Office 365 users being completely unable to work (at one point this even lasted a whole day) while my old-fashioned-but-still-working Office 2010 just started without any hassle (and without any Internet)."

That doesn't ring true to me. Office 365 is the subscription model. You can still have downloadable versions of the software included in that (and I do). They work fine without an Internet connection just as with Office 2010. You might be confusing Office 365 with the online web-based Office software in which case, yes, they obviously don't work when you're not online.

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Re: Web much?

>>"Used to get very long delays with this sort of functionality when Ubuntu Unity had it's web search activated (at least you could always turn this off on Ubuntu)."

You can turn it off in Windows 10 as well. The things you can't turn off are things like sending of telemetry data back to Microsoft (which by default includes things like when you're using the system, what programs you're running and for how long).

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Re: Web much?

"Which you cannot turn off if you have Pro or lower".

I may have misunderstood that. But the Anniversary Update makes Cortana a life long commitment?

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Re: Web much?

"..>>"Thing is: I've read too much "success" stories already about Office 365 users being completely unable to work (at one point this even lasted a whole day) while my old-fashioned-but-still-working Office 2010 just started without any hassle (and without any Internet)."

"That doesn't ring true to me.."

It isn't. I can launch my locally installed copy of Office without 'net connection. It'll run happily like that for at least a month. It's only the licensing it's checking.

Likewise I've turned off internet-based searching along with Cortana on my laptop.

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Re: Web much?

"But the Anniversary Update makes Cortana a life long commitment?"

No. You can switch to a less intrusive OS.

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Re: Web much?

"I may have misunderstood that. But the Anniversary Update makes Cortana a life long commitment?"

- That was my understanding too, we are supposedly discussing the Anniversary update. Windows 10, full engagement with and marriage to Cortana (unless you throw her under a bus penguin).

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Re: Web much?

Yes - this update removes a number of options from the pro edition, one of which is the ability to turn off Cortana. This is widely speculated to be part of a drive to force more businesses onto using Enterprise via a microsoft software agreement.

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FAIL

Re: Web much?

And as you say, even with the much-hated (by me, anyhow) Unity desktop, you could turn off the bloody Amazon/web search crap. And Canonical at least realized that people did NOT like that turned on by default. And responded.

MS is so arrogant they don't give a damn what their users want, a fact which they continue to demonstrate daily.

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Stop

Re: Web much?

Oh, Gawd, don't use the C-word.

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You can put lipstick on a pig

But it;s still a pig

Really should have bitten the bullet & ditched the tiny MAXPATH limit instead of apps having to notify OS they want sensible path size

As for centeniall (converting to UWP) - quiet a few hoops to jump through as lots of "lower level" things not supported e.g. cannot write to HKLM registry as all you get is virtualized registry, issues on what directories your app can access etc.

As Phomne 10 dead in water not that much incentive to port existing app to UWP.

As for Contana in your face - Nooooo!

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Joke

"As Phomne 10 dead in water"

Looks like the spelling and grammar checkers need some work as well.

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

a bloated pig with lipstick, to be precise.

applause, applause, applause...

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

Having a nested directory structure that runs to over 256 characters is "sensible"??

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Re: @Just Enough

From a human perspective - no, its not.

But typically *NIX systems had MAX_PATH / PATH_MAX set to 1024 or even more and no doubt there are cases where that has been used to go over 256 leading to porting issues if you want to run *NIX tools on Windows (as MS are trying to encourage now).

And just when you thought that was a simple fixed value - no! It is not because Linux, for example, allows you to mount various different file systems and even files systems mounted from deeper within another, and as each of those file systems (ext4, NTFS, FAT32 and many more) could all have differing limitations on path and file name lengths, the total is not a simple constant.

So if you start a project, try to keep to 256 if you can but don't had-code it.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: @Just Enough

It's entirely possible to exceed the 256 character limit on Windows by dicking around with the MS version of symlinks.

Causes me bucketloads of problems when trying to restore user data that's been backed up to a cloud based service that obviously has no issue with file paths exceeding MS's limits as Windows is then smart enough to pull you up on it.

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

Windows path handling (due to the DOS/VMS/POS/ETC heritage) is so shit it's worth a book.

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

Can anyone speak as to the alleged "gnarly" compatibility problems? Given that security is mentioned, I assume it's as simple as some of the relevant calls taking a pointer to a C string to which to write, and a previous guarantee that `wchar_t path[MAXPATH];` would always be long enough, or something of that ilk?

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

Hey, that's my line..... :-D

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Devil

Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

"Having a nested directory structure that runs to over 256 characters is 'sensible'??"

more like 'flexible' - 256 character file path name limits are "so 90's". I think bash may have a 4k limit, though. But can't 21st century software be written INTELLIGENTLY ENOUGH to simply ALLOW FOR arbitrarily long path names?

(now, when Microsoft puts SPACES in standard file/directory names - forcing me to add QUOTE MARKS to paths on the command line... ew)

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Re: You can put lipstick on a pig

I have may files from different applications that go over the 260 File Path limit.

And so do many other people.

So it was great to hear that this version woudl remove that ridiculous OS limit, not present in the file system it uses.

BUT

I installed it an enabled it and AFAICT File Explorer, Microsoft's File Explorer, STILL cannot handle those files ?!

Am I missing something, or are Microsoft very, very stupid ?

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Re: "As Phomne 10 dead in water"

Not at all. Phomne is the god of phones dropped in toilets. You must have slept through mythology during grammar school.

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FAIL

Cant turn off Cortana without lose of search ? ? ?

Well that's it my windows machine is now no longer going to connect to the net and I will use my ChromeOS or Android kit only.

MS I don't want your annoying AI or any other one adding another layer of possible security issues. I want to turn the thing off and not report to your servers thank you very much.

It bad enough with Google but MS are taking it even further, the NSA must be drooling over the data they can access.

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Re: Cant turn off Cortana without lose of search ? ? ?

You can just sign out of Cortana, not too difficult. Local search is all still there, they just moved the option to a bit of a neater area within Cortana settings.

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LDS
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FAIL

Re: Cant turn off Cortana without lose of search ? ? ?

"I will use my ChromeOS or Android kit only."

LOL, afraid of Cortana but the using the full set of Google slurping OSes and applications... exactly those one MS is desperately trying to copy. Where's the difference? You trust Google more than MS? LOL again!

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Big Brother

Re: Cant turn off Cortana without lose of search ? ? ?

"You trust Google more than MS? LOL again!"

NO, which is why I use 'duckduckgo' for searching, and run things like 'NoScript' in the browser for normal intarweb access.

Yes, there _ARE_ alternatives. This kind of advert+tracking nonsense is *NOT* inevitable, nor unescapable. And for those times when I have to use an unprotected browser (because of the massive 3rd-party-scripting dependencies - godaddy, that's YOU), I do so from a Linux VM, using iceweasel, pre-configured to wipe ALL history and ALL cached data after it closes (thus defeating the purpose of the tracking garbage).

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Anonymous Coward

Bing had better 'techy' results for me, than Google for the first time this week.

Actually finding Bing has improved a fair bit, now I'm not saying its better than Google (yet) but Google seems to have been lobotomised of late, in terms of Search in a number of techy areas, where Bing finds those valid results, whereas Google no longer does.

Often if you search for the name of say a missing driver that HP.com has pulled from their driver support page servers (but you know exists) and you want to find the original SPxxxx.exe file associated with particular machine/driver.

Google returns nothing, but Bing will show you forum results where that file is mentioned, allowing you to work back.

Google appears to be going 'mainstream' / 'high level' in terms of what it returns, no longer giving you the nitty gritty tech results it once had.

I'm no Microsoft Fan, but Google has gone downhill of late in terms of what it returns in its detailed results. It could be Google are under more pressure to remove copyrighted content, and are now becoming very cautious about what it can 'recall', i.e. a new lobotomised Google.

It could be that Microsoft themselves are aggressively using the content removal 'take down' requests against Google to actually stiffle Google results, to give Bing better results, long shot but possible.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Bing had better 'techy' results for me, than Google for the first time this week.

I've noticed recently that google has gotten worse for trying to search for specific terms eg. function names, as it is always trying to autocorrect, and trying to search with the old double quotes or '+' before a search term no longer seems to work

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Re: Bing had better 'techy' results for me, than Google for the first time this week.

"Often if you search for the name of say a missing driver that HP.com has pulled from their driver support page servers..."

I'm sorry if this gets read the wrong way but, do you still need to fish around for third party drivers in Windows?

I'm asking as I haven't used Windows since the days of NT4 and Win 98. I would have thought that that sort of thing was long in the past by now.

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Re: Bing had better 'techy' results for me, than Google for the first time this week.

MS has a lot more in windows update than it used to, and if you don't find them there and you're using a version of the OS compatible with the hardware, you're almost guaranteed to find the drivers on the manufacturer's site.

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JLV
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Happy

Re: Bing had better 'techy' results for me, than Google for the first time this week.

To each his own, but I can think of safer things than trawling random forums for EXEs to run on a Windows PC. Or any OS, actually.

Doesn't excuse Google's nearsightedness in the matter, but still ;-l

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