back to article Surfing the web from Android? We KNEW it – sorry, iOS fanbois

Google's Android has slipped past Apple's iOS to become the top mobile operating system for the first time, in terms of online usage. Figures from Net Marketshare show that devices powered by Android were detected browsing the web more than iPhones, iPads, and iPod Touch devices running iOS throughout July 2014. Net …

Anonymous Coward

Huge party in Android land this morning. Balloons, cakes, bubble machines and chocolate fountains all around.

In Apple land they looked up from the money counting machine just long enough to raise a small smirk before returning to their mountain of cash.

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Mushroom

Why are fanboys so obsessed with the size of Apple's mountain of cash?

Are they trying to compensate for something?

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Anonymous Coward

"Why are fanboys so obsessed with the size of Apple's mountain of cash?

Are they trying to compensate for something?"

Oh hahahahahaha!

(okay people step away from the mental person, don't make eye contact, I did it once but think I got away with it)

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Anonymous Coward

Why are fanboys so obsessed with the size of Apple's mountain of cash?

And the funny thing is... THEY contributed towards it!

"I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

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Anonymous Coward

So many people with Mal-droid phones, when will they learn?

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Anonymous Coward

RE: Fanbois and Apple's Cash Mountain

What always confuses me is *why* any Apple fanboi thinks Apple's mountain of cash is *in any way* a good thing.

Do they not realise that the cash mountain is derived from profits which are derived from overcharging the fanbois themselves?

The pile of cash is directly related to the profit margin on their sales ... the last thing they should feel is joy at being taken for a mug.

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Re: RE: Fanbois and Apple's Cash Mountain

When a company makes a product you like and would want to continue getting support, it is important that company has a healthy stash of cash. The only reason Apple got through the 1990s was it had a goodly sized cash reserve - don't start claiming that MS saved them with their little investment, it was a cash settlement to stop the legal battles between the two and Apple had $1billion in the bank at the time so weren't in any danger of running out of cash but they had little chance of growth if MS pulled Office from the Mac.

In the end, the cash mountain means Apple doesn't have to compromise so much and can give its customers a product that is just better because they can stick deals down the throat of the phone companies for instance which is why the iPhone was so much better than every other smartphone at the time. The same goes for software for the platform - they can afford to develop best in class applications for their platform and give them away rather than relying on other companies to support them. Look at Java - Apple had to port Java, and support it for years because Sun wasn't interested.

If MS had no mountain of money, they wouldn't have been able to do the Xbox, or blow huge chunks of cash on the disaster that is Windows Phone. However, MS hasn't historically owned the hardware so have been reliant on hardware partners to cobble things together and thus we get the race to the bottom with poor build quality and components. When MS builds the hardware themselves they do a pretty good job - Surface is a nice premium piece of kit although misguided as far as reading the market. Then again, they can also get it horribly wrong - my Xbox 360 has RRoD'd three times and that isn't unusual. MS couldn't have even stayed in the market without the huge pile of cash. Apple is just the same. The difference is I choose to buy Apple gear out of my own pocket. Except for the Xbox 360 and I really really wish I had just sucked it up and bought the PS3 at the time but I won't be fooled this time around and the Xbox One can stay right there in the shop, thanks.

The problem with Android is it is the same race to the bottom that plagued PCs. Sure, there are some really good phones and I've been tempted but they're just as expensive as the iPhone unless you're willing to put up with some custom version of Android which doesn't work half as well as the pure thing, plus I happen to like the integration between my iPhone and Mac which again is a benefit of Apple having a pile of cash. Doesn't Google also have a large pile of cash?

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Silver badge

One could equally ask why Android fanboys are so obsessed with market share. Fanboys always focus on the areas where the object of their adoration leads the competition, and dismiss those where it falls short.

Profit or cash on hand matters for investors and stockholders, but for someone who merely owns an iPhone, what difference does it make how profitable Apple is? Likewise, Android may be totally dominant in market share, but the fact it only now has beaten iOS in actual usage, and still trails in developer income, demonstrates that statistic isn't all that its cracked up to be either.

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Silver badge

"I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

Why is Apple making a lot of money a negative for the buyers of Apple products? They clearly believe that it is worth what they paid for it, and whether an iPhone cost $50 or $500 to make is irrelevant.

Would you refuse to buy a product from a company that makes "too much" money because you think they're taking advantage of you? Would you refuse to buy a house whose price has gone up at 5x the rate of inflation over the past couple decades, because the seller would be making too much money off the sale?

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Actually, I knew my comment was going to be interpreted for the obvious, and not so good, joke, but it is serious question.

What has Apple's pile of cash got to do with the the article? Nothing at all, but the AC was so distressed at the idea of Apple losing in some metric that he had to come up with a metric in which they could still come ahead to compensate for the loss.

Why? Well, no rational reason but then, we humans are barely rational at the best of times, you may think you are an exception, but if you do, you are deluding yourself.

Seriously, you are deluding yourself, accept it and you have a chance of not falling for your biases all the time.

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Re: "I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

"Would you refuse to buy a product from a company that makes "too much" money because you think they're taking advantage of you?"

Let's see, a real life case:

Olive oil; Brand X costs 2.5 times the amount of Brand Y, a store brand at the local supermarket.

Same ingredients, subject to identical health regulations, and, Oh look, the fine print on the bottle says both are produced by the same manufacturer!

I buy brand Y, brand X can go hang.

"Would you refuse to buy a house whose price has gone up at 5x the rate of inflation over the past couple decades, because the seller would be making too much money off the sale?"

What the? I don't even... Uh, I'd refuse because the house would cost me way over its true long term market value.

So, yes, I'd refuse because the seller is making too much money off the sale, and I'd be losing a fortune!

Geez, what's it like to have so much credit that 'cost' and 'value' are mere abstract concepts to you?

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Re: "I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

quote::Would you refuse to buy a product from a company that makes "too much" money ... Would you refuse to buy a house whose price has gone up at 5x the rate of inflation over the past couple decades .... ::quote

Yes.

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Anonymous Coward

"the AC was so distressed at the idea of Apple losing in some metric that he had to come up with a metric in which they could still come ahead to compensate for the loss."

Total and utter bullshit. It was simply a joke, but clearly it was a joke that really hit home with some people. Maybe they should try and go out and enjoy life rather than constantly trying to validate their own position by trying to convince themselves that their purchasing decisions are somehow relevant to anyone else.

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g e

AC - Apple Cultist

It's maybe more likely that many people held off buying a tablet until they were higher-powered (as they are now) and that such a demographic of people, being more circumspect and probably thrifty couldn't see the point in spaffing a wedge more cash on an iThing when a droidThing does the same and cheaper, lighter, waterproofier (in the case of stuff like the Z2, at least).

Chances are they already have a droidPhone too (statistically) so logically a tablet would also be a droid so they could have familiar apps. Then they start using the internet on it as a tab is way more handy for webbyness than a phone.

So the stats increase.

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Pint

Yeah but...

86% of all Android mobiles accessing the Internet is done via their coworker's Apple iPhone's Hotspot feature.

As far as I can see, not one Android owner has a mobile data plan with the word "GB" in the name of the plan. It's all ZERO MB here and 100MB there.

(Joke alert. But there's an element of truth in it...)

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Pint

Re: "I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

"Brand X costs 2.5 times the amount of Brand Y"

The 'Apple Tax' is vastly less than the ratio of 2.5x. If you shop around and are not in a rush, it can trend towards zero.

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Silver badge

Re: "I love Apple because they take the most money from me"

There's a big difference between "brand X" and "brand Y" that are identical and even made by the same company, and "brand X" and "brand Y" where there are differences. You may not care about the differences in olive oil between different brands, made in different regions, etc. but others will value those differences and be willing to pay 2.5x more accordingly.

To take another example, what about the differences in wine? You can buy a lot of different reds, ranging from a few bucks a bottle to thousands. Are the differences there bullshit? Maybe you think people who pay more than $15 for a bottle of wine are idiots just like you think people buying Apple are idiots, but 1) it is their money, and 2) you may value differences in things that others will think you are an idiot for valuing.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Yeah but...

I don't understand this joke. Is this some American thing? What does the call/data plan have to do with the phone.... they are separate entities usually...at least to us techies...right?

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Re: RE: Fanbois and Apple's Cash Mountain

"What always confuses me is *why* any Apple fanboi thinks Apple's mountain of cash is *in any way* a good thing."

Back in the 90s, before His Jobsness returned to Apple, everyone who didn't like the company was saying "they're losing money, clearly that's a bad thing. Apple is doomed."

Now it's "they're making money, clearly that's a bad thing."

I use a lot of different machines--there are three Apple devices, two generic PC boxes running Linux, and a NAS on my desk as I type this. I make money from my machines, and I find that I use an Apple laptop a lot more than I use any of the other computers. That suggests to me the money I invested in this tool was worth it. :)

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JLV
Silver badge

>Would you refuse to buy a house... Yes!

Glad to see we all agree. Preposterous to think people would be that silly.

I mean, it's not like hugely accelerated house price inflation has ever happened, at a national level, ever, izzit?

What those Case-Shiller guys smoking? And we all know Euro house prices have been moderate in the last decade, don't we? Canadian house prices? A study in mature, astute, moderation.

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Re: Yeah but...

"As far as I can see, not one Android owner has a mobile data plan with the word "GB" in the name of the plan. It's all ZERO MB here and 100MB there."

Mine's 500MB. I could pay a little more and get 3GB, but given that I finish the month with over 100MB remaining (unless I'm in a belligerent look-at-kittens-on-YouTube-to-use-up-my-allocation mood), there doesn't really seem much point in going for more. http://open.orange.fr/forfaits/forfaits-internet-plus-mobile.aspx

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h3

RE: fandom

I just envisage loads of hipsters getting burnt alive on top of Apples mountains of cash. (Like that part of the Dark Knight but a bigger pile of cash obviously so more hipsters can fit).

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Anonymous Coward

proppleganda

> when will they learn?

The more important question is:

When will you learn that malware is a complete non-issue for everyday, mainstream android users?

Malware is a non-issue. Its a bogey-man created by the security software vendors and the apple-cultists community.

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Re: Yeah but...

> I don't understand this joke. Is this some American thing? What does the call/data plan have to do with the phone.... they are separate entities usually...at least to us techies...right?

I'm a US citizen, and I don't see any relevance to the comment. It smells like an fruit fan trying too hard to find some way to criticize android users, and failing.

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Even Forbes can give a link to the report

Can someone at Vulture Central show Jasper which button to press?

So, this report. Does it show that 'devices powered by Android were used more than iPhones, iPads, and iPod Touch devices running iOS throughout July 2014'?

Of course not. It reports on 'data from the browsers of site visitors to our [Net Applications] exclusive on-demand network of live stats customers.' In other words, on some websites, Android devices show up more than iOS.

Did anyone at El Reg even read the press release?

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Facepalm

Re: Even Forbes can give a link to the report

" It reports on 'data from the browsers of site visitors to our [Net Applications] exclusive on-demand network of live stats customers.' In other words, on some websites, Android devices show up more than iOS."

... but you can bet your life that the usual suspects will be using this as an excuse to make their usual noises.

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Happy

Re: but you can bet your life that the usual suspects....

... will be using this as an excuse to make their usual noises.

That's you that is.

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Big Brother

Mobile Share Methodology

@Frankee Llonnygog: "So, this report .. reports on .. some websites"

"We use a unique methodology for collecting this data"

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Re: Even Forbes can give a link to the report

"So, this report. Does it show that 'devices powered by Android were used more than iPhones, iPads, and iPod Touch devices running iOS throughout July 2014'?"

Well.. Considering it uses the exact same data as fanboys have been using to prove Apple superiority due to superior web surfing numbers.. It must do.

Otherwise they would just look silly.

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Re: Even Forbes can give a link to the report

Fans of any techie stripe look silly - except bottleheads of course

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FAIL

More likely

The method of measuring is badly flawed. We already know they only count the stock Android browser, and don't count Chrome, Opera, Boat, Dolphin, Firefox etc...

That alone could easily double the number of Android users browsing, especially as Chrome is now the default browser for over 2 years.

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Re: More likely

Umm, we don't know that because that isn't true. Chrome, Opera, etc, were counted towards the Android total. It's 44.83% Safari, 21.86% Android Browser; adding in the other options is how Android gets to number one.

In future maybe don't just make things up?

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Megaphone

The most interesting detail there...

Is at the bottom.

I'd have guessed that Android and Apple were way out in front and roughly neck and neck. But I'd have guessed the others completely wrong. So Symbian is still way ahead of Windows Phone 8 for actual usage; that's surprising. And it looks like featurephones are the third phone ecosystem at the moment, comfortably beating Windows Phone, Blackberry and Symbian.

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Anonymous Coward

Symbian still beating WinPho?

Hahahahahahaha!

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Happy

Re: Symbian still beating WinPho?

And always will be.

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Title seems misleading

The title implies that individual Android users are more active than individual iOS users - but that, of course, is far from being the case. The study simply found that Android users, as a whole, finally overtook iOS users in generating network traffic. Given that there are about 7 Android devices for every iOS device, that makes the average iOS user still about 7 times as "active" as the average Android user.

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Re: Title seems misleading

True, but it does mean that your web page is more likely to be viewed by an Android user than an iOS user. Plan appropriately.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Title seems misleading

By "active", do we actually mean "making discretionary visits to Internet sites not related to one's work?". Is there any way to quantify that, I wonder?

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Re: Title seems misleading

Today's headline in Forbes: "iOS Users Seven Times More Active Than Android Users, Suggests Net Applications." In a way, both headlines are right.

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FAIL

A 1% drop is a slump now?

Forgetting the fact that up to 3% can be regarded as statistical errors.

So including those errors the situation is about equal. Neither one is trouncing the other.

Time for you to have some lessons in Statistics then Jasper?

Failure all round.

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Big Brother

Microsoft mobile market share

Microsoft could have owned the mobile market a long time ago, if they'd only promoted TRON, instead of joining the Forum and endeavoring to have TRON suppressed in the north American market. Presumably because they didn't out-right own TRON and TRON would have cut into Microsofts Windows revenue. Not much vision in evidence there.

''We don't want the Japanese to create a specification that would preclude competition'', former Deputy U. S. Trade Representative Michael B. Smith

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Re: Microsoft mobile market share

The tragedy of Microsoft, from its point of view anyway, is that there are about a hundred different things it could have done to own the mobile market and it succeeded at none of them.

What's certain is that it was a losing strategy to recreate the Windows desktop at 256x160 and expect people to poke at scrollbars barely a couple of millimetres wide with a stylus, then respond to the launch of the iPhone with laughter and disdain for it as a business product — i.e. if you think a large touch screen phone would be good for any part of your business then you're not the sort of company Microsoft is willing to treat seriously. Never mind waiting until long after Android has hit its stride finally to release a usable touch interface, then hobbling any potential uptake by applying a bunch of strict criteria about required buttons that means that if you're Samsung or whomever you can't just decide whether to put Windows or Android on at the final stage of manufacture.

The market is now Google's to lose.

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Re: Microsoft mobile market share

Windows Mobile on small screens was far from ideal but many of my handsets were usable without a stylus. I day that Apple proclaimed to have released a massive screened phone, I had a 5" HTC. I only ever used the stylus to calibrate the screen or for resets. TBH I actually miss the pixel perfect accuracy of resistive screens. Trying to sketch on phones these days is like playing a piano with boxing gloves.

II don't recall any WM phones with 256x160 respolutions, my first one (HTC BlueAngel- 2004) had 320 x 240, the first iphone was only 320×480, the phone I had at the time was 640 x 480

Regarding MS mocking the iphone- IIRC Balmer suggested that it was to expensive- shortly after, Apple dropped the price 2 or three times. That said, they clearly under estimated the forthcoming public desire for touch screen smartphones.

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Anonymous Coward

Active users or ....

all that malware and dodgy apps doing the activities for the droids?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Active users or ....

As said elsewhere, that's the price you pay for being mainstream.

Having said that, you do have to jump through quite a few hoops to catch the vast majority of Android malware - it doesn't just "catch" it. I guess you haven't used the most popular smartphone OS.

[I'm not an Android user, BTW]

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rvt

So I guess that Google finally fixed the browser on Android so people actually use it?

Disclaimer: I have a xperia V and chrome browser is dog slow, my dolfin browser work's okay.

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My personal pet theory is that bargain Android phones like the Moto G are now actually usable, as are cheap Android tablets - which wasn't necessarily the case a couple of years ago.

So, imagine with me, if you will...Bob.

Bob, two years ago, works in an office. His works computer is his primary web browsing machine (because he's a shifty skiver, natch). His home computer was his secondary device. His budget Android handset, used to replace a Nokia 6320 or similar, was his third device, really a last resort if the home computer was too far away, wasn't turned on, etc. because the home computer was much better for surfing the web than his (lets say) HTC Wildfire S.

Now, today. Bob still works in an office - we'll assume he's still a tricksy character who likes to check the web between assignments. His works computer is his primary web access machine, by nature of it just being there, as before. But now, he has a Moto G or similar current budget handset (or a Tesco Hudl or similar) that's actually worth a light, as most basic android devices have become thanks to efficiencies of scale at the high end filtering down - a Moto G is as quick as the Nexus 4, the previous years flagship Google handset, which is still not a slow phone, and has a similarly good screen and digitiser (unlike the HTC Wildfire S - can you tell I've owned one?).

When he gets home, he uses that phone/cheap tablet to quickly google stuff, get quick updates on gossip sites etc, rather than fire up the home machine - which he only uses for actual research (aka getting stuck in TV Tropes for four hours at a time, trolling wikipedia, whatever it is the kids do these days that requires lots and lots of tabs).

So the budget android handset has gone from being a tertiary device that was a bit of a PITA, frankly, to being a secondary device, getting much more use because they have suddently got so much better.

Correlation != causation but you've got to admit, the last couple of years, the quality and performance of <£200 android devices has seriously improved. My father, for example, barely boots his PC up unless he has to type an invoice, etc...everything else he does through a £180 tablet bought last year. It's just bob on for it, and loads pages faster than his Win 7 machine, is always 'on' within a second of picking it up, etc.

Steven R

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Silver badge

I feel your pain - I have an HTC Wildfire until recently, now have a Moto G.

Its quite a usable phone really...

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I'm told (by someone who has used both) that it's Nexus 4 quick. I've got a Nexus 4. It's a perfectly good device!

Also, I wonder how many upvotes I got for invoking the Blackadder variant of 'Bob', versus any useful content I may have posted?

Steven R

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