back to article Scottish gov moans over broadband cash handout

The Scottish government isn't happy about the trifling amount of cash UK.gov's culture secretary splashed on the rollout of broadband in that country yesterday. Jeremy Hunt allocated £68.8m to Scotland from the £530m pot set aside as part of his ambitious plans to gift the UK with the fastest broadband network in Europe by …

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  1. PsychicMonkey
    Mushroom

    well

    people in England deserve to get the same level of treatment from the NHS but we have to pay for our prescriptions, whic those north of the border don't have to. Even when they did it was less than half what we have to pay so what goes around eh?

    Flames, cause I expect to get some for posting this....

  2. Jedibeeftrix

    "Scottish gov moans over broadband cash handout"

    It is innate to the character of scotlands political class to need to whinge about unfairness from the 'south'.

    1. David Neil

      Not a flame..

      But if you want the same deal, vote for a party that will deliver it.

      Personally I think it's the usual socialist buy-votes-with-someone-elses-money con that worked so well for 13 years, if wee Eck ever gets his independence vote i'll piss myself laughing as he has to fess up to the stuff we won't be able to pay for any more.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Err...

        The UK and Scotland did have the same government (more or less) for quite a while when this was happening. The New Labour/Lib Dem coalition in Scotland were rather more focused on delivering services in Scotland than New Labour were in the UK.

        Nothing to do with New Labour having a large amount of very senior people having their seats in Scotland, oh no.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Devil

        Exactly

        Reminds me of the old classic joke about Andropov's telegram congratulating Cheushesku on the Romanian sportsmen successes in the LA olympics.

        Dear Comrade Cheushesku comma We congratulate you on the successes of your sportsmen in the Olympics stop Gas stop Electricity stop Food stop ...

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      re:whinging

      Surely the role of a national government is to represent the people, so by ‘whinging’ they are only trying to get a better deal for the people they represent. As the old saying goes, “If you don’t ask, you don’t get”.

      Gone are the days that the ruling party in Scotland was the same as in the UK parliament, which meant that they did as they were told and didn’t complain.

    3. Chimpofdoom!
      FAIL

      Well...

      England is now the only member of the UK that pays for prescriptions...

      So wouldn't be moaning about the Scots.. if your not happy.. go complain.. oh wait you just did..

  3. Mike Judge
    FAIL

    Devolutions a bitch

    that is all.

    Now fuck off and stop moaning. You wanted devolution, sort out your own fucking broadband...

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Mushroom

    Whinging cnuts!

    "We're Scotland... we want independence... we don't need the union... we'd be much better off on our own..."

    So fund your own fast broadband if you want it! Or do you expect UK.gov to pay stupid amounts so a few thousand arran sweatered farmers and fishermen can watch YouTube and buy from eBay and Amazon (oh no sorry they charge extra to deliver that far out)..??

    1. Mike Brown

      we would....

      ....but you damn UK'ers keep stealing all our natural resources

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Flame

        You mean the natural resources

        the *UK* government helped pay to extract ?

        1. Mike Brown

          yes

          yes your right. but im fairly sure that the oil has more than paid for the extraction by now.

          plus, what makes you think we couldnt have got it our ourselfs?

          1. Jedit
            Headmaster

            Because they didn't?

            BP had five years of exclusive rights to prospect those waters for oil and gas, and they didn't bother trying. Amoco and Shell then went looking and hit paydirt, and within another five years Aberdeen was richer than Glasgow. Even now, though, the major work is done abroad because it's easier, with Aberdeen serving only as the administrative centre.

    2. Gregor
      Thumb Down

      RE: devolution

      "You wanted devolution, sort out your own fucking broadband..."

      Erm, thanks for that wonderful insight, but broadcasting and communications of this nature is Reserved to Westminster.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Once again Scotland gets too much

    This works out at £13 per person for Scotland and less than £7 per person for everyone else.

    Scotland's share should be decreased

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Mushroom

    You wanted devolution...

    Pay for it yourselves, stop relying upon the English you so stridently abhor yet still use to bankroll your free prescriptions

    Now for the down-votes

  7. DavCrav Silver badge

    Scotland gets more cash than rest of UK

    Population of Scotland: 5.2m. (2010 estimate)

    Population of UK: 62.3m (2010 estimate)

    Percentage of UK citizens living in Scotland: 8.3%

    Cash divvied up so far: £430m

    Cash going to Scotland: £68.8m

    Percentage of UK cash disappearing in Scotland: 16%

    So, I have this to say to Jeremy Hunt (nearly spelled his name wrong there): fuck off, you already have twice as much cash as you should, get your thieving hands off the money meant for the rest of the UK. Independence for Scotland! I would really love it.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Oh the irony ...

    Some things never change ... didn't the great Dr. Johnson make a remark about the Scots wanting indepence from everything English except her money ?

    1. Oli Wright

      Wasn't that ire meant to be directed at Alex Neil?

      And please remember to use the full form of Jeremy Hunt, Culture Secretary to add to the chances of a slip.

      1. Code Monkey

        Hulture Secretary

        What's a Hulture Secretary?

      2. DavCrav Silver badge

        Apologies to Hunt this time

        "Wasn't that ire meant to be directed at Alex Neil?"

        Indeed, it was meant to be. Whoops. I have a whole sackful of other ire for Hunt though, so it all evens itself out in the end.

        1. Oli Wright
          Stop

          I feel dirty now

          I didn't mean to prompt an actual apology to Jeremy Hunt, Culture Secretary.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Down

      You forgot a variable

      Percentage of UK cash generated from North Sea Oil in Scottish waters....?

      Stupid argument.

      1. DavCrav Silver badge

        Two can play at that game

        "Percentage of UK cash generated from North Sea Oil in Scottish waters....?

        Stupid argument."

        Percentage of UK cash needed for Scottish banks (HBOS, RBS)?

        I was under the impression Scotland already got extra money from the block grant for this.

        1. Red Bren

          Scottish Banks?

          What does the 'H' in HBOS stands for?

          What is their relationship with Lloyds TSB?

          When did they receive a bail-out from the public purse?

          http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7885589.stm

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            re: Oil

            The oil and gas thing always comes up and it's always reported as if the Scottish own all of it. In reality a fair bit of the oil fields are south of the boarder, thus making it English, it's just all landed in Scotland.

            As it happens I think the union is a good thing, and the tedious arguments for splitting it up grate on me. I do think that tuition fees and prescription charges etc. should be the same across the uk though.

          2. DavCrav Silver badge

            Convenient history

            "What does the 'H' in HBOS stands for?

            What is their relationship with Lloyds TSB?

            When did they receive a bail-out from the public purse?"

            What does the H stand for? Halifax. So? It was headquartered in Edinburgh. That's in Scotland, if I remember correctly.

            What is their relationship with Lloyds? If I remember correctly -- and I do -- Lloyds was leant on by the government (i.e., Gordon Brown, who IIRC comes from Scotland) to take over the collapsing, toxic mess that was HBOS. Lloyds was one of the safest banks in the UK, which is probably why they were chosen to be pressured by Brown.

            When did they receive a bailout? Shortly after Lloyds took over HBOS.

            I fail to see how any of your questions make a difference to my point.

            1. jm83

              Re: Scottish Banks

              They're international companies you div.

    3. jm83

      Re: Scotland gets more...

      This might be because Scotland is on the whole poorer than average. Taxes help to redistribute wealth from the rich to the poor.

      If you disagree with this then thats a different matter.... and youre a git.

      1. DavCrav Silver badge

        So it is poorer then?

        "This might be because Scotland is on the whole poorer than average. Taxes help to redistribute wealth from the rich to the poor.

        If you disagree with this then thats a different matter.... and youre a git."

        OK, so either 1) Scotland is poorer than the rest of the UK, and Salmond can shut up about independence being good for Scotland, or 2) Scotland isn't poorer than the rest of the UK, and therefore doesn't need the extra cash.

        I have no problem with using money from richer parts to prop up poorer parts, but I do have a problem with Scottish politicians getting annoyed at only having twice the UK average.

        1. jm83

          Re: DavCrav

          I believe the independence argument is based more on self determination than economics? (though im not scottish so dont know (or care) about this). I also dont know what Alex Neil thinks about independence.

          As it is though, theyre not independent and so its down to the MPs to fight for more cash for their regions.

          Though I would have thought Welsh MPs would be kicking up more of a fuss, didnt someone figure out that they were getting squat?

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Coat

            But they don't need broadband

            They have all the pr0n they need just roaming around in fields ...

            1. jonathanb Silver badge
              Joke

              Yes they do

              Surely they need to be able to upload it to Youtube for everyone else's benefit?

    4. Jedit
      Mushroom

      %%%%%%

      The cash is being allocated to create a network where everyone in the country can have at least 2Mbps - which means significant investment in RURAL broadband. In case you hadn't noticed, Scotland has a hell of a lot more rural areas than anywhere south of the border.

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Devil

      Missing statistic

      Percentage of Scottish cittizens dwelling in the corridors of Whitehall...

    6. TB100

      Quoting the wrong figures

      Area of UK: 243,610 km2

      Area of Scotland: 78,772 km2 - almost one-third of the UK*, and that's not allowing for all the water in between the land.

      So should that 16% should be doubled? Well, part of the cost - exchange equipment, for example - is related to population, but low density means a lot of cable and cabinets.

      *The BBC, with its skewed TV weather map, tries to disguise this fact.

  9. Colin Millar
    Megaphone

    People living in remote areas

    People living in remote areas cannot realistically have the same expectation of access to mass comms or other utilities as city dwellers.

    By this logic we should be paying for on-grid gas and sewerage connections to every remote cottage in the UK.

    Thats not to say that we shouldn't look for solutions to access problems in remote areas - just that it's idiotic to expect parity of provision and that people might have to accept that the provision they get might not be as good as if they lived in a city.

    I expect that most rural people understand this perfectly well and that this is just the usual bleating from a self promoting politico.

    1. GavinC

      re: people living in remote areas

      Nobody is asking for, or even expecting parity with city dwellers. What is being done is ensuring that those in the country have access to a semi-decent broadband connection. More and more services are moving online, and having a decent connection is becoming essential. If it was left up to market economics, those in the sticks would be stuck using dialup, which is simply not going to be economic in future years. Instead, government funding is being used to upgrade the networks and ensure a decent level of service is available, this will still be a lot slower than what is available in cities.

      How do you think they got phone lines, sewerage and on-grid gas in the sticks in the first place? It wasn't due to it being economically viable, that's for sure!

    2. Oliver 7

      I don't need no steenking title

      Have they never heard of satellite broadband, this could be made part of the mix? Indeed I believe the EU has already funded an extensive roll-out of satellite broadband to many far flung European hinterlands, including the Shetland Islands.

      Why the obsession with cables?

    3. jm83

      Re: People in remote ares

      People in the city shouldnt expect an inexhaustible supply of fresh water as clearly theres no space to store it all. That and fresh fruit n veg, why the hell should they get all that when clearly its the folks in the countryside who grow it (well a small percentage of it)

      Oh and electricity... why the hell should city folk use so much when dont host the power stations.

      1. DavCrav Silver badge

        @jm83

        "People in the city shouldnt expect an inexhaustible supply of fresh water as clearly theres no space to store it all. That and fresh fruit n veg, why the hell should they get all that when clearly its the folks in the countryside who grow it (well a small percentage of it)

        Oh and electricity... why the hell should city folk use so much when dont host the power stations."

        Answer: they PAY FOR IT THEMSELVES, rather than expect the government to cough up a subsidy for them to get their water/fruit/electricity.

        1. jm83

          Re: paying for

          Its subsidised & regulated. If (for instance) water was treated as a free market, you can bet those counties with huge resources would charge a lot more than 0.001p per litre for it.

          as it is, we are a country not a selection of little regions and that means sharing stuff about for best effect.

  10. Argolis
    Alert

    Missing the point...

    is it wrong that I dont care about Scottish broadband but am thrilled that WWZ is finally filming?

  11. xyz
    Mushroom

    Listen you lot...

    If it hadn't been for our oil for the past 40 years, you lot (The English) would be living in mud huts and selling your bodies for a rat dinner. So can it and realise who's "the man," that's been funding your lifestyles since you were born.

    1. dogged

      oh, fuck off.

      "our oil" - without England you'd never be able to afford to get it out of the sea.

      1. David Neil

        Really?

        US oil companies did a lot of the hard work

    2. DavCrav Silver badge

      Thanks for it

      "If it hadn't been for our oil for the past 40 years, you lot (The English) would be living in mud huts and selling your bodies for a rat dinner. So can it and realise who's "the man," that's been funding your lifestyles since you were born."

      *cough* £850bn bank bailout for Scottish banks *cough* Gordon Brown's wonderful abilities as Chancellor *cough*. Thanks for half of the oil in the North Sea (the other half is in English waters), but does completely wrecking the UK economy for everyone else make us even?

      1. Mike Brown

        Scotland!

        Since when was the 850bn just for scottish banks? Did Lloyds, Santander and Northern Rock not also get bailed out?

        We may have invinted banks, but it was the shower of shit in london that arsed it up.

        Gordon Brown was voted in, along with the rest of Labour, by a massive landslide over the whole country. No blame there for us. In fact if the SNP's dominance in the Scottish elections are anything to go by, Labour will never have power ever again. No need to say thanks

        1. dogged
          WTF?

          "We may have invinted banks"

          You are Steve Jobs and I claim my £5.

        2. DavCrav Silver badge

          @Mike Brown

          "Since when was the 850bn just for scottish banks? Did Lloyds, Santander and Northern Rock not also get bailed out?"

          Dealt with higher up in the comments: it was RBS (headquarters: Edinburgh) and HBOS (headquarters: Edinburgh) that needed lots of money. OK, I'll knock a few billion off for Northern Rock (headquarters: Newcastle), which still isn't a London bank. As far as I'm aware, Santander didn't need bailing out. Neither did Lloyds TSB, although that HBOS millstone hung around its neck by Brown was what dragged it under.

          "We may have invinted banks, but it was the shower of shit in london that arsed it up."

          See above for how the three bust banks weren't from London. Also, I hate to quote Wikipedia, but: "Banking in the modern sense of the word can be traced to medieval and early Renaissance Italy, to the rich cities in the north like Florence, Venice and Genoa." So shut up about that. Since there are very many inventions and discoveries coming from Scotland, you don't have to lie about things.

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