Top Tory resigns on principle over 42 days bill

Wow!

And I was considering many attempts at trumped up charges, to make a careeer out of it.

...dash!

A politician with principles?

I never suspected David Davis was in any way a man of principle. He's gone up a great deal in my opinion because of this.

That said...it's equally possible he's well aware he stands a very strong chance of being re-elected. I wonder if there's any real risk to his seat.

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So he has resigned from his party because they support his views on a particular topic. Must be a first.

Anyway I'd lay odds on that he'll win his safe seat back again. After invvoling all his constituents in the hassle of an unnecessary by-election. Still he got his face in the papers.

Bill has the support of 60% the public acording to latest polls........

I bet if those 60% were asked the question "Would you mind being locked up for up to 42 days whilst the police desperately search around every part of you life, your family and friends for a reason why they arrested you in the first place”, the percentages might lessen somewhat.

I'm reminded of Lincoln's quote about how, when he heard someone extoll the virtues of slavery, he felt the urge to see it practiced on them.

(I don't know where these 60% live 'cos I have not met one yet)

Shows how crap the BBC are at reporting.

At last someone fighting against this NuLab Nazi Government continually removing our rights all in the name of "anti terrorism". So how does "Aunty" report it - internal fighting within the Tories? WTF? This is not just over 42 days detention without trial, but ID cards, CCTV Surveillance society.

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Hmm okay may it is a loss of civil liberties BUT how would you feel if the law hadn't passed and some "brainwashed" fundamentalist came along and blew up your office / town centre and killed innocent people and it emerged that hmm we could have gotten him if we had more time, we kept working and proved it but too late to prevent this...

That is how I see it, as for the Ulster MP's voting the way the voted - you forget they've all lived through not knowing if they will wake up the next day or when someone's going to try and blow them up or shot them because of who they are..

He shouldn't have resigned really he had a point to try and make, no-one listened so the toys got thrown out the pram and he resigned.

I mean let me think surely MP's are meant to vote for / against something based on what they believe in, how their constituents want them to as after all IF you voted them in, they have a duty to listen or is that just all lies and they just do as they please..

The labour rebels are just idiots, some may say GB is an idiot too at least he's trying to do something to protect YOU the public at large..

Hmm having seen MP's on TV, I've seen school kids better behaved.

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"Robinson numpty"

Ex-ITV, innit. 'Nuff said.

As for Davis. Kudos for him for giving the electorate a chance to give Labour a good kicking in the polls. Woulda been nice to see him defect to LD or Indie, but that's probably a bit much to ask seeing as his party opposed the 42 days. Still no chance of me voting red OR blue though.

Meanwhile, I'm not the world's biggest Diane Abbott fan (to say the least) but her speech yesterday deserves to be read/heard by as many folk as possible. See http://tinyurl.com/5qrrfg - I've del.icio.us-ed the article and stuck the link in my facebook status. This Week should be an interesting watch tonight (assuming she's on it).

@Be interesting to see...

"Some of the rabid hang 'em and flog 'em lot might thing 42 days is not enough..."

Do they feel strong enough to vote against the Tory on this issue? I reckon the people who think this is appalling would vote against Labour on this issue, but that the people who agree don't feel strongly enough to go against every other reasons to vote these fookers out.

So, you're a man, you view internet p0rn0, Jacqui's just made you a potential arrestable target for viewing the wrong type, but you agree with 42 days vs 28. Which issue counts more to you? The fact you can be locked up, and put on a sex offenders register, or the fact people can be detained for an extra two weeks before being charge (or not). I reckon the one that criminalized you is more important to you.

Your kid is a teenager, and you suspect he smokes pot, although he denies it. Jacqui's made possession a criminal offence. But you agree with the 42 days vs 28 days. Does that make you happier that your kid is at risk of a criminal record over 'lethal' pot, knowing it's not lethal? Does that outweigh the 42 day issue?

Do you want to see your teenage boy on a sex offenders register with a criminal record for viewing internet porn? Do you think that's fair? You agree with the 28 vs 42 day limit, but does it outweigh the other issue?

Have you ever been stopped and searched under the anti-terror stop and search laws? Do you think anyone who has been stopped, would ever vote to let the police detain people without charge? Would they ever vote Labour again?

The cumulative effect of this crap is to make Labour unelectable. As long as Cameron represents a change, then he'll win. I reckon Davis is pretty safe on this.

I bet Jacqui Smith would never have the courage to do the same. She and Brown must know they're unelectable. They should have had a proper leadership campaign instead of letting Blair choose his successor.

@AC

Erm.. he resigned from Parliament not his party...

Well, that's a first...

Watched him give his resignation speech outside the Commons today and caught myself nodding at every word. My ghast is flabbered. A Tory with principles, who'd have thunk it?

Good start

Hopefully might persuade a few more will do the same.

Switching off the Twat-O-Tron for a moment it really isn't terrorists I fear any more - it's my own government. Clowns in charge of live ammunition. Creating a State that the Ministerium für Staatssicherheit would be embarrassed to be part of.

Leadership move?

So while I disagree with the whole 42 day detention thing, I applaud David on his principled move.

That said, when he gets re-elected, he's going to have more Kudos with th public and fellow Cons than Cameron, is that the real objective here?

@EmoSys

if you are that desperate!!!

http://web.archive.org/web/20070814175052/http://www.conservatives.com/tile.do?def=people.person.page&personID=4881

@ Ranty AC

"...how would you feel if the law hadn't passed and some "brainwashed" fundamentalist came along and blew up your office / town centre and killed innocent people and it emerged that hmm we could have gotten him if we had more time, we kept working and proved it but too late to prevent this..."

You obviously don't understand the process. If they knew about such a clear and present threat, they could arrest the intended perpetrator and (before yesterday) they'd have 28 days to find something, *anything* to charge 'em with and justify holding them. In other words, if they hadn't got enough evidence to even charge after 28 days they subject would be released automatically.

In my opinion, 28 days, even, is too much time. If the police had suspicions, a fortnight should be plenty to find something confirming *some* of them. There have so far been *no* cases inn which more than 28 days have been needed to find enough evidence to lay charges against the suspect, after which they can be remanded in custody. Why extend it by another fortnight? The criteria for charging someone are no where near as stringent as the criteria for finding them guilty, and the Police can work on getting the additional evidence once they've been charged.

Your example doesn't even have the terrorist in custody. How the fuck would extending the time the police could've held 'em have stopped the murderer going off when they did? Get your head out of your arse.

@AC

>Hmm okay may it is a loss of civil liberties BUT how would you feel if the law hadn't passed and some "brainwashed" fundamentalist came along and blew up your office / town centre and killed innocent people and it emerged that hmm we could have gotten him if we had more time, we kept working and proved it but too late to prevent this...

On balance, I would be absolutely fine - I feel that any victim of a terrorist is a sad, terrible, dreadful loss, but they're also martyrs in the name of freedom.

I've been on the receiving end - I have had my office/town-centre blown up and had innocent people killed, including a friend. A longer detention period would have done absolutely nothing to stop the Bishopsgate bomb, or July 7th on the tube, both of which I was very close to.

I would challenge you to mention a single terrorist case in the UK where if the police/intelligence services had been able to detain someone for longer, they would not have been able to commit the crime.

The best defense against terrorism is not to alter what you stand for, and I stand for liberty.

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party / parliament / slip of the keyboard / makes no real odds.

Resigned when his party was in agreement with him. One could understand someone resigning from government when disagreeing with proposed laws, but that is a different matter.

Interesting "Catch 22" situation noted by M though. But there again, surely the public aren't so daft as to be fooled by that? There again, they might be (unless the polls that claim support for this law resulted from just asking cabinet members).

WOW! A politician with principle!?

Aren't they a dead species? The last politician with principle I can remember was also a Tory, Michael Heseltine who resigned a cabinet post in protest over the then Tory government's dealings with the whole Westland affair.

Anyway, good on the guy, It's a pity that no one else had the courage to do this, perhaps then the legislation he's protesting wouldn't have been passed?

You know, it's a real pity that our politicians no longer view their jobs as roles of statesmanship. Time was when more of the people going into politics did so for reasons of duty, or a feeling of wanting to make things better. Now it seems as though most simply want power. Curiously, I think that is what makes the House of Lords in the UK such a great balance to Parliament. Most of the folks there already have all the power they need, or were born to it. So their personal agenda is somewhat more based in duty and care that those who are making a career in the halls of power...

Ulster Unionists

Why does everyone pick on the DUP when there were 306 other scumbags inthe same lobby as them, the vast majority of them Labour MPs? Why does the 9 at one end of the line get all the flak and the 306 in front get by on "oh, well, we knew THEY'D sell the country down the river"?

Come on Tony McNulty

Home Office minister Tony McNulty should stand down from his seat; immediately announce he's the Labour candidate and will also be fighting the campaign on the 42-day issue. Then we can see how the arguments really stack up.

The prospect of seeing McNulty (a man with the face and personality of a cat's slapped arse) being bulldozed by David Davis would be a pleasure.

Labour is screwed on this one.

Today was going to be the first day of the PM's fightback, but now it's dominated by DD and the botched vote over 42-days.

And it doesn't get much better for them. If Labour choose to fight the election; they will lose (they came third at the last general election) AND they face the prospect of having 42 days in the news *every* day (Guido is reporting that the Labour candidate for the seat opposes 42-day detention, so that'd be fun).

If they don't fight then the Tories will make hay about Gordon Brown being afraid to face the voters.

Jeez, I'm living in a World where I'm wishing all the best to a Eurosceptic Tory.

Help!

Just tell me Paris is still beautiful.