1087 posts • joined Thursday 31st January 2013 20:55 GMT
In case of the Note the size follows function. It is designed along the lines of the old PDAs as a digital notepad/dayplanner first and a smart phone second (Phone part of the hardware is so so) and 5'' is basically the minimum useful size for taking a quick note with a pen. Since at least the original target audience (business) would typically carry the N70x0 in a attache case etc. the size was not a problem there.
Little chance. If you want the Wacom stylus you are stuck with Samsungs mutation of Fragmentdroid.
Re: It's inevitable...
The inductive Wacom stylus of the Note series is vastly superior ti the sausage in a condom capacitive "stylus" offered for some touch only phones. It is as precise as a mouse on a desktop (actually even more precise) so:
Palm detection/rejection - if the stylus is near this is the input taken not the palm/thumb somewhere else
Using Websites not designed for touch
Taking fast handwritten notes while standing
Quick mark and copy of texts
Text annotation in PDF (the Note screen is big enough for that)
all work nicely. And it keeps the phone fingerprint free. For those who see a smartphone as an organiser that can make phonecalls the stylus is THE criteria. And given the Notes sales there are quite a few that see it this way (Otherwise VEB Plaste and Elaste has cheaper touch only phones with similar capacities)
Not to mention all the other nice things a large city can offer:
More than one craftsman of the same type => option to compare and haggle about prices
Choice in restaurants. Not being restricted to "german or german or a chinaman that basically serving german food with chinese nametags" is nice. Being able to get there by foot instead of a 15 or 60min trip is a bonus
More than one store for clothes, shoes etc.
A train station that sees more than four trains a day
Inner city transit that actually exists
The chance to see a good piece of theater / a nice concert insteat of the "Kleinkunstbühne Tuntenhausen" that fails at doing "A Chorus line" or "Kiss me Kate". Doing so without travelling 100+ km is simply nice
A public library that is bigger than my flat and has more books than my reading room
Bookshops that offer more than "required school books" and "The complete Mario Simmel"
Actually Max(imillian) but otherwise it would be Modern since I am not the largest german wholesale company nor the paris subway
Re: complete with the Start button
And surely moving the end users to FossTard OS would not requre retraining. No, the spirit of St. Stallman will simply come to the end users and allow them to use multiple shells. Conversion will be done 49 days after easter sunday...
Re: Why not release XP as open source?
Oh my deity what a nonsense!
Maybe it is time for those NATIONALL IMPORTANT COMPANIES to buy new hardware. Any "XP only" rated box in those environments ist 6+ years old, more likely older. Any VISTA rated box will run Win7 or Win8. And that road has been open for quite some time. Buying W7 volume licences in 2012 would have been an option for those "national security relevant" companies as well. W8 did not come as a surprise and a volume licence for W7 is valid till 2020 (EOS for W7)
Re: Lay on, Macduff, and damned be him who first cries ‘Hold! enough
The Bard of Avon is a prime example of "in there for the money" and "make me loose money and my backer will make you loose your head". Add in the problems of copying his work before he had made the money and again: Not a good example of "no copyrights".
Re: Look what happened in China
Nope, it just shows that being a criminal and stealing other peoples ideas and designs allows you to make short term gains. Those stop when there is nothing left to steal because those that innovate are no longer there.
China is a leech on those who innovate, a parasite. They can only advance as far as their hosts. They are actually the BEST example to ENFORCE patent laws!
Re: complete with the Start button
Oh, I can find my programs faster in Modern UI. But Olav Officedrohne and Larry Linux might take a while longer. After all if they searche in the Granpa Xerox style menues you can easily brew a tea before he is ready so even in the more effective Modern UI they take time.
Re: The modern day Clearance
Banning emigration worked well for the "Workers Paradise" named German Democratic Republic. The thankful population was actually looking for ways to donate large amounts of hemp to their leaders but was bribed with bananas to settle for exiling them and sending some to jail.
Re: complete with the Start button
Oh my god, for all of 20-60 seconds I can not see my current program. That is surely the end of the world! Well actually the stupidity of the Win8 / Modern UI haters is more of a danger there IMHO.
After all if I am starting a new program - why do I need to see the currently running ones? Unless I have Alzheimer or a very short attention span that is.
Interesting is that all three units come with a docking station either as part of the package or as an add on part so these are actually replacements for the average office desktop as well.
And with nobody making money anymore we are reduced to german style "art films" instead of nice "popcorn fun" like Avengers and "The Herne HillyBillies" instead of the Beach Boys.
The price the customers are "willing to pay" is "gimme for free" most of the time. And at that price no one will sell. And the "Artists" won't make more money, they will make none at all.
For all the problems patents and copyrights, a world without them would be worse. Just look at countries that do not have/enforce such laws like China. There EVERYTHING get's copied, sometimes down to the shipping labels. And we are not talking software or movies only, even heavy maschinery like chainsaws or mining equipment gets that treatment. I.e a few years ago STIHL had the german customs office confiscate and destroy container loads of copies sold as STILH as soon as they showed up on the European market. 1:1 copies of the latests products but using inferior materials and being dangerous to the end user due to that.
In a world without copyright/patent those chainsaws could not be stopped. Even if they worked they would have sold cheaper than the original (no R&D) and would have hurt the original designer. Since maschinery has a lengthy return of investment (Think years) that will long term hurt R&D. No company invests in stuff that takes x years of RoI and n month for cheap copies to appear.
Movies are the same. No one makes commercial movies that do not pay back. And the "non commercial ones".... well let's just say I grew up with the 1980s/90s german movie industrie and for every "Das Boot" there where at least five "Hitler and his dog" movies because the state supplied funds. Granted movies like "Immenhof" and "Ewig singen die Wälder" where aimed at the masses rather than the "intellectuals" but just like Shakespears pieces they actually MADE money and WHERE watched!
Please remember we are talking "Verdi" here not one of the real german trade unions. Those start with IG (Industrie Gewerkschaft). Verdi is a bunch of former civil service workers from the ÖTV (famous for the garbage man strike in 1992 that basically ruined ÖTV in the public view).
Wer? Die? is big on leftist rethorics and "Klassenkampf" and low on brains. The strike against Amazon basically centers on Amazon Logistics saying "We are a logistics company and pay BETTER than the Wer?Die? tarif" (True!) and Verdi wanting Amazon Logistics to be "Einzelhandel" and pay according to that. Einzelhandel typically means 3 years apprenticeship while the average logistics worker is given a two hour training and packs boxes...
Add in that the majority or the workers at Amazon Logistics is NOT in a union and the results will be:
Short term nothing happens but VerDi makes big amounts of hot air (basically the only thing they are good at)
Long term logistics for germany is handled from Poland
Android unit from WACOM. That is the same as the Note series. The Samsung drivers are not OpenSource and I doubt the WACOM are. So they can't be absorbed by the GNU
Re: Not surprising
Actually this is not the first tablet pc from DELL they have been doing that for quite some time now. At least two Atom based units have been done.
Re: It's a shame the handsets didn't succeed.
Or a WP8 version of the N770 upgraded with WACOM (a WP8 variant of the Note2 would be ok as well). That might get me to buy another smartphone. Without it smartphone era will end for me 31/March/2014. 10-11'' tablet pc and a dumbphone are better IMHO
Re: Much better price
Starting price so this is (we are talking DELL) the ATOM based unit without LTE and (if there is a choice of batteries) the smallest batterie. Just look at the DELL Latitute 10 and it's pricing system. The data given for the 11'' model obviously includes the i3/i5 model since BayTrail has a memory limit of 4GB so the 8GB model will likely be priced similar to an S/P2
IF DELL does the BayTrail right (option for 4GB, real SSD, MiraCast, Wacom, LTE) at a price below the 4GB/128GB Surface/Pro2 they have a unit that will get nice sales in business (like the Latitude-10 did)
A "toybreed" touch only might get some of the iCrowd since those are conditionend to think "pen = evil" and Win8 might become the new "I am different" system
If their "big versions" come in at a price around(or even slightly above) S/P2s 8GB configurations (and the LTE variant out in early 2014) then you can talk competition since the slightly bigger screen and replaceable battery are bonus points.
Sadly the article does not answer the three important questions:
Will the BayTrail version support 4GB and a "full sized" SSD instead of the eMMC most Atoms have now?
Does the 11 inch model come with an inductive digitizer and if yes WACOM or NTrig (Dell has used both)?
Does the 11 inch model come with LTE?
If all three answer yes (and 2b WACOM) this is a serious player with a nice pricing
Re: Windows 7 Upgrade?
Sometimes you pay for your laziness. This is one such case. Neither the EOL of XP nor the W7->W8 switch came as a surprise. So a smart person would have gotten the licences needed prior to the W8 release OR go with W8
Same as with every other box that does not connect to the internet and only runs some dedicated software - updates and security patches do not matter.
Re: Win8 is a bloated piece of shit.
Been there since the days of CP/M. Happily left those days behind. Even an Atari ST with Word Processor is a lot less useful/capabel than a Atom based tablet pc with Word Processor. And the old Mega ST4 was a mighty powerful box in it's days
Links please of it did not happen. Last time someone offered Links to WACOM it was either for EXTERNAL tablets. Those work different from the screens. Or for Android and the Note drivers are Samsung closed source. There are "early beta" drivers for Wacom penabled technology but they are not very stable.
Same for HWR. If it is not up to at least Win7 - it does not work. And comparing Note to Win7/Win8 even Samsung is not yet there. With the same pen and user the Note has a lot more misses and generally wrong choices than Win8. Problems with words not in the directory and it either does not learn/adapt at all or extremly slowly (> 6 month with steady use)
Xournal is nice but like SNote not up to even MS Journal (lack of OCR among others)
As for speech the short version of your answer is: NO. Oh and speech has come a LOOONG way since the late 90s and ViaVoice. Even the Windows7/8 internal engine is better than say ViaVoice 8 (2000). The better hardware helps here as well
Re: 3 different code bases was a mistake
IF the application is done in a way that works on more than one form factor this would be nice. Quite a few Android apps never managed that, running on a tablet is horrible at best.
Does xBuntu support
+ WACOM digitizer with pressure support
+ Support Handwritting Recognition
+ Offers an equivalent to MS Journal, ArtRage V2 or better?
+ Offer an equivalent to the MS Speech recognition let alone Dragon Natural?
+ Supports MIRACast
If not you are paying 200+ € for components you can not use
Re: Not consumer
The "low price" tablet pc segment will be served by the MS<<DELL Venue 11 that will be shown next Wednesday. Baytrail, proper digitizer (sadly also supports touch), 4GB, 11'' and according to some sources starting prices around 400€. Since it is basically the Latitude10 replacement there will be a LTE model as well and a dock.
Agreed! The unit is clearly a recommended buy! Just ordered five :)
Given that a lot of people around here find WACOM/NTRIG based units quite useable with legacy apps (and do so since 2003) I guess the problem exists between your tablet pc and your chair
Re: Camera weirdness on Surface models
Camera in a "toy breed" (iOS, Android, RT) - well that may get used and may be useful. Never understood those things they are even worse than a compact camera when it comes to sensor size, zoom etc.
Camera in a tablet pc? What for? Photographing the whiteboard that is no longer used because tablet+beamer (or tablet+60'' display) have replaced it? Actually NO camera would be the best solution. If you need one - the S/P2 has USB for that.
Re: They still don't get it.
MS is actually doing "the right stuff" by not bringing out an Atom
An Atom for a decend price AND a good quality is not doable. The good ones with WACOM/NTrig and LTE are well above 700€. Lower priced and you get in the way of VEB Plaste and Elaste and Samsung can compete by sheer mass.
An i3 is not offering much benefit in price or battery performance.
Re: How much an Ultrabook costs?
MS did not buy Atari, Amiga, Acorn or IBM and still TOS/Amiga/RiscOS/OS2 failed
MS did not buy StarOffice (Sun did) nor Corel or Novell and still these Office packages failed
MS did not buy Interactive or SUN and still those UNIX systems failed
If you do not like Win8 - put Win7 on the convertible. It supports tablet pc just fine (tablets OTOH are not supported well)
Right on the second point, wrong on the first. Surface/Pro has a WACOM stylus and with that you can use legacy applications just fine. Currently doing so (FireFox on a T731 in tablet mode)
Re: What a train wreck
For a market "that small" the big players seem to be very busy in there. Lenovo, Sony, Asus, Acer, Samsung, .... - all building new tablet pc and convertibles.
Guess they know their market a bit better than some AC.
Re: They still don't get it.
DrXim asked for "cheap consumer tablets". That means Atom since "consumer" is web/mail/light office work.
If one needs more power then the S/P2 is the smallest of the useful systems. It's main benefit over units like the Vaio Tap11 or Acer R7bis is WACOM instead of NTrig (1), the better dock, battery cover (2) and the 8GB memory that is available. Depending on your needs a bigger screen (I prefer 12 or 13'') and better CPU (M-series) one of the other units out/announced might be better.
(1) At least for me, I dislike the battery needed element of the otherwise fine NTrig Gen 4 and better.
(2) When it becomes available
Before buying check the version! There are some pretty stripped down L10s around (touch only, no 3G/LTE) for cheap but the full Monty costs around 700€ (whatever that is in funny money)
Re: What lack of app?
What's wrong with a car/boat comby? The last I used wasn't all that fast but it could swim nicely, reach 100km/h on the road, 800km on a single refueling, sun roof, high seating (and place for the friends), all wheel drive, stell bumpers, very silend and it never got towed away.
Ah, that old TPz "Fuchs" was fun back then...
Maybe not offering anything if "Tablet == iThingy inspired TouchyToy". But if tablet is "Wacom/Ntrig equiped, full powered CPU and OS like MS does since 2003" than the S/P2 and the other Haswell units have a LOT to offer. Enough endurance for a workday, enough power for everything except First Person Shooters, guarantee that the PowerPoint/Excel/Word stuff with embedded VBA etc. runs, mature tablet software and so on.
Re: They still don't get it.
Assuming similar basic capabilities as the Surface/Pro (Inductive digitizer, no 3G/LTE)
Samsung Ativ Tab3 (630€ with keyboard) does it
Lenovo TPT2 (620€, without keyboard) does it
Dell Latitude 10 (725€ without keyboard) does it (and you can change batteries yourself)
And if "touch only" is good enough there are a few more at even lower prices.
Screen is a tad small and the unit (still) lacks LTE (or at least 3G) and user replaceable battery. But otherwise the S/P2 is very nice even more so since MS (unlike the Tab11 or the Asus units) will offer 8GB of memory
60 percent increase in endurance => 7+ h on the internal 42Wh Battery.
30Wh "Keyboard battery" => 5+h on more
So at under 1.5kg I can get a full powered core i5 with 8GB/256GB SSD (and not a pseudo SSD like in the Android/iThingy units) running a full powered OS for 12 hours. Nice.and the price is ok as well for the build quality of the Surface with the metal shell and all.
And best of all it uses WACOM so there is a third "Wacom" player in the field aside from Lenovos new Yoga and a Fujitsu-refurbished T902. Guess the "switch to NTrig" option of the Sonys no longer is of interest.
Mr. Potts you are what gives journalism a bad name. A REAL bad one.
The real and existinc core-i / sandy T731 with both batteries installed gets 8+ hours right now in my usage. Granted, that does not include watching videos since for that I have a 42'' television screen. And the unit is quite portable.
Sorry but you are a TROLL!
Oh that wall socket was left behind years ago. T731 can do it easily with hot swap batterie in the second bay (Actually 8h on the two internals as well, a second swap-in will get you 12+). And that is "old tech" from 2010/2011. Going by the Duo13s performance the 733/903 will do 12+ on the two internals.
With an core-i7 M-series CPU!
>For pure productivity you're right, a netbook will beat a tablet which cost more every time. Unfortunately most manufacturers don’t put out netbooks these days. I only got my playbook when my AA1 keyboard started to
The "new Netbooks" are devices like the Ativ500t with dock or the similar Atom tablet pc. They have the same performance, a slightly better screen resolution than most netbooks and similar screen size.
Some people OTOH are replacing a scooter (Netbook) with a Hayabusu (Lenovo X230) and call that "minimum required".
>There's really only about three distributions, which are used as a forking point for most of the others. Red Hat, Debian and Suse, I'd go with that.
Well make it RedHat, Suse and xBuntu and you have 90+ percent of the Linux boxes compromised. And those are the packages most likely used "as is" rather then checked and recompiled because they target the "I want to USE the maschine not fiddle with it" part of Linux.
Add in that all three are done by companies and there are legal means to get a company to "play nice and shut up" and the chances increase that there is "something nice" in there. With the Kernel Devs none the wiser.