Speaking of that movie theatre shooting; the guy was in legal possession of the gun, even had a license for it.
Reminds of another thread...
1883 posts • joined 19 Dec 2010
Speaking of that movie theatre shooting; the guy was in legal possession of the gun, even had a license for it.
Reminds of another thread...
I don't use the webapps all that often but in all honesty I do admire them, even though they're limited when compared to the desktop apps.
As said; mixed feelings. I admire the stuff they did and the enhancements they implemented. Most of all we shouldn't forget that this is basically a free service which I also admire.
But having tried the new Word (in both SeaMonkey /and/ "as intended" in MSIE 9) I have very mixed feelings. I don't like the ALL CAPS TABS. Its too "loud", it draws my attention due to the ALL CAPS while it shouldn't do that IMO because "Low Caps" automatically make you pay a little more attention (IMO) to what you're doing.
I have Word open, I want to add stuff so I select: "Invoegen" ('Insert', my Word is localized). The '3d' and gradient (semi-transparent) look is enough to achieve the 'tabbed look'.
I have Word webapp open and in general the same applies. My backstage 'File' is blue and gradient, and the 'Insert' tab looks clean and neat. "Insert".
This new setup is too screaming to my liking. HOME INSERT PAGE LAYOUT VIEW.
Give me a break here!
As said; I don't use the webapps that often but sporadically. If this gets through then I'm pretty certain that I won't use the webapps ever again. The interface is flat, the tabs are SCREAMING and maybe its just me but the flat colour interface is plain out annoying to look at.
Current webapps: The paste icon is a yellow clipboard with a paper in front, selected options are in yellow while my overall theme is in blue (my file backstage tab is blue gradient). Because of the different colour its easy to spot the current selections.
New webapps: /Everything/ is in blue. Apart from the paste icon which all of a sudden looks flat and lame. But options such as alignment, font selection, its all blueish. The same colour as the overall theme which makes it /very/ easy to overlook because it all looks the same.
As such; mixed feelings. I admire the effort but I dislike the current interface quite heavily. Its too noisy.
Now, this is a bit of a troll but also a somewhat seriously meant post.
For the first time since MS went onto the stock market (around 1986) did they manage to book a loss of approx. 492 million dollar. The year before they managed to get a profit of 5,9 billion dollars. Sure; it could be due to investments, it could be due to lower sale rates.
Or is it possible that many people are bailing out with the idea of Metro ahead?
"Since when did BIGBOOBS become offensive anyways?"
When people found out the string wasn't setup by a female person, so they were left disappointed.
I think that covers it.
Personally I like working with both Win7 & Office 2010. I also think that adding Server 2003 into the mixture gives a pretty solid environment.
But would I have any shares of Microsoft I too would have sold them as soon as possible after the Office previews came about.
And before anyone goes off with: investments... (which by itself is a very reasonable point). Don't forget that a loss means it outweighs any foreseen investments + incoming profits (which is also a variable factor by itself). Unfair context but you could also reason that MS didn't get as much income as they anticipated.
My point being: if this were due to investments it would still indicate very poor leadership because you'd normally anticipate for that.
The more this story develops the more to I start to think we may see very drastic developments in the upcoming future.
Something I'm personally not looking forward to but heck... Their loss.
Actually what you're describing is only partly true.
Yes; you could easily create a midlet buy merely compiling your ME project in, say, NetBeans (personal favourite of mine). But with all the phones I worked with you could /not/ simply distribute it onto the phone like you could, for example, a war file onto a J2EE (Glassfish) server. Even if your phone would be recognized as USB storage.
Instead you had to make it available online, use the phone's browser to get to the program location (which always took /2/ files; one description explaining the whole online setup (you always needed to set this up /manually/) and the actual midlet itself) and only then would the midlet actually install.
I can't comment on Android because I don't use it, but its by /far/ as easy as some other development systems do this.
Now, maybe I'm being old fashioned here but iirc 7 was released only last year (2011). Right now the latest update is at 5 (SE 7u5) whereas its predecessor sits at SE6u33.
Isn't it a tad quick to move the whole thing to 8 already ?
Even if it takes us thousands of pounds to find them; they can't hide and we'll find them!
Sad thing is that all fun put aside this is often the way it goes.. When the government gets something "cheap" its often a good idea to look at the investment (time, effort, money) it took to get there.
I don't do social media /at all/ for certain reasons but figured I might just as well get me a company account to put my business there and use it to share some common info every now and then.
Well; the difference between facebook and, say, twitter is IMO shocking. Facebook only allows me to try and get others to subscribe (or like or whatever) my facebook page and that's roughly it. You can't use the common facebook features ("get a personal facebook account"), you can't even follow 'fellow' companies or people. All you can do is buy some "adcoins" (or whatever they're called) and advertise.
Twitter otoh... I also don't really like Twitter that much but in comparison its a /truly/ social network. With my company account I can follow other companies and people, I can comment on other "tweets" and I can even easily send my own tweets out (like announcing work on the website for example). And by simply "going with the flow" you suddenly manage to get quite a few followers. Better yet; you also see visits on your website rise a bit.
Now; I don't expect to get better sales or anything using social media but I do think its a nice way to interact with customers who also have a social media account. And getting your company name a little better known is always a pro of course. "Dangerous" (when many people don't like what you're saying they're basically not liking your company name) but that's the way the game is (and should!) be played. IMVHO.
Twitter allows this, Facebook doesn't. Guess which one is my favourite ?
At least that's the way it looks to me.
Take the Windows Phone. I'm sure many people picked it up with the vast support with Windows in mind. I'm referring to XP for example which has been supported for 13 years, Windows 7 which will easily last another 6 years (the Professional version at least) and Office is also amongst those regions. One of the reasons I'm not too bothered with this Metro doctrine yet.
Windows Phone otoh... There was a first line of devices; and MS insisted on specific hardware specs to meet the demands of the OS. That was reason enough for me to assume continuity even despite the short lifespan of Windows Mobile 6.5. But alas; roughly 1.5 year later the device is already marked / rumoured to be EOL'd because WP8 devices won't be compatible with WP7 devices (logical) but if any software functions will make it back to 7.5 also remains to be seen. IMO that's doing things backwards; including not informing the customers on what is really going on and keeping a rather short lifetime.
Same applies IMO to Win8 & Office 2012. People tried hard to make Office 2010 user friendly (personally I like the Ribbon there but can well imagine that others don't) but with the latest Office a lot of (IMO) key features seem to be getting reversed again. I like my 'Open recent' backstage view section from where I can also immediately go to the "open file" section if I want to. The new "backstage" metro view otoh? Doable, but not as easy it seems.
I don't like the way things are headed but at least I am very happy to have my current office environment supported for many years to come.
Others stated their opinion (matching mine) already but alas...
There is one thing which hasn't been mentioned: sometimes "better" isn't always actually better. Sounds crazy?
Its quite simple: there are things which I can do much faster in MS Office 2010 than I can do in Open or Libre Office. But it isn't always better. For example; tables in Word 2010 cannot be setup so that they keep their formatting. Example: I setup a table, I format several cells with a financial view but when I remove the tables contents then the view is also gone. Writer otoh. can keep its format intact.
Although this makes Writer better for this particular job I can get quicker results with Word. For example because of its "auto text" or "quick parts" feature (insert whole (dynamic) blocks in your Word document).
So IMO there isn't a tight "better" or "worse" line here. Both suites have their advantages and disadvantages.
But just because OpenOffice is free doesn't automatically make it the best tool for the job. In the above example: what I save in purchasing costs can eventually "haunt" me in working hours; time costs money too if you're running a business.
Instead of making the (not too bad) Office webapps look more mature they chose to do things the other way around: make the desktop apps look more like the webapps. But by doing so I think they negatively impacted Office functionality big time.
I'd be more interested if MS still dominated the browser market, but they're not.
So what's this really all about? Freedom on the market or filling one's wallet?
I know; let's have a European poll on the matter with its citizens. Oh, darn; I forgot: the EU never asks the citizens how they feel about things, even if it means they'll have to retire a few years later.
"you know, metro is not aimed at Buisiness right?"
Then why do they also put in the upcoming Server 2012 ?
I'd believe that comment if it were only on El Reg but even on the MS fora themselves do you get /tons/ of negative comments. Even from people who are recognized as long term MVP's.
As Elvis once said: 50.000.000 'fans' can't be wrong!
Sorry El Reg but you're losing your touch IMO. For those of us who want to see a little more about this new Office then they can go to the official Office preview page which doesn't show extremely much but the introduction movie does give you a good impression of how its going to look and feel.
Being an MS Office 2010 power user (and actually enjoying the environment) I can only say that after looking at that intro movie I'm convinced its going to suck. BIG time.
Let me elaborate...
As we all feared the whole kaboodle sits in Metro. If you look at the movie you'll notice around 0:28 a screenshot of OneNote. This is a program I actually use very often, almost on a daily basis. Honestly: you only get to see the notebook sections and only get to see the notebooks themselves when you move your mouse to make it scroll in ?
Right now I have the notebooks sitting in the menu on my left, and the notebook sections on top. I get to chose what I want to see. More importantly: I can switch from my main notebook to my online (SkyDrive) notebook with 1 (one) click of the mouse. This is important to me because my online notebook holds info which is shared between all of my computers (main PC, laptop & WinPhone). Why would I want a sliding panel which only delays my movements?
And really; a round 'dial' pop-up menu ?
Outlook... (0:34); When I sit in Outlook right now I continue to have access to other information, even Messenger and for example, I dunno... A clock maybe? What good is a frickin' appointment calendar without so much as an actual clock visible on your screen ?
What's that? I should get a watch? But like; isn't this Office suppose to make things /easier/ (see the intro movie) ? So how come it doesn't do stuff which the old "inferior" Office does RIGHT NOW ?
Nice to have a 2D full screen Excel window but you know... Very often I add charts to some of my Word documents, and because Excel is quite a good program for that (IMO of course) I have it setup that I can start Excel with the click of a mouse button (sits in Words' quickstart panel).
Guess what ?
Win-RightMouse and it immediately moves to the right of my screen. When I'm in Word I can simply hit Win-LeftMouse and all of a sudden I have 2 programs on 1 1024x768 screen allowing me to work on my document as well as my charts.
I can't do that within Metro because my screen resolution isn't high enough. But why would I want a higher resolution when all I'm doing with this PC is using it for administrative purposes?
But here's the thing...
If you go to that link I showed above you'll notice that as soon as it comes to business use MS is no longer touting their new "Wonderful" Office. No; then all of a sudden its Office 365 (ProPlus, Small Business Premium & Enterprise).
With all due respect but those applications work quite nicely but are in /no way/ comparable to the stuff I can do with the common desktop apps. I tried 365 a month myself, I can see its potential but if you need a little more out of Office then get the desktop apps. For example: VBA scripting? Non existent in 365 because the webapps don't go that far.
I think MS clearly shows in the preview movie itself where this is headed: look at 0:24 in the movie ;-)
When you have SoundCloud ?
Not meant as a sneer but it seems to me that SoundCloud has much extra's to provide over Spotify. For example; when I go to the spotify website the first thing I see is "listen free to milions of songs". Of course all I need to do is download software /and/ register.
My simply stance on that should be obvious: if I need to register then its not free.
With SoundCloud otoh. I go to their website (see link above) and I'm immediately greeted with several players which I can use to listen to tracks, I can further more search artists, listen to more stuff and if I want to open my own account.
It should be obvious where that can lead to... Take for example this Tribute page to 'Fall Silently'. Its just what it says; a tribute page and it shows a freely available SoundCloud player. Yes; if you put your stuff online with SoundCloud for all to hear then even fans can spread the word; even if they don't have a SoundCloud account themselves.
Gee... What would work better to get your name and music recognized....
Now; before I continue I am /not/ trying to justify people who desperately try to look up (short) skirts or kilts.
But I do think its a bit far stretched to fully put the blame on stores (or environments) which have simply been build in a specific way. Because you know; you can also turn this around...
If you wear clothes which could make people look (more) at you then best prepare yourself that people are going to look at you. If you then decide to walk on places where people might get a certain specific view, then who's "fault" (if any) is that? The people who decided themselves to dress in a somewhat specific manner or the people who build such structures?
Would Apple force their female employee's to wear mini skirts and then have them walk up and down such a semi-transparent staircase then I think you have more than enough ground to file a list of complaints. But as long as that didn't happen I don't see the problem here.
They simply lost their mind, that's all.
Wrt Outlook; I tend to agree with the author but to a certain extend. Without the calendar and public folders (I don't use the latter) there's still the Office integration which I personally think is quite good.
For example; I use Outlook to keep all my contact information (customers and such) and when writing letters in Word (using an own developed template with mucho VBA) I can retrieve the contact information right from Outlook. That makes the whole "Office experience" a lot better for me.
This setup seems more difficult to achieve when using OpenOffice (or LibreOffice). I think it should be doable though but I honestly don't know for sure and how you'd set that up.
That is of course assuming MS won't simply finish them off in a next "security" update.
Besides; MS asked for the "moaning" themselves. Remember; The metro crapola was allegedly build thanks to user input from previous Windows versions indicating major problems with the start menu...
So if people are not ok with new "improvements" on Windows I think they're doing the right thing to moan about it. Best on the MS fora themselves but why stop there?
Would make perfect sense...
Scare the public out of using Gadgets from 3rd parties (the only way you can get these now) and then get them all onto the metro bandwagon (where "gadgeteers" can only distribute their gadgets when coughing up some big bucks to MS to be included with their metro marketplace).
The gadgets are even quite well programmed.
I keep a weather & picture gadget on my desktop, even though I don't use a wide screen monitor. I'm especially impressed with the picture gadget because it doesn't only use what's on my PC; it can access my network storages as well.
As such it /truly/ shows me snapshots of /all/ my favourite pictures.
I'm not going to give up on this. And just learning that this will be stripped from Win8 as well (the previews still had this) is yet /another/ reason for me to completely ignore it.
Apart from the obvious problem (E 800 + / year vs. E 150,- / year) MSDN isn't the right tool for the job.
Just take a look at the MSDN and TechNet subscription comparison.
With TechNet I'm allowed to "Use MS software to understand features to make usage, deployment or purchase recommendations or decisions", with MSDN I'm not.
With TechNet I'm allowed to do the above with 3rd party software, MSDN prohibits this.
And here is the most important one: "Become familiar and keep up to date with the latest Microsoft software to support internal or external clients using or deploying the software.". TechNet: Yes, MSDN: No.
Only issue is that XP is still supported until next year.
I have a TechNet subscription simply to have access to software which I sporadically need to set stuff and I think they're making a huge mistake.
Professional users don't need XP Home? So what about when I'm testing a software product which is said to give problems on a Home edition of XP? I don't run Home (be it XP, Win7, etc), so how exactly am I suppose to perform these tests under the new license?
Removing products which "are no longer covered by extended support" ? Just because MS doesn't support these products any longer doesn't mean I can't come across them in the open.
And then I do I rely on TechNet to "have my back" by providing access to all that arcane stuff so that I can help my customers best as possible. Sure; I'll also tell them that it might be a better idea to upgrade their stuff (hopefully by purchasing stuff from me) IF applicable.
But before they'll listen to such arguments I think actually helping them out with their problems is a key issue here. How am I going to do that in the upcoming future?
Instead of taking it out on their subscribers MS should take more action against violators. For example, while I could be mistaken I think only the upcoming new agreement clearly states that you can no longer use their software when your subscription runs out. Yeah, DUH!!
I'm honestly troubled by all this. One of the cool things about TechNet is having access to all sorts of software, even arcane stuff such a DOS and Windows 9x. Heck; I'm even careful enough to /always/ re-use serials when I need them instead of going "Mwa, I have 2 so I'll just go along and see what happens".
Yet I'm the one they're going after, not those idiots who abuse their service it seems. Doesn't feel right.
Now, I probably fall completely outside the category considering that I'm a very small player.
Having said that, my first reaction to this article was: "I'd be more impressed if Microsoft would start being nicer to its resellers!. I know; this link is about their TechNet squeeze; but you'd be surprised how much TechNet has managed to help me help my customers in the last 1.5 years.
Honestly; if such a "hippie" would step up at my doorstep I'd be offended and would make very sure that they'd realize this as well.
Again; will never happen and would make no difference at all, I know. The idea still made me feel good ;-)
The stuff one can do with VMWare are quite extreme, but HyperV has yet to proof itself. The fact that Server 2012 will be Metro flavoured doesn't exactly bode very well for them either IMO.
I'll believe this "huge success" when I see it, but until then pardon me for not being a believer.
The pr0n material itself was left alone (which I still consider a /major/ failure; get those bastards where it really hurts!) and by releasing personal information they could very well have jeopardized official investigations. Put differently: possibly ruined any chance to get those sick abusers take (legal) responsibility for their actions.
This is no different IMO. I fear for all talk, hardly any result and the results they do get are controversial at best. DoS'ing isn't the same as taking down a website IMO.
I'd be much more impressed if they'd manage to /destroy/ those filthy - sickening - collections of kiddie pr0n. How hard can it be if they're really as good as they always claim? There is no risk for errors (you see the crap you're targeting after all), you hit them where it /really/ hurts and best of all; you also automatically get your hands on some undeniable solid evidence.
Will he do the same about his Windows 8 expectations ?
Its slowly turning into a joke IMO.
I mean; only after 3 'waves' of very specific critics (introduction and the developer & customer preview) did MS finally gave us a tip of the iceberg: their decisions regarding Win8 were all based on user input. Information collected through Windows 7.
But if that were so; then I could imagine that MS would become a "little" nervous considering the /huge/ numbers of strictly negative user critics. Not merely critical comments; also usually well build up with arguments as to why the users are so negative.
I know this is about surface and not so much win8 perse, but it strikes me as odd that with the surface all of a sudden MS (Ballmer) does start to reduce expectations a little and "warn" people not to get overexcited. Now; maybe an unfair conclusion but to me it looks as if everything said earlier about user input being used is total bogus. Worse; it seems to me that all MS really cares about when it comes to Win8 and related products such as surface is keeping its partnerships at bay (as said; both customer and competitor all of a sudden).
But when it comes to endusers MS actually doesn't really seem to give very much about their opinion since the whole thing will launch "and it will be sold anyway".
Well, one way to find out.
But I think you might better combine both the RT and non-RT version to make sure you got enough weight ;)
Agreed, and the worst part about it (IMO) is that hardly anyone seems to care. One could imagine that whenever such huge fines are being charged something pretty heavy is going wrong.
However; the figures are often so extremely huge and Google usually has hardly any problem coughing it all up that it seems to be totally losing its symbolic value as well.
"Google gets fine, Google pays fine, what was that?".
btw; this isn't something only applicable to Google; Microsoft has performed the same feasts and more that often the same can be said about other multi-billion companies.
"On the timeline business, SAC 1st and 2nd Gig must be set before the original film"
Well, officially the two stories play out in totally different time lines, which I think makes much sense due to the somewhat different approaches here and there. I mean; when looking at personality I think there is quite a difference between the Major as set out in SAC or the original movies, one which I would indeed deem incompatible.
In the movie the human side is more explored whereas within SAC (and that movie) the focus is more based on the technological aspects and the flaws which that can bring us.
I think SAC is best enjoyed as the name suggests: 'stand alone' :-)
No need for that; back then I got myself the special edition steelbook DVD release. 2 DVD's (movie & extras) and a CD with the soundtrack.
It was a bit costly but oh so worth it. "First gen" special editions are awesome. I collected the GiTS:SAC first season all in special edition releases as well. Got me tshirts, OST's and a very cool metal collection box. 2nd season was much less exciting (IMO) so I simply stuck with the normal release box (which I think is very annoying because the dvd's are cramped in there in small plastic packages).
Same applies to this one ;-)
I agree that the movie was a bit slow pased but in my opinion it wasn't bothersome. In fact; in my experience this really worked well to build up to the climax: the hospital raid.
And this is what I'm missing out on in the review; the OST. The stuff by Origa is (in my opinion of course) totally awesome. /AND/ was very well laid out in this one.
Meaning; during the raid the well known (amongst fans) 'Run Rabbit Jack' music ran, high speed, high tension and works very well for action. Heck; in a way the whole thing even went 'in sync'. And the longer this continued the more did you begin to realize that this wasn't providing enough time. Were they going to repeat 'Rabbit jack', were they going to put in another action (Surf, Velveteen, etc.) ?
And then suddenly; silence (even though it was for a short moment) and the action also paused for a quick moment. The next thing 'Replica' starts beautifully, and before you can wonder "wtf is THIS?!" a Tachikoma screams "security-cyborgu desu!" and the action continues, this time under a totally different music score.
I can still recall myself just staring and listening in awe....
But I wouldn't get the blu-ray. The dvd has enough detail for me as it is; like the awesome scene in the beginning when you can actually /see/ all the rain specks.
Thanks a bunch, much appreciated!
For me V topped it, but only because I saw this as a kid, got scared stiff when Donovan pulled of the skin in the first pilot episode and the whole story was very intriguing IMO. The now classic question of "what if...".
I also recall another sci-fi / horror-like series but completely forgot the name, maybe any of you guys recall this: it featured around Mars; people could travel there (it was colonized) but the planet housed (of course) aliens who were actually friendly. They manifested themselves as blue orbs, could change into whatever they wanted (what people thought of) but didn't like it very well when 'we' tried to invade Mars.
Any of you happen to recall this ?
There are many theories out there and many eventually turn out to be true, just like there are many which simply end up forgotten because most people hardly care to keep up with 'stuff from the past'.
But when reading stories such as these I can't help wonder... What is the big problem with stating on certain topics that: "We don't know. Yet." ?
I dumped thunderbird when the tabbed crap started to appear without any way to get rid of all the crap. Sure; you could change stuff in the registry and such but that would hide /certain/ behaviour but not get rid of it entirely.
TO me those tabs proof that some people should really reconsider what they're doing it all for. I moved to SeaMonkey and used it for a long time for both browsing and email. Guess what?
Only half a year later did I suddenly discover that SeaMonkey supported tabbed e-mail too. Only because I got curious and wondered "what would happen if I control-double click here?".
Thunderbird (right after the upgrade from the "clean" version) revealed this monstrosity within 2 minutes after starting up the program.
IMO that's your real problem right there.
Google also once disputed that there was nothing wrong with their sales model. And then all of a sudden developers started to surface up to a point where Google locked /and/ removed said threads.
Pardon me for not believing Google on their word with this.
"iPad is OK, but what Microsoft really needs is MORE MONEY."
Then I think they'd be much better off if they never came into contact with our "civilization" for reasons well shown in the past. Just take a look at what happened to 'surprisingly' discovered African tribes, then ask yourself how they got discovered in the first place. And finally the part hardly anyone cares about: ask yourself how they're doing now; usually "persuaded" to move to another location because obviously; there was a good reason they were where they were, and we want to have, errr, 'share' that as well.
note: Mermaids? Sure, nice fantasy; but when talking about a whole species wouldn't "merpeople" or such be a better suited description? ;-)
Or its AI fires up and it decides to snack on something else. Would you take the risk?
Calling the editor a troll? That's not really fair now...
After all the trouble he went through... Carefully listening to this MS announcement to share the news while /still/ doing his utmost best not to start laughing out loud when hearing / reading this.
When I got my PS3 its exactly what I bought it for; media & games. Even got myself a bluetooth remote control. Which is kinda cool; it always surprises people that I don't have to point the thing anywhere close to the device.
That's another pro for PS3 indeed; although you can purchase a certain amount "up front" which you can then later use to purchase games you can also simply tell the system to charge your creditcard for the exact amount.
You ignore a major issue; when Google says they use Linux they do not refer to vinil brands. "Based on Debian" does not mean 'Debian' just like 'based on the Linux kernel' does not mean they used the vinil kernel either.
Marketing relies heavily on making it sound as if things are implied while in fact they aren't.
And Google have unfortunately entered the marketing stage a long time ago....
I think Google does have a point. I mean; at one time it looked as if all other major browsers (Firefox, Internet explorer) started to mimic the looks of Chrome. Firefox especially IMO. A move which I detested ever since it started because honestly; if I wanted to use Chrome then I'd download and use it.
IE9 is a bit different when it comes to looks (the tabs sit besides the address bar instead of above it) but its still quite trimmed down in comparison to IE8.
So with that in mind I think Google has a point.
As for me; I'm sticking to SeaMonkey for my every day browsing.
I don't quite get it.. Previously they used large balloons to cover the whole unit and basically had it drop from the sky using parachutes. They did this twice and it worked.
Why all of a sudden change the whole setup for something which has hardly been tested ? It seems to me that this system is a lot more prone to errors than the previous one.
I think there's one thing TechRadar does wrong and that's totally block out their forums without so much as a warning as to what is going on. The moment you go to their forum you'll be greeted (eventually) with a network timeout.
That's very nice for people who visit the forum on a regular basis; getting errors without having a clue where they came from.
For a club which claims to have a big interest in tech I would have expected a more technological satisfying solution, a warning page at the very least.